Hillary Clinton: Europe must curb immigration to stop rightwing populists

[Buzz62]

Well they did, and caused a conflict that last for years, that led to millions of Syrian refugees, 4 million in countries surrounding Syria, and about 1.5 million into Europe

Like I said, it is not Europe's responsibility to allow their culture to be altered, in order to accommodate these people.

 

[Excon]

If you are quoting her accurately and in context, then she would be wrong imo.

What do you mean by "if"?
You did not bother reading the provided information or it's link to the actual report?
Really?
If you had, it would be "if" they reported and quoted it accurately, not whether I did since I provided exactly what they said.

That's the good thing about being a liberal, from my experience, we're a lot freer to think outside of what we've been told to think.

Besides being a hilarious statement, that is your bias speaking as that does not appear to be so in reality.

How much difference is there believing in an imaginary being like Christ because you're told to, and believing what Trump tells you, because you're told to? Just different sides of the same coin.

1. This has nothing to do with Trump.
2. No. That is you again displaying your own bias. No one here believes Trump just because he says something.

 

[Acadia]

If you are quoting her accurately and in context, then she would be wrong imo.

That's the good thing about being a liberal, from my experience, we're a lot freer to think outside of what we've been told to think. Personally I think that's because a lot of Conservatives are Christians, especially Evangelical Christians, and so have spent their entire lives learning to believe what they are instructed to believe, without question.

How much difference is there believing in an imaginary being like Christ because you're told to, and believing what Trump tells you, because you're told to? Just different sides of the same coin.

Funny, your liberal-bubble thinking is so rubber stamped that you don't even realize it whilst spouting what you think is enlightened thought.
Oh, and Jesus did live (even atheists know this) and who the hell looks to Trump for instruction on religion, lol?

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Like I said, it is not Europe's responsibility to allow their culture to be altered, in order to accommodate these people.

They broke it, they bought it

 

[MSgt]

What's funny is, my wife will tell me something somebody on her Facebook said. If they are a right winger, I can tell her every single thing about how that person feels about any issue / what they will say, and she is stunned because I'm always right. The reason is because they're all the same.

This is because they break long enough from their daily FOX News community meetings to regurgitate what they have been taught to say. I note the same thing between my Mom's text messages and conservative members here on this site. It's like they were all in the same room for the last 3 hours and have been fed how to argue and what exactly to default to on any given subject.

 

[Buzz62]

They broke it, they bought it

They "broke" nothing. It was "broken" by their own people.
Why the hell would you want the western world to be changed irreparably to cater to people who have little to nothing to offer except the creation of ****-holes?
What stake do you have in this asinine action?

 

[Acadia]

The obsession with FOX is alive and well. God forbid we have just ONE conservative-leaning news source:lamo

 

[Buzz62]

This is because they break long enough from their daily FOX News community meetings to regurgitate what they have been taught to say. I note the same thing between my Mom's text messages and conservative members here on this site. It's like they were all in the same room for the last 3 hours and have been fed how to argue and what exactly to default to on any given subject.

Come on Sarge...you know perfectly well that the opposite is also true.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

They "broke" nothing. It was "broken" by their own people.
Why the hell would you want the western world to be changed irreparably to cater to people who have little to nothing to offer except the creation of ****-holes?
What stake do you have in this asinine action?

So the US/Europe has not sent weapons, placed military units in Syria, bombed Syria, supported rebel/terrorist groups in Syria over the last what 6 year?

Without that, the civil war would have been over very quickly, and the refugee crisis prevented

 

[Buzz62]

So the US/Europe has not sent weapons, placed military units in Syria, bombed Syria, supported rebel/terrorist groups in Syria over the last what 6 year?

Without that, the civil war would have been over very quickly, and the refugee crisis prevented

Agreed.
So what? Is that reason to sacrifice your own world?

 

[ElChupacabra]

Just to note

She said to curb it, not stop it.

From a general social stability aspect, controlling immigration (refuge, guest worker, or permanent) is important. The numbers per year that a society can absorb is different every year, dependent on the economy, the society as a whole and of course regional issues. Each society is also different. Canada right now can take a lot of immigrants, given our ok economy and the already high number of immigrants and 2nd generation Canadians. During the 80's and 90's I remember alot more anti immigrant Canadians than I do now. For non Canadians, it is in the 70's that the immigration pattern for Canada changed dramatically from being heavily European, to more Asian primarily.

Germany with very little history of immigration (and what was done in the past not done very well by the German state (see Turkish immigration if I recall in the 50-60's). So accepting a 1.5 million refuge's in just two years is going to cause issues. Just to note, proportionally only in 2016 did Germany accept more immigrants than Canada does on a general annual basis.

So yes Hillary is right in this regard. If the goal of a country is to accept immigrants, it has to do so in a controlled manner as to ensure social stability, which will ensure that immigration in the future can continue.

Now as to the immigration issue/crisis in Europe specifically. The highest number of immigrants to the EU in the last few years were from countries destabilized by the EU and US (Libya, Syria, Iraq, along with various African and other Asian countries. Countries around Syria have take in far more refugees than Europe did (vastly more than the US did), despite the refugee's being a direct result of Nato/US actions in those countries. Jordan and Lebanon each have 1.5 million Syrian refugees, both countries are vastly smaller in size, population and economy than the EU or US. So I do not have much sympathy for the EU/Nato countries in seeing refugee's coming to their countries in large part due to their actions

Yep. Opening the flood gates is a complicated process to manage and equally difficult for refugees if they're left in camps for a long time. While I understand that the refugees are in part due to the policies of the EU and the US, the more difficult part is managing what that integration means for the rest of the population; the acceptance of responsibility is good on paper but on the ground is where it gets messy.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Agreed.
So what? Is that reason to sacrifice your own world?

My own world?

I am Canadian, born and raised in the red neck capital of Canada, Calgary. I have seen the demographics of Calgary change from having perhaps 20 000 visible minorities in a population of around 400 000, to now of 470 000 with an overall population of 1.2 million. My world has not been sacrificed. Calgary is one of the best cities in the world to live

 

[Buzz62]

My own world?

I am Canadian, born and raised in the red neck capital of Canada, Calgary. I have seen the demographics of Calgary change from having perhaps 20 000 visible minorities in a population of around 400 000, to now of 470 000 with an overall population of 1.2 million. My world has not been sacrificed. Calgary is one of the best cities in the world to live

I was raised in Varsity Acres and Dalhousie.

But you're making a fatal error in your logic. People who come from other parts of the world LEGALLY, do so because they have passed through our MERIT-BASED immigration system...for the most part. This keeps us relatively safe. However I have lived in Toronto for the last 30-some-odd years, and I can tell you that were it not for the money I make here, and the investments I have here, I'd be packing my family up and getting out ASAP. Likely will once the spawn are fully baked...

My point is this. We (the western nations as a whole) have no responsibility to take in this flood of refugees. In fact, seeing that the USA and Britain (for the most part) saw fit to ****ing level Babylon, it would be a stupid idea to allow this flood of Arab and African refugees in. Because, my fellow Canuck, if you think for a single minute, that the Muslim/Arab peoples do not hold a grudge for the destruction of ancient Babylon...I have a bridge to sell ya.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

I was raised in Varsity Acres and Dalhousie.

But you're making a fatal error in your logic. People who come from other parts of the world LEGALLY, do so because they have passed through our MERIT-BASED immigration system...for the most part. This keeps us relatively safe. However I have lived in Toronto for the last 30-some-odd years, and I can tell you that were it not for the money I make here, and the investments I have here, I'd be packing my family up and getting out ASAP. Likely will once the spawn are fully baked...

My point is this. We (the western nations as a whole) have no responsibility to take in this flood of refugees. In fact, seeing that the USA and Britain (for the most part) saw fit to ****ing level Babylon, it would be a stupid idea to allow this flood of Arab and African refugees in. Because, my fellow Canuck, if you think for a single minute, that the Muslim/Arab peoples do not hold a grudge for the destruction of ancient Babylon...I have a bridge to sell ya.

Yes we do as we in large part made their country a hell hole for our own interests. We broke it, we bear responsibility for that, and the people we screwed over

As for Babylon. I doubt many Muslims outside of perhaps Iraq, care anything about ancient Babyon, as Babylon was not a Muslim empire, nor was it a Christian empire, or even a Jewish Empire. It was gone about 900 or so years before Islam was founded, and around 500-600 years before Christianity.

 

[MSgt]

Come on Sarge...you know perfectly well that the opposite is also true.

I wouldn't know. My Mother watches FOX.

But it seems to me that the left appears to favor what the entire rest of the news outlets declare. If the opposite calls the latest Trump Tweet stupid, then they are pretty much agreeing with the rest of the world, not a single media source. This is why all of the rest are considered "fake news" to Conservatives. And since I tend to see things through a historical lens, it's the left that is demonstrating more common sense and a healthier world perspective today. This may be due to the wider media outlets not being as grossly bias and partisan as FOX News, which tends to be the only source for Conservatives. And you stated it yourself, CNN's ratings are down. This means that Democrats aren't tuning in.

Just look at the intense lean. It's not Liberals who have been embracing a far-left communist lean from campaign trail to daily routine. The Democratic Primaries were almost split between Sanders and Clinton, plenty of Democrats abstained from having to vote for Clinton in the General, and ANTIFA continues to be a consequential nuisance not worth acknowledging. But with every new Trump antic, conservatives appear to be getting more bitter and more angry at the world. They have even made it a matter of routine practice to shove their fellow conservatives into a "rino" category if they dare not tow the developing far-right line, thus relegating even Republicans to "the left." And with the political spectrum showing a them-versus-the-rest divide, instead of a left-versus-right divide, they really are becoming a single obtuse mind way off in the far-right where the alt-Right resides. I mean, there are conservatives here on this site who are openly arguing for GOP autocracy and others who talk of Trump as if Divine. This is mental. And they get their daily dosage of GOP/Trump pride from a single media source.

So when a Liberal declares that Trump is an idiot, that's not CNN's doing. That's Trump's own presentation and the rest of the world coming to a conclusion.

 

[JustHanging]

My own world?

I am Canadian, born and raised in the red neck capital of Canada, Calgary. I have seen the demographics of Calgary change from having perhaps 20 000 visible minorities in a population of around 400 000, to now of 470 000 with an overall population of 1.2 million. My world has not been sacrificed. Calgary is one of the best cities in the world to live

Heh! Love the stampede. Love it when you guys host the Grey Cup....people on horseback running around in hotels is something everyone should see at least once in their lives.


See you in July.



Oh oh, the Calgarians are lose! The Calgarians are lose!

Calgary horse checks into Ottawa hotel at Grey Cup

 

[Buzz62]

Yes we do as we in large part made their country a hell hole for our own interests. We broke it, we bear responsibility for that, and the people we screwed over

Then we are at an impasse and must agree to disagree.
And were you to actually experience what's going on in Europe, I think your position might just be rocked a bit.

As for Babylon. I doubt many Muslims outside of perhaps Iraq, care anything about ancient Babyon, as Babylon was not a Muslim empire, nor was it a Christian empire, or even a Jewish Empire. It was gone about 900 or so years before Islam was founded, and around 500-600 years before Christianity.

This "Babylon" thing was not something I just made up. Its an idea that was explained to me by an Arab person. The results of Bush's Shock and Awe went allot deeper then we very removed civilians can fathom. These people watched on in horror as Baghdad was destroyed. As families were blown to bits right in front of them. Ya...it created a VERY deep anger. It also played right into the hands of both the militant Sunnis and Shia. It is the biggest failure, geopolitically speaking, of this century...to date that is. I think the worst is yet to come. Financially however, it accomplished the main objective. Iraq continues to trade its oil reserves in American Dollars, instead of Euros, which is what Saddam had started doing.

We owe it to these people to finance the rebuilding of their world. That I agree with. But again...it is incredibly stupid to think you can invite a man into your home, after you've finished blasting his wife and children to kingdom come, right in front of his eyes.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Heh! Love the stampede. Love it when you guys host the Grey Cup....people on horseback running around in hotels is something everyone should see at least once in their lives.


See you in July.



Oh oh, the Calgarians are lose! The Calgarians are lose!

Calgary horse checks into Ottawa hotel at Grey Cup

Home of the Ceasar, and Ginger Beef

 

[JustHanging]

Then we are at an impasse and must agree to disagree.
And were you to actually experience what's going on in Europe, I think your position might just be rocked a bit.

What's going on in Europe? I go there every summer, and haven't noticed anything.

 

[Buzz62]

I wouldn't know. My Mother watches FOX.

But it seems to me that the left appears to favor what the entire rest of the news outlets declare. If the opposite calls the latest Trump Tweet stupid, then they are pretty much agreeing with the rest of the world, not a single media source. This is why all of the rest are considered "fake news" to Conservatives. And since I tend to see things through a historical lens, it's the left that is demonstrating more common sense and a healthier world perspective today. This may be due to the wider media outlets not being as grossly bias and partisan as FOX News, which tends to be the only source for Conservatives. And you stated it yourself, CNN's ratings are down. This means that Democrats aren't tuning in.

Just look at the intense lean. It's not Liberals who have been embracing a far-left communist lean from campaign trail to daily routine. The Democratic Primaries were almost split between Sanders and Clinton, plenty of Democrats abstained from having to vote for Clinton in the General, and ANTIFA continues to be a consequential nuisance not worth acknowledging. But with every new Trump antic, conservatives appear to be getting more bitter and more angry at the world. They have even made it a matter of routine practice to shove their fellow conservatives into a "rino" category if they dare not tow the developing far-right line, thus relegating even Republicans to "the left." And with the political spectrum showing a them-versus-the-rest divide, instead of a left-versus-right divide, they really are becoming a single obtuse mind way off in the far-right where the alt-Right resides. I mean, there are conservatives here on this site who are openly arguing for GOP autocracy and others who talk of Trump as if Divine. This is mental. And they get their daily dosage of GOP/Trump pride from a single media source.

So when a Liberal declares that Trump is an idiot, that's not CNN's doing. That's Trump's own presentation and the rest of the world coming to a conclusion.

With respect to your mom.
When you visit her, do you bring up politics and start arguments with her? I hope you don't. She is a MOTHER, and believes what she does, not for her sake, but for YOURS. So I truly hope you understand and respect her views as a result.

As to the rest...
I agree that Trump is a crass blow-hard. I actually don't think many conservatives would disagree with that assessment.
But the vitriol of CNN is just as crass and hard to listen to. They are, collectively, every bit the blow-hard Donald is.
Is Trump a racist? Well, it would be illogical to say that he holds absolutely no racial biases. Every human on this rock holds some racial biases, and those who swear they don't...are simply lying. But does he let his own racial biases affect his presidential judgement? I haven't seen it. I've looked for it...but just haven't really seen it. Oh I know many lefties will make grandiose statements like..."Oh My God! Its a dog-whistle"!". But rally...that's just silliness. Nazi? Blatant silliness. And I feel I must point out that his position on immigration is identicle to that of Chuck Schumer not so many moons ago.
Thus today, when a Liberal declares that Trump is an idiot, the average conservative...like your mom more than likely...hears just another lie.

 

[bubbabgone]

Yes

Google Polish Plumber, and you will see the terrorized Brits voting to leave the EU because of them

Silly me I thought you were being serious.

 

[Acadia]

With respect to your mom.
When you visit her, do you bring up politics and start arguments with her? I hope you don't. She is a MOTHER, and believes what she does, not for her sake, but for YOURS. So I truly hope you understand and respect her views as a result.

As to the rest...
I agree that Trump is a crass blow-hard. I actually don't think many conservatives would disagree with that assessment.
But the vitriol of CNN is just as crass and hard to listen to. They are, collectively, every bit the blow-hard Donald is.
Is Trump a racist? Well, it would be illogical to say that he holds absolutely no racial biases. Every human on this rock holds some racial biases, and those who swear they don't...are simply lying. But does he let his own racial biases affect his presidential judgement? I haven't seen it. I've looked for it...but just haven't really seen it. Oh I know many lefties will make grandiose statements like..."Oh My God! Its a dog-whistle"!". But rally...that's just silliness. Nazi? Blatant silliness. And I feel I must point out that his position on immigration is identicle to that of Chuck Schumer not so many moons ago.
Thus today, when a Liberal declares that Trump is an idiot, the average conservative...like your mom more than likely...hears just another lie.

Trump is most definitely indelicate and yes, crass. I'll never understand why so many need the occupant of the WH to be some sort of perfect father figure. I like that Trump is messy, because I know all humans are. Obama's holier than thou act was tiring and trite.

 

[Buzz62]

What's going on in Europe? I go there every summer, and haven't noticed anything.

Me too. But my place in Europe is in Prague. Where do you go?
Try hanging out in Paris for a while. Maybe hit one of the "no-go zones".
Ask the people. They'll tell you where to experience the beauty that is, the refugee camps.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Silly me I thought you were being serious.

I am

One of the main pushes for Brexit was the "polish plumber". They worked harder for less than British Plumbers, that created fear and terror in the minds of Brexiters who voted to leave the UK to protects and control its boarders from the fearsome Polish Plumber

 

[Buzz62]

Trump is most definitely indelicate and yes, crass. I'll never understand why so many need the occupant of the WH to be some sort of perfect father figure. I like that Trump is messy, because I know all humans are. Obama's holier than thou act was tiring and trite.

I agree. But many do not apparently. Are they correct in saying Trump gives the office a black-eye? I don't really think so.
I've seen him deal with the likes of Merkle and that French guy...can't place the name right now...but those 2 are on the outs because of this...and the carbon tax.
I've seen him deal with my PM Pixey-Dust and frankly...Pixey-dust gets off light with Trump.

I think its refreshing and good, in a way, that Donny-boy is what he is.
They all started off by ridiculing him openly.
Today...I think they're more scared of him than anything else. Between him and Bannon's efforts...Liberal Europe is enjoying a slow and inevitable death.
Which is exactly why Hillary-Billary would say these odd things.