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How Old is the Earth?

Tashah

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teacher said:
Hey Tashah. A while back while you were still new you wrote me lecturing how I should use simple words and be nicer as it takes away from the points I try to make. Now after on this site a while you've gotten all... well, like me. What gives?
Au contraré teacher... you initially wrote to me (I still have the private note) and sought my personal advice on what you could do to improve your posting style. I did indeed advance you some modest tips and pointers.

As for becoming more aggressive, that facet has been limited to this particular thread specifically. I have a low tolerance threshold for pretenders and purveyors of baloney.

teacher said:
I notice on this thread many of the universe theories are stated as fact. Next thing you know string theory will be put forward as fact.
String theory is a valid protoscience and hovers on the cusp of mathematically uniting classical and quantum physics.

teacher said:
I think Tashah and Montalban have the hots for each other.
Hmmm... I wasn't aware that Pez was a hallucinogen lol.

 

teacher

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Tashah said:
Au contraré teacher... you initially wrote to me (I still have the private note)
I haven't washed my PM myself.
and sought my personal advice on what you could do to improve your posting style. I did indeed advance you some modest tips and pointers.

I should have said you wrote me back. A slip.
As for becoming more aggressive, that facet has been limited to this particular thread specifically. I have a low tolerance threshold for pretenders and purveyors of baloney.

Ah there you go. They have a way of putting a burr under your saddle. I was just pointing out even the best of us can get...ah...slightly exasperated at times. Just a good natured jerking of your chain a little. I now often banish myself to the basement. I find insulting them with humor makes them absolutly nuts. You know, the foaming of the mouth, spittle flying, not answering direct questions, lying to make their points, knuckle dragging, mouth breathing....hmm..I seem to be working up to another top ten....yes. To the basement with me....


String theory is a valid protoscience and hovers on the cusp of mathematically uniting classical and quantum physics.

True. I'm just wondering how they will prove it. And that multiverse thing....
Hmmm... I wasn't aware that Pez was a hallucinogen lol.

Only when dispenced from a Bugs Bunny dispencer AND taken in conjunction with green M+M's. Don't ask how I know.
 

Montalban

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Tashah said:
As for becoming more aggressive, that facet has been limited to this particular thread specifically. I have a low tolerance threshold for pretenders and purveyors of baloney.

All you needed to do is ask if I believe that God created the light in being. And I'd have said no, 'cause I'm not pedalling it... it is debunked in my creationist book "The Answers Book" (Don Batten, Ed.) pp84-85. But you were so intent on reading into my posts what you wanted to.
 

Tashah

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Montalban said:
All you needed to do is ask if I believe that God created the light in being. And I'd have said no, 'cause I'm not pedalling it... it is debunked in my creationist book "The Answers Book" (Don Batten, Ed.) pp84-85. But you were so intent on reading into my posts what you wanted to.
Despite the fact that English is my third language, I am proficient enough in its syntax and usage to comprehend both the implicit and the abstract.

You specifically intimated and argued (scroll up) that all light was created in toto by God vis-a-vis the initial genesis. As I have patiently explained, the genesis of light consisted of its ingrediants/mechanics rather than an instantaneous and sum-total realization.

Either I badly misunderstood your publically declared stance (which I tend to discount from the number of supportive private notes I have received), or you failed to properly articulate your nebulous position.

Let's move on.

 

Montalban

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Tashah said:
Despite the fact that English is my third language, I am proficient enough in its syntax and usage to comprehend both the implicit and the abstract.

You specifically intimated and argued (scroll up) that all light was created in toto by God vis-a-vis the initial genesis. As I have patiently explained, the genesis of light consisted of its ingrediants/mechanics rather than an instantaneous and sum-total realization.

Either I badly misunderstood your publically declared stance (which I tend to discount from the number of supportive private notes I have received), or you failed to properly articulate your nebulous position.

From the first you have endeavoured to take the role of condascending teacher....

Post #100
Montalban said:
I have heard that the light from distant stars was created in situ, that is, at the source, and in between it and us, and therefore it's not taken x million years to get here, because it was here already.

Post #101
Tashah said:
I would humbly suggest that you brush up on the electromagnetic spectrum, the speed of light constant (c), astrophysics, and optical physics.

Post #102
Tashah said:
I am not saying I support the idea, so I don't feel a need to brush up on any such thing.

Tashah said:
Really.

I have a B.A. degree in Astrophysics (minor in Optical Physics) and a M.S. degree in Cosmology. Nevertheless, I thank you kindly for the physics lesson

I have not supported it. I merely state that it was a suggestion by some. I have also now noted that it is in fact debunked by a book that I have. However I am interested, in general in people's ideas. I have stated I believe in creation, but I am not a creationist. I don't tie my faith into science.

I have several books on evolution, even though I definately don't support Darwinsim

Tashah said:
Let's move on.


Sure. What do you think about the idea that light may not have travelled at a constant speed?

I have to note too that I don't believe this idea either. I am, however interested in 'ideas' and would still value thought-provoking non-condascending discussion (sans appeals to incredulity).
 
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teacher

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Montalban said:
You need to find something else to do.

Like what? Explain to you basic facts you should have learned in 9th grade earth science. Nah. I'll let Tashah do that. She's much nicer than me. Light may not have traveled at a constant speed. That's classic. And the sun rose in the west the other day. Tashahs right. You need to bone up a little. Here is some homework. Is light a wave or partical? And look up doppler shift. Then maybe you'll look like you know what the f your talking about when you argue with Tashah.
 
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Tashah

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Montalban said:
What do you think about the idea that light may not have travelled at a constant speed? I have to note too that I don't believe this idea either.
This was first considered by Albert Einstein while he was working on his theories of relativity. He quickly discarded the idea.

The current proponent of this schema is Professor Joao Magueijo of Imperial College in London and he refers to this theory as the Varying Speed of Light or VSL. VSL cleans up many problems in Cosmology. In particular, VSL implies that alpha is a variable rather than a constant and thus implies that (c)-[the speed of light] is variant. This view is polar to that of relativity which states that (c) is invariant and a valid Lorentz Transformation. The question is positional and critical... is alpha invariant or variant?

Alpha is the fine-structure constant and dictates the strength of the interaction between an electron and a photon... and governs a host of physical processes from how the Sun burns to the *inflation*of the Universe immediately after the Big Bang. A changing alpha has implications for the constancy of (c) and would revolutionize traditional physics.

In 2001 astronomer John Webb of the University of New South Wales in Sydney, Australia reported that alpha's value (based on observations of how gas clouds absorbed light from quasars) was different 12 billion years ago from what it is today. If Webb is correct, alpha may still be changing by as much as 1 part in 10/14th-power per year assuming a linear rate of change.

However, Webb's original observations have since been questioned by German, French, and Indian astronomers who have been unable to see any change in alpha in their independent survey's of quasars. I will note here that in a few years time, the technology will be available to discern the value of alpha in almost any epoch at 1 part in 10/18th-power per year (LRC).

I have had the opportunity to speak with Dr. Magueijo on two separate occasions. Without doubt he is very brilliant and very persuasive individual. However, there remained some nuances to VSL that he could not explain to my personal satisfaction.

PS. If you are further interested in this subject, obtain a copy of "Faster Than The Speed Of Light" by Joao Magueijo which was authored specifically for the general public. In conjunction with continuing research on VSL, Joao Magueijo is also researching Superstring Symmetry with Lee Smolin... another brilliant and world-class theoretician.

 

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Kelzie said:
I'm not so sure about this. If plants did discriminate against carbon-14, than we could test plants alive now for the ratio of carbon-14, see that it was different from the ratio in the air, and debunk this whole carbon-14 "myth". However, plants tested today do have the same ratio of carbon-14 as the air and all living organisms. So they are obviously not discriminating.



Why would it need to be calculated outside of recorded history if atom bombs and industrialization are what changed the ratio?




I don't pretend to be a scientist, but I'm pretty sure the scientist know the rate at which the earth is demagnetizing, and if it is relevant, they would have calculated it into carbon dating



In response, there was no world-wide flood. It is a physical impossibility. Where did all the water go? Did God suck it up with a giant straw? There is the same amount of water today as there has always been. It is extemely uncommon for a water molecule to be ripped apart in nature. And how many sons did Noah have? Three? So you've got Noah, his three sons, and all their wive. How did eight people repopulate the entire earth without some massive inbreeding?

All this is moot, because scientist do not use carbon dating to determine the age of the earth. The most direct means of determining the Earth's age is a Pb/Pb isochron age, which is done on samples from the Earth and other samples from meteorites

There is such a thing as ice caps, underground aquifers, and mountains non-existent at the time.
 

nkgupta80

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There is such a thing as ice caps, underground aquifers, and mountains non-existent at the time.

So you're saying tehre are mountains that are non-existant 8000 years ago? Its funny how you name these geologic structures so easily as evidence without researching the history of their formation, their properties and so on. Scientists, however, have done so. And the result they found: a world-wide flood is impossible. It completely goes against the climatology and physical formations of the world.

And you still don't explain how Noah and his family would have repopulated the Earth.

Just face it. Its a very exaggerated account of some flood that happened in some area a hell of a long time ago (which scientists have found evidence for in the central asian area), or its just a myth.
 

Montalban

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teacher said:
Like what? Explain to you basic facts you should have learned in 9th grade earth science.
Thanks for the straw-man. Obviously you've so much time that you need to invent debate.
 

Montalban

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Tashah said:
This was first considered by Albert Einstein while he was working on his theories of relativity. He quickly discarded the idea.

The current proponent of this schema is Professor Joao Magueijo of Imperial College in London and he refers to this theory as the Varying Speed of Light or VSL. VSL cleans up many problems in Cosmology. In particular, VSL implies that alpha is a variable rather than a constant and thus implies that (c)-[the speed of light] is variant. This view is polar to that of relativity which states that (c) is invariant and a valid Lorentz Transformation. The question is positional and critical... is alpha invariant or variant?

Alpha is the fine-structure constant and dictates the strength of the interaction between an electron and a photon... and governs a host of physical processes from how the Sun burns to the *inflation*of the Universe immediately after the Big Bang. A changing alpha has implications for the constancy of (c) and would revolutionize traditional physics.

In 2001 astronomer John Webb of the University of New South Wales in Sydney, Australia reported that alpha's value (based on observations of how gas clouds absorbed light from quasars) was different 12 billion years ago from what it is today. If Webb is correct, alpha may still be changing by as much as 1 part in 10/14th-power per year assuming a linear rate of change.

However, Webb's original observations have since been questioned by German, French, and Indian astronomers who have been unable to see any change in alpha in their independent survey's of quasars. I will note here that in a few years time, the technology will be available to discern the value of alpha in almost any epoch at 1 part in 10/18th-power per year (LRC).

I have had the opportunity to speak with Dr. Magueijo on two separate occasions. Without doubt he is very brilliant and very persuasive individual. However, there remained some nuances to VSL that he could not explain to my personal satisfaction.

PS. If you are further interested in this subject, obtain a copy of "Faster Than The Speed Of Light" by Joao Magueijo which was authored specifically for the general public. In conjunction with continuing research on VSL, Joao Magueijo is also researching Superstring Symmetry with Lee Smolin... another brilliant and world-class theoretician.


Thank you for your informative post.
 

teacher

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Montalban said:
You need to find something else to do.

Nice thing about this site. It's all there to go back to. You slight me, I slight back, and now I,m the bad guy. You and Tashah were ripping each others throughts out so I joke you have the hots for each other. So you call me straw man, now I say your panties are in a wad. Then comes moderator with the gavel. Then I go to basement and include you in a humorous Top Ten. Then you go tell your mommy. Way to have a sense of humor. Wound up tight aren't you? I don't start fights. I finish them. Chill out. Have a Pez....mmmm...sweet, tasty Pez.....you might need two. See how this works?
 

Montalban

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teacher said:
Nice thing about this site. It's all there to go back to. You slight me, I slight back, and now I,m the bad guy. You and Tashah were ripping each others throughts out so I joke you have the hots for each other. So you call me straw man, now I say your panties are in a wad. Then comes moderator with the gavel. Then I go to basement and include you in a humorous Top Ten. Then you go tell your mommy. Way to have a sense of humor. Wound up tight aren't you? I don't start fights. I finish them. Chill out. Have a Pez....mmmm...sweet, tasty Pez.....you might need two. See how this works?

ROFL
You need to look up 'straw man' first. I didn't call you straw-man, I called your argument 'straw-man'. It is a logical fallacy. Try researching these things first before re-entering the debate
 

teacher

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Montalban said:
ROFL
You need to look up 'straw man' first. I didn't call you straw-man, I called your argument 'straw-man'. It is a logical fallacy. Try researching these things first before re-entering the debate

So I'm guessing you didn't have any Pez? No wonder......
 

Montalban

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Words from a clown

teacher said:
So I'm guessing you didn't have any Pez? No wonder......
I'm guessing you can't have an honest debate.

You made a straw-man argument, then got into a hissy fit believing that I was making a personal attack against you. I have pointed out your error, and you don't nay, can't acknowledge that it is your fault this persecution complext (honi soi y mal pense!) based on ignorance; not knowing what the term 'straw-man' means.

Most people would admit their mistake and move on. I will move on from this, leaving the last word for you; let's see if you admit your mistake or choose to rant.
 

teacher

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Re: Words from a clown

Montalban said:
I'm guessing you can't have an honest debate.

You made a straw-man argument, then got into a hissy fit believing that I was making a personal attack against you. I have pointed out your error, and you don't nay, can't acknowledge that it is your fault this persecution complext (honi soi y mal pense!) based on ignorance; not knowing what the term 'straw-man' means.

Most people would admit their mistake and move on. I will move on from this, leaving the last word for you; let's see if you admit your mistake or choose to rant.

Kinda like taunting a monkey at the zoo with sweet,tasty Pez. What were we debating? All I said is that you should have paid attention to 9th grade earth science. Then Tashah wouldn't so easily take you to the cleaners. So are you tring to debate that you did pay attention in 9th grade earth science? My bad. Guess your teacher sucked. Not your fault. Let's repost chronologicaly the argument. This is so easy.
Tashah said:
Another pertinint and prominent example of your use of the *God Card* to explain a fact that argues and mitigates against your personal cosmology. If your agenda here is Creationism then fine, be honest and upfront about it. At least your credibility would remain intact.
Montalban said:
I await your next 'lesson'. :smile:
Montalban said:
You're on nasty pills or something?
Tashah said:
I await your next 'flaying'.

teacher If not I can get her some. I eat them like Pez. Mmmmmm....sweet tasty Pez[/QUOTE said:
teacher said:
I think Tashah and Montalban have the hots for each other
Tashah said:
Hmmm... I wasn't aware that Pez was a hallucinogen lol.
Now Tashah to Monty:
Tashah said:
Either I badly misunderstood your publically declared stance (which I tend to discount from the number of supportive private notes I have received), or you failed to properly articulate your nebulous position.
Montalban said:
From the first you have endeavoured to take the role of condascending teacher....
teacher said:
Oh yea, they defiantly have the hots.
Montalban said:
You need to find something else to do
teacher said:
Like what? Explain to you basic facts you should have learned in 9th grade earth science.
Montalban said:
Thanks for the straw-man. Obviously you've so much time that you need to invent debate
teacher said:
Nice thing about this site. It's all there to go back to. You slight me, I slight back, and now I,m the bad guy. You and Tashah were ripping each others throughts out so I joke you have the hots for each other. So you call me straw man, now I say your panties are in a wad. Then comes moderator with the gavel. Then I go to basement and include you in a humorous Top Ten. Then you go tell your mommy. Way to have a sense of humor. Wound up tight aren't you? I don't start fights. I finish them. Chill out. Have a Pez....mmmm...sweet, tasty Pez.....you might need two. See how this works?
Montalban said:
ROFL
You need to look up 'straw man' first. I didn't call you straw-man, I called your argument 'straw-man'. It is a logical fallacy. Try researching these things first before re-entering the debate
teacher said:
So I'm guessing you didn't have any Pez? No wonder......
Montalban said:
I'm guessing you can't have an honest debate.

You made a straw-man argument, then got into a hissy fit believing that I was making a personal attack against you. I have pointed out your error, and you don't nay, can't acknowledge that it is your fault this persecution complext (honi soi y mal pense!) based on ignorance; not knowing what the term 'straw-man' means.

Most people would admit their mistake and move on. I will move on from this, leaving the last word for you; let's see if you admit your mistake or choose to rant.

So let me ask. What is it we were debating? I just threw in you two had the hots for each other and bam. You get all nasty. The norm for you I guess since Tashah was handing you your ass in your debate. What was my error. My advise...take two sweet, tasty Pez and don't mess with me, teacher of the giant brain. If you want to know what I really think of your kind: "The Basement and Flame ON" thread "Top ten Lists and teacher Abuse" #34.
You lose.
 
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