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Here’s an alternative to Trump’s extortion

Rogue Valley

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Here’s an alternative to Trump’s extortion

imrs.php


1/19/19
President Trump has been taking hostages for two years. He ordered an end to dreamers' protection under the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, ordered an end to the temporary protected status for hundreds of thousands of people, and then forced a shutdown of the government, leaving 800,000 without a paycheck and inflicting financial and emotional pain on them, their families and (often small) businesses. And then he came up with a deal — such a deal! He would give partial relief to the dreamers and TPS people and get $5.7 billion for a wall; then he’d open the government. Wait, you say. Wasn’t he the one who put DACA and TPS folks at risk, and haven’t the federal courts already given DACA beneficiaries a likely one-year reprieve? Well, yes. A burglar has broken into your home, has taken the silver and is now offering to lease it back to you for three years only — but first, give him a $5.7 billion edifice. Here is what would be a serious way to proceed:

• Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) brings the bill to the floor and allows amendments.

• After the amendment process is finished, the Senate votes.

• The House puts together its own bill: permanent DACA and TPS relief, money for border security (not a wall) and a way to prevent future shutdowns (e.g., an automatic continuing resolution in case funding lapses).

• The House passes its bill.

• As the two bills go to a conference, the government is reopened.

• The House and Senate then negotiate a resolution.

This does not reward hostage-taking. It allows the parties negotiate on even footing. It does not give McConnell and anti-immigration hard-liners the “out” that they won’t consider something Trump doesn’t want. Trump would be forced to decide at the end of the process either to veto a bill everyone else agrees upon or to sign a compromise measure — and he wouldn’t have the shutdown as a further bargaining chip. If McConnell votes and the Senate passes the president’s proposal, Republicans — including the president, we hope — will learn to ignore the most strident anti-immigrant voices and fulfill their obligation to negotiate without looking over their shoulders. Trump is plainly worried. Seeing the rotten polling for him and the wall, the impressive unity of the Democrats and McConnell’s unwillingness to help bail him out, Trump was forced to reverse his earlier pledge not to include DACA in the shutdown settlement. He blinked, albeit with his fingers crossed behind his back. Trump is the worst negotiator to occupy the Oval Office, in large part because he is utterly untrustworthy. We are in this predicament because Trump has repeatedly reneged on a deal (most recently a clean continuing resolution). Because he is entirely incapable of behaving honorably, Congress must act independently. McConnell should now be prodded to emerge from behind Trump’s skirts and negotiate in good faith as half of an equal branch of government. That might actually generate a reasonable compromise.

The Trump, Kushner, Mulvaney offer of yesterday is a non-starter throw-away and they already knew this when it was released. This was simply a Trumpian attempt to put the ball back in the Democrat court. They are still playing zero-sum politics with the lives of over a million Americans that are now directly affected by Trumps shutdown. 30 days in now, and the Trump administration is still playing their silly games. It still hasn't sunk in that the GOP no longer controls all levers of government.
 
shut down the airports so that the rich can't go anywhere. that will solve the problem pretty quickly.
 
Nonstarter

If the wall funding isn’t in a bill, then it wont see the light of day in senate

The democrats can ask for whatever right now....

All Trump can do is say no....but every time he says no to a reasonable offer he looks worse

With no offers on table from democrats....Trump can’t negotiate with himself
 
Nonstarter

If the wall funding isn’t in a bill, then it wont see the light of day in senate

The democrats can ask for whatever right now....

All Trump can do is say no....but every time he says no to a reasonable offer he looks worse

With no offers on table from democrats....Trump can’t negotiate with himself

You appear to have missed it. The Dems put an additional $1B on the table for Immigration Judges and added Technology at POE's where the bulk of the drugs entering the country come in.
 
Nonstarter

If the wall funding isn’t in a bill, then it wont see the light of day in senate

The democrats can ask for whatever right now....

All Trump can do is say no....but every time he says no to a reasonable offer he looks worse

With no offers on table from democrats....Trump can’t negotiate with himself

That would be correct if the house hadn't already passed a funding bill and sent it to the senate. Has the senate voted on the bill? What's holding it up from a vote?
 
You appear to have missed it. The Dems put an additional $1B on the table for Immigration Judges and added Technology at POE's where the bulk of the drugs entering the country come in.

I saw it...it isn’t the wall...and he isn’t going to sign it

It is a nonstarter
 
It sounds reasonable. However, the senate already passed a bill 100-0 that trump was willing to sign until coulter and limbaugh stirred the conservative pot. Let the republican figure a way out of the mess they have created. Why should the democrats give an inch? He promised mexico would pay, he said he would own the shutdown. Well, he and his troops have it, now figure a way out.

There's a real easy way out. Own up to the fact it was a bad idea from the start. Just like kennedy that liberal leftist took the blame for the bay of pigs fiasco.
 
That would be correct if the house hadn't already passed a funding bill and sent it to the senate. Has the senate voted on the bill? What's holding it up from a vote?


Same thing that held bills up in Reid’s senate...the leader

Obama had Reid as his watch dog....Trump has McConnell as his

Same thing...different things they are holding up
 
It sounds reasonable. However, the senate already passed a bill 100-0 that trump was willing to sign until coulter and limbaugh stirred the conservative pot. Let the republican figure a way out of the mess they have created. Why should the democrats give an inch? He promised mexico would pay, he said he would own the shutdown. Well, he and his troops have it, now figure a way out.

There's a real easy way out. Own up to the fact it was a bad idea from the start. Just like kennedy that liberal leftist took the blame for the bay of pigs fiasco.

We are way past that now...doesn’t matter what was said earlier...or done earlier...

This is not going to end until Trump gets his wall....or his presidency comes to an end

So as long as the democrats are willing to let the government stay closed for two years....sure...they win

But then, we will have seen that we don’t need half of the agencies we have....and gutting the federal government will be our next move
 
Here’s an alternative to Trump’s extortion

imrs.php


President Trump has been taking hostages for two years. He ordered an end to dreamers' protection under the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, ordered an end to the temporary protected status for hundreds of thousands of people...

The Trump, Kushner, Mulvaney offer of yesterday is a non-starter throw-away and they already knew this when it was released. This was simply a Trumpian attempt to put the ball back in the Democrat court. They are still playing zero-sum politics with the lives of over a million Americans that are now directly affected by Trumps shutdown. 30 days in now, and the Trump administration is still playing their silly games. It still hasn't sunk in that the GOP no longer controls all levers of government.

Well...

The Obama administration chose to deploy DACA by Executive Branch memorandum—despite the fact that Congress affirmatively rejected such a program in the normal legislative process on multiple occasions. The constitutionality of this action has been widely questioned since its inception.
https://www.dhs.gov/deferred-action-childhood-arrivals-daca

This "program" was not enacted by law. It was created by a Presidential executive order. Any such order can typically be rescinded by any subsequent President under normal circumstances.

Abnormal circumstances can occur when someone finds an "activist" Federal judge (like the Eastern District of New York) who rules otherwise:

Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals: Response to January 2018 Preliminary Injunction
https://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/...-response-january-2018-preliminary-injunction

Trump had the authority to do what he did. He is not the first President to rescind a prior President's executive order, and will not be the last.

And before someone accuses me of "racism" (strange, I thought the Left's narrative has been that Black citizens can't be racist :unsure13: ) I am on record as having no problems with any deal allowing a final "amnesty" for DACA members in exchange for a ban on future amnesty programs. If immigration needs be modified, do it by act of Congress. :coffeepap:
 
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We are way past that now...doesn’t matter what was said earlier...or done earlier...

This is not going to end until Trump gets his wall....or his presidency comes to an end

So as long as the democrats are willing to let the government stay closed for two years....sure...they win

But then, we will have seen that we don’t need half of the agencies we have....and gutting the federal government will be our next move

What is the reasoning behind keeping the departments closed that have nothing to do with the wall? And, it does matter what was said and not done, words matter it's one of our main means of communicating.
 
I saw it...it isn’t the wall...and he isn’t going to sign it

It is a nonstarter

He is not getting his wall and if he does enough damage to the country in this absurd effort at extortion he will find himself on the wrong end of an Impeachment and Removal argument. Can't bring down the government for a stupid Wall and ultimately the GOP will cut bait on Trump if he keeps this up. I will repeat something I have said in these pages before. Washington always wins in the end.
 
He is not getting his wall and if he does enough damage to the country in this absurd effort at extortion he will find himself on the wrong end of an Impeachment and Removal argument. Can't bring down the government for a stupid Wall and ultimately the GOP will cut bait on Trump if he keeps this up. I will repeat something I have said in these pages before. Washington always wins in the end.

You can try that route

Best of luck....
 
We are way past that now...doesn’t matter what was said earlier...or done earlier...

This is not going to end until Trump gets his wall....or his presidency comes to an end

So as long as the democrats are willing to let the government stay closed for two years....sure...they win

But then, we will have seen that we don’t need half of the agencies we have....and gutting the federal government will be our next move

The senate and house can override a veto... If the GOP and McConnell want to enter 2020 as being afraid to allow a vote, I'm all for it... Good luck in the senate elections in 2020.
 
We are way past that now...doesn’t matter what was said earlier...or done earlier...

This is not going to end until Trump gets his wall....or his presidency comes to an end

So as long as the democrats are willing to let the government stay closed for two years....sure...they win

But then, we will have seen that we don’t need half of the agencies we have....and gutting the federal government will be our next move

No, that will not be the next move for several reasons, the least of which include the courts.
At some point, some part of this will get to a step that involves litigation.
And at some other point, another part of this will wind up impacting the future of a lot of Republican lawmakers.
And at another point, another part of this will wind up being the cause of some sort of disastrous "unintended" consequences, which prove in stark and compelling manner the foolishness of playing a can of gasoline and matches.
 
At this point, I'm losing patience with the whole lot of them. If there ever were a time to go over our current POTUS's head, this is it.
 
I suggest that next time we elect a president we find someone who can get a loan from a US bank and is a good negotiator.
 
Well...

https://www.dhs.gov/deferred-action-childhood-arrivals-daca

This "program" was not enacted by law. It was created by a Presidential executive order. Any such order can typically be rescinded by any subsequent President under normal circumstances.

Abnormal circumstances can occur when someone finds an "activist" Federal judge (like the Eastern District of New York) who rules otherwise:

https://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/...-response-january-2018-preliminary-injunction

Trump had the authority to do what he did. He is not the first President to rescind a prior President's executive order, and will not be the last.

And before someone accuses me of "racism" (strange, I thought the Left's narrative has been that Black citizens can't be racist :unsure13: ) I am on record as having no problems with any deal allowing a final "amnesty" for DACA members in exchange for a ban on future amnesty programs. If immigration needs be modified, do it by act of Congress. :coffeepap:

What is an activist judge?
 
shut down the airports so that the rich can't go anywhere. that will solve the problem pretty quickly.

I also came to this conclusion about two weeks ago. If all the TSA people simply said they were not working until they got paid for their work, this impasse would be solved in a matter of hours.
 
The Trump, Kushner, Mulvaney offer of yesterday is a non-starter throw-away and they already knew this when it was released. This was simply a Trumpian attempt to put the ball back in the Democrat court. They are still playing zero-sum politics with the lives of over a million Americans that are now directly affected by Trumps shutdown. 30 days in now, and the Trump administration is still playing their silly games. It still hasn't sunk in that the GOP no longer controls all levers of government.

Your preference for non-citizens over citizens is noted.
 
And Pence has done nothing to help.

Get rid of the VP too.

I agree.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

ETA: That extends to Republicans and Democrats.
 
At this point, I'm losing patience with the whole lot of them. If there ever were a time to go over our current POTUS's head, this is it.

That time will come well before 2020.... How many TSA personnel do you think will be around in say, 45 days, if this keeps going? It is against federal law for a commercial airline to depart the gate with passengers who have not been cleared by TSA. I don't think the senate will want to be responsible for shutting down commercial aviation...
 
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