House Republican accidentally tells the truth about voter ID

[TheDemSocialist]

Difficult to catch when you don't check IDs.

Academic research

The Truth About Voter Fraud, by Justin Levitt of Loyola Law School. Levitt performed a wide-ranging analysis of alleged incidents of voter fraud across the U.S. "Usually, only a tiny portion of the claimed illegality is substantiated — and most of the remainder is either nothing more than speculation or has been conclusively debunked."

The Politics of Voter Fraud, by Lorraine Minnite of Columbia University. Minnite concludes that voter fraud is exceedingly rare, and that the few allegations in the record usually turn out to be something other than voter fraud: "a review of news stories over a recent two year period found that reports of voter fraud were most often limited to local races and individual acts and fell into three categories: unsubstantiated or false claims by the loser of a close race, mischief and administrative or voter error."

Fraudulent Votes, Voter Identification and the 2012 US General Election, by John Ahlquist and Kenneth R. Mayer of the University of Wisconsin, and Simon Jackman of Stanford. The authors conducted a survey experiment "to measure the prevalence of two specific types of voter fraud: repeat/fraudulent ballot casting and vote buying." Their conclusion: "The notion that voter impersonation is a widespread behavior is totally contradicted by these data."

Voter Identifications Laws, by Minnite again. "In 95 percent of so-called 'cemetery voting' alleged in the 2010 midterm election in South Carolina, human error accounts for nearly all of what the state's highest law enforcement official had informed the U.S. Department of Justice was fraud."

Caught in the Act: Recent Federal Election Fraud Cases, by Delia Bailey of the Washington University in St. Louis. Bailey unearthed only nine federal election fraud cases occurring between 2000 and 2005.

They Just Do Not Vote Like They Used To: A Methodology to Empirically Assess Election Fraud, by M.V. Hood III of the University of Georgia and William Gillespie of Kennesaw State University. "After examining approximately 2.1 million votes cast during the 2006 general election in Georgia, we find no evidence that election fraud was committed under the auspices of deceased registrants."

Identifying Election Fraud Using Orphan and Low Propensity Voters, by Ray Christensen and Thomas Schulz of Brigham Young University. The authors devise a new test for identifying instances of voter fraud; turn up no new instances of voter fraud.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-ruling-proving-voter-fraud-is-mostly-a-myth/

 

[tres borrachos]

The whole purpose of these voter ID laws is attempts to suppress voters who dont vote Republican.

Because everyone who votes Republican has ID, and everyone who doesn't have ID votes Democratic?

 

[jonny5]

During the Wisconsin primary coverage Tuesday several outlets related how college students all over the state were having trouble voting because the GOP legislature changed the law and would no longer take student college ID. So your statement is false.

Election turnout robust despite some confusion over new photo ID requirement | Politics and Elections | host.madison.com

Wisconsin Is Making It Harder For Students To Vote. Now They're Fighting Back. | ThinkProgress

'Desperate times for democracy' in Wisconsin | MSNBC

No, your facts are wrong. They do take student ID, they just have to conform to the new law that was passed long before the election.

From YOUR link

It took him about five minutes to wait in line and get a voting ID at an office in the Gordon Dining and Events Center, two blocks from his polling place.

UW-Madison printed voter ID cards at two locations on campus for students who didn’t have Wisconsin driver’s licenses and were not voting absentee in their home states.

“It’s a longer process, but it was pretty smooth,” Rosenberg said. “(UW-Madison) took the right steps to make sure it was pretty clear where to go and how to get registered.”

No one was prevented from voting. They just had to follow simple procedures, which they had known about for years. It was passed in 2011. And it even provides FREE state IDs.

 

[haymarket]

No, your facts are wrong. They do take student ID, they just have to conform to the new law that was passed long before the election.

From YOUR link







No one was prevented from voting. They just had to follow simple procedures, which they had known about for years. It was passed in 2011. And it even provides FREE state IDs.

Okay - and what evidence was there of a problem that made this law necessary in the first place?

 

[Absentglare]

Love the left wing soft racism of lowered expectations. As if certain folks, are incapable of getting an ID.

LOL wtf ??

What a pathetic argument.

 

[Absentglare]

Because everyone who votes Republican has ID, and everyone who doesn't have ID votes Democratic?

Looking at the situation pragmatically, it is more likely for those without ID to vote democrat.

What you're basically doing is making a US citizens right to vote contingent on their having spent the time and money to get an ID.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

Because everyone who votes Republican has ID, and everyone who doesn't have ID votes Democratic?

Voter ID laws affect mainly minorities, and older Americans, these demographics generally vote Democratic....

 

[VanceMack]

Make a difference as in cut down on voter fraud? Make sure those that are legal to vote are voting?

yes...I can see how that would scare the **** out of a rat supporter.

 

[RetiredUSN]

So how many people have been persecuted for voter fraud?

Or investigated?

 

[tres borrachos]

Voter ID laws affect mainly minorities, and older Americans, these demographics generally vote Democratic....

Older Americans don't vote Democratic.

PRINCETON, NJ -- U.S seniors -- those aged 65 and older -- have moved from a reliably Democratic group to a reliably Republican one over the past two decades. From 1992 through 2006, seniors had been solidly Democratic and significantly more Democratic than younger Americans. Over the last seven years, seniors have become less Democratic, and have shown an outright preference for the Republican Party since 2010.

U.S. Seniors Have Realigned With the Republican Party

I didn't know that minorities couldn't get ID.

 

[Caine]

Because its not occurring on levels that justify the need for these regulations.

Uhmm.... How exactly do you know this?

You do realize that when a crime occurs, and nobody knows it has occurred.... then it can't be "documented" right?????

Just think about that for a second. There is no way of knowing how often voter fraud occurs, as we have no system to put it in check.

 

[Caine]

Academic research

The Truth About Voter Fraud, by Justin Levitt of Loyola Law School. Levitt performed a wide-ranging analysis of alleged incidents of voter fraud across the U.S. "Usually, only a tiny portion of the claimed illegality is substantiated — and most of the remainder is either nothing more than speculation or has been conclusively debunked."

And then again..... as I have stated several times....

Alleged incidents that are not known about or discovered..... cannot be analyzed.... as they are unknown.... and not documented..... and how many other effing ways I can explain that for you to understand that when someone does something and nobody knows they have done it.... then they can't "analyze" it.

If I pick my nose in the privacy of my home.... nobody knows I have done it.... thus I cannot be a part of any "documented cases of nose picking by adults"... now can I?

 

[Caine]

Looking at the situation pragmatically, it is more likely for those without ID to vote democrat.

What you're basically doing is making a US citizens right to vote contingent on their having spent the time and money to get an ID.

Why is it more likely?

Its already been established that voter ID laws have ways of alleviating or completely nullifying the cost involved. You can keep pretending these don't exist because it is convenient for you, but it only makes you seem obtuse.

 

[Caine]

Voter ID laws affect mainly minorities, and older Americans, these demographics generally vote Democratic....

Bigotry of Low Expectations?

Minorities ought to be offended at how often the left claim they are not expected to be able to do certain things in America. Like possess or obtain an ID.

As for old people....

Party Identification Varies Widely Across the Age Spectrum

 

[Absentglare]

Why is it more likely?

Its already been established that voter ID laws have ways of alleviating or completely nullifying the cost involved. You can keep pretending these don't exist because it is convenient for you, but it only makes you seem obtuse.

It always consumes time, at a minimum, and it doesn't serve any real purpose.

 

[jonny5]

Okay - and what evidence was there of a problem that made this law necessary in the first place?

I already posted it. It even made headlines years ago. Here are evidence of fraud on both sides.

The voter fraud hall of shame: Milwaukee voter fraud conviction makes ACORN’s 2010 total at least 15 | The Daily Caller

Scott Walker Supporter Charged With Major Voter Fraud Claims Amnesia

The point is to prevent it before it happens. Banks dont wait to get robbed before locking the vault.

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

LOL wtf ??

What a pathetic argument.

You should explain why it's pathetic. Otherwise your argument has no weight.

 

[Absentglare]

You should explain why it's pathetic. Otherwise your argument has no weight.

You brought racism into this.

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

You brought racism into this.

Because, I see people doing racist ****. try to keep up here.

 

[Absentglare]

Because, I see people doing racist ****. try to keep up here.

This thread isn't about racism or socioeconomic status.

If you bothered to sincerely understand what has been said, you likely would never have attempted an argument so pathetically disjointed from the topic of this thread.

 

[Mr Person]

I already posted it. It even made headlines years ago. Here are evidence of fraud on both sides.

The voter fraud hall of shame: Milwaukee voter fraud conviction makes ACORN’s 2010 total at least 15 | The Daily Caller

Scott Walker Supporter Charged With Major Voter Fraud Claims Amnesia

The point is to prevent it before it happens. Banks dont wait to get robbed before locking the vault.

A. If that was the point, why is it something they pretty much only try to pass in an election year, close to an election?

B. How many total instances of proven voter fraud are there in national elections? The Bush DOJ spent 2003-07 looking at it and came up with something like 87 technically incorrect ballots (not fraudulent).

One of your sources counts 5 fraudulent votes by one person, and the other just notes an employee charged with "a scheme to submit fraudulent voter registration applications", but what matters here is actual fraudulent votes cast.



It should be really easy to prove widespread voter fraud if it exists: get the rolls kept at polling places into a database, and check them against death records as well as each other to see. Somehow, the GOPers who keep selling voter ID as some big issue never get around to trying to actually prove how much vote fraud there is.

Meanwhile, you have shenanigans, such as in WI. There, places where on gets ID were closed in D-heavy areas, whereas the same types of places in R-heavy areas had their hours increased.

 

[Mr Person]

No he didn't, the reporter made that part up. Yes, voter IDs do help republicans, but not for the reason you and this idiot reporter believe. In fact the real reason is very damning to democrats. When we check that the people voting are legally allowed to vote - it helps republicans.

What a load of bull.

And yes, he did. "I think Hillary Clinton is about the weakest candidate the Democrats have ever put up. And now we have photo ID, and I think photo ID is going to make a little bit of a difference as well."

In person voter fraud (the only kind that can be addressed by ID laws) is basically nonexistent. The penalty is severe and there is no personal advantage for putting a vote it.

But it helps people who vote Republican feel morally superior to entertain conspiracy theories about vast voting fraud schemes by the Democrats. It's just a subset of the widespread victimhood mentality of conservatives/Republicans, always being taken advantage of by the crafty and evil liberals.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

Bigotry of Low Expectations?

Minorities ought to be offended at how often the left claim they are not expected to be able to do certain things in America. Like possess or obtain an ID.

As for old people....

Party Identification Varies Widely Across the Age Spectrum

"As noted in previous Gallup research, Democrats also perform relatively well among baby boomers aged 60 to 63. Democrats have a seven- to eight-percentage-point average advantage among this group of Americans who were born between about 1950 and 1953, and who came of age during the late 1960s and early 1970s."

 

[TheDemSocialist]

And then again..... as I have stated several times....

Alleged incidents that are not known about or discovered..... cannot be analyzed.... as they are unknown.... and not documented..... and how many other effing ways I can explain that for you to understand that when someone does something and nobody knows they have done it.... then they can't "analyze" it.

If I pick my nose in the privacy of my home.... nobody knows I have done it.... thus I cannot be a part of any "documented cases of nose picking by adults"... now can I?

Keep on reading:

"The Politics of Voter Fraud, by Lorraine Minnite of Columbia University. Minnite concludes that voter fraud is exceedingly rare, and that the few allegations in the record usually turn out to be something other than voter fraud: "a review of news stories over a recent two year period found that reports of voter fraud were most often limited to local races and individual acts and fell into three categories: unsubstantiated or false claims by the loser of a close race, mischief and administrative or voter error."

"Identifying Election Fraud Using Orphan and Low Propensity Voters, by Ray Christensen and Thomas Schulz of Brigham Young University. The authors devise a new test for identifying instances of voter fraud; turn up no new instances of voter fraud."

 

[jonny5]

A. If that was the point, why is it something they pretty much only try to pass in an election year, close to an election?

B. How many total instances of proven voter fraud are there in national elections? The Bush DOJ spent 2003-07 looking at it and came up with something like 87 technically incorrect ballots (not fraudulent).

One of your sources counts 5 fraudulent votes by one person, and the other just notes an employee charged with "a scheme to submit fraudulent voter registration applications", but what matters here is actual fraudulent votes cast.



It should be really easy to prove widespread voter fraud if it exists: get the rolls kept at polling places into a database, and check them against death records as well as each other to see. Somehow, the GOPers who keep selling voter ID as some big issue never get around to trying to actually prove how much vote fraud there is.

Meanwhile, you have shenanigans, such as in WI. There, places where on gets ID were closed in D-heavy areas, whereas the same types of places in R-heavy areas had their hours increased.

Wisconsing passed it in 2011. Theyve have 4 years to get a real ID. And it ALWAYS an election year.

Fact is, there is fraud, and there is the potential for more. Whereas there is no evidence anyone is intentionally prevented from voting.