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He's dead.

mixedmedia

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Trajan Octavian Titus said:
May god have mercy on his soul.
For everyone so confident about this display of justice:

Do you feel safer this morning?

And what ya gonna go out and blow your saved tax pennies on?
 

debate_junkie

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Trajan Octavian Titus said:
May god have mercy on his soul.
If you're meaning Stanley Williams, justice has been served. He executed four people who did nothing to deserve to die.
 

Billo_Really

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Originally posted by shuamort:
I only feel safer when Bush allows a mentally retarded person to be executed
Not me. I'm holding out until we start killing kids before I feel safe.
 

Cremaster77

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Billo_Really said:
Not me. I'm holding out until we start killing kids before I feel safe.
Haven't you heard. We have been killing kids...in Iraq. I've felt much safer since that's been going on.
 

Calm2Chaos

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mixedmedia said:
For everyone so confident about this display of justice:

Do you feel safer this morning?

And what ya gonna go out and blow your saved tax pennies on?

YES

I was thinking a christmas present for my daughter.................
 

Calm2Chaos

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Cremaster77 said:
Haven't you heard. We have been killing kids...in Iraq. I've felt much safer since that's been going on.

And all this time I thought it was the terrorist driving into a crowd of children before detonating there homemade bomb.... Guess that doesn't count though does it... :rofl
 
F

FireUltra 98

Intersting Commentary piece in the Chicago Defender. For those who not familiar with The Defender, its a long time Black Newspaper that has a long and respected history in Chicago.
Tookie goes Hollywood
by Joseph C. Phillips
December 12, 2005

Stephen Jones, author of Seven Secrets of How to Study, recently attended the National Society of Black Engineers (NSBE) conference in Boston, which boosted attendance of over 8,000 African American students. Sadly, no television reporters attended to tell about the good news.

"African Americans must start a revolution that will not be televised," Jones says.

Dr. Jones and many others agree that the media will only show up in the Black community, if there is a crime or an FBI investigation. "There were over 8,000 potential college graduates doing good things for their colleges and local community and it was not breaking news," Jones says.
>
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Standing outside the walls of San Quentin prison, the rapper Snoop Dogg urged California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger to grant clemency to convicted murderer Stan "Tookie" Williams. Williams, the co founder of the notorious street gang the Crips, was convicted and sentenced to death for the 1979 slayings of Albert Owens, Yen-I Yang, his wife, Tsai-Shai Chen Yang, and their daughter, Yu-Chin Yang Lin.
>
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"Stanley `Tookie' Williams is not just a regular old guy, he's an inspirator. His voice needs to be heard." Snoop, Mike Farrell, Danny Glover, Jamie Foxx and the other celebrity voices now raised in support of Williams offer a clear picture of the distorted moral vision of the Hollywood left. It is a vision that finds virtue contemptible and props up homicidal maniacs who write bad children's books as role models for the masses.
>
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The portrayal of Williams as some pied piper of peace for the gang community also holds very little water. A quick review of Book Scan shows the Tookie series of books have hardly been blockbusters. His top seller, "Gangs and Violence" has sold 330 books. Another book "Gangs and Wanting to Belong" sold exactly two copies. No one is reading his books, least of all his two sons, one of whom is serving time in San Quentin.
>
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On Sunday Nov. 13, one week before the "Save Tookie" rally at San Quentin, 14-year-old William Cox and a friend were attending a neighborhood carnival when they were gunned down by a man who mistook them for rival gang members. Cox, who was not in a gang, was struck in the chest and died at the scene. That is the evil wrought by Stanley Williams!

Of course Snoop and Danny Glover did not hold a rally for William Cox. His death went unnoticed by the Hollywood commissars of compassion. They were too busy trying to save the life of a cold-blooded killer to notice one more young life snuffed out by gang violence. That tells you all you need to know about the corrupt vision the Hollywood left has for America.
Read the whole article here.


http://www.chicagodefender.com/page/commentary.cfm?ArticleID=3232


Good read.
 
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Cremaster77 said:
Haven't you heard. We have been killing kids...in Iraq. I've felt much safer since that's been going on.
Ah, it only took 7 posts before the Tookie Williams thread became a Hate Bush thread.
 

Calm2Chaos

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KCConservative said:
Ah, it only took 7 posts before the Tookie Williams thread became a Hate Bush thread.
Well ya know there a connection between Iraq and everything else in the world.
 

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Ah, it only took 7 posts before the Tookie Williams thread became a Hate Bush thread.
And why not? You people are gloating about this guys death as if it actually means something. No wonder people get pissed. Your not helping.
 

Calm2Chaos

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FinnMacCool said:
And why not? You people are gloating about this guys death as if it actually means something. No wonder people get pissed. Your not helping.
I'd prefer to win...

4 people died by his hand. Probably more there just the ones he was convicted on

And many many many more have died due to his gang.

No real connection to Iraq other then BS and the constant need to complain
 
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FinnMacCool said:
And why not? You people are gloating about this guys death as if it actually means something. No wonder people get pissed. Your not helping.
Who's gloating, I mean I supported the decision to put him to death for his hanous crimes but I still hopes he finds forgiveness, ever hear of Barabis?
 
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FinnMacCool said:
And why not? You people are gloating about this guys death as if it actually means something. No wonder people get pissed. Your not helping.
Still has nothing to do with Iraq or your hatred for the president. And you're welcome to show where I gloated. I oppose the death penalty, Finn. Thanks for playing.
 
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galenrox said:
But what difference does killing him make? Has he continued killing since he's been in prison? Do people still live in fear of him while he's been in prison?

The fact is in this particular case his execution has done more harm to this society than good, considering for the last several years he has been doing good, and now he's not.

I mean, what could possibly be more effective at reaching kids who're thinking of joining a gang than a man who very clearly has street credit and started one of the most notorious gangs coming out and saying that you need to put down the gun and pick up a book? But no, we don't consider the actual pragmatism behind the situation, we need revenge!

And by the way, mixedmedia mentioned that you saved a few tax pennies in executing him, you actually spent quite a few more dollars in having him executed, you would've saved quite a bit if you'd left him in jail for the rest of his life.
The only reason it cost more money to have him executed was because the California judicial system is so screwed up that it took ten odd years of him sitting on death row with a seeminly endless amount of appeals.

People need to know that if you kill somebody you to in turn will be killed.

As for him reaching out to kids do you really think that makes up for the thousands of kids he turned into gang members in the first place, and does it make up for the 4 people who he slaughtered? What about the good they might have done had they been given a chance to live?
 

mixedmedia

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Trajan Octavian Titus said:
Who's gloating, I mean I supported the decision to put him to death for his hanous crimes but I still hopes he finds forgiveness, ever hear of Barabis?
Barabas, you mean? The man who was granted clemency instead of Jesus? I'm not sure I follow your line of reasoning.
 

shuamort

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Loxd4 said:
hey what was Stanley Williams last qoute and meal?
It looks like he skipped the "last meal".

REPORTER: What have you thought about doing in your last 24 hours? Who do you want there? What about your last meal, Stanley?

STANLEY TOOKIE WILLIAMS: I accept no last meal. I don’t want anyone to be there. Who would I possibly want to see me die?
 
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galenrox said:
Oh yeah, those damn Californians, you know, wanting to take every last step to make sure that they don't allow the state to kill innocent civilians, oh those crazy bastards!

As pertaining to your question, I don't know, it is my opinion that that is between him and God, and if he has done enough, and was truely remorseful for what he did, he's in heaven right now, and if not, well, at least he's black and thus better suited for the climate (I'm KIDDING!!!)

But we need to face the situation pragmatically, not ideologically, and pragmatically, we have a major problem as a society, and he was helping in our attempts to solve that problem.
ya but he was a major contributer to the problem in the first place, it's like saying that if Hussein decided to turn over a new leaf right now and started denouncing terrorism that we should just let him off the hook for the millions that he's slaughtered. Well that's probably not a good example I mean they gave Arafat the noble peace prize.:roll:
 

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"If you join a gang, yousa gonna die!"

"Why would I die, Donkey?"

"Because either another gang member will kill you, OR you'll end up doing something stupid like ol' Tookie and end up with a needle in your arm counting the seconds away until you pass away."

"But what did Tookie do to deserve to die, Donkey?"

"Well, he murdered a man by shooting him IN THE BACK, TWICE, and then he LAUGHED at the sounds he made while he died. How barbaric! Then he murdered 3 asian women with a shotgun. For no good reason."

"Oh, I get it now, Donkey. I'll make sure to tell my friends to never ever join a gang, or else we'll end up like Tookie, Tupac, and Biggie. Thanks Donkey!"

"You're welcome, Billy. Now run along and play. But whatch out for the mean ol' pimp. Cuz he'll take yo momma away!" LOL
 

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galenrox said:
But what difference does killing him make? Has he continued killing since he's been in prison? Do people still live in fear of him while he's been in prison?
Guess you should ask that to the families wether it makes a difference. This may be closure for them after he stole the lives of there family members. Cost is another reason. Why should I have to pay to keep this guy in 3 hits and cot for the rest of his life. He pretty much disregaurded a major social rule in our society. If he is incapable of being part of society I see no reason we should have to continue to care for him
galenrox said:
The fact is in this particular case his execution has done more harm to this society than good, considering for the last several years he has been doing good, and now he's not.
HE MURDERED FOUR PEOPLE< HE WAS DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE MURDERS OF MANY MANY MANY MORE. He NEVER Appologized for his crime or showed remorse for what he did. He wrote some worthless ass books. Yet he never attempted to help authorities bring down the monster he helped create. His kind of good I think we can survive without.

galenrox said:
I mean, what could possibly be more effective at reaching kids who're thinking of joining a gang than a man who very clearly has street credit and started one of the most notorious gangs coming out and saying that you need to put down the gun and pick up a book? But no, we don't consider the actual pragmatism behind the situation, we need revenge!
How would he know, he has never ever accepted responsibility for killing those people. You want to help? Help go after those that are running it now. Sorry his great literary mind is lost, im sure those that he murdered execution style are real sad about it
galenrox said:
And by the way, mixedmedia mentioned that you saved a few tax pennies in executing him, you actually spent quite a few more dollars in having him executed, you would've saved quite a bit if you'd left him in jail for the rest of his life.
Because we allowed a man that was utterly and completely guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt play the system for 33 years. He should have gotten a single appeal and then they should have started saving the taxpayers money right there. Get closure for the family and victims.
 

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galenrox said:
Right. Dude, you're a conservative, and thus you understand the importance of governing with logic, not emotion, so why in the hell would we ask the people who absolutely cannot think about this issue objectively to decide on that?

32 years ago that very well may have been true. BUt this crime is almost as old as I am. I am pretty sure they have come to there senses since then.

galenrox said:
And he is incapable of participating in society, hmmm? Gosh, if there was only a place where you could put people outside of society, where they are held with other people deemed incapable of participating in society. Can you think of a place like that?

LOL Smart Ass........
Again.... I am paying for this man to have his bed, food and cable TV. I honestly don't see the point in spending the taxpayers money on him... Now that being said. The justice system in these cases is for the most part horendous in my opinion. In cases such as these that have overwhelming physical evidence and eyewittness accounts the appeals process should be severaly limited as to not waste the states time and the taxpayers money

galenrox said:
What are we, in fourth grade TO THE EXTREME? "You didn't say you're sorry, so we're gonna kill you!" As far as the gravity of his offenses, you don't have to convince me, we're in full agreement that his crimes are unforgivable, except between him and the Lord. What I'm saying is killing him is a waste of time, money, and other resources.

Saying he was sorry or acknowledging his crime has nothing to do whatsoever with his sentence. It shows the type of person he was and the type of person he STILL is up until his death anyway. And if he still didn't care abou the people he killed what makes you think that his writings were anything but fodder for his release from death row.

galenrox said:
Also, by the same logic, many people will die because of people of your opinion. Because he was convincing some kids to stay out of gangs, and those efforts were quite abruptly halted, thus meaning because of this more kids will join gangs, and kill more people or get killed themselves.
:bravo: Good job!

You can't blame that on the death penalty. The guy you can blame that on just got the needle.... So he's dead. And you don't know if he convinced anybody. If he was really interested in keeping kids out of gangs he should have maybe

1. Stood up and said he was wrong and this is what happens when your in a gang.

2. Le t the kids know that he was in a gang and for his crimes he is going to pay the ultimate price.

3. Unless you want to end up like him you need to straighten out.

Because I tell you what. I bet the images of them pushing that needle into his veins might go a long way to detering or turning around a few young potential gang members. A lot more then a book anyway. Can't see these guys as being big book worms to begin with.

galenrox said:
But once again, at least we got to kill a guy, that's good, right?:roll:

Not just any guy. A cold blooded executioner that deemed himself the judge, jury and exacutioner for 4 people. And the probable starting point for many other innocent people who got gunned down by his people. You murder 4 people in cold blood and no reason and you get designated an animal. Animals that are a danger to society are put down


galenrox said:
I think you and I both know that the people who he murdered have no opinion on the matter, so your assumptions about the opinions of the dead are kind of ridiculous.

Granted

galenrox said:
You know what would've assured closure quicker? Life in prison without possibility of parole. 4 consecutive life sentences, you know why that would work? Because they wouldn't have to keep worrying about the appeals, they wouldn't have to keep waiting for his execution. With 4 conseucutive life sentences, you're not getting out of jail, you're gonna be there until you die.


And he was in San Quinten, it's not like it's a little cushy resort.

With scores upon scores of people that adored him and would do anything for him. The ritz it isn't but his prison stay wasn't like yours or mine would have been. Three hots and a cot with a little TV.... NO woman mind you..but at least he had to give up something


galenrox said:
Life in prison is justice, take away his life as he knows it. Killing him is just revenge for the blood thirsty.
In this case I don't think it is Justice. If your willing to snatch someones life from them for your own enjoyment. Then you should be willing to pay for it with your own. Society as a whole lost nothing but a liability and an expenditure.
 

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I thought this current piece hits the heart of the often used criticism that executions don't deter murders:

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/1214/p09s01-coop.html

Essentially the reason why the death penalty doesn't have a deterant effect in California is because hardly any on death row are ever executed. Instead they spend their long lives watching tv and eating good meals on the tax payers expense. If those limp wristed morons in charge here would only get rid of the lawyer caused legal consitpations murders here would certainly decrease. The one thing criminals understand is pain, suffering, and killing because they dish it out to both those they terrorize and to keep their own in line by its threat. Instead there has long been an epidemic of murders and violence mainly by gangs. Are they deterred? Of course not. In fact some of them look forward to getting "an education" there.
 
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