Iam not a felon.

[CRUE CAB]

No sir, never been convicted of a felony.
Yet I have people in government and politicians and special interest groups just begging for me to be stripped of my 2A rights.
I have made it to 50, some scrapes with the law when I was younger and not so younger.
Nothing that rises to the level of felony though.
I do the usual, pay my taxes (then watch the money get pissed away), work well over 40 hours a week (over 60 sometimes), support myself and my family, love my family and friends.
I can be violent when it requires it. And have in the protection of myself, family and friends as well as for work.
But 99% of the time I am just a good old southern boy who likes drag racing, guns and a few beers. All separately.
I hear people that have not been able to keep from running astray of the law wanting the same rights as me. Why should they? If I am able to keep my rights? Why not them?
Loss of rights is part of the punishment for their crimes, above and beyond the jail time or probation. Its known going in they will lose some rights if convicted. The shock and surprise of that should not be there.

 

[TurtleDude]

so if the government decides to ban guns will you keep them or comply

 

[CRUE CAB]

so if the government decides to ban guns will you keep them or comply

Simple, I will not turn over any firearms ever. As in never ever not even one.
If they want them bad enough, they will have to come get them.

 

[Goshin]

I'm a felon
you're a felon
he's a felon
wouldn't you like to be a felon too?



You've almost certainly committed undetected felonies and didn't even know it.

We have too many laws on the books, and we've gone way past the point that common sense can keep you out of trouble.


As I mentioned in the other thread, if you went to a foreign country and brought back a potted plant (thinking it was fine and harmless), there is a federal law that says if ANY treaty with ANY country bans that plant from import or export, you committed a FELONY trying to bring it in to the country... whether you knew it or not!

There's lots of what I term "technical felonies".... or bull**** felonies.... and you've probably committed one or two in your lifetime.



We need laws the common man can understand. We can't even get an ACCURATE count of how many federal laws and regulations-with-force-of-law there are... the bureau that is supposed to keep track has to ESTIMATE.

 

[What if...?]

No sir, never been convicted of a felony.
Yet I have people in government and politicians and special interest groups just begging for me to be stripped of my 2A rights.
I have made it to 50, some scrapes with the law when I was younger and not so younger.
Nothing that rises to the level of felony though.
I do the usual, pay my taxes (then watch the money get pissed away), work well over 40 hours a week (over 60 sometimes), support myself and my family, love my family and friends.
I can be violent when it requires it. And have in the protection of myself, family and friends as well as for work.
But 99% of the time I am just a good old southern boy who likes drag racing, guns and a few beers. All separately.
I hear people that have not been able to keep from running astray of the law wanting the same rights as me. Why should they? If I am able to keep my rights? Why not them?
Loss of rights is part of the punishment for their crimes, above and beyond the jail time or probation. Its known going in they will lose some rights if convicted. The shock and surprise of that should not be there.

Can we tell them what they can say and what church to go to too?

Can we force them to testify against themselves going forward?

Search them at will forever?

Why just that one?

 

[CRUE CAB]

Can we tell them what they can say and what church to go to too?

Can we force them to testify against themselves going forward?

Search them at will forever?

Why just that one?

Because that one can have dire consequences.

 

[What if...?]

Because that one can have dire consequences.

The same can be said for all the others.

That's why we codified them.

Because tyrants are threatened by these things.

Any of them can have dire consequences.

Tell our enemies where our troops are.

The inquisition.

Having to testify against oneself.

Being shook down by the state at will.

Try again.

 

[black_squirrel]

Felons are more likely to commit crimes. It was his choice to be a felon. So it is not unfair to take the ability to have guns.

Thieves should not have guns. First we do not know whether he or his companions were carrying guns.Should we take
their word for it?

Our right to be safe from criminals threats from criminals trumps the right of a felon to have guns.

 

[SMTA]

No sir, never been convicted of a felony.
Yet I have people in government and politicians and special interest groups just begging for me to be stripped of my 2A rights.
I have made it to 50, some scrapes with the law when I was younger and not so younger.
Nothing that rises to the level of felony though.
I do the usual, pay my taxes (then watch the money get pissed away), work well over 40 hours a week (over 60 sometimes), support myself and my family, love my family and friends.
I can be violent when it requires it. And have in the protection of myself, family and friends as well as for work.
But 99% of the time I am just a good old southern boy who likes drag racing, guns and a few beers. All separately.
I hear people that have not been able to keep from running astray of the law wanting the same rights as me. Why should they? If I am able to keep my rights? Why not them?
Loss of rights is part of the punishment for their crimes, above and beyond the jail time or probation. Its known going in they will lose some rights if convicted. The shock and surprise of that should not be there.

The US recidivism rate is about 60%.

I disagree with any felon owning guns.

 

[Surtr]

I hear people that have not been able to keep from running astray of the law wanting the same rights as me. Why should they?

Because denying someone Constitutionally guaranteed rights beyond a sentenced punishment is wrong.

 

[TurtleDude]

Felons are more likely to commit crimes. It was his choice to be a felon. So it is not unfair to take the ability to have guns.

Thieves should not have guns. First we do not know whether he or his companions were carrying guns.Should we take
their word for it?

Our right to be safe from criminals threats from criminals trumps the right of a felon to have guns.

depends on the felony. a tax cheat is no more likely to commit crimes with GUNS than someone without a record. That is true with many felonies-such as importing a parrot without a license, many drug addicts, or repeat offender drunk drivers

and again, the federal government does not properly have that power


and given your posting history, you seem hostile to the concept of honest people owning guns

 

[rocket88]

depends on the felony. a tax cheat is no more likely to commit crimes with GUNS than someone without a record. That is true with many felonies-such as importing a parrot without a license, many drug addicts, or repeat offender drunk drivers

and again, the federal government does not properly have that power


and given your posting history, you seem hostile to the concept of honest people owning guns

I think that's an important spot where the laws fail. I would agree with keeping weapons out of the hands of violent felons, but non-violent felons shouldn't be held to the same standard.

 

[CRUE CAB]

Because denying someone Constitutionally guaranteed rights beyond a sentenced punishment is wrong.

I suppose they should have thought about that first.
Obviously their rights at some point meant nothing to them.

 

[CRUE CAB]

The same can be said for all the others.

That's why we codified them.

Because tyrants are threatened by these things.

Any of them can have dire consequences.

Tell our enemies where our troops are.

The inquisition.

Having to testify against oneself.

Being shook down by the state at will.

Try again.

Not part of the OP.

 

[Surtr]

I suppose they should have thought about that first.
Obviously their rights at some point meant nothing to them.

I've accidentally carried in a Post Office before. Should I be permanently stripped of my rights? Because if I got caught, that's exactly what would have happened, regardless of my CHL.

 

[LaMidRighter]

Because that one can have dire consequences.

So can a bunch of idiots with a vote, as evidenced by the elections and reelections of many idiots in D.C. such as Dianne Feinstein, Harry Reid, Obama, Chuck Schumer, John Boehner, Mitch McConnel, Barney Frank, etc. A felon is usually prohibited from many constitutional rights and it's not okay under most circumstances. Yes, I get it, people using weapons or committing violent felonies, sure, give them a post incarceration time to prove to society that they have changed(recidivism is usually within the first five years of release). But you can't smack someone down permanently for a mistake if they are willing to change, I don't mean that as a bleeding heart, I mean there is a constitutional prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment, to me, telling someone they are a lesser citizen no matter what they've already paid towards their "criminal debt" is certainly cruel.

 

[LaMidRighter]

I suppose they should have thought about that first.
Obviously their rights at some point meant nothing to them.

I know a few good people who are ex felons, I know some bad ex felons too. Here's the thing, the ones who decided to turn their lives around did not realize how badly they would be persecuted after their sentence, like professional licenses not being available to them, no access to certain jobs, etc.
Yes, they made bad choices, but after they realized they were on the wrong track and are good citizens they are still being smacked around.

 

[Northern Light]

Are we supposed to think you're clever for creating a whole new thread to counter the old one, when you could have just countered the old thread IN the old thread?

What Kal'Stang did took courage. All you did was whine.

 

[Surtr]

So can a bunch of idiots with a vote, as evidenced by the elections and reelections of many idiots in D.C. such as Dianne Feinstein, Harry Reid, Obama, Chuck Schumer, John Boehner, Mitch McConnel, Barney Frank, etc. A felon is usually prohibited from many constitutional rights and it's not okay under most circumstances. Yes, I get it, people using weapons or committing violent felonies, sure, give them a post incarceration time to prove to society that they have changed(recidivism is usually within the first five years of release). But you can't smack someone down permanently for a mistake if they are willing to change, I don't mean that as a bleeding heart, I mean there is a constitutional prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment, to me, telling someone they are a lesser citizen no matter what they've already paid towards their "criminal debt" is certainly cruel.

Most states restore voting rights after a sentence is disposed. I believe there are only two states that impose a permanent ban on voting rights for convicted felons. Other states never impose a ban, some even give inmates still serving time ballots to fill out.

 

[LaMidRighter]

Most states restore voting rights after a sentence is disposed. I believe there are only two states that impose a permanent ban on voting rights for convicted felons. Other states never impose a ban, some even give inmates still serving time ballots to fill out.

True, but just about every state hits felons with other prohibitions such as professional license bans, the federal hits them for their second amendment rights, etc. To me none of that is fair on a permanent basis.

 

[douglas]

Harvey Silverglate estimates that in 2009, the average American commits about three federal felonies per day.

We're All Felons, Now - Reason.com

To strip someone of their 2A rights for a felony was a great idea when "felony"= Rape, Murder, or Grand Theft; now that you can't wipe your own butt without committing a felony, we need a law to specifically strip 2A rights in "violent" felonies, instead of just any law they call a felony. I feel safer when people in my neighborhood are packing heat, it keeps down crime rates; when I hear about some of my neighbors who got convicted of completely non-violent felonies, decades ago, it makes me feel helpless at what the government could do to me and mine. These are often good people, and they could protect society via herd immunity simply by owning a gun. To strip 2A rights from every "felony", independent of whether there was violence, makes me and everyone else just a little less safe. I shouldn't be paying tax money to make me less safe.

 

[Surtr]

True, but just about every state hits felons with other prohibitions such as professional license bans, the federal hits them for their second amendment rights, etc. To me none of that is fair on a permanent basis.

I agree. Even worse is that most employers now do criminal background checks. Got a felony? Good luck getting a job. There's a reason why the recidivism rate is so high. I'd say it's why the recidivism rate is so high. These people can't get real jobs that can pay the bills, so they either do something that will violate their parole, and send them back to where they know they'll have food and a roof over their head, or they go back to living how they used to, because nobody is going to give them a chance, so **** it. Went through all of that with my brother, and it's hard on a family. Even after serving in the Marines, society told him to piss off, because he'd never be anything but a dirty criminal. It's wrong, and dpes nothing to benefit society at all.

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

Simple, I will not turn over any firearms ever. As in never ever not even one.
If they want them bad enough, they will have to come get them.

Congratulations. You realize that would make you a felon, right?

 

[TheNextEra]

Loss of rights is part of the punishment for their crimes, above and beyond the jail time or probation. Its known going in they will lose some rights if convicted. The shock and surprise of that should not be there.

If the person is not to be trusted with consitutional rights, then why are they out of jail?

Sorry, but if the person is so much a threat to society that they can't own a firearm, they shouldn't be on the streets then.

 

[haymarket]

The US recidivism rate is about 60%.

I disagree with any felon owning guns.

So if a person has a criminal record but has served their time and is back in society - you would deny them their Second Amendment rights?

Would you also deny them their other Constitutional rights or are you simply arbitrarily selecting just Second Amendment rights?

Do you distinguish between a person who committed a crime with a weapon as opposed to a person whose crime did not involve a weapon?