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I'm Enjoying Watching Silent Audit Videos on YouTube

Loulit01

RESIST
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In case you don't know, and many people don't, it's legal to film or take pics of anything you can see from a public place. You can stand on a public sidewalk and legally film banks, police stations, correctional facilities, ICE detention centers, military installations, anything. If you're standing in a public space, nothing and no one you can see has an expectation of privacy. You can stand there and film as long as you want. You don't need anyone's permission to film them if they can be seen from a public space. You can film anyone (including you, yes you can be filmed), for any reason or none, without their permission.

Tough to believe? Fact.

I wouldn't do it on a beach. But that's just because I have good manners and I'd get punched in the face. But other than that...

Anyway, there are people who go around filming just to prove the point. Which may make them annoying jerks, but they have the legal right to do it.

Some of these guys do it by not saying a word to anyone, including cops.

 
multivita-man said:
Not really a fan of people who provoke encounters with law enforcement for shits and giggles. I mean, you have the right to do it. Doesn't mean it's a good idea.
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Well, the way this country is going, I think it's good that cops learn that can't run people off who aren't committing a crime. That they can't demand ID just because someone called and cast suspicion. Suspicion isn't a crime. Suspicion of what? They must articulate a crime before they can demand ID. That's the law.

You should be able to walk down the street without ID on you. You should be able to film anything you can see without being harassed. We're drifting ever farther toward an authoritarian state.

There is no provocation if the police understand and follow the law. They should show up and explain to everyone who called to complain, that no crime is being committed. And then go back to work. There would be no confrontations if the police followed the law.
 
People who enjoy being a jerk by passively provoking others is nothing new. Paparazzi keep walking a fine line including invading a person’s personal space.
 
gman said:
People who enjoy being a jerk by passively provoking others is nothing new. Paparazzi keep walking a fine line including invading a person’s personal space.
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Many US police seem to have this idea that simply not wanting to talk to them is reason enough for them to detain you.

It isn't.
 
Peter said:
Many US police seem to have this idea that simply not wanting to talk to them is reason enough for them to detain you.

It isn't.
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You're behaving suspiciously, I need to see your ID.

Uh. No you don't.
 
multivita-man said:
Not really a fan of people who provoke encounters with law enforcement for shits and giggles. I mean, you have the right to do it. Doesn't mean it's a good idea.
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I find it rather distasteful. On the level of cowardice. I won't be surprised if cowards like that are not the first to dial 911 to have same cops endanger themselves protecting them
 
Juin said:
I find it rather distasteful. On the level of cowardice. I won't be surprised if cowards like that are not the first to dial 911 to have same cops endanger themselves protecting them
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What are these cowards afraid of?
 
gman said:
People who enjoy being a jerk by passively provoking others is nothing new. Paparazzi keep walking a fine line including invading a person’s personal space.
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Paparazzi! That's the disgust I have for such fakes. They are as disgusting as pimps
 
Juin said:
I find it rather distasteful. On the level of cowardice. I won't be surprised if cowards like that are not the first to dial 911 to have same cops endanger themselves protecting them
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The right feels it has this God given right to cast aspersions and call names with zero to back it up. Why are you calling these people cowards? What do you think they're afraid of?

Probably wasting my time again.
 

I think if you want to train police officers in anything, you should apply for a job at the police academy.

In many circumstances, if they have a lawful reason, they are required to ID a person, and if they refuse, they will be arrested and held until they are ID'd.

They don't need to articulate the details to the subject's satisfaction on the spot. They only need to be able to do so in court.

That I suppose is why I find that behavior so offensive. These people presume to know better than a police officers and judges, but few enough have finished high school.


Loulit01 said:
You should be able to walk down the street without ID on you. You should be able to film anything you can see without being harassed. We're drifting ever farther toward an authoritarian state.
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Yeah, but that's not what those videos show, in my experience. They are typically standing around outside these places for hours at a time, frequently entering and leaving the private areas, actively trying to video and provoke the staff, making a scene. They very frequently have a grudge against whatever agency or people that work there, and will be happy to tell the police all about how the staff is acting criminally.

If they were just walking by filming in public, none of that would be happening.



If someone calls in a suspicious person, it's not offensive when the police come out to give them a sniff. That's their job.

And when a suspicious person doesn't turn out to be a criminal, that's not any sort of loss for the police.
 

So, what you're saying is that someone just out for a walk can be arrested for simply not having ID.
I go out for walks all the time without ID.
Would I be liable to arrest in the US just for doing that?
 
I like HYO. And The Battousai. A lot of others are pretty meh, and some are really terrible at it and of course there are assholes giving all of them a bad name.
 
Peter said:
So, what you're saying is that someone just out for a walk can be arrested for simply not having ID.
I go out for walks all the time without ID.
Would I be liable to arrest in the US just for doing that?
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No, they'd need a reason to approach you, and cause to ID you, and even then it's the refusal to ID that gets you arrested.

You don't need an ID card, generally name and SSN will suffice. If you're from overseas that might be a bit trickier, but presumably there are ways.

My point is that the police officer doesn't need the subject's permission to do their job. They justify themselves to the the courts.
 
Peter said:
So, what you're saying is that someone just out for a walk can be arrested for simply not having ID.
I go out for walks all the time without ID.
Would I be liable to arrest in the US just for doing that?
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Arrested for taking a walk, unlikely. No ID plus a refusal to give any identifying information such as name arouses reasonable suspicion. Around here it may get you detained, not arrested, until the police can verify identity assuming there are no applicable BOLOs.
 

Oh, so the US isn't a free country then?
 
Peter said:
Oh, so the US isn't a free country then?
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Of course the US is a free country. Unlike the UK our freedoms are enshrined in a Constitution.
 
If you want to someone to produce ID, you must have reasonable articulable suspicion of a crime. Filming from a public space is not a crime. People calling and saying you're suspicious does not mean there's a crime.
WillyPete said:
They don't need to articulate the details to the subject's satisfaction on the spot. They only need to be able to do so in court.
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And if they can't do so in court, they got sued and the taxpayer pays.
WillyPete said:
That I suppose is why I find that behavior so offensive. These people presume to know better than a police officers
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They often do know the law better, as these videos and law suits prove.
WillyPete said:
and judges,
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No evidence of that.
WillyPete said:
but few enough have finished high school.
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Again, no evidence of that.
WillyPete said:
Yeah, but that's not what those videos show, in my experience.
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You've had personal experience of people filming from public spaces?
WillyPete said:
They are typically standing around outside these places for hours at a time, frequently entering and leaving the private areas,
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They do not go in private areas. They know better
WillyPete said:
actively trying to video and provoke the staff, making a scene.
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Nope.
WillyPete said:
They very frequently have a grudge against whatever agency or people that work there, and will be happy to tell the police all about how the staff is acting criminally.
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Nonsense.
WillyPete said:
If they were just walking by filming in public, none of that would be happening.
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Happens all the time.
WillyPete said:
If someone calls in a suspicious person, it's not offensive when the police come out to give them a sniff.
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No, it isn't. But they can't demand ID.
WillyPete said:
That's their job.
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It is.
WillyPete said:
And when a suspicious person doesn't turn out to be a criminal, that's not any sort of loss for the police.
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Unless the police break the law.
 
Failure to ID is a secondary offense. They have to have reasonable articulable suspicion you committed a crime, and then they can ask for ID which you would then be required to produce. “Suspicious activity” isn’t a crime and you can tell the cops to **** off if they ask for ID and there is nothing they can do about it.
WillyPete said:
They don't need to articulate the details to the subject's satisfaction on the spot.
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By law, yes they do.
WillyPete said:
They only need to be able to do so in court.
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Nope. They need to do so during the encounter.
WillyPete said:
That I suppose is why I find that behavior so offensive. These people presume to know better than a police officers and judges, but few enough have finished high school.
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They do know better than most police officers. It’s why so many departments lose bigly in court over this issue.
All of which they have a right to do.
WillyPete said:
If they were just walking by filming in public, none of that would be happening.
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It doesn’t matter why they are filming. It’s a constitutionally protected activity.
WillyPete said:
If someone calls in a suspicious person, it's not offensive when the police come out to give them a sniff. That's their job.
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And they can tell the police to go **** the selves and there is nothing they can do about it.
WillyPete said:
And when a suspicious person doesn't turn out to be a criminal, that's not any sort of loss for the police.
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Suspicious person isn’t a crime. You can’t be forced to provide ID because the police say you are a suspicious person. They have to provide reasonable articulable suspicion that you’ve committed a crime in order for ID to be required.
 
People might not like my take here, but go ahead and argue against my post.

I despised those masked, gun-carrying losers in Arizona who decided to set up shop with their cameras focused on election drop boxes, and I despise these social media morons with phones who are doing nothing productive, but like stirring up trouble. Yes, I said trouble, because nothing positive comes out of this activity.

The world in which we live in needs less of this kind of crap, not more of it. These amateurs need to find something productive to do with their time rather than provoking people and law enforcement. It doesn’t matter if it’s legal- it’s still something ridiculously stupid done by morons.
 
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Loulit01 said:
You're behaving suspiciously, I need to see your ID.

Uh. No you don't.
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Here in California cops can call up an image of my DL on the screen in their car.

It always annoys them when they demand I’d and for some reason you don’t have it or they can’t search the bag it’s in because you won’t let them search it and you remind them that they have a picture.

Because, as of now, you are required to identify yourself not show a particular object.
 
multivita-man said:
Not really a fan of people who provoke encounters with law enforcement for shits and giggles. I mean, you have the right to do it. Doesn't mean it's a good idea.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the Chinese Coast Guard can empathize. They really don’t like the U.S. Navy “casing” their coastline through the Taiwan Strait. Point being, it’s either use it or lose it. These people are actually performing a public service.
 
Are the police here actually doing anything wrong other than having their time wasted ?
 
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