Illegal iimmigration

[teacher]

Even worse, that post used Hanyu Pinyin, not real Chinese, so I have no idea what he said anyway.

Ludahai. Is that what your mother calls you. I lived in Hudson and Amherst. If you are Chinese then I understand. If not then how do you come to pick up the Chinese attitude concerning foragers speaking Chinese? On another site I type pinyin (Chinese phonetically) with real Chinese ren in mainland China for hours with no problem. Besides I see no characters on this keyboard. Tian bu pa, di bu pa, jui pa yuang guizi shou zhongguo hua. Go ahead and pretend you don't understand so as not to dui lian (lose face). Maybe in China dui lian has it's merits but to Americans it's on the maturity scale just below "I know you are but what am I". Lying to another's face when they know your lying and you know he knows your lying yet keeping lian because you don't fess up is a concept understood only by lawyers. Read your websites guest book. Yes we are all on to you. Come clean or be silent but don't play that Snobby lying BS where I can read it or I bore this thread with a long boring scathing litany of accurate facts on Chinese culture. You would love my analogy of dui lian. Most puzzling of all is we are allies and if the yellow horde comes marching whose got your back. Maybe we should turn a blind I and miss out on all those wonderful plastic toys you make. Defense Language Institute is the premier language school in the world.

 

[ludahai]

Ludahai. Is that what your mother calls you. I lived in Hudson and Amherst. If you are Chinese then I understand.

I never said that I was Chinese. I am an American living in Taiwan.

If not then how do you come to pick up the Chinese attitude concerning foragers speaking Chinese?

What attitude are you talking about? I only said that I can't read the pinyin you typed on the post.

On another site I type pinyin (Chinese phonetically) with real Chinese ren in mainland China for hours with no problem.

People in China begin using pinyin when they are six years old. In Taiwan, few people can read pinyin. Most use a Chinese phonetic system known locally as bo po mo fo. I am more familiar with that system than I am with Hanyu Pinyin. Furthermore, Hanyu Pinyin is not the dominant form of pinyin in this country, Tongyong and the Wade-Giles systems are more commonly used than Hanyu Pinyin.

Besides I see no characters on this keyboard. Tian bu pa, di bu pa, jui pa yuang guizi shou zhongguo hua.

Then go ahead and use English as the moderator suggested.

Go ahead and pretend you don't understand so as not to dui lian (lose face).

You assume far more than you should. You are an example of the danger of someone having a little knowledge, but not much more than that.

Maybe in China dui lian has it's merits but to Americans it's on the maturity scale just below "I know you are but what am I". Lying to another's face when they know your lying and you know he knows your lying yet keeping lian because you don't fess up is a concept understood only by lawyers.

Again, I am not in CHina, I am in Taiwan. As for "saving face", most Taiwanese people think that most Westerners lack personal honor because they don't know how to "save face."

Read your websites guest book. Yes we are all on to you. Come clean or be silent but don't play that Snobby lying BS where I can read it or I bore this thread with a long boring scathing litany of accurate facts on Chinese culture. You would love my analogy of dui lian. Most puzzling of all is we are allies and if the yellow horde comes marching whose got your back. Maybe we should turn a blind I and miss out on all those wonderful plastic toys you make. Defense Language Institute is the premier language school in the world.

Again, you assume too much. I don't live in China, I live in Taiwan. I haven't used Hanyu Pinyin in many years, so I am not accustomed to using it for reading. You are the only one in this discussion showing any amount of arrogance, that is plain for anyone to see.

 

[Folgore]

What gives us the right to tell people that they cant step over a line and live there? If I remeber correctly we did the same, but much worse. We came in, killed the natives, and set up our own system. Telling people that they cant come into this country to live is hypocracy. We need to stop thinking in terms of nationalism and start thinking of the world as a whole.

In substance I am agree with You, but for reasons that are opposites from Your's. If you close the borders you say that the "american dream" has failed, that the melting pot is a deadly cancer of a society (and to me is so)
Here, in Italia, immigrants come from Nigeria, Senegal, Libia, Pakistan, China, Ucraina, more and more... in few years we will not exist no more.

 

[Hippie]

"These people are taking our jobs, taking our social security, sleeping with our women, "

What a disgusting and sexist remark to make! "our" women as in ownership of a human being? And to assume all immigrants are heterosexual and male is ridiculous! Get some class!

 

[Kyle]

"These people are taking our jobs, taking our social security, sleeping with our women, "

What a disgusting and sexist remark to make! "our" women as in ownership of a human being? And to assume all immigrants are heterosexual and male is ridiculous! Get some class!

..or maybe he mean't women of the same country. I doubt he assumes all immigrants are heterosexual and male. btw, this has nothing to do with the topic of debate..so move along troll. Find something better to do with your time than overanalyzing what people write.

 

[Hippie]

It's obvious what he meant. If he was talking about immigrants sleeping with people from their own country then what does that have to with anything and why would he say "our" women. Why didn't he say "our men" as well.
I am sure he can defend himself and explain what he meant without you jumping in.

 

[Kyle]

It's obvious what he meant. If he was talking about immigrants sleeping with people from their own country then what does that have to with anything and why would he say "our" women. Why didn't he say "our men" as well.
I am sure he can defend himself and explain what he meant without you jumping in.

maybe because he is a man himself? Does it really matter? get a life

 

[Hippie]

He is the one who made a point of bringing up who the immigrants are sleeping with. What does that matter?

 

[shh!]

I agree. Take the people on welfare and make them do the jobs the illegals did. Kill two birds with one stone.

I_bleed_redwhiteandblue!​

When you make the welfare recipients work at these low paying jobs, what will they do with their children while they are gone? After all, many welfare recipients are single parents of multiple young children, and the jobs would not pay enough for child care.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

When you make the welfare recipients work at these low paying jobs, what will they do with their children while they are gone? After all, many welfare recipients are single parents of multiple young children, and the jobs would not pay enough for child care.

single mothers with multiple children from multiple fathers...I don't feel sorry for them...except the kids

It's amazing that all the things we need a license for...driving (with many different types of certifications...CDL, etc.), marriage, hunting, fishing, but the most important thing any of us will ever do doesn't require a license or any sort of qualifications...PARENTING.

 

[shh!]

single mothers with multiple children from multiple fathers...I don't feel sorry for them...except the kids

It's amazing that all the things we need a license for...driving (with many different types of certifications...CDL, etc.), marriage, hunting, fishing, but the most important thing any of us will ever do doesn't require a license or any sort of qualifications...PARENTING.

While I share your frustration about the poor reproducing irresponsibly, I don't see what difference it makes how many different fathers there are. The kids need to be cared for by someone; removing their mother to a low paying job is not the answer, at least not entirely.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

While I share your frustration about the poor reproducing irresponsibly, I don't see what difference it makes how many different fathers there are. The kids need to be cared for by someone; removing their mother to a low paying job is not the answer, at least not entirely.

I don't believe I said anything about the poor. Heck, one of those fathers could be a millionaire or even a former president. Not being able to take care of your children & then having more children on top of that is nothing short of criminal. It is child endangerment. Maybe we shouldn't be looking at removing the parent but rather the child.

 

[shh!]

I don't believe I said anything about the poor. Heck, one of those fathers could be a millionaire or even a former president. Not being able to take care of your children & then having more children on top of that is nothing short of criminal. It is child endangerment. Maybe we shouldn't be looking at removing the parent but rather the child.

(puzzled) Remove the child to where? As it is there is a huge shortage of foster care available. In any case, it seems you have missed the point of my original post.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

(puzzled) Remove the child to where? As it is there is a huge shortage of foster care available. In any case, it seems you have missed the point of my original post.

Try telling my sister & her husband that. Not only have they been foster parents but they would love to adopt. The children they were caring for got put back with the biological mother. One of them has just been hospitalized AGAIN for neglect. I emphasize AGAIN because that was what caused the children to be put into foster care to begin with.

My problem with what you said is that you suggest we give a free ride or even reward someone who has been irresponsible.

 

[akyron]

This is a subject dear to my heart.

Illegal Immigration is crippling our country, in terms of economically and in terms of defense. If we dont close off the borders soon, 9/11 will start happenning on a daily basis.

There are over 11 million illegal immigrants in the US. These people are taking our jobs, taking our social security, sleeping with our women, getting drivers licenses, going to our schools and being educated while our classrooms get overcrowded and so our kids suffer. this whole thing is getting out of control.

We need to close the borders, not only down south, but up north too, Remember, its not racist to make immigration sensible and its not racist to love this great country of ours that our brave men and women in Iraq are fighting for and these illegal immigrants should realize that.

It should be noted that unless you are a native american then you or your ancestors were immigrants as well.


The economic importance of Mexican workers will only continue to grow as job openings for unskilled and semi-skilled workers increase. Governmental and private sector leaders concerned about strengthening the productivity of the American workforce should therefore implement steps to maximize the contributions of Mexican workers and minimize any hindrances associated with their admission and integration into the country.

Maximizing the contributions of Mexican workers can take the form of facilitating the ability of American employers to legally hire needed Mexican workers: to help, as President Bush has said "willing employers to get together with willing employees." NOTE 8 This can be achieved in part by reducing conditions that force employers to unknowingly hire Mexican workers pressured to enter the U.S. illegally to obtain a job. As described earlier, the current system of admissions to the U.S. disfavors Mexican workers in comparison to other immigrants.

The need to increase the number of visas or methods of entry for Mexican workers is clear. Not only would employers be less hindered in responding to worker shortages, but the dramatic human and social consequences of undocumented immigration would be alleviated. Hardworking, taxpaying Mexican Americans contribute to our nation's economy, and without access to them, employers face a more difficult challenge of meeting their labor needs.

Immigration is not crippling anything. It is merely a small part of the grease by which the wheels of the US economy turn.


AILF's findings:

Mexican Workers Are Integral to U.S. Economic Growth. The portion of Mexican workers in the U.S. workforce has doubled during the past decade, as they become more integral to the nation's economic growth. While other immigrant groups also perform these essential worker jobs, the size of the Mexican population makes its impact on the U.S. economy more quantifiable.


Mexican Workers Are Filling Needed Jobs in New Geographic Areas. Mexican workers are becoming increasingly important in locations throughout the nation not previously known for large immigrant populations, including southern states such as Mississippi and Tennessee.


New Jobs Will Not Require Advanced Education. Nearly 43 percent of all job openings by 2010 will require only a minimal education, at a time when native-born Americans are obtaining college degrees in record numbers and are unlikely to accept positions requiring minimal education.


The nation must act to reform immigration laws so that they give the immigration system the integrity to keep Americans safe, while at the same time giving businesses the essential workers they need to succeed. U.S. immigration law must provide ways for Mexican workers to enter and remain in the U.S., in both temporary and permanent status, with protections to assure that they have the dignity and respect they deserve, given the important contributions they make to America. The status quo can no longer be accepted if the United States is to remain the world's leading economy.


If 11 million immigrants are sleeping with your woman you have other things to worry about anyway.

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

from The New Colossus
by Emma Lazarus

 

[shh!]

Try telling my sister & her husband that. Not only have they been foster parents but they would love to adopt. The children they were caring for got put back with the biological mother. One of them has just been hospitalized AGAIN for neglect. I emphasize AGAIN because that was what caused the children to be put into foster care to begin with.

My problem with what you said is that you suggest we give a free ride or even reward someone who has been irresponsible.

No, I didn't. Reread my posts. I am merely being pragmatic and stating the obvious. Allow me to summarize:

1) Welfare recipients often have multiple young children who need caring for.
2) Forcing a welfare mother into a low-paying job will leave those children with nobody to care for them.
3) A low paying job will not pay enough to cover child care costs.

The point I am making is NOT about "rewarding" irresponsible parenting. It is about caring for the existing children. This is not a simplistic problem that can be solved by flipping burgers at the local McDonald's.

By the way, it is too bad about your sister, but - at least where I live - there are very many non-white children in need of homes. Perhaps she would consider expanding her interests.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

No, I didn't. Reread my posts. I am merely being pragmatic and stating the obvious. Allow me to summarize:

1) Welfare recipients often have multiple young children who need caring for.
2) Forcing a welfare mother into a low-paying job will leave those children with nobody to care for them.
3) A low paying job will not pay enough to cover child care costs.

The point I am making is NOT about "rewarding" irresponsible parenting. It is about caring for the existing children. This is not a simplistic problem that can be solved by flipping burgers at the local McDonald's.

By the way, it is too bad about your sister, but - at least where I live - there are very many non-white children in need of homes. Perhaps she would consider expanding her interests.

If you're not suggesting we reward irresponsible parents then what are you suggesting...? You clearly stated that we can't send them to work a low paying job. What qualifications do they have to work a high paying job...& what would you consider to be high paying or at least above the poverty level as to provide enough money for child care? Would you suggest a government run child care program for single parents who make less than...say...$20,000 a year...? In that case we'd be leaving out poor couples with children. That really helps promote family & positive choices. When my wife & I had our son we did what we had to do to ensure he was taken care of & that we had the money to support him. I worked a 2nd shift job while she worked 1st shift so to cut out daycare costs. I know we've been talking about single parents...but... In the summer months my mother would watch my son. Now at different times my sister & her husband (now that they live near us as my bro-in-law is now retired from the military) watch my son & we in turn watch their children when needed. Families need to help each other. Families need to stop being selfish. We all need to stop looking to our government as if they were God to fix every problem that comes along. Especially when in many of these cases (I might even believe most cases) these people are in their predicament because of their own poor choices in life. I know that may sound selfish but I'd rather help a family member or someone in my own neighborhood. In fact that has been the case where I live on some occasions. I think Hillary was a quack when she said it takes a village to raise a child or something like that. I believe help from family & friends is imperative, but government assistance only leads to more dependency.

 

[shh!]

If you're not suggesting we reward irresponsible parents then what are you suggesting...?

I am merely suggesting this: to say we should give welfare mothers the jobs that are being filled by illegal immigrants may create as many social problems as it will solve. C'mon! Admit it is true! You really can't deny it!

Families need to help each other. Families need to stop being selfish.

When you can figure out how to compel people to do this, let me know. And to tie this thought in to the thread's topic, I should think that this commitment to family welfare that you rightly value is being demonstrated by the illegals who sneak in to America to work so they can support their families back in their poor, native countries.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

I am merely suggesting this: to say we should give welfare mothers the jobs that are being filled by illegal immigrants may create as many social problems as it will solve. C'mon! Admit it is true! You really can't deny it!



When you can figure out how to compel people to do this, let me know. And to tie this thought in to the thread's topic, I should think that this commitment to family welfare that you rightly value is being demonstrated by the illegals who sneak in to America to work so they can support their families back in their poor, native countries.

Solutions.....I'm looking for solutions. We know there's a problem. How do we fix it? Leaving it alone only makes it worse.

If the work done by illegals was done legally by Americans maybe the wage would be of the rate that one could afford child care.

I've bailed hay, carried bricks for a mason, cleaned toilets...I've done a lot of crappy jobs (no pun intended...well maybe...LOL).

It ticks me off when, on the news, they say Americans won't do jobs like work in fields/pick fruits & veggies or clean houses. The business my wife owns & operates is a home cleaning service. She does all the work herself...I used to do the work as well. Now I work in another industry (primarily to get insurance...had been without since the late 90s). We didn't hire illegals...nor was that ever an idea. She works part time hours...about 30 hours a week. & makes more money doing that than if she worked full time, 40+ hours per week, at a factory.

It's time for solutions & ideas, instead of excuses.

 

[shh!]

Solutions.....I'm looking for solutions. We know there's a problem. How do we fix it? Leaving it alone only makes it worse.

Your "solutions" do not address the obvious issues they would cause. Therein lies the problem.

If the work done by illegals was done legally by Americans maybe the wage would be of the rate that one could afford child care.

That might be true, but then one wouldn't be able to afford groceries because we would all be paying a higher salary to whomever was out there picking our produce, etc.

By the way, I think it is ironic that you choose "Fonzi" as your screen personna since everyone knows that Henry Winkler is liberal.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

Your "solutions" do not address the obvious issues they would cause. Therein lies the problem.



That might be true, but then one wouldn't be able to afford groceries because we would all be paying a higher salary to whomever was out there picking our produce, etc.

By the way, I think it is ironic that you choose "Fonzi" as your screen personna since everyone knows that Henry Winkler is liberal.

Yeah, & in real life Henry Winkler is a dork. I actually chose the Fonz as a tribute to good quality family entertainment. Not for any political reasons. Plus the Fonz was always right & well...so am I...LOL...

seriously, back to the issue. You still have only offered up excuses; no solutions. Are you a Congressional Democrat?

The problem does not lie in ideas for change but rather in the pessimistic attitude that it can never get better. It lies in the fact that it will take hard work & won't offer any comfort for quite some time. Maybe not even until the next generation or the one after that. This is what our ancestors had to go on. In many cases there was no immediate relief for their struggle. They did it for the future. For us to have it better than they did. They didn't bother to complain that life wasn't fair...that was a given.

 

[shh!]

seriously, back to the issue. You still have only offered up excuses; no solutions. Are you a Congressional Democrat?

No I haven't offered up excuses; I am pointing out the weakness in your solution. I do not claim to have an easy solution to illegal immigration. I don't believe one exists. Throughout history, it should not have escaped your notice that wherever there has been poverty, there have been people trying to escape it. It is human nature.

The problem does not lie in ideas for change but rather in the pessimistic attitude that it can never get better.

So, you are one of those "do something, even if it is wrong" types, even if there are forseeable flaws in your plan? Now, how does THAT make any sense?

 

[akyron]

Immigration is not crippling anything. It is merely a small part of the grease by which the wheels of the US economy turn.



It does however need to be regulated in order to keep track of who is going in and out across US borders given these insecure times.