How the GOP really stole a state senate race

[pamak]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article247288694.html

Excerpts:

No-party candidate in Florida Senate race hires lawyer, says he doesn’t live in district


Alex Rodriguez received more than 6,300 votes in the race for Senate District 37 and likely cost incumbent Democrat José Javier Rodríguez, who shared the same surname, his seat. Republican Ileana Garcia won the race by 34 votes after a manual recount. More than 215,000 votes were cast in the election.

...

Rodriguez’s candidacy is in question after he listed a Palmetto Bay house on his sworn candidate oath, though he no longer lives there

...


Questions have also been raised about his ties to the Republican Party.

Rodriguez was registered Republican when he voted in the 2018 midterm election and changed his status to no party affiliation in June, the same month that he qualified to run in the 2020 election.

 

[Cameron]

More on this story:

A dark money mystery in the Sunshine State

A dark money mystery in Florida centers on the campaign of a spoiler candidate who helped a Republican win by 32 votes.

www.cnn.com

A month before Election Day in Florida a mysterious company called Proclivity, Inc. contributed $550,000 to a pair of newly formed political action committees in the state.

Two days later, the money flowed from the PACs to an Orlando-area print and advertising firm.

Shortly thereafter, came a torrent of nearly identical political fliers seemingly intended to siphon away support from Democratic candidates by tricking voters into casting their ballots for purported spoiler candidates who demonstrated no real interest in getting elected. None, for example, engaged in typical campaigning activities or raised significant funds.

In one case, the mailers appear to have helped a Republican—a co-founder of Latinas For Trump—unseat the Democratic incumbent in a state Senate race by a razor-thin margin of just 32 votes.

 

[pamak]

I believe that the Democrats are really STUPID for letting the opposition be on the attack with bogus claims about the integrity of the mail-in ballots and the elections and do not bring such stories forward which show real corruption.

 

[Mycroft]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article247288694.html

Excerpts:

No-party candidate in Florida Senate race hires lawyer, says he doesn’t live in district


Alex Rodriguez received more than 6,300 votes in the race for Senate District 37 and likely cost incumbent Democrat José Javier Rodríguez, who shared the same surname, his seat. Republican Ileana Garcia won the race by 34 votes after a manual recount. More than 215,000 votes were cast in the election.

...

Rodriguez’s candidacy is in question after he listed a Palmetto Bay house on his sworn candidate oath, though he no longer lives there

...


Questions have also been raised about his ties to the Republican Party.

Rodriguez was registered Republican when he voted in the 2018 midterm election and changed his status to no party affiliation in June, the same month that he qualified to run in the 2020 election.

Was anything illegal done?

 

[pamak]

Was anything illegal done?

Rodriguez’s candidacy is in question after he listed a Palmetto Bay house on his sworn candidate oath, though he no longer lives there.

And the point goes beyond what is legal or not because the GOP tries to argue that perfectly legal mail in votes corrupt the elections.

 

[Luce]

Was anything illegal done?

Not sure how harsh Florida is on perjury.

 

[pamak]

Not sure how harsh Florida is on perjury.

This is still illegal, even if the penalty is not harsh. And such issue (assuming that there is no penalty for such false declaration) reveals a corrupt system. Sometimes corruption has become perfectly legal and part of the system See lobbying...

 

[Mycroft]

Rodriguez’s candidacy is in question after he listed a Palmetto Bay house on his sworn candidate oath, though he no longer lives there.

And the point goes beyond what is legal or not because the GOP tries to argue that perfectly legal mail in votes corrupt the elections.

It's not the "perfectly legal mail in votes" that are the problem. It's the "illegal mail in votes" that are the problem...among other things.

In any case, it seems...if there was any illegality with that Florida guy found, then the solution is to through out all the votes he received. Pretty much the same should be done in the other races where there was illegal voting.

 

[Acadia]

Is this like moving to GA just to vote?

 

[Luce]

It's not the "perfectly legal mail in votes" that are the problem. It's the "illegal mail in votes" that are the problem...among other things.

In any case, it seems...if there was any illegality with that Florida guy found, then the solution is to through out all the votes he received. Pretty much the same should be done in the other races where there was illegal voting.

It's over. You lost.

 

[Exquisitor]

Re-vote re-vote.

 

[pamak]

It's not the "perfectly legal mail in votes" that are the problem. It's the "illegal mail in votes" that are the problem...among other things.

In any case, it seems...if there was any illegality with that Florida guy found, then the solution is to through out all the votes he received. Pretty much the same should be done in the other races where there was illegal voting.

How does your promosed solution solve the issue of siphoning votes to a fake independent candidate?

By the way, it seems that his case was not unique:

State investigating mysterious candidate who swayed tight Florida Senate race

Reporters found that the third party candidate who affected the outcome of the race was renting a home in Palm Beach County, not in Miami-Dade County, where he filed to vote and run for state office.

www.tampabay.com

Rodriguez, 55, is not the only no-party candidate backed by dark money who ran in competitive state Senate races this year. Celso Alfonso is a no-party candidate who ran in Senate District 39, and whose candidacy shared similarities to Rodriguez. Both candidates' email addresses are Gmail accounts with identical patterns: first initial, last name, district number and “2020.” They also have identical campaign finance records, both only reporting $2,000 loans to themselves, and using the money to pay for the $1,187.88 filing fee required of no-party candidates for state Senate.

Both Rodriguez and Alfonso were registered Republicans when they voted in the 2018 midterm elections. Both qualified for the 2020 election the same day, with checks hand-delivered in Tallahassee and time-stamped within minutes of one another.

 

[pamak]

Re-vote re-vote.

Did not happen in those state senate races even though the votes that this fake candidate received were over 6,000 while the GOP winner got just 30 or so more votes than his opponent.

 

[Exquisitor]

I tell you, if the Democrats don't file in court about a re-vote here, they're missing the boat.

The Democrats Are Missing the Boat

The Democrats Are Missing the Boat: We should be out there screaming how Texas and Florida were short the polls because of widespread systemic voter fraud. We should be in the Courts alongside Trump saying the same thing. If you use his philosophy back on him, this is what you do.

debatepolitics.com

 

[Exquisitor]

Did not happen in those state senate races even though the votes that this fake candidate received were over 6,000 while the GOP winner got just 30 or so more votes than his opponent.

Did not happen?

Make it happen, jump up and down, scream, go to court, jack the Paradigm.

 

[pamak]

Did not happen?

Make it happen, jump up and down, scream, go to court, jack the Paradigm.

I am all for it, which is why I say that Democrats have to be on the offense instead of letting the GOP claim victimhood in courts.

 

[Mycroft]

How does your promosed solution solve the issue of siphoning votes to a fake independent candidate?

By the way, it seems that his case was not unique:

State investigating mysterious candidate who swayed tight Florida Senate race

Reporters found that the third party candidate who affected the outcome of the race was renting a home in Palm Beach County, not in Miami-Dade County, where he filed to vote and run for state office.

www.tampabay.com

Rodriguez, 55, is not the only no-party candidate backed by dark money who ran in competitive state Senate races this year. Celso Alfonso is a no-party candidate who ran in Senate District 39, and whose candidacy shared similarities to Rodriguez. Both candidates' email addresses are Gmail accounts with identical patterns: first initial, last name, district number and “2020.” They also have identical campaign finance records, both only reporting $2,000 loans to themselves, and using the money to pay for the $1,187.88 filing fee required of no-party candidates for state Senate.

Both Rodriguez and Alfonso were registered Republicans when they voted in the 2018 midterm elections. Both qualified for the 2020 election the same day, with checks hand-delivered in Tallahassee and time-stamped within minutes of one another.

Of course, it's not unique. It's been done many times in the past. And, while it may be an objectionable tactic, it may not be illegal.

Here is a case from CA back in 2018. https://www.ocregister.com/2018/09/...view-of-assembly-decoy-candidate-allegations/

That's why I asked if anything done was illegal.

 

[pamak]

Of course, it's not unique. It's been done many times in the past. And, while it may be an objectionable tactic, it may not be illegal.

Here is a case from CA back in 2018. https://www.ocregister.com/2018/09/...view-of-assembly-decoy-candidate-allegations/

That's why I asked if anything done was illegal.

Nomatter how the law defines such practices, they are still undermining the trust in the election process.

Note: The issue was in a GOP primary election.

Anyway, the issue in this case is not just that the candidate was a decoy. From the links I posted before


The state attorney’s office may take interest in Rodriguez’s voter registration form, the latest filled out in Miami-Dade County on June 9, in which he listed an address on the 7700 block of Southwest 156th Street in Palmetto Bay. The couple that lives at the house now told WPLG-10′s Glenna Milberg that Rodriguez hadn’t lived there in five years. Univision Miami reported that Rodriguez has been living in a rented Boca Raton house in Palm Beach County.

Lying on the voter registration form is what led to the downfall of former Democratic State Rep. Daisy Baez, who falsely swore she lived at an address during a 2016 campaign. In 2017, she resigned from office and pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor perjury charge brought by the Miami-Dade State Attorney’s Office.

 

[Mycroft]

Nomatter how the lae defines such practices, they are still undermining the trust in the election process.

Note: The issue was in a GOP primary election.

Lots of things "undermine the trust in the election process". Heck, McCain severely undermined the trust of his voters back in 2016 when he outright lied to them so they would elect him. Guess what...nobody cared (except the people he scammed).

But what McCain did wasn't illegal and I'm questioning whether what that guy in Florida did was illegal.

 

[pamak]

Lots of things "undermine the trust in the election process". Heck, McCain severely undermined the trust of his voters back in 2016 when he outright lied to them so they would elect him. Guess what...nobody cared (except the people he scammed).

But what McCain did wasn't illegal and I'm questioning whether what that guy in Florida did was illegal.

But few of them become an issue of public debate and this should change.

Anyway notice my editing regarding the legal aspect of the current case in FL

The state attorney’s office may take interest in Rodriguez’s voter registration form, the latest filled out in Miami-Dade County on June 9, in which he listed an address on the 7700 block of Southwest 156th Street in Palmetto Bay. The couple that lives at the house now told WPLG-10′s Glenna Milberg that Rodriguez hadn’t lived there in five years. Univision Miami reported that Rodriguez has been living in a rented Boca Raton house in Palm Beach County.

Lying on the voter registration form is what led to the downfall of former Democratic State Rep. Daisy Baez, who falsely swore she lived at an address during a 2016 campaign. In 2017, she resigned from office and pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor perjury charge brought by the Miami-Dade State Attorney’s Office.

 

[Mycroft]

But few of them become an issue of public debate and this should change.

Anyway notice my editing regarding the legal aspect of the current case in FL

The state attorney’s office may take interest in Rodriguez’s voter registration form, the latest filled out in Miami-Dade County on June 9, in which he listed an address on the 7700 block of Southwest 156th Street in Palmetto Bay. The couple that lives at the house now told WPLG-10′s Glenna Milberg that Rodriguez hadn’t lived there in five years. Univision Miami reported that Rodriguez has been living in a rented Boca Raton house in Palm Beach County.

Lying on the voter registration form is what led to the downfall of former Democratic State Rep. Daisy Baez, who falsely swore she lived at an address during a 2016 campaign. In 2017, she resigned from office and pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor perjury charge brought by the Miami-Dade State Attorney’s Office.

So...let's wait and find out what the state AG's office decides and what gets done about it.

I already gave my recommendation.

 

[Cameron]

Lots of things "undermine the trust in the election process". Heck, McCain severely undermined the trust of his voters back in 2016 when he outright lied to them so they would elect him. Guess what...nobody cared (except the people he scammed).

But what McCain did wasn't illegal and I'm questioning whether what that guy in Florida did was illegal.

I think it is probably illegal to misrepresent to voters that you are a progressive, if in fact you are a conservative who is running purely to siphon off votes in the hopes of helping another conservative win. That sounds like fraud to me, if that is in fact what happened. And if he was not in fact qualified to run because of his domicile and lied about it on a sworn document, those would be two additional issues. Of course, nothing has been proven yet.

In terms of remedy, I don't think there's anything that can be done to change the election result unless the victor were shown to be part of the scheme, in which case perhaps she could be disqualified or something. But to the extent this was true election fraud those involved should be punished.

 

[pamak]

So...let's wait and find out what the state AG's office decides and what gets done about it.

I already gave my recommendation.

The outome of the AG's investigation will never trigger a revoting. And this is a common pattern of how the legal and the election system work. Even when the courts find that certain election practices were unconstitutional (for example gerrymandering), such findings are too slow and do not negate the results of the past elections.

Here is an example from a Supreme Court Decision in 2016 which found that TX was engaged in unconstitutional gerrymandering in 2012

{{meta.fullTitle}}

www.oyez.org

 

[Mycroft]

The outome of the AG's investigation will never trigger a revoting. And this is a common pattern of how the legal and the election system work. Even when the courts find that certain election practices were unconstitutional (for example gerrymandering), such findings are too slow and do not negate the results of the past elections.

Here is an example from a Supreme Court Decision in 2016 which found that TX was engaged in unconstitutional gerrymandering in 2012

{{meta.fullTitle}}

www.oyez.org

I didn't suggest a revoting and gerrymandering is unrelated.

Moving on...

 

[pamak]

I didn't suggest a revoting and gerrymandering is unrelated.

Moving on...

That is exactly the point I made.

That you did not present any real remedy for elections that are materially affected by fraud, even when such fraud is proven in courts.
The case of gerrymandering was just an example of the ineffectiveness of the current legal system to address extensive and unconstitutional abuse of state rights to legislate election laws that affect mostly minority voters.