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How can anyone be for OBUMMERCARE ?!?!

HoongLoong

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Listen to Congressman Mike Rogers regarding OBUMMERCARE:

Google: Youtube: Congressman Mike Roger's Opening Statement on Healthcare in Washington DC.

Obviously the question is not addressed to the deadbeats

Comments ?
 
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Hyper Partisan Rhetoric you can believe in!!!! :roll:

I went online and used the Kaiser Family Foundation rate calculator for ACA. My state, which another hyper partisan claims would have a rate increase due to ACA, actually was a push as far as cost goes. Lower deductible but no cash payout like AFLAC. I make good money so no subsidy for me- still the full rate is NOT higher than what I have now, and the cap on out of pocket expenses is far lower with ACA.

I'd say let's see if we like Green Eggs and Ham Sam-I-am....
 
Hyper Partisan Rhetoric you can believe in!!!! :roll:

I went online and used the Kaiser Family Foundation rate calculator for ACA. My state, which another hyper partisan claims would have a rate increase due to ACA, actually was a push as far as cost goes. Lower deductible but no cash payout like AFLAC. I make good money so no subsidy for me- still the full rate is NOT higher than what I have now, and the cap on out of pocket expenses is far lower with ACA.

I'd say let's see if we like Green Eggs and Ham Sam-I-am....
what is your deductible under Obama care? is it the bronze plan or silver? what are your payments per month?
are you going to be allowed to see any doctor you want? are you able to go to any hospital you want? are the treatment chooses decided by you and your doctor or by bureaucrats Washington?

one last thing calling some one an arsonist and an extortionist is not Inflammatory Partisan Rhetoric?

I see you are from Oklahoma where rates went up by 53% for a 27 and 40 year old male

HHS-27-yo-men.jpg

and you where one of the lucky ones 3 states had theirs go up over 200%
http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapot...nsurance-premiums-by-99-for-men-62-for-women/
 
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If you start with the mistaken proposition that this country is full of deadbeats and moochers, then of course Obamacare will frighten you. But that's obviously not what this country actually looks like. This country is full of people trying as hard as they can, and a lot of them are getting screwed. Obamacare helps to unscrew some of them.
 
If you start with the mistaken proposition that this country is full of deadbeats and moochers, then of course Obamacare will frighten you. But that's obviously not what this country actually looks like. This country is full of people trying as hard as they can, and a lot of them are getting screwed. Obamacare helps to unscrew some of them.

by forcing them to subsidies some one else's health cost?
If im going to be forced to buy health insurance then I want it to be the same as auto insurance that you are also forced to buy.
If you are a bad driver with many accidents and tickets you are required to pay a higher premium because you are a higher risk
then if that is allowed and practiced under auto insurance then so it should be under health insurance.
the fat pigs, smokers, heavy drinkers or any other unhealthy lifestyle choices should pay a higher premium because of their unhealthy life style are a higher risk to require costly medical bill
if im being forced to subsidies you health insurance then I have the right to control your life style to make sure my cost for you is minimum
 
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by forcing them to subsidies some one else's health cost?
If im going to be forced to buy health insurance then I want it to be the same as auto insurance that you are also forced to buy.
If you are a bad driver with many accidents and tickets you are required to pay a higher premium because you are a higher risk
then if that is allowed and practiced under auto insurance then so it should be under health insurance.
the fat pigs, smokers, heavy drinkers or any other unhealthy lifestyle choices should pay a higher premium because of their unhealthy life style are a higher risk to require costly medical bill

That's an entirely different issue. The point here is not keeping poor people from having health care. If you want to propose higher premiums for people who are chronically reckless with their health, that's fine. But that has nothing to do with expanding coverage.
 
That's an entirely different issue. The point here is not keeping poor people from having health care. If you want to propose higher premiums for people who are chronically reckless with their health, that's fine. But that has nothing to do with expanding coverage.

poor = unhealthy lifestyle choices

The Economics of Obesity: Why Are Poor People Fat?
The Economics of Obesity: Why Are Poor People Fat?


Unhealthy People are Poor People...and vice versa.
http://www.columbia.edu/~xs23/papers/parisconference.pdf
 
what is your deductible under Obama care? is it the bronze plan or silver? what are your payments per month?
are you going to be allowed to see any doctor you want? are you able to go to any hospital you want? are the treatment chooses decided by you and your doctor or by bureaucrats Washington? one last thing calling some one an arsonist and an extortionist is not Inflammatory Partisan Rhetoric? I see you are from Oklahoma where rates went up by 53% for a 27 and 40 year old male. and you where one of the lucky ones 3 states had theirs go up over 200% Double Down: Obamacare Will Increase Avg. Individual-Market Insurance Premiums By 99% For Men, 62% For Women - Forbes

The Manhattan Institute is the source Forbes uses to propagate the wild right wing propaganda. The Manhattan Institute is a right wing 'think tank'. Not an unbiased source and Forbes would in no way publish a pro-ACA study.

When exactly will my premium go up? I got my October notice, no notice of rate increase. You claim you 'see' my rate going up? Prove that!!!

Now for all your wild rant about bureaucrats coming between you and your doctor... buddy it is VERY obvious you don't understand what an Insurance policy is... it is a Bureaucrat coming between you and your doctor! :doh

I went to the Kaiser Family Foundation rate calculator which is far more honest than you claims of what has happened because NOTHING has happened!

According to their calculator I get no subsidy, pay within ONE DOLLAR of what I pay now with what is called the silver or mid level plan. The ACA plan has a much smaller deductible, a 12.5K out of pocket cap per year (lower than what I have now) and a few more 'freebees' like preventative care and a few baseline tests. I have two AFLAC types riders now, but my deductible is twice as high.

For my wife and I it seems a push not a huge increase... but then again no one will force us to buy into ACA. It is voluntary and my thought is if the insurance companies raise individual rates on private insurance like the big business ranters are want to claim- people will flock to ACA.

While many CONs rant about subsidies the cutoff is pretty low so those who would qualify are going to struggle to make the payments, I don't see a huge flood of 3 dollar a month policies.
 
The Manhattan Institute is the source Forbes uses to propagate the wild right wing propaganda. The Manhattan Institute is a right wing 'think tank'. Not an unbiased source and Forbes would in no way publish a pro-ACA study.

When exactly will my premium go up? I got my October notice, no notice of rate increase. You claim you 'see' my rate going up? Prove that!!!

Now for all your wild rant about bureaucrats coming between you and your doctor... buddy it is VERY obvious you don't understand what an Insurance policy is... it is a Bureaucrat coming between you and your doctor! :doh

I went to the Kaiser Family Foundation rate calculator which is far more honest than you claims of what has happened because NOTHING has happened!

According to their calculator I get no subsidy, pay within ONE DOLLAR of what I pay now with what is called the silver or mid level plan. The ACA plan has a much smaller deductible, a 12.5K out of pocket cap per year (lower than what I have now) and a few more 'freebees' like preventative care and a few baseline tests. I have two AFLAC types riders now, but my deductible is twice as high.

For my wife and I it seems a push not a huge increase... but then again no one will force us to buy into ACA. It is voluntary and my thought is if the insurance companies raise individual rates on private insurance like the big business ranters are want to claim- people will flock to ACA.

While many CONs rant about subsidies the cutoff is pretty low so those who would qualify are going to struggle to make the payments, I don't see a huge flood of 3 dollar a month policies.

isn't this special you try to discredit my source as being right wing when it is a libertarian think tank then go and use a left wing source Kaiser Family Foundation
 
isn't this special you try to discredit my source as being right wing when it is a libertarian think tank then go and use a left wing source Kaiser Family Foundation

Well the discredit comes from the Manhattan crowd not showing their math as it were. Couple that with the claim my payments are going to skyrocket and they have not, that somehow the bureaucrats are not already nuts deep in between us and our doctor. :roll:

I do have to wonder at those who almost shriek about how bad a health care insurance exchange is (was it when the GOP proposed it?) I just have to wonder what the shrieker's connect with insurance companies is????

OH FYI- Calgun brought is a chart that had a few more 'positive' states, seems the wild eyed right wing ranters have differing amounts of doom and gloom, makes me wonder where they are getting their numbers and just how much fudge is involved... :2wave:
 
Eww, not sure about this......

But a 60-year-old in Wyoming who makes more than $46,000 a year -- too much to get a tax credit -- could pay as much as $758 for a similar plan....

Obamacare premium rates lower than expected - Sep. 25, 2013

10% of a $46,000 income and no tax credits? That just seems.....outrageous. I assume the $46,000 is gross income before taxes. How are they supposed to pay for mortgage, food, car, clothing, utilities AND save for retirement if they have to pay 10% of income to health insurance? And that doesn't even include any kids they might have to pay for. No, no, no, I don't see that working at all.

Come on someone, say it ain't so.
 
Well the discredit comes from the Manhattan crowd not showing their math as it were. Couple that with the claim my payments are going to skyrocket and they have not, that somehow the bureaucrats are not already nuts deep in between us and our doctor. :roll:

I do have to wonder at those who almost shriek about how bad a health care insurance exchange is (was it when the GOP proposed it?) I just have to wonder what the shrieker's connect with insurance companies is????

OH FYI- Calgun brought is a chart that had a few more 'positive' states, seems the wild eyed right wing ranters have differing amounts of doom and gloom, makes me wonder where they are getting their numbers and just how much fudge is involved... :2wave:

look this is pointless there is no such thing as an unbiased source if a group think tank, organization, blog, or news source release info the left doesn't like they are labeled as bias and the same goes for the right
you can go on line and find some bias source to tell you that another source is bias and around and around we go
Now what we need to go by these days is credibility and Forbes which is run by a libertarian can be called leaning right but they are creditable and respected that is read by both the right and the left and quoted by many around the word and im sure they wouldn't use information that wasn't vetted to be accurate so to keep that resect and creditability
 
what is your deductible under Obama care? is it the bronze plan or silver? what are your payments per month?
are you going to be allowed to see any doctor you want? are you able to go to any hospital you want? are the treatment chooses decided by you and your doctor or by bureaucrats Washington?

one last thing calling some one an arsonist and an extortionist is not Inflammatory Partisan Rhetoric?

I see you are from Oklahoma where rates went up by 53% for a 27 and 40 year old male

View attachment 67154248

and you where one of the lucky ones 3 states had theirs go up over 200%
Double Down: Obamacare Will Increase Avg. Individual-Market Insurance Premiums By 99% For Men, 62% For Women - Forbes

What do the plans cover? Bad stats.
 
Eww, not sure about this......



10% of a $46,000 income and no tax credits? That just seems.....outrageous. I assume the $46,000 is gross income before taxes. How are they supposed to pay for mortgage, food, car, clothing, utilities AND save for retirement if they have to pay 10% of income to health insurance? And that doesn't even include any kids they might have to pay for. No, no, no, I don't see that working at all.

Come on someone, say it ain't so.

and that is from Wyoming with a 110% increase how do you those feel from the 3 sates that have over 200% increase in premiums

and CNN used the age bracket with the least amount of increase the young are going to see much larger increases

Look moot we have been preaching this for months and you just dismiss us as scare mongers. we warned you, we gave you links, and you just dismissed them all, and stuck with your propaganda site like huff and puff post
it is a bitch when you find out you been lied to and especially when you defended that lie
 
poor = unhealthy lifestyle choices

The Economics of Obesity: Why Are Poor People Fat?
The Economics of Obesity: Why Are Poor People Fat?

Unhealthy People are Poor People...and vice versa.
http://www.columbia.edu/~xs23/papers/parisconference.pdf

It wouldn't be the American right wing if it wasn't striving to prove that poor people deserve to be poor. Keep up the misplaced moral superiority, especially when you fall down on your luck and need help from other people.

Oh, and the reason that poor people are fat is because the cheap food is pretty bad for you. That's not an "unhealthy" life choice. That's eating what you can afford to eat. Eating healthy takes time and money that poor people often don't have.
 
It wouldn't be the American right wing if it wasn't striving to prove that poor people deserve to be poor. Keep up the misplaced moral superiority, especially when you fall down on your luck and need help from other people.

Oh, and the reason that poor people are fat is because the cheap food is pretty bad for you. That's not an "unhealthy" life choice. That's eating what you can afford to eat. Eating healthy takes time and money that poor people often don't have.

the argument isn't the cause the argument is we the healthy will be subsidizing the unhealthy the most because of their economic status and unhealthy life style choice or not
 
comparable to what the Obama care bronze plan covers

Did you even read the article? You made an assumption, and you know what they say about making assumptions.

The article compared the bronze plan, which the article stated covers MORE than the alternative plans because of requirements in the ACA law. They compared the bronze plan to the CHEAPEST current available options. So yeah...a plan with a 15K deductible is going to cost considerably less than one with a 6K deductible.

They are not COMPARABLE plans. That is why they are BAD STATS.

Honestly, if you are going to quote stats, you probably ought to know what the stats are.
 
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I see you are from Oklahoma where rates went up by 53% for a 27 and 40 year old male

What's 53% of zero? See, it's only the poor, lazy and unmotivated who will benefit from this clusterfark. Everyone else will be taking it up the chute.
 
If you start with the mistaken proposition that this country is full of deadbeats and moochers, then of course Obamacare will frighten you. But that's obviously not what this country actually looks like. This country is full of people trying as hard as they can, and a lot of them are getting screwed. Obamacare helps to unscrew some of them.

You are misrepresenting REALITY and factual statements made with reference to Obummercare in this thread.

You are twisting REALITY and Mike Roger's position which is exactly the opposite to your post when he opposes Obamarrhoid's rewarding our country's FACTUAL 15% of deadbeats and moochers (which could not mathematically lead even a retarded paramecium with a frontal lobotomy to the conclusion that "this country is 'FULL' (caps mine) of people trying hard as they can, and a lot of them are getting screwed" .

According to the American Journal of Psychiatric Studies ~10% of our Nation (and by extension any Nation) have an anti-social bias, i.e., deadbeats and moochers. For you to assume that 85% of our FACTUALLY productive citizens who are being penalized by ObummerCare in order to reward the deadbeats and moochers is sound National Health Care is preposterous.
 
the argument isn't the cause the argument is we the healthy will be subsidizing the unhealthy the most because of their economic status and unhealthy life style choice or not

Well, most of those "unhealthy lifestyle choices" aren't really choices. They're the result of economic status. Is your point really that you don't want to help the poor get out of poverty and get up to the middle class? Because basically what it is is subsidizing the poor. Who otherwise aren't living nearly as long nor living as productive lives, as injuries and chronic illnesses keep them from working, and from enjoying the fruits of that work. So, a healthier working class means more productivity, more time spent in pursuit of enjoyment (which means more buying products and services), and overall higher quality of life.

Obviously, there are plenty of unhealthy people who aren't poor. Every obese middle class person is a good example of unhealthy lifestyle choices, but a lot of them can afford insurance. So it's really not the healthy subsidizing the unhealthy, and certainly not simply the unhealthy by choice. It's really the nation, as a whole, dispersing the cost of insuring the poor onto everyone, so that we can all reap the benefits of a healthier nation. Consider it an investment in your fellow Americans.
 
and that is from Wyoming with a 110% increase how do you those feel from the 3 sates that have over 200% increase in premiums.
Do you know why those states premiums will be higher? Apparently, it's because they're states with a large rural population and it's more difficult to provide them with healthcare.


and CNN used the age bracket with the least amount of increase the young are going to see much larger increases
Compared to zero they were paying, yes probably will pay more. It's called "shared responsibility".


Look moot we have been preaching this for months and you just dismiss us as scare mongers. we warned you, we gave you links, and you just dismissed them all, and stuck with your propaganda site like huff and puff post
it is a bitch when you find out you been lied to and especially when you defended that lie
Look trfjr....I know for a fact that the Republicans have been lying and making it harder to find the truth of the matter. Sorry, but I don't think you know the facts or the truth, either.


.
 
Do you know why those states premiums will be higher? Apparently, it's because they're states with a large rural population and it's more difficult to provide them with healthcare.


Compared to zero they were paying, yes probably will pay more. It's called "shared responsibility".


Look trfjr....I know for a fact that the Republicans have been lying and making it harder to find the truth of the matter. Sorry, but I don't think you know the facts or the truth, either.


.

was it the republicans that said you can keep your health insurance, you can keep your doctor, and a family will save 2,500 a year on health insurance?

and are these 313 employers lying
http://news.investors.com/politics-...mandate-a-list-of-cuts-to-work-hours-jobs.htm
 
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by forcing them to subsidies some one else's health cost?
If im going to be forced to buy health insurance then I want it to be the same as auto insurance that you are also forced to buy.
If you are a bad driver with many accidents and tickets you are required to pay a higher premium because you are a higher risk
then if that is allowed and practiced under auto insurance then so it should be under health insurance.
the fat pigs, smokers, heavy drinkers or any other unhealthy lifestyle choices should pay a higher premium because of their unhealthy life style are a higher risk to require costly medical bill
if im being forced to subsidies you health insurance then I have the right to control your life style to make sure my cost for you is minimum

Exactly how are you subsidizing others because of Obamacare? There is already a 8% average surcharge for the uninsured on your policy under the old system which will go away when everyone has insurance. Most of the costs of subsidies are derived from savings from drug companies and taxes on certain medical devices, "Cadillac" health plans and tanning salons. Spend a lot of time under the tubes, do you? Be careful it causes skin cancer.
 
was it the republicans that said you can keep your health insurance, you can keep your doctor, and a family will save 2,500 a year on health insurance?
If you work for an employer with 50 or more full time employees then you likely will keep your health insurance and doctor. It remains to be seen how much money people will save since everyone's needs are different and there's a lot more plans to chose from.
 
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