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High crimes and misdemeanors

Does calling for peaceful protest & claiming election fraud constitute high crimes and misdemeanors?


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Does calling for a "peaceful protest" and claiming the election was stolen constitute "high crimes and misdemeanors?" That is the accusation against President Trump.

No the accusation against Mr. Trump is that he was inciting insurrection.

Mr. Trump's DEFENCE is that he was "only calling for a peaceful protest" and that his statement that the election was "stolen" was factually correct.
 
If you bother to listen to his speech...Trump in fact did not call for more than peaceful protests....and his so called enablers are not the one the shit for brains Dem's are impeaching.
Context is key. That Stop the Steal speech was not given in a vacuum. You won't learn anything or change anyone's mind by pretending that it was.
 
it would be political suicide for the GOP

Why?

Most in the GOP are pretty much anti-Trump.

Once he’s no longer in any position of power they’re going to turn on him in droves.

The GOP will be fine without Trump.
 
As we were informed last year, the House can impeach for any reason it chooses. Just because the Constitution uses a phrase like "high crimes and misdemeanors" doesn't mean that the legislature needs to consider that phrase. The legislature as a whole is the principle branch of government and what they say goes, period. This is especially important to note as the Constitution expressly says that impeachment shall not extend beyond removal from office but if congress decides that they want to try someone for impeachment after they leave office they can damned sure do so!

This is America, mother****ers! Congress rules this bitch!
Constitutional scholars disagree over this. I believe John Turley is one of them. Doesn’t matter though. It will never get through the senate with a conviction.
 
You’re just dashing the hopes of all the idiots who want Trump impeached. They’re hoping in addition to that he can be hung in the public square where tickets will be sold to throw stones at him.

I've come to the conclusion that cretins like this are worse than anything Trump allegedly did.

At any rate, it's political suicide for the GOP senate to purge Trump from the party. If they do, they'll never win an election again. The majority of Trump's base remains with him.
 
Why?

Most in the GOP are pretty much anti-Trump.

Once he’s no longer in any position of power they’re going to turn on him in droves.

The GOP will be fine without Trump.

This might be true, but his base, Republicans, are still with Trump.
Read the article... go look at a few polls since Jan. 6th.
 
Is saying "fight" a high crime or a misdemeanor in your opinion.

Quote anything you claim President Trump said that instructed people to illegally take over the US Capital and overthrow the American government. Be specific. You bing ordered to make the purpose of your life hating Trump is not proof of anything.
Funny. You need specifics re. Trump's speach but vague innuendoes are enough re. election fraud. Let's try it the other way round- we need specific proofs of major election fraud but Trump's vague innuendoes are enough to convict.
How's that work for you?
Trump told his followers that the election had been stolen from them, them personally, based on absolutely nothing. It was a lie intended to make his people very angry, and if Congress decides he was culpable in that disgraceful performance in the Capitol, that's the US government in action. Suck it up.
 
I've come to the conclusion that cretins like this are worse than anything Trump allegedly did.

At any rate, it's political suicide for the GOP senate to purge Trump from the party. If they do, they'll never win an election again. The majority of Trump's base remains with him.
Although I supported Trump and agreed with many of his policies I will no longer be supporting any republican (or democrat) in future elections. Why would I vote for Trump again only to have a repeat of the last four years of insanity from the left in going all out to remove him from office from day one? All future votes from me will be cast for third party candidates. I hope Jo Jorgensen will run again.
 
Quote Trump calling for an insurrectionist attack in the Capital to overthrow the government - or you got nothing.

You hate Trump and his "enablers" is not proof anything but about your psychological nature.

Much like other threads, you seem to project a whole lot.

But Trump (and/or his enablers and supporters) said all of the following, and the result was a literal attempt to overthrow Congress by the extreme right of Trump's Republican Party.

"We won this election, and we won it by a landslide." - One this is a lie, but set the stage to anger those who think the election was stolen.
"We will stop the steal." - This is a basis, not in itself calling for violence but is built on.
"We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn't happen. You don't concede when there's theft involved. Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore. You will have an illegitimate president. That is what you will have, and we can't let that happen." - More basis, not in itself calling for violence but adds on to the narrative.
"If we are wrong, we will be made fools of, but if we're right, a lot of them will go to jail. So let's have trial by combat." - Giuliani being himself and making matters worse.
"If you don't fight like hell you're not going to have a country anymore." - This one takes the above and crosses a line, to the point of incitement.
"We're going to walk down to the Capitol..." - With all the above this is the pointer, who is targeted and when.
"You'll never take back our country with weakness, you have to show strength, and you have to be strong." - More fuel on the fire.

Now, this is a matter for the courts.

But this was a concerted effort by Trump and many others who all decided to escalate the event right up to the day Congress needed to certify the election results (really Pence's part being a formality.) The result was a large group of lunatics took all that fuel and tried to overthrow Congress to the point of flooding the capital, killing a police officer, damaging and stealing things from the Capital, endangering members of Congress - Staff - and everyone else in the building, and ultimately causing a delay in Pence's action that day.

Those that are Trump loyalists, much like you, will dismiss it all in a haze of partisanship. However, Giuliani may be up for disbarment and Trump has seen his second articles of Impeachment against him (a record.)

Face the facts, Trump and his enablers appealed to the worst of the right to do what all their efforts to date failed to do to that point.
 
Although I supported Trump and agreed with many of his policies I will no longer be supporting any republican (or democrat) in future elections. Why would I vote for Trump again only to have a repeat of the last four years of insanity from the left in going all out to remove him from office from day one? All future votes from me will be cast for third party candidates. I hope Jo Jorgensen will run again.

Though I am on the conservative side, I currently do not consider myself a loyal GOPer, hence changed my forum lean to Independent.
 
The speech is easy to understand even for a Trump apologist which is why the mob did exactly what Trump told them to do, they marched to the Capitol and tried to stop the steal strongly before their nation was taken from them by communist Democrats and Nancy Pelosi. Even the troglodytes who attended the speech understood what was being asked of them. Trump then sat on the sidelines and watched the spectacle unfold even as his own VPs life was being threatened. He did nothing. Sorry but you can try the legal verbal hijinks all day long and it won't fool anyone with half a brain. Trump acts like a mob figure. He never said he was going to put the head of a horse in bed with the producer, he just said he was going to make him an offer he couldn't refuse.
 
The actual language of the article of impeachment claims that claiming there was election fraud constitutes "insurrection."


Why isn't Democrat Stacy Abrams in prison for insurrection? She continues to claim election fraud to this day. Why instead did the Democratic Party have a criminal insurrectionist give the response to President Trump's state of the union address?

This is a lie. See how your blind support for Trump is based on lying for Trump? Abandoning all sense of integrity and honor is a prerequisite to being associated with Trump.

The "actual language" involves a single use of the word "fraud." And it is written in this context:

In the months preceding the Joint Session, President Trump repeatedly issued false statements asserting that the Presidential election results were the product of widespread fraud and should not be accepted by the American people or certified by State or Federal officials. Shortly before the Joint Session commenced, President Trump addressed a crowd at the Ellipse in Washington, DC. There, he reiterated false claims that ‘‘we won this election, and we won it by a landslide’’.

He also willfully made statements that, in context, encouraged—and foreseeably resulted in—lawless action at the Capitol, such as: ‘‘if you don’t fight like hell you’re not going to have a country anymore’’. Thus incited by President Trump, members of the crowd he had addressed, in an attempt to, among other objectives, interfere with the Joint Session’s solemn constitutional duty to certify the results of the 2020 Presidential election, unlawfully breached and vandalized the Capitol, injured and killed law enforcement personnel, menaced Members of Congress, the Vice President, and Congressional personnel, and engaged in other violent, deadly, destructive, and seditious acts.

Clear enough to those who don't have a personal fetish to worship a national traitor.
 
Although I supported Trump and agreed with many of his policies I will no longer be supporting any republican (or democrat) in future elections. Why would I vote for Trump again only to have a repeat of the last four years of insanity from the left in going all out to remove him from office from day one? All future votes from me will be cast for third party candidates. I hope Jo Jorgensen will run again.
Welcome to the 'throw away your vote' club. We have stickers! 💕&☮
 
Though I am on the conservative side, I currently do not consider myself a loyal GOPer, hence changed my forum lean to Independent.

Yeah, only took January 6th to do it. Four years of blind support preceded it.
 
Though I am on the conservative side, I currently do not consider myself a loyal GOPer, hence changed my forum lean to Independent.
The swamp is filled with both sides of the two parties. Trump just shined a light on many of them. But failed to significantly clean it up. I’m beginning to think that the likes of Barr is a card carrying member of it.
 
Welcome to the 'throw away your vote' club. We have stickers! 💕&☮
That’s hogwash. It’s what the masters of the two parties want you to believe.
 
That is exactly the charge. That his calling for a peace protest and claiming the election was stolen constituted committing a criminal insurrection.
Your post would say "that his calling for a "peaceful protest" to coincide with the final certification of the election while claiming that election was stolen constituted inciting a criminal insurrection".
 
Republicans, are still with Trump.

Most republicans were not with Trump before he was nominated.

I think it’s very wrong to connect Trump Supporters and Republicans.

Many Republicans are repulsed by Trump and can’t wait for him to go away.

I have little doubt there will not be a shortage of candidates to run against whoever the Dem candidate is in 2024.
 
That’s hogwash. It’s what the masters of the two parties want you to believe.
I didn't say I agreed, it's just what everyone says I am doing.
 
Much like other threads, you seem to project a whole lot.

But Trump (and/or his enablers and supporters) said all of the following, and the result was a literal attempt to overthrow Congress by the extreme right of Trump's Republican Party.

"We won this election, and we won it by a landslide." - One this is a lie, but set the stage to anger those who think the election was stolen.
"We will stop the steal." - This is a basis, not in itself calling for violence but is built on.
"We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn't happen. You don't concede when there's theft involved. Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore. You will have an illegitimate president. That is what you will have, and we can't let that happen." - More basis, not in itself calling for violence but adds on to the narrative.
"If we are wrong, we will be made fools of, but if we're right, a lot of them will go to jail. So let's have trial by combat." - Giuliani being himself and making matters worse.
"If you don't fight like hell you're not going to have a country anymore." - This one takes the above and crosses a line, to the point of incitement.
"We're going to walk down to the Capitol..." - With all the above this is the pointer, who is targeted and when.
"You'll never take back our country with weakness, you have to show strength, and you have to be strong." - More fuel on the fire.

Now, this is a matter for the courts.

But this was a concerted effort by Trump and many others who all decided to escalate the event right up to the day Congress needed to certify the election results (really Pence's part being a formality.) The result was a large group of lunatics took all that fuel and tried to overthrow Congress to the point of flooding the capital, killing a police officer, damaging and stealing things from the Capital, endangering members of Congress - Staff - and everyone else in the building, and ultimately causing a delay in Pence's action that day.

Those that are Trump loyalists, much like you, will dismiss it all in a haze of partisanship. However, Giuliani may be up for disbarment and Trump has seen his second articles of Impeachment against him (a record.)

Face the facts, Trump and his enablers appealed to the worst of the right to do what all their efforts to date failed to do to that point.

So if he was inciting violence, why did he claim, "I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard."

I think that is the one sentence he did say that puts a wrench into the claim that Trump inciting of an insurrection.
Mind you, there were a lot of things I said from the day of the uprising he did say that could be see as pandering to his base, but inciting the crowd will be hard to prove in an Impeachment trial. He called for the crowd to make their voices be heard peacefully.
 
Constitutional scholars disagree over this. I believe John Turley is one of them. Doesn’t matter though. It will never get through the senate with a conviction.
People that understand the purpose of the Constitution disagree with that comment. People that seek only political power and believe that the people are too damned stupid to be left to their own devices and therefore must be ruled by an all powerful government totally agree with what I wrote.
 
[QUOTE="Dragonfly, post: 1073350918, member: 4695"
Most republicans were not with Trump before he was nominated.

I think it’s very wrong to connect Trump Supporters and Republicans.

Many Republicans are repulsed by Trump and can’t wait for him to go away.

I have little doubt there will not be a shortage of candidates to run against whoever the Dem candidate is in 2024.
[/QUOTE]

75% of Republican voters remain with Trump. The senate needs 12 more GOP to convict. Why would they do that if they ever want to win an election again?
 
Although I supported Trump and agreed with many of his policies I will no longer be supporting any republican (or democrat) in future elections. Why would I vote for Trump again only to have a repeat of the last four years of insanity from the left in going all out to remove him from office from day one? All future votes from me will be cast for third party candidates. I hope Jo Jorgensen will run again.

Ha!

So, in your quest to absolve yourself of your responsibility for helping the right-wing create this mess through blind support and loyalty, you choose to lash out at "the left" for being correct again.

- First, you pretend that the man's presidency did not begin under the shade of discovered secret meetings with Russian operatives, at a time when Putin was actively interfering in our election on Trump's behalf, in which Trump's National Security Advisor tried to cover up.

- Second, you pretend that criticism for Trump did not routinely come from throughout the political spectrum, opting instead to pretend that yours was a unified defense against "the left."

- Third, instead of acknowledging what radical right-wing propaganda created, with great help from the GOP, you choose to re-direct that uncomfortable reality at "the left" for simply being mean to Trump.


In the end, you still clearly devote yourself to Trump and the nonsensical and irrational propaganda about "the left." You vote for a third party, not because the GOP sucks anymore, but because "the left" won't allow it to suck without consequence. Don't get me wrong. I'm fine with your kind throwing your vote away. It's better than giving it to another Trump.
 
People that understand the purpose of the Constitution disagree with that comment. People that seek only political power and believe that the people are too damned stupid to be left to their own devices and therefore must be ruled by an all powerful government totally agree with what I wrote.
You disagree with the idea that the Senate most likely wont convict?

Find me a source that clearly states that all constitutional scholars are in full agreement on this subject. Saying most do won’t cut the mustard.
 
So if he was inciting violence, why did he claim, "I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard."

I think that is the one sentence he did say that puts a wrench into the claim that Trump inciting of an insurrection.
Mind you, there were a lot of things I said from the day of the uprising he did say that could be see as pandering to his base, but inciting the crowd will be hard to prove in an Impeachment trial. He called for the crowd to make their voices be heard peacefully.

Odds are Trump's defenders will try that very approach, one statement somehow nullifies all the others.
 
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