• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

If trickle down doesn't work......

KLATTU

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
19,259
Reaction score
6,899
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
Ok , everybody knows trickle down is a made up term to describe an economic theory that ddoesn't exist in real life, but let's leave that aside.

If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???
 
Ok , everybody knows trickle down is a made up term to describe an economic theory that ddoesn't exist in real life, but let's leave that aside.

If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???

The unemployment rate was dropping long before that last federal income tax rate tweaking happened. Are you seriously going to ignore that easily checked data?
 
If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???

The same people who were hiring them before. Job creation numbers for the last couple years have been virtually identical to what we saw in 2013-2015 under Obama despite eliminating the Bush Tax cuts and lowering the deficit. Everyone knows deficit spending can help stimulate the economy. That's why President Obama let us run a deficit early on his first term when the economy was struggling. But because he's a responsible person he realizes you can't do that forever which is why he reduced our deficits towards the end of his presidency once the economy came back.

The real question you need to ask yourself is that if Trickle Down does work. Why was it that after roughly 5 years under Bush's tax cuts did we have one of the worst financial crisis in American History? Towards the end of Bush's term, we were loosing almost 800,000 jobs per month despite Tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires that were supposed to create jobs.

If Tax cuts fuel investment then why has the stock market been negative ever since Trump's tax cuts passed?

If deficit spending was such a horrible idea under Obama why does the Republican party seem to love it to death today?

Do you even know what an economic Bubble is and how it's created?
 
Ok , everybody knows trickle down is a made up term to describe an economic theory that ddoesn't exist in real life, but let's leave that aside.

If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???

Trickle down doesn't work because the rich spend their money for a return which extracts more money from the economy, so a governor is required to redistribute some of this money in the form of Government employment.

Just where the governor should be set can be debated, but those who do not acknowledge this factor cannot know what they are doing.

Obama had slow and steady economic growth despite Republican obstructionism.

Trump's tax cut was a little shot in the arm (heroin, needle and hose).
 
Ok , everybody knows trickle down is a made up term to describe an economic theory that ddoesn't exist in real life, but let's leave that aside.

If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???

If this is meant to be serious it is fallacious right off the bat. The fallacy of false cause.

I might as well say if the moon isn't green, why are there all these jobs? There's literally no connection. The job situation has been improving for the last 8 years, so the recent tax cuts have had little to no effect.

If we're going to discuss the merits of trickle down economics just as a mental exercise, the theory is supposed to be that it uplifts everyone, not just minimum wage jobs at Walmart. It is a silly term, unintentionally honest (The rich are going to pee on us and all we get is a 'trickle' anyway) and the fact is it has been demonstrated by these very latest tax cuts that it doesn't work: it just goes into buybacks that benefit the wealthy and creates very little investment and comparatively fewer new jobs. On the other hand more money in everyone's pockets stimulates buying, home investment, small businesses and entrepreneurship.
 
Ok , everybody knows trickle down is a made up term to describe an economic theory that ddoesn't exist in real life, but let's leave that aside.

If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???

Flawed question, on several levels.

"Trickle-down economics" is a theory, an economic proposal, about more wealth in the hands of the wealthy will eventually trickle-down to the rest of society. Said another way, that taxes on businesses and the wealthy should be lower in order to stimulate investment in the short term on the hope that all of society benefits in the long term.

It is not exclusively about unemployment numbers, but rather about all earners benefiting from the highest income earners keeping more of their wealth.

It has been largely disproved as even in our current economic climate unemployment being low we can tell that labor participation is still low, the distance between all the income quintiles continues to grow, and wages for the lower income quintiles are largely flat by trend.

Meaning, the wealthy did get more wealth but it did not trickle down near enough to make the theory plausible. By the numbers the 3rd income quintile (middle) down to the 5th income quintile (lowest) are behind inflation, underwater in relation to the spending power of money year on year, and way behind by every economic measure we can find.

Labor Participation by Trend...
20190129 - Labor Participation.jpg

Income Quintile by Trend...
20190129 - Income Quintiles.jpg

What we are seeing is wages out of sync with productivity, wealth accumulation at the highest getting further away from other income quintiles, less labor participation rate (a good portion due to age,) but also a few other alarming statistics.

* Almost 80% of Americans live "paycheck to paycheck."
* On average Americans are over $100,000 in various forms of debt, on average Americans die with over $60,000 in debt.
* Nearly half of all Americans have no retirement plan or retirement account of any kind.
* Roughly 30% of all Americans have less than $400 in their savings account, another 30% do not have a savings account.
* Less than 15% of Americans have a pension plan at all.
* Over half of the nation cannot afford an emergency $1,000 expense.
* 50-60 years ago over half of the top 10 employers in this nation paid a wage in the 3rd income quintile (middle,) today the majority of the top 10 employers pay a wage at the 5th income quintile (bottom.)

There is no such thing as trickle down economics, and all economic good times means is higher wealth accumulation for the highest earners perhaps impacting the 4th and 3rd income quintiles for a minimal amount of time between recessions. Wealth accumulation at the highest points continues to grow, everyone else is falling behind.
 
The unemployment rate was dropping long before that last federal income tax rate tweaking happened. Are you seriously going to ignore that easily checked data?

The rate which was tweaked was LOW.


The point is that - who does the hiring ?
 
F

"Trickle-down economics" is a theory, an economic proposal, about more wealth in the hands of the wealthy will eventually trickle-down to the rest of society. d.

It's not an economic theory-it's a political one.

And so id wealth does not 'trickle down' form above- who is hiring all these people?
 
If this is meant to be serious it is fallacious right off the bat. The fallacy of false cause.

I might as well say if the moon isn't green, why are there all these jobs? There's literally no connection. The job situation has been improving for the last 8 years, so the recent tax cuts have had little to no effect.
Who's talking about the recent tax cuts?

As all you lefties are quick to point out- the unemployemnt rate has been going down for a long time. A tax cut or tax cut cut is irrelevant -it's context dependent. what really matters is whether they are high or low. And they've been low for quite some time. So tell me- WHO IS DOING ALL THIS HIRING?
 
Ok , everybody knows trickle down is a made up term to describe an economic theory that ddoesn't exist in real life, but let's leave that aside.

If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?

Who's hiring all these people???

Unemployment is low? That must mean employment is up, right?

fredgraph.png


And the cost of living is still increasing faster than wages.

No, our current economic system isn't working. It hasn't worked for decades.
 
It's not an economic theory-it's a political one.

And so id wealth does not 'trickle down' form above- who is hiring all these people?

Wealth does "trickle down" from above in a healthy economy. Very slowly and in very small amounts. Wealth also "trickles up" from below. Very quickly in fact and in much larger amounts even in unhealthy economies. This is the basis of the free market. So therefore why would any economy embrace the trickle down theory, when the trickle up theory works so much better regardless of how well the economy is doing? Maybe because trickle down economics benefits the wealthiest members of society with an artificial boost to profits that is not connected to business performance, and those wealthiest members of society tend to prefer to vote for an economic system that gives them the most profits in the short term?
 
It's not an economic theory-it's a political one.

And so id wealth does not 'trickle down' form above- who is hiring all these people?

I said trickle-down economics is a theory, and it has been largely disproved. If you are going to ignore all the rest of my post it shows why your question is irrelevant.
 
If 'trickle down' doesn't work, why is unemployment so low?
lol

If trickle down works, then why have we still had recessions after Reagan axed top marginal tax rates on the rich?

Why do only 39% of Americans able to cover an emergency that requires $1000 in cash?
 
lol

If trickle down works, then why have we still had recessions after Reagan axed top marginal tax rates on the rich?

Why do only 39% of Americans able to cover an emergency that requires $1000 in cash?
complete non sequitir.

So can you tell us- who is hiring all these people?
 
Who's talking about the recent tax cuts?

As all you lefties are quick to point out- the unemployemnt rate has been going down for a long time. A tax cut or tax cut cut is irrelevant -it's context dependent. what really matters is whether they are high or low. And they've been low for quite some time. So tell me- WHO IS DOING ALL THIS HIRING?

Well I don't have a PhD in economics but, umm, business owners?

Just starting a business and hiring someone does not equal 'trickle down' economics. That's just called 'economics'.

Trickle down refers to the idea that tax cuts and other policies that immediately benefit the wealthy will one day translate to growth and opportunity for everyone.

Ironically term itself was meant derisively:

"The term "trickle-down" originated as a joke by humorist Will Rogers and today is often used to criticize economic policies which favor the wealthy or privileged while being framed as good for the average citizen. David Stockman, who as Ronald Reagan's budget director championed Reagan's tax cuts at first, later became critical of them and told journalist William Greider that "supply-side economics" is the trickle-down idea:[3][4]"

Now me, I tend to do my own homework before starting a thread.
 
Last edited:
What a dumb indicator. "why is unemployment so low" What does it matter if so many jobs still keep people in poverty or just at the brink. Oh, should we bow to the masters for giving people crumbs?

1. Look at the ever increasing wealth disparity, proof all tax cuts do is line the pockets of the rich.
2. Look at the increased rates of poverty
3. Look at the increased number of people in debt
4. Look at the increased number of people with no savings and a paycheck away from homelessness
 
complete non sequitir.

So can you tell us- who is hiring all these people?
LOL

A "non sequitur?" I'm pointing out obvious flaws in your (for lack of a better term) logic.

So: If Trickle Down works, then why is inequality growing? Why was there significantly less inequality when taxes on the wealthy were higher? Why are the already-wealthy collecting nearly all of the income gains over the past 40 years? Why does the middle class feel more squeezed than ever? Why are so many living paycheck to paycheck? Why do people who live in more equal societies have better economic mobility than the US?

As to the unemployment rate? Surprise! A lot of those jobs are people getting exploited by the wealthy. That's why Christy Walton, the widow of John Walton (one of the sons of Walmart's founders) -- who did nothing whatsoever to help Walmart ever earn a profit -- is a multibillionaire, while the rank-and-file Walmart employees have to rely on food stamps.

And again: There is no correlation between tax rates on the wealthy, and unemployment (or LFPR). The rich getting richer does not lower the unemployment rate.

So yes, "Trickle Down" is a bull**** rationalization, used to keep less-affluent conservatives in line, as the rich keep paying off elected officials for bigger and bigger tax cuts -- for themselves, that is.
 
What a dumb indicator. "why is unemployment so low" What does it matter if so many jobs still keep people in poverty or just at the brink. Oh, should we bow to the masters for giving people crumbs?

1. Look at the ever increasing wealth disparity, proof all tax cuts do is line the pockets of the rich.
2. Look at the increased rates of poverty
3. Look at the increased number of people in debt
4. Look at the increased number of people with no savings and a paycheck away from homelessness

!. It would be worse if people had no jobs, courtesy of the job creators.
2. They would be worse if people had no jobs,courtesy of the job creators.
3. There would be more if people had no jobs,courtesy of the job creators.
4. There would be more of them if people had no jobs, courtesy of the job creators.

As I've brilliantly and famously concluded ,leftists are very good at redistributing wealth but woefully clueless about the far bigger problem. How to create it.
#TRUTH.
 
LOL

A "non sequitur?" I'm pointing out obvious flaws in your (for lack of a better term) logic.

So: If Trickle Down works, then why is inequality growing? Why was there significantly less inequality when taxes on the wealthy were higher? Why are the already-wealthy collecting nearly all of the income gains over the past 40 years? Why does the middle class feel more squeezed than ever? Why are so many living paycheck to paycheck? Why do people who live in more equal societies have better economic mobility than the US?

As to the unemployment rate? Surprise! A lot of those jobs are people getting exploited by the wealthy. That's why Christy Walton, the widow of John Walton (one of the sons of Walmart's founders) -- who did nothing whatsoever to help Walmart ever earn a profit -- is a multibillionaire, while the rank-and-file Walmart employees have to rely on food stamps.

And again: There is no correlation between tax rates on the wealthy, and unemployment (or LFPR). The rich getting richer does not lower the unemployment rate.

So yes, "Trickle Down" is a bull**** rationalization, used to keep less-affluent conservatives in line, as the rich keep paying off elected officials for bigger and bigger tax cuts -- for themselves, that is.

^^^^^

AOC fan.

#LAFFRIOT!#LEFTIST PROPAGANDA
 
Back
Top Bottom