How can a vote against a Syrian STRIKE not be a vote for Assad & Putin?

[DDD]

If we take this tact enough times ...China will see this void to exploit ...and they should. They'll start stepping up ...and taking charge ....now do you understand why that's not a good tactic?

Yes, it may be possible for them to grab a few countries to support and exploit also. Wonder how they would engage in the media. Putin has RT that uses similar methods as Western media. With similarity comes convincing to the point that Beck (an American) wants us to make Putin's claims even wider.

But how would the Chinese do with the media?

 

[DDD]

God help these stupid fools that actually believe they benefit from this neo-imperialism.

What do you mean by that?

 

[Drake McHugh]

Something an elderly,retired senator and secretary of state once said seems to apply here.
"WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE?"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[BmanMcfly]

What do you mean by that?

I figured it was pretty clear; thinking that the people will somehow benefit from the spoils of war (excepting military contractors, oil companies, arms dealers and big banks) are simply stupid. Worse yet, that they don't see the backlash from such an action, and that the BEST CASE SCENARIO is a new civil war over who controls the ash pike, makes them fools as well.

Double so when you consider that this action is going to be assisting Alquaida (and other groups), who we are at war with already...

If these people don't stop buying into the lies, they will ensure the downfall of the American empire.

The only note is that, while I was replying to someone in specific I was not targeting them as stupid fools, beyond that it might Shake them into reconsidering their position.

 

[Hypersonic]

People in the US can slice and dice and equivocate all they want. But the world ..especially those in the region (including Israel) will see an American congress vote against a STRIKE against Syria as a vote siding with Vladimir and Assad.

There simply is no other way to look at it ...especially if your in Israel right walking around with Gas Masks in your bag!

In fact I endorse McCain's idea to not just hit Assad..but to take steps to take him out. Hit his weapons cache...and arm the rebels to go in and finish the job!

I also feel if congress vote no for this STRIKE ...Obama should exercise his executive power ...and STRIKE Syria non the less.
He (Obama) isn't looking for another term...and when the history books look at this fiasco ..I am sure this will clearly be the right decision.

Tell me why are Russian ships are moving towards U.S warships what's in it for Russia?

 

[thinkforyoursel]

I figured it was pretty clear; thinking that the people will somehow benefit from the spoils of war (excepting military contractors, oil companies, arms dealers and big banks) are simply stupid. Worse yet, that they don't see the backlash from such an action, and that the BEST CASE SCENARIO is a new civil war over who controls the ash pike, makes them fools as well.

Double so when you consider that this action is going to be assisting Alquaida (and other groups), who we are at war with already...

If these people don't stop buying into the lies, they will ensure the downfall of the American empire.

The only note is that, while I was replying to someone in specific I was not targeting them as stupid fools, beyond that it might Shake them into reconsidering their position.

Bush took us real close to destruction ...and he did it with much support from those on the right.

The right wing have no credibility to claim anybody is buying lies ....because you guys bought a lifetime from Bush and Fox News.
For example ...remember when the UN report they couldn't find these WMD's bush wanted to attack Iraq over .....guess what ...they were right ....and the right-wing didn't believe them.

Kerry and Obama debrief Congress on the damming evidence that Assad gassed his people ....Bhoener, and all ...have no doubt about it. But that won't stop the right wing lunatics ...they actually believe Assad argument that this is a lie!! :roll: The .."theories"...are all out there that the rebels gassed themselves ...and Assad ...not Obama's story is credible.

Bush had a moment when the entire country rallied around the flag and the country ...prior to Iraq ...Obama has never had such a moment. For the people on the right ...any dog...any lier...any butcher out there ...is better than the American president. This hate ...is truly too much ...and the American people will further punish you people at the poles for it. There is not an ounce ...of true patriotism from those on the right...none!!

You people

 

[BmanMcfly]

Bush took us real close to destruction ...and he did it with much support from those on the right.

This is true, but Afghanistan had an air I legitimacy, and Iraq was sold on lies.

The right wing have no credibility to claim anybody is buying lies ....because you guys bought a lifetime from Bush and Fox News.
For example ...remember when the UN report they couldn't find these WMD's bush wanted to attack Iraq over .....guess what ...they were right ....and the right-wing didn't believe them.

I was speaking out against bush as well, and you raise a valid point here as well. The only point in their favor is how heavily bush used the tragedy of 9-11 to sell those lies as truth.

Kerry and Obama debrief Congress on the damming evidence that Assad gassed his people ....Bhoener, and all ...have no doubt about it. But that won't stop the right wing lunatics ...they actually believe Assad argument that this is a lie!! :roll: The .."theories"...are all out there that the rebels gassed themselves ...and Assad ...not Obama's story is credible.

Wait, so you actually believe that Assad, who is winning against the rebels and "protesters", would do the thing that would bring the us into the conflict?

Where the Alquaida forces, and other groups benefit by performing a false flag to get themselves air support...

Who really benefits from gassing the rebels?

Bush had a moment when the entire country rallied around the flag and the country ...prior to Iraq ...Obama has never had such a moment. For the people on the right ...any dog...any lier...any butcher out there ...is better than the American president. This hate ...is truly too much ...and the American people will further punish you people at the poles for it. There is not an ounce ...of true patriotism from those on the right...none!!

You people

Ya, bush was bad, obama is bush on steroids.

Trying to keep this non-partisan, it's the democrats, who were correct in attempting to fight bush who are now apologizing for THE SAME CRIMES THAT BUSH WAS DOING!!!

The best bet would be for those left who opposed bush to maintain their principles and fight Obama on this dangerous course he's taking the country on.

 

[thinkforyoursel]

This is true, but Afghanistan had an air I legitimacy, and Iraq was sold on lies.



I was speaking out against bush as well, and you raise a valid point here as well. The only point in their favor is how heavily bush used the tragedy of 9-11 to sell those lies as truth. .

Think about having this record as any politicians ...of the two conflicts you had the choice to chose ....you picked the Iraq war. Rather than chose a STRIKE...with no boots on the ground ....you decide to pick a 10 year war ....because Saddam gassed his people ....15 years ago....very smart isn't it?:roll:

Wait, so you actually believe that Assad, who is winning against the rebels and "protesters", would do the thing that would bring the us into the conflict?

Where the Alquaida forces, and other groups benefit by performing a false flag to get themselves air support...

Who really benefits from gassing the rebels?

OK..OK...so Assad who's gassing his people have credibility .....but sadly Obama has none.:roll:

Ya, bush was bad, obama is bush on steroids.

Trying to keep this non-partisan, it's the democrats, who were correct in attempting to fight bush who are now apologizing for THE SAME CRIMES THAT BUSH WAS DOING!!!

The best bet would be for those left who opposed bush to maintain their principles and fight Obama on this dangerous course he's taking the country on.

The assertion that Obama is anything like Bush ...is another right wing spin. You guys try so hard you don't know which way is forward or backward. Obama is like Bush ...no wait ..Obama is an illegal Muslim.....no wait ..Obama is more like Hitler ...good grief.

 

[Lord of Planar]

 

[Lord of Planar]

Food for thought:

 

[Simon W. Moon]

i'm ok with China taking the lead when it comes to global military police actions. let them spend fifty years figuring out what we already should have learned.
when this stuff started happening, why did no one ask Switzerland why it wasn't doing anything to stop it? where's the moral outrage that Finland isn't getting involved? how about Denmark? do you think they're upset right now that they are "irrelevant?"

Tangential to your points... Europe's more recent experience with combat on their soil may play a part in their greater reluctance in regard to military ventures in general.

So I presume you're OK with the murdering of Christians and Shia by the rebels?

That is an odd presumption to choose.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

Food for thought:

I am not a munitions expert.
What leads me to believe that this is sarin or some other poison instead of something else?

 

[Lord of Planar]

I am not a munitions expert.
What leads me to believe that this is sarin or some other poison instead of something else?

They can put just about anything in these DIY munitions. It's a propane canister. The sources says it is, which is not better or worse than what any one else is saying. We have no actionable proof. At least none that Obomba is sharing with the UN, and the UN is saying the rebels used the sarin.

Check out this one, loaded with explosive:

Syrian Sunni Arab citizen soldiers attack regime outpost with propane canister: Aleppo City (Sept 1st, '13)

Who's killing civilians...

 

[BmanMcfly]

Think about having this record as any politicians ...of the two conflicts you had the choice to chose ....you picked the Iraq war. Rather than chose a STRIKE...with no boots on the ground ....you decide to pick a 10 year war ....because Saddam gassed his people ....15 years ago....very smart isn't it?:roll:

I was agreeing with you, you mustn't have read that before typing... Bush finished off his daddies war, all based on blatant lies.

OK..OK...so Assad who's gassing his people have credibility .....but sadly Obama has none.:roll:

No, it's a simple matter of who benefits more:
A) Assad gassing people in a war he is winning without that will draw in an invasion
B) the rebels gas other rebels, this gets them a new ally in a fight they are losing

Obama meanwhile has just as much credibility as bush, but at least is a better speaker / reader of teleprompter.... If anything that makes Obama more dangerous than bush because bush couldn't find his way out of a wet paper bag, and he most certainly would not have got away with half Of what obamas done to EXPAND on bushes policies.

The assertion that Obama is anything like Bush ...is another right wing spin. You guys try so hard you don't know which way is forward or backward. Obama is like Bush ...no wait ..Obama is an illegal Muslim.....no wait ..Obama is more like Hitler ...good grief.

Well, they are distant cousins...

But you are right, you can't make a true apples to apples comparison of the two, in that they are more the same then they are different in the areas that matter.

 

[joko104]

Over 70K have already died in the civil war, with millions displaced, and we're just now outraged over his actions?

Why is this the Syrian government's fault? It did not start the revolution.

 

[thinkforyoursel]

They can put just about anything in these DIY munitions. It's a propane canister. The sources says it is, which is not better or worse than what any one else is saying. We have no actionable proof. At least none that Obomba is sharing with the UN, and the UN is saying the rebels used the sarin.

Check out this one, loaded with explosive:

Syrian Sunni Arab citizen soldiers attack regime outpost with propane canister: Aleppo City (Sept 1st, '13)

Who's killing civilians...

And you know this is a recent tape ...and those are rebel fighters (not Assad's people)and ...you somehow see the GAS on this footage?:roll:

I can believe our president ...or Assad on who's responsible for the gas ....I choose to believe the President of the US.

I think back on the Iraq war ....same dam thing we saw from the right wing. Remember those grainy photo's of trucks moving WMD's ...remember that? Have we not learned anything from the right wing when you people want to believe your....... "theories"?
No wonder you hate the "main-stream-media"....often they're right and you're wrong.

 

[Helix]

Tangential to your points... Europe's more recent experience with combat on their soil may play a part in their greater reluctance in regard to military ventures in general.

not at all. when some horror happens in the world, there are many countries which don't seem to have a moral duty to do anything. how is that fair? if the US fails to act every single time, we are looked at as selfish monsters. if we do act, we become an imperialistic bully.

it's not our turn this time. specifically, it's Saudi Arabia's turn, and if Saudi Arabia won't act, it's on them.

 

[Un biased]

Reminds me of Rwanda remember them no one would help and their death total was in the 100,000 . Lets not repeat that .

 

[Simon W. Moon]

I suspect that there's the will in the US to "do something." But the question is, "What?"

What can we do that will both be helpful and have the net effect of advancing our national interests?

 

[VanceMack]

Over 70K have already died in the civil war, with millions displaced, and we're just now outraged over his actions?

Lets not forget that a good number of those civilians were killed by BOs allies...

 

[Kal'Stang]

People in the US can slice and dice and equivocate all they want. But the world ..especially those in the region (including Israel) will see an American congress vote against a STRIKE against Syria as a vote siding with Vladimir and Assad.

There simply is no other way to look at it ...especially if your in Israel right walking around with Gas Masks in your bag!

In fact I endorse McCain's idea to not just hit Assad..but to take steps to take him out. Hit his weapons cache...and arm the rebels to go in and finish the job!

I also feel if congress vote no for this STRIKE ...Obama should exercise his executive power ...and STRIKE Syria non the less.
He (Obama) isn't looking for another term...and when the history books look at this fiasco ..I am sure this will clearly be the right decision.

I really don't care what Israel thinks. I care about what our government does. And quite frankly I am tired of our country acting like the worlds police force. We are not. IMO we should get all of our troops the hell out of all countries. The only troops we need abroad are the ones to protect our embassies. Tell everyone to leave our allies alone we we throw a few ICBM's their direction and do so if our allies are attacked. There is no need to have soldiers on the ground in this day and age. And let other countries fight their own civil wars.

 

[VanceMack]

And you know this is a recent tape ...and those are rebel fighters (not Assad's people)and ...you somehow see the GAS on this footage?:roll:

I can believe our president ...or Assad on who's responsible for the gas ....I choose to believe the President of the US.

I think back on the Iraq war ....same dam thing we saw from the right wing. Remember those grainy photo's of trucks moving WMD's ...remember that? Have we not learned anything from the right wing when you people want to believe your....... "theories"?
No wonder you hate the "main-stream-media"....often they're right and you're wrong.

There you go. Thats fact. You believe Obama. He could **** on your head and call it a blessing and you would thank him for it. You are as bad as those that blindly followed Bush. Yo 'know' precisely nothing, but advocate for anything he tells you is right. You ignore the FACT that rebels in Syria have killed civilians. Yu ignore the fact that rebels in Syria have been found to have used chemical weapons back in march. you ignore the fact that rebels were caught with Sarin gas in June. You ignore the fact that rebels in Syria have slaughtered entire Christian settlements and even today slaughtered two dozen people. You ignore the previous violations of the 'red line' because they were committed by the people Obama supports and insist it MUST be those he is opposed to, even though you 'know' somewhere comfortably between 'jack and' 'dammt'. You have no idea what attacks on Syria will look like, if it will be effective, if it will escalate, nor do you care. You are a 'true believer'.