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Husband charged with beating wife's would-be rapist to death

Dragonfly

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Husband charged with beating wife's would-be rapist to death - CNN.com



Would you charge this guy with a crime?

More importantly, would you convict him of a crime, and what sentence would you impose?

Would you send this guy to jail?

How long was this guy with the wife, cause they way I see it if he was hanging out with her for say half hour and had not raped her I dont see why we should assume that he ever would. I could probably settle for manslaughter 10-12.
 

HonestJoe

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Would you charge this guy with a crime?
It’s impossible to give any legitimate answer on the basis of the limited information in that article. That’s why we have judges and juries to carefully consider all of the evidence in detail and specifically not the limited information as spun by the tabloid media.

As a general matter of principle, I don’t think someone (believed) to have committed or have been going to commit a serious crime is justification to violently attack or kill them. Violence can be justified in immediate self-defence or defence of others though the intent in that case should be only what is necessary to end the threat. How it is dealt with when someone does overstep the line in the heat of the moment (as appears to be the case here) is difficult and I’m not sure there is an easy “right” answer.
 

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In the hands of the jury, it is very likely that he walks.
 

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Husband charged with beating wife's would-be rapist to death - CNN.com

Would you charge this guy with a crime?

More importantly, would you convict him of a crime, and what sentence would you impose?

Would you send this guy to jail?

It's an interesting story. She called her husband. Were the.cops called? He was outside the apartment when the husband attacked him. Ah, still, With the info presented, I think the prosecutor did the right thing. Let the court or a jury figure it out. If the husband says the guy came at him, he easily walks assuming there is no one to contradict his testimony.

The would-be rapist wasn't playing with a full deck.
 

ludin

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shouldn't have been charged or arrested.
 

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Husband charged with beating wife's would-be rapist to death - CNN.com



Would you charge this guy with a crime?

More importantly, would you convict him of a crime, and what sentence would you impose?

Would you send this guy to jail?

Here's the problem I have with the scenario as presented, what if he was wrong? From the article, he met up with the rapist in the hallway. So this sounds like he wasn't currently raping or threatening anyone. How did he know this was his wife's attacker? Did he just assume? Which if so means he could have been wrong (not saying he was wrong here only that he could have been) and killed an innocent man in a fit of rage. Killing in actual defense is absolutely justified. As revenge, not so much. Even if this is somewhere in between, he should have subdued the guy.

I think there is a lot of information missing though and doubt the guy will actually be convicted without some pretty strong evidence that the man killed was no longer a threat and that the "killer" didn't know (from either the wife or cousin) that the man he was attacking was actually his wife's attacker and he just guessed.
 

Captain Adverse

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This was not an act of self-defense.

It was an act of retaliation.

In the first instance a person is protected by the affirmative defense their life and limb were in danger.

In the second case, no such defense exists. Instead, the person should be faced with at least some level of Manslaughter charge charge depending on whether it was negligent (car accident), or non-negligent as in this case. It could also be Second Degree Murder if he had come armed with willful intent to cause mayhem leading to a death.

From the video it is clear that the man was coming prepared for mayhem after being called by his wife. She did not call the police, she called her husband. He attacked the person his wife alleged was trying to molest her. Since the facts are not clear and a person is dead, it is right and proper for a criminal trial to ensue.

I think the Prosecutor is bowing to public opinion rather than doing their job in charging him with such lesser offenses.
 
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Should anything bad, at all, happen to a potential rapist or child molester or whoever? I don't get hearts hemorrhaging for criminals, with rarely more than a passing mention of the victim, like the victim is now just being unreasonably spiteful. To me, if "Justice" means ya gotta do everything for the perpetrator and feel sorry for him and impact his life as little as possible for his sake then **** that, I'll take vengeance instead.
 

Ntharotep

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There's not nearly enough information but with what is presented I might make the husband pick up a candy wrapper and throw it away if one could be found nearby and he didn't have to go too far out of his way.
 

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This was not an act of self-defense.

It was an act of retaliation.

In the first instance a person is protected by the affirmative defense their life and limb were in danger.

In the second case, no such defense exists. Instead, the person should be faced with at least some level of Manslaughter charge charge depending on whether it was negligent (car accident), or non-negligent as in this case. It could also be Second Degree Murder if he had come armed with willful intent to cause mayhem leading to a death.

From the video it is clear that the man was coming prepared for mayhem after being called by his wife. She did not call the police, she called her husband. He attacked the person his wife alleged was trying to molest her. Since the facts are not clear and a person is dead, it is right and proper for a criminal trial to ensue.

I think the Prosecutor is bowing to public opinion rather than doing their job in charging him with such lesser offenses.

You bring up a really good point which makes me suspicious about the whole situation. Why didn't she call the police? Why did she call her husband? Most cell phones allow you to call the police without even unlocking the phone. There's definitely missing info here.
 

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Legally I see an importance difference between this case and that case. In the Texas case the father actually walked in on the rape. He, arguably, used force to STOP the rape. In this new case it appears the wife was no longer in danger. This attack seems to be retaliatory. So, from the perspective of the DA I can see why they may feel compelled to level SOME kind of charge against the husband.

That said, if I was on the jury, and the dead man did in fact try to rape his wife, no way in hell do I convict him.
 

ksu_aviator

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Legally I see an importance difference between this case and that case. In the Texas case the father actually walked in on the rape. He, arguably, used force to STOP the rape. In this new case it appears the wife was no longer in danger. This attack seems to be retaliatory. So, from the perspective of the DA I can see why they may feel compelled to level SOME kind of charge against the husband.

That said, if I was on the jury, and the dead man did in fact try to rape his wife, no way in hell do I convict him.

There is no such thing as no longer in danger when the person that perpetrated the attack remains in the area.

That being said, I'm not sure I believe the whole story. If he had come into the apartment and the attacker was there I could see his reaction. But the guy was standing in the hallway. How could he be certain that was the guy? I'm sure he was on the phone with the wife and she probably told him he had left, and maybe she told him he didn't have a shirt on. But, the chances of two men being in the area without their shirts on is pretty high. If it was me, I wouldn't have beat him to death because I would have questioned if it was the guy. But, if he can show he knew it was the guy, I would believe that his rage would have been difficult to contain. There is a valid legal defense that usually applies to men who catch their wives cheating and lose control. It doesn't excuse them from their act, but it does get a reduced sentence.
 

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If the evidence plays out to support the story, he should be acquitted. The story could be very sketchy were it not for the presence of the second family member. You could theorize that it was an affair...a lovers triangle, etc. But...a career criminal with corroborating witness testimony...nah.

Maybe they settle out of court...no contest to reduced charges of something like aggravated assault, sentenced to parole, record expunged after 3-5 years with no arrests. Thats something everyone could live with.
 

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There is no such thing as no longer in danger when the person that perpetrated the attack remains in the area.

I think, legally, there is such a thing. If the person is fleeing the scene of the crime, in most jurisdictions you can't use lethal force on them.

That being said, I'm not sure I believe the whole story. If he had come into the apartment and the attacker was there I could see his reaction. But the guy was standing in the hallway. How could he be certain that was the guy? I'm sure he was on the phone with the wife and she probably told him he had left, and maybe she told him he didn't have a shirt on. But, the chances of two men being in the area without their shirts on is pretty high. If it was me, I wouldn't have beat him to death because I would have questioned if it was the guy. But, if he can show he knew it was the guy, I would believe that his rage would have been difficult to contain. There is a valid legal defense that usually applies to men who catch their wives cheating and lose control. It doesn't excuse them from their act, but it does get a reduced sentence.

I agree with all of that.
 

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Husband charged with beating wife's would-be rapist to death - CNN.com



Would you charge this guy with a crime?

More importantly, would you convict him of a crime, and what sentence would you impose?

Would you send this guy to jail?

Yes. We live in a society where we have agreed to allow our legal system to administer justice. While we all can empathize with this man, he still has a responsibility to live by the laws of the nation he lives in. BUT, I also know that in the same situation, I would have most likely done the same thing, the only difference would be, I would have just beaten him unconscious, tossed him in the back of my truck and drove him out to the woods to finish him off, stuffed his body in a lava cave and let the coyotes do the rest. If I got caught, I'd still be subject to the law...
 

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Yes. We live in a society where we have agreed to allow our legal system to administer justice. While we all can empathize with this man, he still has a responsibility to live by the laws of the nation he lives in. BUT, I also know that in the same situation, I would have most likely done the same thing, the only difference would be, I would have just beaten him unconscious, tossed him in the back of my truck and drove him out to the woods to finish him off, stuffed his body in a lava cave and let the coyotes do the rest. If I got caught, I'd still be subject to the law...

And then pray you get someone like me on your jury. :) *cough* jury nullification *cough*
 

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Should anything bad, at all, happen to a potential rapist or child molester or whoever? I don't get hearts hemorrhaging for criminals, with rarely more than a passing mention of the victim, like the victim is now just being unreasonably spiteful. To me, if "Justice" means ya gotta do everything for the perpetrator and feel sorry for him and impact his life as little as possible for his sake then **** that, I'll take vengeance instead.

Really, there is a difference between stopping an attack and killing or seriously hurting the person as a result and attacking someone that was doing nothing towards another person at the time of your attack. In the former example it is an act of third party self defense that went a bit too far perhaps, while in the later case it's murder/assault and battery. No one is feeling anything towards criminals because they are opposed them being randomly beaten up and killed, but instead voicing disapproval with revenge justice.
 

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Really, there is a difference between stopping an attack and killing or seriously hurting the person as a result and attacking someone that was doing nothing towards another person at the time of your attack. In the former example it is an act of third party self defense that went a bit too far perhaps, while in the later case it's murder/assault and battery. No one is feeling anything towards criminals because they are opposed them being randomly beaten up and killed, but instead voicing disapproval with revenge justice.

Well you can keep your handwringing, heart bleeding, criminal coddling notion of "justice".
 

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Really, there is a difference between stopping an attack and killing or seriously hurting the person as a result and attacking someone that was doing nothing towards another person at the time of your attack. In the former example it is an act of third party self defense that went a bit too far perhaps, while in the later case it's murder/assault and battery. No one is feeling anything towards criminals because they are opposed them being randomly beaten up and killed, but instead voicing disapproval with revenge justice.

No. The threat is never gone. Ask any rape victim. This is a deeply personal assault and proximity of the assailant to the victim is not a factor. Nor can a family member or spouse just stand by and watch the assailant walk away minutes after the attack. That is not a reasonable expectation. You make these statements as if we can just shut down our emotions and use only logic in these situations. The reality is, the emotions are so highly charged in a scene like this that a violent reaction is difficult, if not impossible, to contain.

I stand by my post above. I don't know if I'd have done the same thing because I'd have been worried it was an innocent person I attacked. But I won't automatically convict the guy just because the attacker had stopped for a moment.
 

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Should anything bad, at all, happen to a potential rapist or child molester or whoever? I don't get hearts hemorrhaging for criminals, with rarely more than a passing mention of the victim, like the victim is now just being unreasonably spiteful. To me, if "Justice" means ya gotta do everything for the perpetrator and feel sorry for him and impact his life as little as possible for his sake then **** that, I'll take vengeance instead.
It’s not just about this single incident and not just about actual criminals (even presuming the dead man was actually guilty of what has been alleged).

The principle you’re effectively proposing is that we should all be free to kill people we believe are guilty of or are about to commit a serious crime (or, if it helps put it in context, other people should be free to kill you if they wrongly believe you are a criminal). It’s not at all rare for entirely (or mostly) innocent people to be falsely accused or falsely identified as perpetrators, especially in the heat of the moment. This is, after all, one of the reasons we have criminal justice systems requiring evidence and opportunity to present a defence.

Even beyond all of that, surely you can perceive of some middle ground between an unnecessarily soft approach to criminals as you describe and them beat beaten to death on sight?
 

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It’s not just about this single incident and not just about actual criminals (even presuming the dead man was actually guilty of what has been alleged).

The principle you’re effectively proposing is that we should all be free to kill people we believe are guilty of or are about to commit a serious crime (or, if it helps put it in context, other people should be free to kill you if they wrongly believe you are a criminal). It’s not at all rare for entirely (or mostly) innocent people to be falsely accused or falsely identified as perpetrators, especially in the heat of the moment. This is, after all, one of the reasons we have criminal justice systems requiring evidence and opportunity to present a defence.

Even beyond all of that, surely you can perceive of some middle ground between an unnecessarily soft approach to criminals as you describe and them beat beaten to death on sight?

Can you conceive of any punishment being too "soft"? For criminal coddlers there's no such thing and any punishment is too harsh and screw the victim for being so mean and vengeful.
 
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