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How deep is support for the revolution?

Greenbeard

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Not very, it seems.

If the point of Bernie's campaign is to build support for his agenda so that it could actually come to pass someday, he doesn't seem to be succeeding even among his own supporters: Most Bernie Sanders supporters aren't willing to pay for his revolution.

Sanders's plan would put an additional $5,000 of federal tax liability on households earning $50,000, but in exchange he would nationalize vital services currently in the private sector.

That means at least some of the money we're now paying private companies would be paid to the federal government instead.

But the majority of Sanders supporters in our poll (much less all voters) aren't willing to pay enough to actually support those nationalized services.
About 66 percent of Sanders supporters said they wouldn't be willing to pay more than an additional $1,000 in taxes for universal health care. This includes the 8 percent of Sanders supporters who aren't willing to pay anything at all.
Sanders supporters are far and away the most likely to want free public college tuition. Still, 14 percent said they don't want to pay additional taxes for it — and another half said they would only pay up to $1,000 a year:

This is a reality the far left is going to need to address at some point (ironically, Vermont itself was the canary in the coal mine on this one two years ago) and I'm not seeing much of a plan for what to do about it.
 

Captain Adverse

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Not very, it seems.

If the point of Bernie's campaign is to build support for his agenda so that it could actually come to pass someday, he doesn't seem to be succeeding even among his own supporters: Most Bernie Sanders supporters aren't willing to pay for his revolution.





This is a reality the far left is going to need to address at some point (ironically, Vermont itself was the canary in the coal mine on this one two years ago) and I'm not seeing much of a plan for what to do about it.

Bernie's (and let's face it, Trump's) public support has little to do with pro-socialist idealism and more to do with anti-establishment frustration.

People are just tired of status quo government full of false promises leading to SSDD (same sh*t different day) policies regardless of which Party is in power.
 

Abbazorkzog

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Does Bernie Sanders need to win New York for the media to take him seriously again?

Nope.

New York is almost here. Sanders probably doesn't need to "take" the primary to restore some of the press's faith, but he can't lose by 30 points. I'm not even sure that a margin of defeat in the high single digits would be seen as terribly impressive. But if he can claw to within five points in the popular vote, Sanders can make Clinton appear newly vulnerable again and make himself look more viable than he has seemed in a couple months.

And that is from the same source that ran 16 hit pieces on Sanders in 16 hours.
Whether he wins or loses, Bernie is here to stay, along with his revolution.
So get over it.
 

Chomsky

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Not very, it seems.

If the point of Bernie's campaign is to build support for his agenda so that it could actually come to pass someday, he doesn't seem to be succeeding even among his own supporters: Most Bernie Sanders supporters aren't willing to pay for his revolution.





This is a reality the far left is going to need to address at some point (ironically, Vermont itself was the canary in the coal mine on this one two years ago) and I'm not seeing much of a plan for what to do about it.
I'm wondering if those replying to the poll were cognizant they would not be paying insurance premiums, in lieu of the higher tax?

1K a year to be guaranteed healthcare and be free of insurance companies, premiums, and deductibles, sounds like a pretty good deal from where I'm sitting. Why have to be poor, over 65, or a gov employee, to receive affordable healthcare? This business of providing a benefit to those deemed privileged, rather than provided universally, is something I don't agree with.
 

Greenbeard

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Bernie's (and let's face it, Trump's) public support has little to do with pro-socialist idealism and more to do with anti-establishment frustration.

It may well be that he's just been racking up protest votes.

Whether he wins or loses, Bernie is here to stay, along with his revolution.

Except it doesn't appear the revolution exists. That's the problem: he's gotten lots of votes and media attention, but at the end of the day he hasn't built any support for his agenda (even among his own supporters!). I've said for months that he was in danger of wasting his window by avoiding leading a real conversation about the big things he says he wants to do. Now that window is closing and what's been achieved?

I'm wondering if those replying to the poll were cognizant they would not be paying insurance premiums, in lieu of the higher tax?

Hard to imagine what the point of his campaign was if at the end of it even his supporters don't know what single-payer is or what he was running on. Seems like a massive wasted opportunity for his cause.
 

Glen Contrarian

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Bernie's (and let's face it, Trump's) public support has little to do with pro-socialist idealism and more to do with anti-establishment frustration.

People are just tired of status quo government full of false promises leading to SSDD (same sh*t different day) policies regardless of which Party is in power.

When was the last time the voters weren't "tired of SSDD"? How often have we seen over the years politicians saying, "Vote for me, I'm the outsider untainted by Washington's corruption!" What has made this time different is the backlash against the ongoing demographic change happening across America...thus the resurgence of white nationalism.
 

Captain Adverse

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When was the last time the voters weren't "tired of SSDD"? How often have we seen over the years politicians saying, "Vote for me, I'm the outsider untainted by Washington's corruption!" What has made this time different is the backlash against the ongoing demographic change happening across America...thus the resurgence of white nationalism.

This time they have two candidates who are not beholden to either Party's elite, yet have the capacity to run anyway.

Candidates each Party's leadership clearly does NOT wish to see elected.

That was my response to this OP.
 

RetiredUSN

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When was the last time the voters weren't "tired of SSDD"? How often have we seen over the years politicians saying, "Vote for me, I'm the outsider untainted by Washington's corruption!" What has made this time different is the backlash against the ongoing demographic change happening across America...thus the resurgence of white nationalism.

White nationalism is a very dangerous phrase to use. To some, it brings back thoughts of lynchings and white only water fountains.
 

Glen Contrarian

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This time they have two candidates who are not beholden to either Party's elite, yet have the capacity to run anyway.

Candidates each Party's leadership clearly does NOT wish to see elected.

That was my response to this OP.

Ralph Nader, Pat Buchanan, Ross Perot, John Anderson...there's quite a list.
 

Glen Contrarian

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White nationalism is a very dangerous phrase to use. To some, it brings back thoughts of lynchings and white only water fountains.

I quite agree...but have you noticed even here on DP that more than few conservatives have stated that the freedom to discriminate is more important than freedom from discrimination? Have you noticed the surge of white supremacist support for Trump, or the length of time he took to finally reject the endorsement he got from David Duke?
 

Helix

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he's probably not going to be the nominee. it has been very obvious for a long time. this general election is going to be one of the ****tiest voting choices that i've ever had to make.
 

Captain Adverse

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Ralph Nader, Pat Buchanan, Ross Perot, John Anderson...there's quite a list.

Only in the case of Ross Perot was there a valid presumption that he was REALLY not beholden to other elites...he, like Trump, had his OWN money.

People assumed that because of this he was his own man and could be believed when he said something. I supported him back then until he imploded his own campaign.
 

Glen Contrarian

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Only in the case of Ross Perot was there a valid presumption that he was REALLY not beholden to other elites...he, like Trump, had his OWN money.

People assumed that because of this he was his own man and could be believed when he said something. I supported him back then until he imploded his own campaign.

But the point still stands that people have run as "outsiders" for nearly as long as America's been around...and many - perhaps most - of them were beholden to no one (or at least that's what they would claim).
 

Captain Adverse

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But the point still stands that people have run as "outsiders" for nearly as long as America's been around...and many - perhaps most - of them were beholden to no one (or at least that's what they would claim).

Yes, but if you look at history, Political Parties have come and gone, with third parties (usually based on support of a particularly stand-out leader) also playing a role.

But a majority of people in any society are inherently "status quo" in their thinking. As long as they can make ends meet, and still have a little something left over for entertainment, they remain content.

I'd say like any past example, the current frustration has come from a series of government faux pas over the last 15 years. From the Patriot Act/National Security Orders loss of privacy, through the Business/Banking caused recession Bail Out, to continued involvement in Middle East police actions...

Too many people have been affected to remain content.
 

Abbazorkzog

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Bernieor_BUSSSSTTTTT.jpg
 

Abbazorkzog

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Yay!!!!!!

But that is still pretty damn close.

And if Clinton doesn't win NY by a landslide, Bernie will continue to press on to an inevitably contested Convention. (It is becoming less and less likely that Clinton will win by a landslide, I predict he will lose but still claw within roughly 4-7 points in NY, and neither will clinch the nomination before the Convention).
 
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