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How do you know Jesus wasn't lying? (1 Viewer)

Noodlegawd

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Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
So you pretend to believe it is all true.
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
You must be filled brother with the Holy Spirit which gives you faith

Oh…. And Jesus is free of sin. He is perfect in every way.
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
Religious people believe what they want to believe. Reason, logic or plain common sense don't come into it, so don't attempt to engage in discussion with them. I first learnt this when I was about eight when I asked a nun at my RC school a question she found awkward. Her reply: There are mysteries that God does not wish us to understand. He is testing your faith. Just believe.
 
You don't, that's why it's faith. If you knew, for sure, then you wouldn't need faith.
 
Why believe Jesus? He prophesied the destruction of Jerusalem, which happened almost 40 years later. So he didn't lie about that.
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
Not sure I understand --
  • Assume it's true He existed
  • Assume what's written about Him is true
  • Assume He did do all the miracles recorded of Him
How do we know He wasn't lying...... about what? 🤨
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?

................................because, there were witnesses!

And the fact that Christianity is very much alive, and relevant even today - which is a fulfillment of a prophecy about the Messiah.
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
Lying about what?
 
Why believe Jesus? He prophesied the destruction of Jerusalem, which happened almost 40 years later. So he didn't lie about that.

Given that Palestine was in a near constant state of simmering rebellions and everyone at the time knew that the Romans dealt with open rebellion by annihilating whole cities, not a very difficult prediction to make.
 
................................because, there were witnesses!

And the fact that Christianity is very much alive, and relevant even today - which is a fulfillment of a prophecy about the Messiah.

The Bible *says* there were witnesses.
 
You don't, that's why it's faith. If you knew, for sure, then you wouldn't need faith.

What's the point of faith? Why have faith in this arbitrary belief, instead of some other arbitrary belief.
 
You must be filled brother with the Holy Spirit which gives you faith

Oh…. And Jesus is free of sin. He is perfect in every way.

Says who?
 
Wow, I thought it would be difficult to get a straight answer, but I never imagined that this would be such an utter game of dodgeball.
 
What's the point of faith? Why have faith in this arbitrary belief, instead of some other arbitrary belief.
The point of faith is to signal virtue and to make one feel superior to those who do not share it. In some countries it allows the faithful to chop off the heads of unbelievers. A pastime they seem to enjoy.
 
Not sure I understand --
  • Assume it's true He existed
  • Assume what's written about Him is true
  • Assume He did do all the miracles recorded of Him
How do we know He wasn't lying...... about what? 🤨
Lying about what?

About anything you believe he said that has any consequence to your life or, more to the point, your afterlife.

This isn't an LSAT question. This should be easy for you.
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
How do we know the entire Bible isn’t simply the handy work of Satan? Leading billions down a false path?

Can anyone prove Satan isn’t responsible for everything contained within the Bible?
 
What's the point of faith? Why have faith in this arbitrary belief, instead of some other arbitrary belief.
I have no idea, I'm not a believer. But, they don't know it's the truth, so they have faith it is. Hence the reason there's so many different religions, with different stories.
 
Jesus told us that this world would devolve in the direction of a more bloody, brutal, deadly and evil place.
Becoming darker and darker, never moving towards the light .
Someone please explain that he lied and that the world is actually moving towards the light, becoming a much nicer less deadly and despair filled place ?
 
Jesus told us that this world would devolve in the direction of a more bloody, brutal, deadly and evil place.
Becoming darker and darker, never moving towards the light .
Someone please explain that he lied and that the world is actually moving towards the light, becoming a much nicer less deadly and despair filled place ?
Today a far greater percentage of the world’s population lives in peace than at any time before in history, which is a non-trivial, curiously underreported statistic. By any reasonable measure, the world is living in a golden age of peace and security, even if it may not always appear to be so.

There’s more (and of course, much more in Pinker’s book), but this paints the picture we need: Our current world is the safest time in all of human history. In his Wall Street Journal article, Pinker sums up his conclusions: “Violence has been in decline for thousands of years, and today we may be living in the most peaceable era in the existence of our species.” Hallelujah!


 
Jesus told us that this world would devolve in the direction of a more bloody, brutal, deadly and evil place.
Becoming darker and darker, never moving towards the light .
Someone please explain that he lied and that the world is actually moving towards the light, becoming a much nicer less deadly and despair filled place ?

Let's assume you are correct about that one point (you're not, but I'll go with it). Do you think that the supposed fact he said one thing that wasn't a lie, necessarily means that the other stuff (particularly the stuff most people care about) also wasn't a lie?
 
Jesus told us that this world would devolve in the direction of a more bloody, brutal, deadly and evil place.
Becoming darker and darker, never moving towards the light .
Someone please explain that he lied and that the world is actually moving towards the light, becoming a much nicer less deadly and despair filled place ?
Never mind what Jesus might or might not have said the world is, in reality, a far LESS deadly place than it has been at any time in its history - at least since the end of the very low population of the hunter-gatherer era.
 
Jesus told us that this world would devolve in the direction of a more bloody, brutal, deadly and evil place.
Becoming darker and darker, never moving towards the light .
Someone please explain that he lied and that the world is actually moving towards the light, becoming a much nicer less deadly and despair filled place ?

The lives of people today are objectively better by pretty much any metric you want to use than at any other time in history.
 
Let's pretend for the sake of argument that it's somehow indisputably proven that the guy called Jesus Christ existed about 2000 years ago, and that Bible contains a perfectly accurate account of what he said and did. And let's assume for the sake of argument that all his miracles were not parlor tricks, but the result of actual magical, devine, or some other form of power or ability that he possessed.

With all that assumed to be true, how do you know he wasn't lying?
How about if he wasn't lying, we just don't understand, or the Church is lying?
 

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