Ground Zero mosque bad idea: Canadian Muslims

[Ikari]

And the 54% of the American public is within their right to protest, hold banners, and stage other forms of protest for the duration of the Mosque's life. If the people that want to build this Mosque are sincere about their desire for more sensitivity and understanding between Christians and Muslims they are going about it in exactly the wrong way.... so they are either stupid, or being disingenuous about their goals.

Thanks for not addressing anything in that post you quoted. I asked what counted as support. I said nothing about people being unable to protest or anything of that nature.

 

[Crunch]

I do not think it is supporting the idea of the mosque, nor the intent of the people who wish to build it. But rather many support it because in this country they hold a constitutional right to build it there once they obtain the permits and such. It is supporting the principle that regardless of which creed, religion, or ethnicity one belongs to, the rights guaranteed by the Constitution must be upheld for all citizens.

Except most cities, counties, and States reserve the right to stop the building of inappropriate buildings in inappropriate neighborhoods...... so this is not a Constitutional matter, it’s a matter of an inappropriate building etc.

 

[tlmorg02]

Except most cities, counties, and States reserve the right to stop the building of inappropriate buildings in inappropriate neighborhoods...... so this is not a Constitutional matter, it’s a matter of an inappropriate building etc.

And the city could easily deny the permit needed for the building of the Mosque.

 

[Crunch]

I wish we could blame Obama for this, but while researching Rauf I found somewhere that he was being used by Bush for Muslim outreach before Obama.

Was Bush paying the bills for a fund raising trip that is against the wishes of the majority of Americans to the Middle East?.... I think we can safely blame Barry.

 

[Crunch]

My experience here is that the conservatives are the ones that dismiss foreigners except when they agree with them.

My experience here is that the liberals are the ones that dismiss foreigners except when they agree with them... I guess it is what type of "other" you are.

 

[Crunch]

Thanks for not addressing anything in that post you quoted. I asked what counted as support. I said nothing about people being unable to protest or anything of that nature.

Thanks for not addressing anything in that post you quoted.... see how that works?

 

[Ikari]

Thanks for not addressing anything in that post you quoted.... see how that works?

I do. I asked what counted as support. You went off on a tangent and didn't actually answer anything. I called you on it. You made a silly retort which did nothing to advance your cause. Clear as day.

 

[Barbbtx]

But with one major difference.....



WikiAnswers - How many gun owners are there in the United States of America

Ya know, I never felt the need for a gun. Lately though it's crossed my mind more than a few times that I might be safer with one.

 

[Crunch]

And the city could easily deny the permit needed for the building of the Mosque.

They could, but it still is not a Constitutional matter or everyone could build what they wanted, anywhere they wanted, anytime they wanted.

 

[tlmorg02]

My experience here is that the liberals are the ones that dismiss foreigners except when they agree with them... I guess it is what type of "other" you are.

When have liberals dismissed foreigners?

 

[tlmorg02]

They could, but it still is not a Constitutional matter or everyone could build what they wanted, anywhere they wanted, anytime they wanted.

Of course it is, it has everything to do with property rights. Zoning is under property rights as well.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

My experience here is that the liberals are the ones that dismiss foreigners except when they agree with them... I guess it is what type of "other" you are.

You're not paying attention. It's not whether or not you dismiss someone else's opinion -- it's whether or not you dismiss someone's opinion on the basis of the fact that they're a foreigner and as such couldn't possibly know what they're talking about, only to accept that opinion when it supports your agenda.

 

[Crunch]

I do. I asked what counted as support. You went off on a tangent and didn't actually answer anything. I called you on it. You made a silly retort which did nothing to advance your cause. Clear as day.

No, I chose to indirectly answer your question by example..... yes they can build their Mosque anywhere they can get permits to build it, and we, as Americans have THE RIGHT to make their lives hell over it.

Notice we have a right..... they have no right to build. (Constitutionally speaking)

Feel better now?

 

[Crunch]

Ya know, I never felt the need for a gun. Lately though it's crossed my mind more than a few times that I might be safer with one.

You are not alone.....

Politics
Obama Driving Surge in Gun Sales, Firearms Groups Say

FOXNews.com - Obama Driving Surge in Gun Sales, Firearms Groups Say

The only part of the economy he has stimulated. :lamo

 

[Barbbtx]

What do you mean by "be on their side"? If you mean that they will say they are well within their rights to build it; then perhaps. And that's a true statement; they are well within their rights to build it. There's nothing we can really do about it. I mean, people may not like it being built but can still support their right to build it.

Wouldn't you even be worried a teensy bit if the majority of Muslims were against it yet the few insisted on building it there? There are 23 or 30 some mosques already in NYC. It's my understanding this one will be built in a poor location for Muslims to frequent. (please don't ask me for links or I'll just retract my statement) POS PC
Anyways, I am against it because I really believe it will be a symbol of Conquest for radical Muslims.

 

[Ikari]

No, I chose to indirectly answer your question by example..... yes they can build their Mosque anywhere they can get permits to build it, and we, as Americans have THE RIGHT to make their lives hell over it.

Notice we have a right..... they have no right to build. (Constitutionally speaking)

Feel better now?

You don't have the right to make anyone's life hell. They have a right to build the mosque on land they legally purchased if they meet all the permits/zoning laws, etc. There is a limit to the harassment, however, that people are allowed to give. Protesting is one thing, and that is the one thing allowed. You cannot do anything which would infringe upon their rights. And you still didn't answer the question, which is why I pointed it out before. It was said that the left would still support it. I wanted to know what counted as support. Surely people can be pissed off at it, but realize there is nothing legally they can do about it. Would they be supporting the building of the mosque? Even though they don't like it, they're willing to grant them their ability to build it. Is it support? I think that many people who are saying it's their right to build this building aren't so happy with it going up; but rather are recognizing religious and property rights.

 

[MaggieD]

You don't have the right to make anyone's life hell. They have a right to build the mosque on land they legally purchased if they meet all the permits/zoning laws, etc. There is a limit to the harassment, however, that people are allowed to give. Protesting is one thing, and that is the one thing allowed. You cannot do anything which would infringe upon their rights. And you still didn't answer the question, which is why I pointed it out before. It was said that the left would still support it. I wanted to know what counted as support. Surely people can be pissed off at it, but realize there is nothing legally they can do about it. Would they be supporting the building of the mosque? Even though they don't like it, they're willing to grant them their ability to build it. Is it support? I think that many people who are saying it's their right to build this building aren't so happy with it going up; but rather are recognizing religious and property rights.

Don't you think the system worked just like it's supposed to? People protested to their heart's content. In the end, fairness won. This is a basic freedom in the United States of America. What went wrong? I say nothing. You say? I'd even say that most people agree it's their right to build...anyone who thinks otherwise now, is just plain wrong.

 

[Ikari]

Wouldn't you even be worried a teensy bit if the majority of Muslims were against it yet the few insisted on building it there?

It would depend on the situation. I don't know why I should be worried about a building. We'll see how it works out; but why should anyone be worried about a building? Particularly a place of worship.

There are 23 or 30 some mosques already in NYC. It's my understanding this one will be built in a poor location for Muslims to frequent. (please don't ask me for links or I'll just retract my statement) POS PC

So? In my town there's at least 20 Churches around town. And we're nowhere close to the size of NYC. Some of them, like that mega-Church, is way the fudge out there in the boondocks. If they want to put their Church there, fine by me. I don't see why number of churches comes into it at all.

Anyways, I am against it because I really believe it will be a symbol of Conquest for radical Muslims.

I think this is an incredibly made up reason.

 

[Barbbtx]

Wooo I'm listening to Sean Hannity. There is a Muslim on there screaming at the top of his lungs against the mosque and the Imam. Saying they want to change this country and he loves this country the way it is. Telling them to leave and go home. He condemned Hamas as a terrorist org. and said Rauf won't because he has ties to them. Interesting caller.

 

[texmaster]

Ground Zero mosque bad idea: Canadian Muslims | Toronto & GTA | News | Toronto Sun



Why didn't this story make mainstream media in the U.S.? It should be on the front page of the NY Times. I've been waiting for other Muslims to speak out against building that mosque. Surely this is a worthy story. Why hasn't it been covered here?

I saw one of their representatives on O'Reilly. Some of the most rational thought out there.

YouTube - O'Reilly Factor: Raheel Raza Speaks Out Against 9/11 Mosque

*waiting for the far lefties to come out and call HER a bigot against Islam* :lamo

 

[The Prof]

Here's the point:

Might it be insensitive? Sure, of course. Should we make policy based on whether people will be upset? No.

Should people who object try to convince the mosque to locate itself elsewhere? Sure, of course -- this is America. You have the right to do that. Should that fact alone prevent it from being built? No, of course not -- this is America. They have a right to do that.

you are 100% verbatim correct, in my opinion

which is exactly why this mosque will be moved

too many ny pols are gonna be puttin too much political pressure on their friends, who are ultimately gonna have to relocate

y'know, for their friends

 

[Ikari]

Don't you think the system worked just like it's supposed to? People protested to their heart's content. In the end, fairness won. This is a basic freedom in the United States of America. What went wrong? I say nothing. You say? I'd even say that most people agree it's their right to build...anyone who thinks otherwise now, is just plain wrong.

I just wanted to know if you don't like the idea of the mosque being built, but will allow it because you note it is their right to do so; if that counts as support for the mosque.

 

[Crunch]

You don't have the right to make anyone's life hell.

Sure we do..

Amendment 1 - Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The United States Constitution - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

If you don't think 1000's of people surrounding the Mosque 24/7 chanting "go home", some of the women wearing string bikinis (hopefully only those that look good in them, thus drawing a bigger crowd :mrgreen: ) and the rest eating pork sandwiches wouldn't be hell for Muslims, you don't know how easily Muslims are to offend..... or maybe you just didn't notice.

They have a right to build the mosque on land they legally purchased if they meet all the permits/zoning laws, etc. There is a limit to the harassment, however, that people are allowed to give. Protesting is one thing, and that is the one thing allowed. You cannot do anything which would infringe upon their rights. And you still didn't answer the question, which is why I pointed it out before. It was said that the left would still support it. I wanted to know what counted as support. Surely people can be pissed off at it, but realize there is nothing legally they can do about it. Would they be supporting the building of the mosque? Even though they don't like it, they're willing to grant them their ability to build it. Is it support? I think that many people who are saying it's their right to build this building aren't so happy with it going up; but rather are recognizing religious and property rights.

I didn't dispute the above, I just gave the probable result.

 

[The Prof]

My experience here is that the conservatives are the ones that dismiss foreigners except when they agree with them.

way too blanket a statement, no?

i find it quite odd, with all due respect

 

[texmaster]

Irony: Why are those who are the most guilty of it never self-aware enough to realize it?

Who knows? Some just pretend quotes they have made never happened.