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Governor Jan Brewer on illegals their children.

mike2810

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Can't agree more. AZ lawmakers may challenge the "anchor" baby situation. They may try and pass a law where illegal babies born in AZ would not get a birth certificate. Some are saying the 14th admendment has been misused beyond the orginal intent.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Can't agree more. AZ lawmakers may challenge the "anchor" baby situation. They may try and pass a law where illegal babies born in AZ would not get a birth certificate. Some are saying the 14th admendment has been misused beyond the orginal intent.
It has been misused beyond its orignal intent. If it meant anyone born on US soil then they would have never needed to create the Indian citizenship act of 1924 and the nationality act of 1940.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

I agree that the 14th has been abused. What I would like to see is a court ruling where one of the parents must be a US citiizen to have the child be a US citizen.

Before its ratification in 1868, Michigan's Senator Jacob Howard, author of the citizenship clause, made the intent crystal clear to the Senate: "This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the government of the United States, but will include all other classes of persons."
The 14th amendment to the U.S. Constitution and the dangerous misinterpretation of the birthright citizenship clause - DA King - the 14th Amendment to the United States Constitution - Fourteenth Amendment - anchor babies and birthright citizenship -
"The 14th amendment was never meant to reward illegal aliens with the jackpot grand prize of becoming a parent of a new American citizen who would then serve as immunity and insulation from punishment for violation of U.S. immigration laws and an anchor in the U.S. welfare state."
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

"The 14th amendment was never meant to reward illegal aliens with the jackpot grand prize of becoming a parent of a new American citizen who would then serve as immunity and insulation from punishment for violation of U.S. immigration laws and an anchor in the U.S. welfare state."
Indeed, but I bet the problem never came inherently from the idea of being born here == American citizen, but the exploitation that allows the parents to become legals. You can close the loophole without completely eliminating automatic citizenshop upon birth, and IMO we should.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Indeed, but I bet the problem never came inherently from the idea of being born here == American citizen, but the exploitation that allows the parents to become legals. You can close the loophole without completely eliminating automatic citizenshop upon birth, and IMO we should.
That has nothing to do with the 14th amendment. It has everything to do with the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 that allows for the chain migration of relatives other than spouse or minor children. That is the provision that should be repealed. Even if that provision gets repealed on day I still support denying birthright citizenship to the children of illegals.
 
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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

I have to stop for a moment and reflect on the mantras repeated so often around the ideas of divorce, gay marriage and adoption, or single parenting. These sayings that are repeated so often, "A family unit is the best thing for children and for society" dont seem to apply once a person is unable to afford citizenship in the country of your choice.

Furthermore, this underscores the Ouroborean nature of the efforts to stop undocumented immigration by massive deportations: people are going to come back. It's laughably stupid to expect a family that risked a hell of a lot to get here in the first place would sit down on the other side of the border and say "Oh darn, they caught us! Guess we cant go back!" I mean seriously, ask yourself, if you were in that position where hopping the border illegally was the best and fastest way to make money for your family, would deportation stop you? I know sure as **** my ass would be headed for the border the second my feet touched the ground in my home country.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Furthermore, this underscores the Ouroborean nature of the efforts to stop undocumented immigration by massive deportations: people are going to come back. It's laughably stupid to expect a family that risked a hell of a lot to get here in the first place would sit down on the other side of the border and say "Oh darn, they caught us! Guess we cant go back!" I mean seriously, ask yourself, if you were in that position where hopping the border illegally was the best and fastest way to make money for your family, would deportation stop you? I know sure as **** my ass would be headed for the border the second my feet touched the ground in my home country.
I know that this is not your first anti-illegal immigration thread you posted and I know you watch the news so you are aware of how states like Arizona and Oklahoma and Arizona handle their illegal immigration problem. So why do you still pretend as though mass deportation is the only solution that those who are against illegal immigration have to offer? Perhaps since you are on the amnesty for illegals band wagon you hope that by pretending that there is no way to encourage illegals to go back home amnesty will have a shot. If it wasn't for the Reagan Amnesty there would probably be a lot of suckers ready to support a so called compromise that gives amnesty to illegals with hollow promises of enforcement as a quick band aid solution. People are not retarded enough to fall for the same thing twice like that.

These sayings that are repeated so often, "A family unit is the best thing for children and for society" dont seem to apply once a person is unable to afford citizenship in the country of your choice.
I do not want that family unit here if they are here illegally.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

I know that this is not your first anti-illegal immigration thread you posted and I know you watch the news so you are aware of how states like Arizona and Oklahoma and Arizona handle their illegal immigration problem. So why do you still pretend as though mass deportation is the only solution that those who are against illegal immigration have to offer?
Do you have another solution?

The way I see it, you have four options.

1. Keep doing what we've been doing. That's shown to be expensive and entirely in-effective.

2. Widespread deportation of any and all undocumented immigrants. Again, in-effective and expensive.

3. Start shooting people. I dont even need to comment on how bad an idea that is.

4. Amnesty.

Yes we can make dozens more rules about employing undocumented workers and encourage reporting. But that's not going to do very much. There are millions of undocumented workers and many employers willing to ignore labor laws or turn a blind eye to fake identification papers to get cheap labor. More rules is not going to help you.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Do you have another solution?
States simply doing what Arizona and Oklahoma have done and enforcing those laws would probably be enough to drive most illegals out.

But here some of my solutions-
Repeal the part of the Immigration and nationality act of 1965 that allows for the chain migration of relatives other than spouse or minor children.

Make those who hire illegals subject the same Asset forfeiture and seizure laws that drug dealers,mobsters and other criminals are subject to. This would encourage law enforcement to crack down on dishonest businesses that hire illegals

Make those who hire illegals subject to heavy fines as well as prison time.

Make those who aid illegals subject to prison time and heavy fines.Regardless if it a law maker trying to give benifits to illegals or someone transporting their aunt who is an illegal alien or someone picking up a so called day laborer or someone housing or employing illegals.

Require that banks and money wiring services verify the legal status of those who do business with them.

Allow those whose wages have been depressed because of illegal to sue dishonest businesses that hire illegals.



The way I see it, you have four options.
Your four options are not the only thing people have been suggesting and you know it.


1. Keep doing what we've been doing. That's shown to be expensive and entirely in-effective.
Token enforcement has never worked. Which is what the federal government has been doing.

2. Widespread deportation of any and all undocumented immigrants. Again, in-effective and expensive.
I agree, unless the border is secured or the incentives for coming here is removed all deportation becomes is nothing more than a free bus or plane ticket home.

3. Start shooting people. I dont even need to comment on how bad an idea that is
.

I do not think anyone has suggested that happen inside the US.

4. Amnesty.
Amnesty should never be a solution seeing how it was tried in the mid 80s and all it did was encourage the 12-20 million + illegals that we have now.

Yes we can make dozens more rules about employing undocumented workers and encourage reporting. But that's not going to do very much. There are millions of undocumented workers and many employers willing to ignore labor laws or turn a blind eye to fake identification papers to get cheap labor.
Then you should have no problem with those laws then.

More rules is not going to help you.
If they are enforced they will.
 

Hoplite

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

States simply doing what Arizona and Oklahoma have done and enforcing those laws would probably be enough to drive most illegals out.
Is there any indication that it's working?

But here some of my solutions-
Repeal the part of the Immigration and nationality act of 1965 that allows for the chain migration of relatives other than spouse or minor children.
Why? That has nothing to do with undocumented immigration.

Make those who hire illegals subject the same Asset forfeiture and seizure laws that drug dealers,mobsters and other criminals are subject to. This would encourage law enforcement to crack down on dishonest businesses that hire illegals
Good luck getting that to pass the legislature. You'll get called a "commie" for wanting to confiscate things from a business and promptly ignored.

Make those who hire illegals subject to heavy fines as well as prison time.
And in instances where an employer didnt know such as an immigrant having fake identification information?

Make those who aid illegals subject to prison time and heavy fines.Regardless if it a law maker trying to give benifits to illegals or someone transporting their aunt who is an illegal alien or someone picking up a so called day laborer or someone housing or employing illegals.
How do you plan on enforcing this?

Require that banks and money wiring services verify the legal status of those who do business with them.
Its possible, but again you're going to face resistance from the banks. Also, it wont stop middle-man services springing up and enforcement with the smaller money wiring services will be next to impossible.

Allow those whose wages have been depressed because of illegal to sue dishonest businesses that hire illegals.
And watch as a veritable legal free-for-all ensues as ANYONE making minimum wage steps forward to try and claim it.

These are nice ideas, but you are going to spend so much money trying to keep these rules enforced that any money you save will be immediately pissed away and it'll cost you more to try and fix the problem than the problem was actually costing you.

Your four options are not the only thing people have been suggesting and you know it.
They're the only realistic options.

Token enforcement has never worked. Which is what the federal government has been doing.
Where do you expect the money for all this new enforcement to come from?

I agree, unless the border is secured or the incentives for coming here is removed all deportation becomes is nothing more than a free bus or plane ticket home.
As long as our economy remains somewhat successful there will always be incentive for coming here.

I do not think anyone has suggested that happen inside the US.
Poke your head into a Minnuteman forum or chat and ask what they think ought to happen to people crossing the border.

Amnesty should never be a solution seeing how it was tried in the mid 80s and all it did was encourage the 12-20 million + illegals that we have now.
It was a half-assed effort and you know it.

Then you should have no problem with those laws then.
I contend they will be expensive to enforce and end up not actually helping the problem. Also, the people who are NOT undocumented will strongly resist many of them.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Is there any indication that it's working?
I do not know about Arizona but I do know that with Oklahoma the local news they do the occasional boo hoo we need illegals stories., Look how since all the undocumented immigrants left they took their kids with them and now these schools may not get as much money, look how the Mexican supermarkets and other businesses are not as busy as they used to be before HB1804, and all sorts of other bull **** stories once in a while.

Why? That has nothing to do with undocumented immigration.
Anchor babies have a lot to do with illegal immigration. Removing this provision would eliminate anchor babies and since a child born to an illegal can not facilitate the immigration of a relative other than a spouse or minor children then that will be one less incentive for someone to come here illegally.

Good luck getting that to pass the legislature. You'll get called a "commie" for wanting to confiscate things from a business and promptly ignored.

If a business is honest then they have nothing to worry about from this law.

And in instances where an employer didnt know such as an immigrant having fake identification information?
An employer should have paper work showing that he verified the legal status of his or her employees.

How do you plan on enforcing this?
Easy, if they are caught then toss their ass in jail,charge them and have trial.

Its possible, but again you're going to face resistance from the banks. Also, it wont stop middle-man services springing up and enforcement with the smaller money wiring services will be next to impossible.
If law enforcement can do bait cars and john stings then they can most certainly have a law enforcement official pose as an illegal to see if these places are abiding by the law.

And watch as a veritable legal free-for-all ensues as ANYONE making minimum wage steps forward to try and claim it.
If a business is honest then they will not have to worry about these lawsuits.


These are nice ideas, but you are going to spend so much money trying to keep these rules enforced that any money you save will be immediately pissed away and it'll cost you more to try and fix the problem than the problem was actually costing you.
It should cost much to have a banker, law enforcement or anyone else look up information in a computer.Seeing how it will discourage illegal immigration that means no 12-20 + million illegals in this country or their children or anchor babies.

They're the only realistic options.
Amnesty is not a realistic option since it will only increase illegal immigration.

Where do you expect the money for all this new enforcement to come from?
How much do you really think it will cost a police officer, bank employee or who ever else to look up information on a computer how much do you really think it will cost to send a officer posing as an illegal to walk into a bank or money wiring service? Surely this can't be any more expensive that schooling for the children of illegals,welfare for those whose wages were depreciated due to illegals, the cost of incarcerating illegals who commit crimes other than illegal immigration, the cost of social services(California seems to think 4-5 billion on illegals is not one of the reasons they are in the red) Surely it can't be more expensive than legalizing 12-20 million + illegals and out illegal immigration problem triple in 20 years.

As long as our economy remains somewhat successful there will always be incentive for coming here.

Incentives for coming here illegally can always be removed.

Poke your head into a Minnuteman forum or chat and ask what they think ought to happen to people crossing the border.
Attempting to cross the border or already here in the US?
It was a half-assed effort and you know it.
Which is what any new amnesty will be hald-assed. Meaning the half of the agreement upheld is the amnesty while the enforcement part gets ignored or amended out.

I contend they will be expensive to enforce and end up not actually helping the problem. Also, the people who are NOT undocumented will strongly resist many of them.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

I do not know about Arizona but I do know that with Oklahoma the local news they do the occasional boo hoo we need illegals stories., Look how since all the undocumented immigrants left they took their kids with them and now these schools may not get as much money, look how the Mexican supermarkets and other businesses are not as busy as they used to be before HB1804, and all sorts of other bull **** stories once in a while.
Ok, I know this is a sensitive subject, but can we do without the bigotry? Thanks.

Anchor babies have a lot to do with illegal immigration. Removing this provision would eliminate anchor babies and since a child born to an illegal can not facilitate the immigration of a relative other than a spouse or minor children then that will be one less incentive for someone to come here illegally.
It's also used by LEGAL immigrants to establish themselves.

If a business is honest then they have nothing to worry about from this law.
If a business is honest then they will not have to worry about these lawsuits.
Does that logic ever work? I mean EVER?

By that logic, the cops should be allowed to search your home whenever they want. I mean, if you're honest then you have nothing to worry about, right?

An employer should have paper work showing that he verified the legal status of his or her employees.
Ok, but that still doesnt protect him. Is it going to be like statutory rape where you get nailed even if she SAID she was over 18 and had a fake driver's license to prove it?

Easy, if they are caught then toss their ass in jail,charge them and have trial.
That's not enforcement. I meant how do you have law enforcement make sure this rule is being followed?

If law enforcement can do bait cars and john stings then they can most certainly have a law enforcement official pose as an illegal to see if these places are abiding by the law.
Ok, you watch too much COPS. Operations like that dont go down very often and are usually done only in large metro areas by a special team in the police department. How do you plan to check every building site, contractor, fruit farmer, and factory in the US?

It should cost much to have a banker, law enforcement or anyone else look up information in a computer.Seeing how it will discourage illegal immigration that means no 12-20 + million illegals in this country or their children or anchor babies.
I'm guessing you meant SHOULDN'T, and my argument here isnt about expense, it's about people being willing to cooperate. Undocumented immigrants dont go to big banks to wire money, they go to small, hole-in-the-wall places or Western Union.

Amnesty is not a realistic option since it will only increase illegal immigration.
How? To get it you have to prove you were in the US and working before a certain date. I've heard many things attributed to undocumented immigrants but the power to distort space and time is not one of them.

How much do you really think it will cost a police officer, bank employee or who ever else to look up information on a computer how much do you really think it will cost to send a officer posing as an illegal to walk into a bank or money wiring service? Surely this can't be any more expensive that schooling for the children of illegals,welfare for those whose wages were depreciated due to illegals, the cost of incarcerating illegals who commit crimes other than illegal immigration, the cost of social services
That still doesnt explain where we're going to get the money for it. You cant pay officers with IOUs

(California seems to think 4-5 billion on illegals is not one of the reasons they are in the red)
I know it isnt. The biggest reason is we tend to not vote for taxes required to pay for the things we vote yes on.

Surely it can't be more expensive than legalizing 12-20 million + illegals and out illegal immigration problem triple in 20 years.
Considering the tax revenue we'd get from the new citizens, it's a lot cheaper than chasing them.

Incentives for coming here illegally can always be removed.
Yeah, by decimating our economy. Good luck selling that.

Attempting to cross the border or already here in the US?
Either or.

Which is what any new amnesty will be hald-assed. Meaning the half of the agreement upheld is the amnesty while the enforcement part gets ignored or amended out.
Can I borrow your crystal ball of future seeing? I need some lotto numbers.
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Yeah, by decimating our economy. Good luck selling that.
Really? So all the Americans out of work right now will just ignore those jobs, right? Please. If you think that are economy can't function without illegal immigrants you have not done enough research about the issue.

I know it isnt. The biggest reason is we tend to not vote for taxes required to pay for the things we vote yes on.
I agree that our proposition system in CA is a bad system. But those 3 million illegal immigrants aren't paying income taxes on the money they make. If they were all legal workers with minimum wage of $8 an hour and they worked 5 8-hour days per week 11 months out of the year, and that income was taxed, then CA would get 7 billion dollars more in tax revenue each year. And that is a very conservative estimate, as many estimate around 10.5 billion. So it isn't pocket change, and it is a problem.
 
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Hoplite

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Really? So all the Americans out of work right now will just ignore those jobs, right? Please. If you think that are economy can't function without illegal immigrants you have not done enough research about the issue.
They sure as hell wont work those jobs for what undocumented immigrants are getting paid.

I agree that our proposition system in CA is a bad system. But those 3 million illegal immigrants aren't paying income taxes on the money they make. If they were all legal workers with minimum wage of $8 an hour and they worked 5 8-hour days per week 11 months out of the year, and that income was taxed, then CA would get 7 billion dollars more in tax revenue each year. And that is a very conservative estimate, as many estimate around 10.5 billion. So it isn't pocket change, and it is a problem.
A problem easily fixed with provisionary visas and taxed income
 

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Ok, I know this is a sensitive subject, but can we do without the bigotry? Thanks.
What bigotry?

It's also used by LEGAL immigrants to establish themselves.
It is still a lie to say it has nothing to do with illegal immigration.

Does that logic ever work? I mean EVER?
If a business is not hiring illegals then they should not have anything to worry about.

By that logic, the cops should be allowed to search your home whenever they want. I mean, if you're honest then you have nothing to worry about, right?
If there are reports that a company is hiring illegals then police should investigate just like if there are reports of a burglary then they should check it out.

Ok, but that still doesnt protect him. Is it going to be like statutory rape where you get nailed even if she SAID she was over 18 and had a fake driver's license to prove it?
It is reasonable to believe that someone who did all the checks they can and kept the paper work then that employer did everything they can to verify the legal status of an employee.

That's not enforcement. I meant how do you have law enforcement make sure this rule is being followed?

They will get caught for some other crime. Traffic offenses, hiring illegals, drug raid,


Ok, you watch too much COPS.Operations like that dont go down very often and are usually done only in large metro areas by a special team in the police department. How do you plan to check every building site, contractor, fruit farmer, and factory in the US?
First you would start with the reported businesses, then the usual suspects like farms, lawn maintenance companies, construction companies, hotels, "day labor sites" and etc and then just random businesses.


I'm guessing you meant SHOULDN'T, and my argument here isnt about expense, it's about people being willing to cooperate. Undocumented immigrants dont go to big banks to wire money, they go to small, hole-in-the-wall places or Western Union.
Which is why I included money wiring services. because I know there are small hole in the wall services like western union.

How? To get it you have to prove you were in the US and working before a certain date.I've heard many things attributed to undocumented immigrants but the power to distort space and time is not one of them.

It wasn't that hard for the 3 million illegals who got amnesty in the mid 80s. Besides that proving they were here before a certain date and job should be easy seeing how they will have utility bills and anchor babies and other children in school.


That still doesnt explain where we're going to get the money for it. You cant pay officers with IOUs
We are a country that gives billions away in foriegn aid, we spend millions on prisons, we spends millions on educating the children of illegals and so. Do you really think the US has to scrape under a rock for some change?

I know it isnt. The biggest reason is we tend to not vote for taxes required to pay for the things we vote yes on.
A quarter or fifth of the debt would go away if you didn't have to deal with illegals.

Schwarzenegger Backs State Services to Immigrants | News10.net | Sacramento, California | Local News


Considering the tax revenue we'd get from the new citizens, it's a lot cheaper than chasing them.
For every illegal you give amnesty to you encourage more to come here waiting for their turn at amnesty thus making the problem worse.

Yeah, by decimating our economy. Good luck selling that.
I never said anything about decimating out economy. The incentives can be removed by cracking down on those who hire illegals, denying tax payer funded services to illegals,requiring schools verify the legal status of parents before letting them enroll their kids into school, require police to verify the legal status of anyone they pull over for a traffic offense or DUI check, mandatory 6 month jail sentence for anyone caught in the country illegal like federal law says they can be and two years in prison for the second offense and many other solutions.


Can I borrow your crystal ball of future seeing? I need some lotto numbers.
I am going by they did the Reagan amnesty, how they have token raids, purposely not secure the border, purposely inadequately man the border, cry foul anytime a state does something about the problem, toss the president of Mexico's salad while bashing states that do something about illegal immigration can call a group that is the equivalent to a neighbor hood watch a bunch of vigilantes . Only a ****en moron would believe that it would be different with another amnesty. Fortunately most people are not Bart Stupack.
 

SgtRock

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Hoplite's solution is to throw up are hands, wave the white flag and open the border compleltly allowing anyone who wishes to cross amnesty and allow them to apply for citizenship. That includes criminals, jihadist, drug cartels etc. And why would hoplite want to do such a thing. Its purely political. Its for votes. And why not, criminals jihadist and drug cartels and anyone else who wishes to disregard our laws will fit in to the the party just fine.

Hoplite is seeing the USA through third world glasses. We can't continue to be successful and live the American dream while so many suffer in third world poverty. How could we sleep at night? Right Hoplite?
 
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mike2810

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

The most recent AZ law (SB1070) does become law till the end of July 2010. That is unless the courts put it on hold or terminate it. So AZ law impact is not know because LE is not enforcing it yet.
 

Scarecrow Akhbar

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

I have to stop for a moment and reflect on the mantras repeated so often around the ideas of divorce, gay marriage and adoption, or single parenting. These sayings that are repeated so often, "A family unit is the best thing for children and for society" dont seem to apply once a person is unable to afford citizenship in the country of your choice.
And, once the bogus citizenship of the illegal alien child is removed, there's no barrier to packing the whole family off to the border to be dealt with by Mexico.

And once it's determined that an Invader illegally crossed the border from Mexico, he and his whole family should be dumped back on the border for Mexico to deal with...regardless of what that person's nation of origin was in the first place.

Furthermore, this underscores the Ouroborean nature of the efforts to stop undocumented immigration by massive deportations: people are going to come back. It's laughably stupid to expect a family that risked a hell of a lot to get here in the first place would sit down on the other side of the border and say "Oh darn, they caught us! Guess we cant go back!" I mean seriously, ask yourself, if you were in that position where hopping the border illegally was the best and fastest way to make money for your family, would deportation stop you? I know sure as **** my ass would be headed for the border the second my feet touched the ground in my home country.
Since the fact of entry itself should be a felony, just like it is in Mexico, clearly re-entry should be a second strike. if they want a permanent residence in the US, it can be arranged.

And then we deport their children, if they bring them back, to their nation of origin without their felon parents, and their nation governments can deal with them.

Once we kick them out, they're no longer our problem. Right now, their parents are stealing jobs from Americans who have children of their own to feed.

THAT's OUR problem.

We should deal with it, and that means we should deal with it effectively.
 

Scarecrow Akhbar

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

They sure as hell wont work those jobs for what undocumented immigrants are getting paid.
So you support the exploitation of the illegal alien to faciliate the accumulation of ill-gotten profit by the big meanie evil corporate state.

Personally, having a better understand of basic economics, if Americans won't do the job at the wages offered, then the offered wages will go up, or the job won't get done, and the prospective employer has to make some decisions there....ONCE HE'S REQUIRED TO OBEY THE DAMN LAW.

A problem easily fixed with provisionary visas and taxed income
A problem more easily fixed by making it very unlikely that an employer would want to hire an Invader. After all, the laws already exist, all that needs doing is enforcing them on the local, state, and federal level. It's not like Arizona's SB1070 is doing anything the Federal laws don't already allow.
 

Scarecrow Akhbar

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Do you have another solution?
1)

The way I see it, you have four options.

Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo:
ARTICLE XVI
Each of the contracting parties reserves to itself the entire right to fortify whatever point within its territory it may judge proper so to fortify for its security.

So the US is perfetly justified in not only building fences where it desires along the border, it's authorized to install anti-personnel mines, machine gun nests, patrol the border with US Army regulars, and use armed Predator drones as well as helicopter patrols to secure the national border.

That's what's going to happen when the nation finally gets serious about the Invasion.

Other channels of correction:

Make illegal presence a felony.

Make illegal re-entry a second strike.

Fine employers of Invaders $10,000 for each invaders. Make life simple, pay 25% of collected fines to US citizens to report the hiring of Invaders, payable upon conviction of the offender.

Fine landlords for renting to illegals, fine them one year's rent for each offending illegal, regardless of how many occupy a given house or apartment. Pay the reporting citizen 25% of the collected fine.

Seize the assets of Invaders for use in financing their deportation.

Require all emergency rooms to demand legal ID of all admissions, or of their parents, if a minor child is involved. Failure to produce such documentation must result in a call to the police, who, naturally, are authorized to hold persons suspected of violating immigration law.

Make possession of a false ID to show legal residence a felony, to be coupled with the additional felony of illegal entry.

Under no circumstances should ANYONE accused of entering the nation illegally be released from custody until such time as they have demonstrated their legal residency status.

That's what do.

Clearly amnesty is the absolute worst thing we could do.
 

Rightwingnutjob

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I have no problem with amnesty on the conditions of:
1) They pay a fine greater than the cost of entering legally.
2) They pay back taxes based on how long they've been in the U.S. illegally.
3) If they can't afford it. They work it off in some form of debtor's prison where their labor is used to perform jobs that cost the tax payers money.
4) They don't start earning citizenship until all of the above is completed.

I don't see this happening so, I'm going to continue to stand against amnesty.
 

DrunkenAsparagus

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

It has been misused beyond its orignal intent. If it meant anyone born on US soil then they would have never needed to create the Indian citizenship act of 1924 and the nationality act of 1940.
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

-14th Amendment to the United States Constitution
 

jamesrage

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

-14th Amendment to the United States Constitution


Notice the part in bold which also means they have to be subject to the jurisdiction theorof, not just born here. Which is why the Indian citizenship act of 1924 and the nationality act of 1940 were created to ensure that those born here were natural born citizens.
 

DrunkenAsparagus

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Re: Governor Jan Brewer on illegals and their children.

Notice the part in bold which also means they have to be subject to the jurisdiction theorof, not just born here. Which is why the Indian citizenship act of 1924 and the nationality act of 1940 were created to ensure that those born here were natural born citizens.
And one could argue that both of those laws were merely rectifying past convolutions and mistakes. "Subject to jurisdiction" is a nebulous phrase. Their parents came here illegally, but the kid committed no crime. The Supreme Court affirmed birthright citizenship in 1898 and 1982.

Besides anchor baby status isn't that big of an issue. The main reason for illegal immigration is jobs. The parent can't get a resident visa until the child reaches the age of majority. Also the legal nightmare of trying to prove one's citizenship will raise costs and bureaucratic nightmares for everyone, and is bound to create unfair treatment of many.
 
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