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Hyper-partisans - Where do you draw the line?

Keridan

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I would specify that this thread is aimed at folks who know what moderation is or who aren't extremists themselves, but the whole point is that they can't tell.

In threads on both sides of the aisle the last several days, I have hit the same extremism that made me wander off political boards for a year or so. I really enjoy a good debate and I think this board does far better than most. I actually enjoy being proven wrong and pulled to the other side or at least arguing with someone who can see something outside their views even if they don't agree with me in the end.

Unfortunately, we all know the extremists. The folks that will hold tight to their views no matter how categorically proven wrong or who have no concept of their own failures in logic. There are a ton of them mixed in with all the intelligent folks here.

My question is this; where do you just drop them? I'm not the type of guy who needs to get the last word and I know that you will never end an argument with a hyper-partisan on a reasonable note. I often find myself walking away and pitying them on how much they miss.

Where do you personally draw the line? Do you feel a couple tries is enough to show them logic? Do you keep it up in hopes that you will convince them or the other fools who believe as they do? Do you just see a name and not think it's worth responding? Does the first sign of refusing to even read opposing views make you give up on them anymore?

Share your thoughts. I would enjoy if this thread didn't turn into a hate-fest, but I'm not a moderator. Please try to keep your responses to I statements and not attacks on any other person.
 
I use ignore a lot for the most extreme ... or for the ones who seem most committed to saying outrageous things that even they might not believe ... they just like the reaction.

Every now and then I take someone off ignore for some reason -- maybe because it's a topic where I'm actually curious what they'll think. Then I get quickly fed up and put them back on ignore.

When someone starts claiming I said something I didn't say, it's very easy for me to walk away. If they don't get to that point quickly, I'll sometimes go three or so rounds with them before I decide to get off the carousel. There are few whom I expect to come close to a meeting of the minds with. But, hey, we both get to vent.
 
I use ignore a lot for the most extreme ... or for the ones who seem most committed to saying outrageous things that even they might not believe ... they just like the reaction.

Every now and then I take someone off ignore for some reason -- maybe because it's a topic where I'm actually curious what they'll think. Then I get quickly fed up and put them back on ignore.

When someone starts claiming I said something I didn't say, it's very easy for me to walk away. If they don't get to that point quickly, I'll sometimes go three or so rounds with them before I decide to get off the carousel. There are few whom I expect to come close to a meeting of the minds with. But, hey, we both get to vent.

Seems like you have a pretty good set of guidelines. I always have trouble keeping to simple rules on it. I was raised by a very ardent republican (80s, not today) lawyer and a very strong-willed democrat professor of economics. I always feel like there is another argument to be made, even having been shown my whole life how pointless it can become.

I've been thinking I might enjoy the debate more if I could clearly define where I spend my energy. Moderate isn't the right word for me because I fall on both sides, but not without strong feelings. I don't get worked up over internet arguments, but I enjoy them more when I spend my time in the right places.
 
Seems like you have a pretty good set of guidelines. I always have trouble keeping to simple rules on it. I was raised by a very ardent republican (80s, not today) lawyer and a very strong-willed democrat professor of economics. I always feel like there is another argument to be made, even having been shown my whole life how pointless it can become.

I've been thinking I might enjoy the debate more if I could clearly define where I spend my energy. Moderate isn't the right word for me because I fall on both sides, but not without strong feelings. I don't get worked up over internet arguments, but I enjoy them more when I spend my time in the right places.


Some people rhetorically ask whether any minds have been changed on internet forums. I am a most definite yes. My mind was changed. A progressive Republican on the forum I was at in 2010 or so drew me out of my casual moderate rightwing mindset ... didn't change me quickly but set the wheels in motion.
 
I would specify that this thread is aimed at folks who know what moderation is or who aren't extremists themselves, but the whole point is that they can't tell.

In threads on both sides of the aisle the last several days, I have hit the same extremism that made me wander off political boards for a year or so. I really enjoy a good debate and I think this board does far better than most. I actually enjoy being proven wrong and pulled to the other side or at least arguing with someone who can see something outside their views even if they don't agree with me in the end.

Unfortunately, we all know the extremists. The folks that will hold tight to their views no matter how categorically proven wrong or who have no concept of their own failures in logic. There are a ton of them mixed in with all the intelligent folks here.

My question is this; where do you just drop them? I'm not the type of guy who needs to get the last word and I know that you will never end an argument with a hyper-partisan on a reasonable note. I often find myself walking away and pitying them on how much they miss.

Where do you personally draw the line? Do you feel a couple tries is enough to show them logic? Do you keep it up in hopes that you will convince them or the other fools who believe as they do? Do you just see a name and not think it's worth responding? Does the first sign of refusing to even read opposing views make you give up on them anymore?

Share your thoughts. I would enjoy if this thread didn't turn into a hate-fest, but I'm not a moderator. Please try to keep your responses to I statements and not attacks on any other person.

My line is on public view, both in my tagline (below), and posted on my blog: https://www.debatepolitics.com/blogs/captain-adverse/1391-time-re-introduce-myself.html

I also adhere to my tagline, I stop responding for the following three reasons.:

1. I feel that I've made my point already and really don't feel like repeating it.

2. The post is fallacious in some way (emotional appeal, ad hominin, red herring, straw man, false dilemma, etc.) therefore trolling and I simply chose not to respond.

3. There is no real issue to respond to, it's just an opinion or an assertion I have no interest in.

Basically, when the member either attacks me personally, tries to create a new argument, or just keeps re-asserting something as opposed to addressing the point I made...I consider they have lost the argument and I don't need to post anymore.
 
I would specify that this thread is aimed at folks who know what moderation is or who aren't extremists themselves, but the whole point is that they can't tell.

In threads on both sides of the aisle the last several days, I have hit the same extremism that made me wander off political boards for a year or so. I really enjoy a good debate and I think this board does far better than most. I actually enjoy being proven wrong and pulled to the other side or at least arguing with someone who can see something outside their views even if they don't agree with me in the end.

Unfortunately, we all know the extremists. The folks that will hold tight to their views no matter how categorically proven wrong or who have no concept of their own failures in logic. There are a ton of them mixed in with all the intelligent folks here.

My question is this; where do you just drop them? I'm not the type of guy who needs to get the last word and I know that you will never end an argument with a hyper-partisan on a reasonable note. I often find myself walking away and pitying them on how much they miss.

Where do you personally draw the line? Do you feel a couple tries is enough to show them logic? Do you keep it up in hopes that you will convince them or the other fools who believe as they do? Do you just see a name and not think it's worth responding? Does the first sign of refusing to even read opposing views make you give up on them anymore?

Share your thoughts. I would enjoy if this thread didn't turn into a hate-fest, but I'm not a moderator. Please try to keep your responses to I statements and not attacks on any other person.

When I get to the point of repeating myself. A lot of times anymore I just make side commentary. To get into a real debate requires too much time and effort to put together a cogent sailable argument supported by solid and substantial facts with all the trimmings associated including sources, only to get bogged down in got ya games. There are also people I tend to avoid, (redacted) comes to mind in particular, though I am currently running an experiment on him right now to see how OCD he is in quantifiable terms. Most times I get my 2 cents :twocents: in and leave it at that anymore. No point going at something ad nauseam. Mainly I am here to chat a bit and throw my opinion out and occasionally have an interesting debate with reasonable people without getting hostile. That last seems to be more difficult to do anymore.
 
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Some people rhetorically ask whether any minds have been changed on internet forums. I am a most definite yes. My mind was changed. A progressive Republican on the forum I was at in 2010 or so drew me out of my casual moderate rightwing mindset ... didn't change me quickly but set the wheels in motion.

I've had my mind changed on certain points to be certain! I enjoy that most of all! It means I am smart enough to be open to new ideas. I like feeling good about being wrong :)

I have to agree that there are some folks out here like us with open minds and that's why I love debate. It's also just plain informative sometimes.

My line is on public view, both in my tagline (below), and posted on my blog: https://www.debatepolitics.com/blogs/captain-adverse/1391-time-re-introduce-myself.html



Basically, when the member either attacks me personally, tries to create a new argument, or just keeps re-asserting something as opposed to addressing the point I made...I consider they have lost the argument and I don't need to post anymore.

I've read and agreed with your signature many times. I personally am content declaring victory in my head if I've tried my best and they have resorted only to the tactics you list. Sometimes I'm better than others at letting it go, though. I'm trying to do what you did and find a simple set of rules that will cause me to get less aggravated and just be happy that my point was made and not need to declare a "winner" on an internet debate.

Thank you both for your input.
 
When I get to the point of repeating myself. A lot of times anymore I just make side commentary. To get into a real debate requires too much time and effort to put together a cogent sailable argument supported by solid and substantial facts with all the trimmings associated including sources, only to get bogged down in got ya games. There are also people I tend to avoid, AgentJ comes to mind in particular, though I am currently running an experiment on him right now to see how OCD he is in quantifiable terms. Most times I get my 2 cents :twocents: in and leave it at that anymore. No point going at something ad nauseam. Mainly I am here to chat a bit and throw my opinion out and occasionally have an interesting debate with reasonable people without getting hostile. That last seems to be more difficult to do anymore.

Thank you for your input and I like the general guidelines you shared. I will please ask you to avoid any direct names. I'm really hoping this thread will keep to a simple topic of finding where a good place to call it quits is.
 
I would specify that this thread is aimed at folks who know what moderation is or who aren't extremists themselves, but the whole point is that they can't tell.

In threads on both sides of the aisle the last several days, I have hit the same extremism that made me wander off political boards for a year or so. I really enjoy a good debate and I think this board does far better than most. I actually enjoy being proven wrong and pulled to the other side or at least arguing with someone who can see something outside their views even if they don't agree with me in the end.

Unfortunately, we all know the extremists. The folks that will hold tight to their views no matter how categorically proven wrong or who have no concept of their own failures in logic. There are a ton of them mixed in with all the intelligent folks here.

My question is this; where do you just drop them? I'm not the type of guy who needs to get the last word and I know that you will never end an argument with a hyper-partisan on a reasonable note. I often find myself walking away and pitying them on how much they miss.

Where do you personally draw the line? Do you feel a couple tries is enough to show them logic? Do you keep it up in hopes that you will convince them or the other fools who believe as they do? Do you just see a name and not think it's worth responding? Does the first sign of refusing to even read opposing views make you give up on them anymore?

Share your thoughts. I would enjoy if this thread didn't turn into a hate-fest, but I'm not a moderator. Please try to keep your responses to I statements and not attacks on any other person.

When all the poster has is a logic fallacy, a personal attack, or attempts to rewrite my words, I draw the line and say good-bye for awhile.
I don't put anyone on formal ignore, but I will mentally ignore that poster until they decide to change their ways. Some never learn and those people are simply trolls and deserve no second chances with me.
 
When all the poster has is a logic fallacy, a personal attack, or attempts to rewrite my words, I draw the line and say good-bye for awhile.
I don't put anyone on formal ignore, but I will mentally ignore that poster until they decide to change their ways. Some never learn and those people are simply trolls and deserve no second chances with me.

Makes total sense.

To those reading and responding, I appreciate it and have a question. How much does your pride or stubbornness bother you when you have to let a moron feel like they won? I admit it bothers me much more than it should as a reasonable adult.
 
Thank you for your input and I like the general guidelines you shared. I will please ask you to avoid any direct names. I'm really hoping this thread will keep to a simple topic of finding where a good place to call it quits is.

I redacted the name for ya.
 
I redacted the name for ya.

Thanks for that. I understand your point, but I'm no mod and can't control anything. I'm just trying not to let my thread become personal anywhere.
 
Makes total sense.

To those reading and responding, I appreciate it and have a question. How much does your pride or stubbornness bother you when you have to let a moron feel like they won? I admit it bothers me much more than it should as a reasonable adult.


I dont care, I am used to dealing with stupid. Sometimes it can even be entertaining.
 
Thanks for that. I understand your point, but I'm no mod and can't control anything. I'm just trying not to let my thread become personal anywhere.

No worries. :cheers:
 
For me it depends on what mood I'm in. Lately though I just stop replying to some folks, it's senseless. Some people are on here just to disagree never really adding to any conversation. I find a lot of people are on here strictly to agitate, so sometimes I play sometimes I don't, it's the mood thing. What doesn't really surprise me and yet it does, is the amount of raw hatred from some folks. If you don't agree with them, do I need to say more? I thought the whole point is to try to get the other person to come to your side? Nah, it's name calling, insulting and taunting. I am guilty because the stupidity of some comments irk me so much I can't resist.

After all is said and done, it's the internet, so people can feel free to be more cruel.
 
....

To those reading and responding, I appreciate it and have a question. How much does your pride or stubbornness bother you when you have to let a moron feel like they won? I admit it bothers me much more than it should as a reasonable adult.


It's frustrating. But I find posting a face palm picture or a condescending Jennifer Lawrence helps me wrap things up as I shake the dust off my heels and walk away. :lol:


giphy.gif
 
For me it depends on what mood I'm in. Lately though I just stop replying to some folks, it's senseless. Some people are on here just to disagree never really adding to any conversation. I find a lot of people are on here strictly to agitate, so sometimes I play sometimes I don't, it's the mood thing. What doesn't really surprise me and yet it does, is the amount of raw hatred from some folks. If you don't agree with them, do I need to say more? I thought the whole point is to try to get the other person to come to your side? Nah, it's name calling, insulting and taunting. I am guilty because the stupidity of some comments irk me so much I can't resist.

After all is said and done, it's the internet, so people can feel free to be more cruel.

Totally understandable! In a bad mood, I find myself engaging more than I should. Getting nasty actually hurts my argument and I know it, but snarky sometimes is just so easy and they keep feeding me bait. Not an excuse, but the reason I do it sometimes. I try to stop myself because I know the reason isn't good enough.

I guess if everyone were here for a real debate and discussion, the posts would be cut by half and we might have some awkward ends to conversations. But I definitely see the folks out here to strictly to agitate. Hence my OP.

Thanks for the input!
 
It's frustrating. But I find posting a face palm picture or a condescending Jennifer Lawrence helps me wrap things up as I shake the dust off my heels and walk away. :lol:


giphy.gif

Not a fan of J-Law (ironically for political reasons) but I totally agree with your point :)
 
I would specify that this thread is aimed at folks who know what moderation is or who aren't extremists themselves, but the whole point is that they can't tell.

In threads on both sides of the aisle the last several days, I have hit the same extremism that made me wander off political boards for a year or so. I really enjoy a good debate and I think this board does far better than most. I actually enjoy being proven wrong and pulled to the other side or at least arguing with someone who can see something outside their views even if they don't agree with me in the end.

Unfortunately, we all know the extremists. The folks that will hold tight to their views no matter how categorically proven wrong or who have no concept of their own failures in logic. There are a ton of them mixed in with all the intelligent folks here.

My question is this; where do you just drop them? I'm not the type of guy who needs to get the last word and I know that you will never end an argument with a hyper-partisan on a reasonable note. I often find myself walking away and pitying them on how much they miss.

Where do you personally draw the line? Do you feel a couple tries is enough to show them logic? Do you keep it up in hopes that you will convince them or the other fools who believe as they do? Do you just see a name and not think it's worth responding? Does the first sign of refusing to even read opposing views make you give up on them anymore?

Share your thoughts. I would enjoy if this thread didn't turn into a hate-fest, but I'm not a moderator. Please try to keep your responses to I statements and not attacks on any other person.

When I dismiss you, you will know when you have reached the line.
 
Makes total sense.

To those reading and responding, I appreciate it and have a question. How much does your pride or stubbornness bother you when you have to let a moron feel like they won? I admit it bothers me much more than it should as a reasonable adult.

I've learned to just say :2wave: when dealing with "morons" who think they have won the argument. What have they won?
The winner walks away, cuts their losses because there is no sense dealing with miserable people.
 
Give you points for succinct, but could you elaborate on what gets you to this point?

No.

Perhaps you could do a search of all the times I've dismissed people. That should give you an idea. Otherwise, just be yourself. As I said...if you reach the line, you'll know it.
 
I've learned to just say :2wave: when dealing with "morons" who think they have won the argument. What have they won?
The winner walks away, cuts their losses because there is no sense dealing with miserable people.

Cant' argue with that logic! I don't deny it's the petty version of me that wants to make them see the light.

No.

Perhaps you could do a search of all the times I've dismissed people. That should give you an idea. Otherwise, just be yourself. As I said...if you reach the line, you'll know it.

Fair enough. Of course I totally won't search your history, but I don't argue your logic.
 
I would specify that this thread is aimed at folks who know what moderation is or who aren't extremists themselves, but the whole point is that they can't tell.

In threads on both sides of the aisle the last several days, I have hit the same extremism that made me wander off political boards for a year or so. I really enjoy a good debate and I think this board does far better than most. I actually enjoy being proven wrong and pulled to the other side or at least arguing with someone who can see something outside their views even if they don't agree with me in the end.

Unfortunately, we all know the extremists. The folks that will hold tight to their views no matter how categorically proven wrong or who have no concept of their own failures in logic. There are a ton of them mixed in with all the intelligent folks here.

My question is this; where do you just drop them? I'm not the type of guy who needs to get the last word and I know that you will never end an argument with a hyper-partisan on a reasonable note. I often find myself walking away and pitying them on how much they miss.

Where do you personally draw the line? Do you feel a couple tries is enough to show them logic? Do you keep it up in hopes that you will convince them or the other fools who believe as they do? Do you just see a name and not think it's worth responding? Does the first sign of refusing to even read opposing views make you give up on them anymore?

Share your thoughts. I would enjoy if this thread didn't turn into a hate-fest, but I'm not a moderator. Please try to keep your responses to I statements and not attacks on any other person.

I am not an old hand here. So far I just look at the topics. If its something that interests me I will engage. Sometimes the topic was just a hook to draw people in. If I see its not something I wish to pursue and no attempt at honest debate I will just drop it and move on. You quickly identify ideologues that are best just to leave to their own purposes. I find most people to be at least civil. I am not a perfect person nor do I expect others to be.
 
No one considers their self an extremist. Everyone thinks they are moderate and sane, no matter how crazy extreme they actually are.

I have a simple way to determine of someone is an extremist -- do they agree with one party, or ideological group, on every single issue, and disagree with the other party on every single issue?
 
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