If all the democrats voted for wall funding before Trump?

[NeverTrump]

All the top democrats said we needed border protection, but along comes Trump and some miracle happened and they no longer want border protection.
My Question. If they oked it then what happened to the billions they had then, where did it go, what was it spent on?


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They know a wall will never be built.

 

[tecoyah]

No, she's advocating for MORE barrier and fixing existing ones. She wants barriers in places which do not have them now.
I don't care what any swamp creature has to say. I'll take her word and the word of other people who live this every single day.

She specified exactly what you say and that is what is happening and has been for decades....Hell even Obama built quite a bit of it, as did Bush and Clinton.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexico–United_States_barrier

 

[jnug]

Dems did vote for a section of dual barrier fencing at one time, true. From what I understand, it was strategically located. Not sure what ever became of it.

That said, if Trump is not wanting a wall all across the entire southern border, where is he wanting it, and how much does he want? Can we at least have those basics before we complain about not having to spend $5B on a vague idea?

It was part of one of these Lets Make Deal bits of Legislation. $46B of border security for Immigration Policy that Dems could support. As usual, with these lets make a deal Bills, it was lousy legislation. It didn't pass and shouldn't have. All it provides now is cannon fodder for the Right to claim that "Dems supported border security but don't want it now because its Trump's idea".

NOOOOOOO! The border security dollars referred to were the other end of the balance sheet of one of these "Lets Make a Deal" Bills that died. Now all anybody wants to remember of it is one end of the deal without discussing what was on the other end of the balancing act because remembering one end of the deal suits the Right's narrative.

I hate lets make a deal legislation regardless of where it comes from. Trump tried it earlier this year and it FAILED. Dems tried it 6 years ago and it FAILED. Congress needs to have the guts to hack their way through dedicated bits of Legislation and appropriations that are cobbled together on the merits of the specific arguments for that specific legislation and appropriation, not by piling their alternate chips all the way to the ceiling in a mountain of what are actually disassociated issues worked into some insane compromise. What border security you decide to fund should be based on the border security that make sense for this country, not some whacked out compromise predicated on an abundance of legislative and executive malfeasance.

The Executive for its part should propose, which this administration has STILL not as yet done and the Legislature disposes. That is how it works!

 

[trixare4kids]

You’re conflating border protection with the wall. Dems (and most Americans) want improved border protection. Dems (many Republicans, and most Americans) don’t want Trump’s wall.

Looks to me that people who want the wall, don't want the wall are divided by party line and race according to a recent Quinnipiac Poll.

Republicans support the wall 86 - 14 percent. Independent voters are divided as 45 percent support the wall, with 51 percent opposed

It's the Democrats who are by a huge majority, 90%, who are against the wall. Men also are divided as 47 percent support the wall, with 51 percent opposed.

White voters are divided 49 - 50 percent. Opposition is 78 - 16 percent among black voters and 68 - 27 percent among Hispanic voters.

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2590

 

[trixare4kids]

That's my take as well. I'm still waiting to see the reputable study which shows Trump's wall is a cost effective means of achieving it's stated goals.

Has Trump really suggested building this very expensive structure without a clue as to whether it will work? My guess would be yes, because it's not his money so he just doesn't give a fark.

Why would you, a Canadian, even care about the cost effectiveness of a prospective border wall?

 

[RaleBulgarian]

Looks to me that people who want the wall, don't want the wall are divided by party line and race according to a recent Quinnipiac Poll.

Republicans support the wall 86 - 14 percent. Independent voters are divided as 45 percent support the wall, with 51 percent opposed

It's the Democrats who are by a huge majority, 90%, who are against the wall. Men also are divided as 47 percent support the wall, with 51 percent opposed.

White voters are divided 49 - 50 percent. Opposition is 78 - 16 percent among black voters and 68 - 27 percent among Hispanic voters.

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2590

As all those who are included in the poll are Americans, your post is irrelevant and my point stands.

 

[Acadia]

Why would you, a Canadian, even care about the cost effectiveness of a prospective border wall?

Perhaps because Canadians know that the stronger Trump is on illegal immigration and unecessarily prolonging refugee status means more of the same flooding across Canada's border.
#WelcomToCanada!

 

[trixare4kids]

All the top democrats said we needed border protection, but along comes Trump and some miracle happened and they no longer want border protection.
My Question. If they oked it then what happened to the billions they had then, where did it go, what was it spent on?



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In 2006, Democrats were saying ‘build that fence!

WASHINGTON — As a senator, Barack Obama once offered measured praise for the border control legislation that would become the basis for one of Donald Trump’s first acts as president.

“The bill before us will certainly do some good,” Obama said on the Senate floor in October 2006. He praised the legislation, saying it would provide “better fences and better security along our borders” and would “help stem some of the tide of illegal immigration in this country.”

Obama was talking about the Secure Fence Act of 2006, legislation authorizing a barrier along the southern border passed into law with the support of 26 Democratic senators including party leaders like Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, and Chuck Schumer.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/po...ts-embraced/QE7ieCBXjXVxO63pLMTe9O/story.html

What has its impact been?
For starters, the fence was never finished. This was due to a combination of factors, primarily a lack of funding and a change in the political landscape. Republicans lost control of both chambers of Congress in the 2006 midterm elections, and after providing about $1.5 billion for the project in 2007 (the last fiscal year during which the GOP controlled both Congress and the White House) funding began to decline under the Democratic Congress.

That trend continued when President Obama took office, who gave a 2011 speech saying: “The (border) fence is now basically complete.” That claim was rated as “mostly false” by Politifact.

While the government had built 652 miles of fencing on about one-third of the southern border as of 2016, only 36 miles of it was double-layered as required by the Secure Fence Act. Nearly 300 miles of that total was vehicle fencing (think standalone, waist-high metal posts meant to stop cars), which means that those parts of the border are still very accessible to people on foot.

https://www.countable.us/articles/1...mile-fence-built-southern-border-12-years-ago

I would say the money that was appropriated for the doubled layer fence was spent by the same people from the Obama admin., who voted for the Secure Fence Act. on other things...

 

[Lovebug]

All the top democrats said we needed border protection, but along comes Trump and some miracle happened and they no longer want border protection.
My Question. If they oked it then what happened to the billions they had then, where did it go, what was it spent on?


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We need to have some serious talks. Partisan back and forth has been going on for far too long. Heck, how many administrations had the chance to fix this fiasco?
If you want to blame someone, please don't leave anyone out.

 

[trixare4kids]

As all those who are included in the poll are Americans, your post is irrelevant and my point stands.

But you didn't go into the details of your "many Americans" and that makes a big difference when 90% of Democrats overwhelming contributed to your pov.
You probably should have said many MORE Democrats do not want the wall while many MORE Republicans do.

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

You’re conflating border protection with the wall. Dems (and most Americans) want improved border protection. Dems (many Republicans, and most Americans) don’t want Trump’s wall.

That is simply not true. The democrats today and even many establishment republicans absolutely do not want border security. The democrats want to gradually change the voting demographics in all the southwestern border states, especially Texas for the sake of a massive advantage in the electoral college and congressional races, and both democrats and establishment republicans are subservient to their big donors who absolutely do want the cheap labor provided by illegal immigrants.

 

[trixare4kids]

Perhaps because Canadians know that the stronger Trump is on illegal immigration and unecessarily prolonging refugee status means more of the same flooding across Canada's border.
#WelcomToCanada!

In fact, this is happening. the undocumented illegally crossing over into Canada. Maybe his time spent would be better concentrated on what the citizens of his own country are saying...tensions are arising as more and more illegals flood into Canada.

Canada is not so welcoming... #StayAwayIllegals!

Randy Boissonnault, a liberal member of Parliament and a special advisor to Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, visited South Florida this week to try to educate would-be immigrants about the limitations of the Canadian immigration system.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...mmigrants-u-s-heading-north-border/683297002/

 

[RaleBulgarian]

But you didn't go into the details of your "many Americans" and that makes a big difference when 90% of Democrats overwhelming contributed to your pov.
You probably should have said many MORE Democrats do not want the wall while many MORE Republicans do.

Again, irrelevant, as all concerned are Americans.

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

But you didn't go into the details of your "many Americans" and that makes a big difference when 90% of Democrats overwhelming contributed to your pov.
You probably should have said many MORE Democrats do not want the wall while many MORE Republicans do.

The truth is that he is cherry picking polls and likely trusting the same polls that told him that Hillary would be elected president in 2016 and only gave Trump a 16% chance.

 

[trixare4kids]

Again, irrelevant, as all concerned are Americans.

It does matter.
Look at the poll numbers on political lines... The Democrats who voted in the poll are simply Trump resisters and are probably the same people who want the double layered fence your team voted for in 2006; Obama, Schumer, Clinton, and Pelosi. Anything Trump proposes, they resist. The resistance is drawn on party lines. Democrats don't want to give Trump the win even though they were all for it before they suddenly became against it...

The Republicans always wanted strong border barriers.

 

[ttwtt78640]

That is simply not true. The democrats today and even many establishment republicans absolutely do not want border security. The democrats want to gradually change the voting demographics in all the southwestern border states, especially Texas for the sake of a massive advantage in the electoral college and congressional races, and both democrats and establishment republicans are subservient to their big donors who absolutely do want the cheap labor provided by illegal immigrants.

Yep, and the sheeple keep re-electing their congress critters at a rate of over 90% while, somehow, expecting change. Illegal immigration will remain as "an issue" so long as the donor class wants it to be so.

 

[trixare4kids]

The truth is that he is cherry picking polls and likely trusting the same polls that told him that Hillary would be elected president in 2016 and only gave Trump a 16% chance.

So true.
Didn't Quinnipiac say Hillary would win?
Why yes, they did.....

October 19, 2016 - Clinton Tops Trump By 7 Points, Quinnipiac University

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2390

 

[ttwtt78640]

It does matter.
Look at the poll numbers on political lines... The Democrats who voted in the poll are simply Trump resisters and are probably the same people who want the double layered fence your team voted for in 2006; Obama, Schumer, Clinton, and Pelosi. Anything Trump proposes, they resist. The resistance is drawn on party lines. Democrats don't want to give Trump the win even though they were all for it before they suddenly became against it...

The Republicans always wanted strong border barriers.

Keep kidding yourself.

 

[Acadia]

In fact, this is happening. the undocumented illegally crossing over into Canada. Maybe his time spent would be better concentrated on what the citizens of his own country are saying...tensions are arising as more and more illegals flood into Canada.

Canada is not so welcoming... #StayAwayIllegals!


https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...mmigrants-u-s-heading-north-border/683297002/

When Trudeau says that immigrants must come legally or not at all, they praise him. When Trump says it, he's an ogre, "ripping children from their mothers".

 

[trixare4kids]

Keep kidding yourself.

Republicans, as in the people, by majority do want border walls. 90% Republicans according to the Quinnipiac Poll.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

That is simply not true. The democrats today and even many establishment republicans absolutely do not want border security. The democrats want to gradually change the voting demographics in all the southwestern border states, especially Texas for the sake of a massive advantage in the electoral college and congressional races, and both democrats and establishment republicans are subservient to their big donors who absolutely do want the cheap labor provided by illegal immigrants.

What I stated are facts. What you’re stating ^^ is opinion.

 

[trixare4kids]

When Trudeau says that immigrants must come legally or not at all, they praise him. When Trump says it, he's an ogre, "ripping children from their mothers".

I've come to believe that most of these people are liars.
This is the same group I'd imagine that praised Obama for saying we need "secure borders" In 2006, they were shouting build that double layered border fence!
Remember when Obama said, “The bill before us will certainly do some good,” Obama said on the Senate floor in October 2006. He praised the legislation, saying it would provide “better fences and better security along our borders” and would “help stem some of the tide of illegal immigration in this country?"

Oh but when Trump says it, he's a racist xenophobic hater. :lol:

 

[RaleBulgarian]

The truth is that he is cherry picking polls and likely trusting the same polls that told him that Hillary would be elected president in 2016 and only gave Trump a 16% chance.

Your bias has adversely effected your ability to distinguish between reality and a desired Trump eutopia. I can easily find and post more polls from respected groups, can you find one that disagrees with what I’ve posted?

 

[RaleBulgarian]

It does matter.
Look at the poll numbers on political lines... The Democrats who voted in the poll are simply Trump resisters and are probably the same people who want the double layered fence your team voted for in 2006; Obama, Schumer, Clinton, and Pelosi. Anything Trump proposes, they resist. The resistance is drawn on party lines. Democrats don't want to give Trump the win even though they were all for it before they suddenly became against it...

The Republicans always wanted strong border barriers.

1. Your post is nothing more than your opinion.
2. Dems are not my team. I am an Independent. Party loyalty is for suckers.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Republicans, as in the people, by majority do want border walls. 90% Republicans according to the Quinnipiac Poll.

They want to have better interior immigration law enforcement, yet also don't hold anyone accountable when that does not happen. Why do you suppose that the republicant majority did not put wall funding into the 2018 'budget' and yet Trump signed it into law?

The 'deal' seems obvious enough - fund a bit more fencing, call it the Great Wall Of Trump and have (all?) republicants declare promise kept. Or, better yet, find some way to blame the demorats for failing to complete the Great Wall Of Trump and run on planning to finish it, for real next time, yet again.