• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!
  • Welcome to our archives. No new posts are allowed here.

Ideology of Hope

mikeangelo said:
with freedom comes responsibility. The culture we are in does not emphasise responsibilty. It does not produce responsible individuals. It does not celebrate responsible individuals. Our celebraties are people who are total failures. They are alcoholics and junkies. Their marriages fail. Their children are often as messed up as the celebrity themselves. They need to be placed in rehab clinics. The same goes for the politicians. The concept of Freedom has destroyed western society.

This is what freedom has brought to this society. The muslims do not want this inferior thought. As muslims we judge actions by that which pleases the creator.

I need re-educating? Bush talks of spreading Democracy and Freedom throughout the world. These concepts require at their base the thought that Man has the sovereignity to rule as opposed to God.
NO, socialism brought these ills to society. See, you don't even know what freedom is, because you were probably taught in a socialist school. Yes, you need re-educating because you can't even tell what freedom is. Read the Declaration of Independence for starters. You'll find that it is the Creator that has sovereignity, not man.

I'll agree, these ideals are not taught anymore. But these ideals are at our national foundation. We need to get back to them, because it's the only way we can beat these blasted islamo-fascist socialists...
 
Hope springs eternal in the human breast;
Man never Is, but always To be blest:
The soul, uneasy and confin'd from home,
Rests and expatiates in a life to come.

-Alexander Pope,
An Essay on Man, Epistle I, 1733

When a person has nothing to look forward to, no opportunity to improve his condition, when a view of the future is as bleak as the past and the present, then that person has not hope.

Old people consign themselves to their condition and bitterly live out their remaining days. Young people are also bitter but lash out at what they see as their future -- the same as that of the old people around them -- and are filled with resentment and hostility.

Think of the kid who grows up fatherless and uneducated in a slum in some Islamic, tyrannical third world country. For many in this condition, the only future they see is a prison cell or an early, violent death, unless they succumb to disease. They have not hope and, too often, become a living examples of the self-fulfilling prophecy. Life, whether their own or that of others, has little value.

This is the grist for the mill of terrorism. These are the folks who have nothing, and so, have nothing to lose. They are easily recruited to join any group that tells a good story; especially if it includes a full stomach and the promise of adventure.

When the President speaks of an "Ideology of Hope" he recognizes that so long as conditions in many countries remain the way they are, that there can be no improvement in the lives of their people. He recognizes that the prime factor in the condition of many countries is a corrupt, tyrannical government that is concerned only with the welfare of the few at the top and perfectly content to let the people suffer in misery. He believes that the political changes in Afghanistan and Iraq are improving the lives of the people there much the same as the political changes in Poland and the rest of the former satellites of the USSR greatly improved the lives of the people in those countries.

Freely elected governments coupled with opportunities afforded by capitalistic economies raise living standards and provide hope that was formerly non-existent. Countries whose people are enjoying economic prosperity rarely cause trouble for their neighbors.

Witness the Asian countries. Those which have improved their economies by creating a climate which encourages foreign investment have prospered, their people have prospered, and they are benign. Those who have stuck to the old ways are doing poorly, their people live in poverty, and their governments are thorns in the sides of their neighbors.

The situation in Africa is the same.

The President has the right idea. However, the professional Bush haters continue to mock and scoff at anything and everything he proposes. That is understandable. That's the way they are.
 
Fantasea, that was a fantastic post. Very well written. Your last line left me thinking about something though - why do you think he won't say the things that you just did in your post? He talks about the ideology of hope, but won't articulate what he means. I find it very frustrating...
 
Imudman said:
Fantasea, that was a fantastic post. Very well written. Your last line left me thinking about something though - why do you think he won't say the things that you just did in your post? He talks about the ideology of hope, but won't articulate what he means. I find it very frustrating...
I can only surmise that statements such as I made, coming from the President, would be seized upon by his opponents and accusations of "He wants to be Emperor of the World" and "He's going to incite all of the second and third world countries against us.", would never stop. We all know how the spin machines work. The liberal media would have a field day.

The UN, consisting mainly of tyrannical and dictatorial governments would go ballistic.

He's relying on the spread of the infection of freedom from country to country as we have seen with the collapse of the USSR into democratic republics. As more and more information flows through mobile telephones, the internet, cross-border TV, and other sources, people develop an understanding that differs greatly from what they see in their own countries and hear from their governments.

It's strange that the liberals, who claim to be the champion of the underdog, aren't supporting this kind of stuff.
 
look around you man. please just look around you. get off the internet go to the nearest public park and talk to your fellow countrymen.

with regards to sovereignity to God. America describes itself as secular, meaning seperation of Religion from Life's affairs. You are the first person on the planet i have met who says otherwise.

you say that socialism has brought these ills? what are you saying freedom loving capitalists are not like that? Is that your line? Again go in to society and talk to people. Find out their ideas and how they think. Guys I criticise this society not just to beat up on you all. I criticise society so that it will jump start a desire to change it. The basis of our society is corrupt and we need to reform it. It will never improve based on the principles that it works on.

And again Bush will never come out with what we have all said in this post as Bush needs to say that the War is on Islam.

Sir, you have no right to comment on my education.
 
mikeangelo said:
with regards to sovereignity to God. America describes itself as secular, meaning seperation of Religion from Life's affairs. You are the first person on the planet i have met who says otherwise.
Read our Declaration of Independence. Please. You should know about it, since it was sent to the King of England in 1776, AD. It is our birth certificate, so to speak, and it says our rights come from the Creator.

America is not secular! We have a secular government for a reason, that is to let even muslums worship in a land chock-full of christians. But the American people are not secular, and we have agreed to have a secular government so that all people can worship, or not worship, as they see fit. We do not allow the government to dictate to religion (although I'll admit, this is changing due to socialist policies, but that's for another thread.)

you say that socialism has brought these ills? what are you saying freedom loving capitalists are not like that? Is that your line? Again go in to society and talk to people. Find out their ideas and how they think. Guys I criticise this society not just to beat up on you all. I criticise society so that it will jump start a desire to change it. The basis of our society is corrupt and we need to reform it. It will never improve based on the principles that it works on.
See, we agree there are problems with society. You are just wrong when you say it is capitalism that caused the problem. From your posts, I gather you would impose more soicalism if you had your way. Socialism combined with your religion. Well, I've gotta tell you, that won't fly here in America. It just won't fly.

And again Bush will never come out with what we have all said in this post as Bush needs to say that the War is on Islam.
Bush has never, not once, said this is a war on Islam. Remarks like this last one of yours makes me think you're really not so reasonable. Go ahead, prove that Bush has ever said that. Please. If you think this is a war on Islam, then you've been misinformed yet again.

Sir, you have no right to comment on my education.
You asked me to, remember? See post #38089 from yesterday.

Mr. mikeangelo, I implore you to read the founding documents of the USA. Find out what freedom is before you condemn it.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom