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GOP bill would defund schools with rules against playing with imaginary guns

TheDemSocialist

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Rep. Steve Stockman (R-Texas) introduced legislation this week to block federal funding for schools that enforce rules that punish students for playing with imaginary weapons.






The Student Protection Act, H.R. 2625, is a reaction to what Stockman says is the zero tolerance policy at some schools that has led to several suspensions of very young children who engage in these activities, including cases where students pretended their thumb and index finger is a gun.
The legislation seeks to stop these practices by blocking federal funds to any school that punishes students for a select list of activities. Those activities include carrying miniature toy guns, and "brandishing a pastry or other food which is partially consumed in such a way that the remnant resembles a gun."


Read more: GOP bill would defund schools with rules against playing with imaginary guns - The Hill's Floor Action

[h=5]Ok so i think those "zero tolerance" rules are a bit drastic when it comes to "playing" with imaginary guns but i also think this bill is also a bit drastic supporting defunding of these schools that have these rules.[/h]



 

Fishstyx

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How else would you remove these draconian and downright stupid rules from schools? Even with public outcry in opposition to them, they're still in place.
 

davidtaylorjr

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Read more: GOP bill would defund schools with rules against playing with imaginary guns - The Hill's Floor Action

[/FONT][/COLOR][h=5]Ok so i think those "zero tolerance" rules are a bit drastic when it comes to "playing" with imaginary guns but i also think this bill is also a bit drastic supporting defunding of these schools that have these rules.[/h]




The bill serves a purpose. Schools need to quit overstepping their bounds. Guns are actually a good thing.
 

TheDemSocialist

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How else would you remove these draconian and downright stupid rules from schools? Even with public outcry in opposition to them, they're still in place.

So the answer is defund the schools hurting the kids education?
 

Goshin

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So the answer is defund the schools hurting the kids education?



Heh, trust me the schools will change their policy FAST before risking their funding. They live and breathe for Fed funding.
 

Fishstyx

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So the answer is defund the schools hurting the kids education?

The schools wouldn't face a cent of defunding if they get rid of the rules. So if the school is defunded and the kids' education hurt, the blame resides solely on the schools' boards and administrations. Pretty cut and dry.
 

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Read more: GOP bill would defund schools with rules against playing with imaginary guns - The Hill's Floor Action

[/FONT][/COLOR][h=5]Ok so i think those "zero tolerance" rules are a bit drastic when it comes to "playing" with imaginary guns but i also think this bill is also a bit drastic supporting defunding of these schools that have these rules.[/h]




I'm split. On the one hand, I think those zero tolerance policies are really stupid. On the other hand, I don't think the Federal Government should be often dictating policy to local schools. And while I'm sure any school who had a zero tolerance policy would change it in light of this bill if it were passed, on the off chance that one did not defunding is an excessive punishment.
 

a351

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Grandstanding through and through. These types of rules should be combated, but in their respective districts, and not with the threat of defunding the school. Talk about tossing the baby out with the bath water!
 

Fishstyx

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I'm split. On the one hand, I think those zero tolerance policies are really stupid. On the other hand, I don't think the Federal Government should be often dictating policy to local schools. And while I'm sure any school who had a zero tolerance policy would change it in light of this bill if it were passed, on the off chance that one did not defunding is an excessive punishment.

Price you pay for taking the cookies....you're subject to the whims of the baker.
 

specklebang

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Grandstanding. And I applaud him for it. It won't go anywhere but maybe the publicity will send out a message.

Schools have become utterly bizarre in their policies. Expelling for reasons like possession of an aspirin, eating your donut to a gun shape, saying I love you between 8 year olds? It's completely ****ing nuts and some sense of reasonableness must be found. Kids are humans, not robots. Bringing a gun to school and holding 2 fingers out as an imaginary gun are actually 2 different things. It's not like our school system has done such a great job that we can allow their nutty administrators their little pleasures of being utter dorks.
 

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I'm in favor of dropping much of this zero tolerance policy nonsense, especially for stuff that couldn't possibly be considered a crime like a kindergartener holding up a chicken finger and going "pow pow", but this is overkill. The bill is draconian, and this really is something at the very most should be dealt with at the state or county level, and better if we could get the local district itself to see the light.
 

Paschendale

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Trying to control kids to that extent is taking things way too far. Let them play however they like so long as no one actually gets hurt. And even then, I mean more than scrapes and bruises.
 

Bob Blaylock

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So the answer is defund the schools hurting the kids education?

Allowing schools to go so far overboard with these kind of policies is already hurting education. Schools need to be in the business of education, not brainwashing and indoctrination.

The most drastic plausible result of the policy proposed here would be to drive out of business those schools that indoctrinate and brainwash instead of educate. This is certainly a better result than allowing such schools to continue to operate in their current manner.
 

Fishstyx

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Trying to control kids to that extent is taking things way too far. Let them play however they like so long as no one actually gets hurt. And even then, I mean more than scrapes and bruises.

Thats the problem with these rules, it has absolutely nothing to do with kids' safety. Its a conditioning tactic. As far as guns, that should be something left to the desires of the parents. If you're not OK with your kids playing cops and robbers or GI Joe or whatever, thats fine. If you are, thats fine too.
 

Fiddytree

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Heh, trust me the schools will change their policy FAST before risking their funding. They live and breathe for Fed funding.

Not unless it is a politically viable policy. As it is not, they won't fear it, and will only laugh at it, if they catch wind of it at all.
 

ttwtt78640

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I'm split. On the one hand, I think those zero tolerance policies are really stupid. On the other hand, I don't think the Federal Government should be often dictating policy to local schools. And while I'm sure any school who had a zero tolerance policy would change it in light of this bill if it were passed, on the off chance that one did not defunding is an excessive punishment.

Exactly! The federal gov't should not be funding any "local" schools, ever. What federal constituional power is the Education Department based on? If you think that the federal gov't should have no control over local schools, then why should the federal gov't (i.e. all taxpayers) have any reason to fund them? Why should a taxpayer in TX or CA be forced to fund a "local" school in LA or MI?
 

Paschendale

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Thats the problem with these rules, it has absolutely nothing to do with kids' safety. Its a conditioning tactic. As far as guns, that should be something left to the desires of the parents. If you're not OK with your kids playing cops and robbers or GI Joe or whatever, thats fine. If you are, thats fine too.

Kids playing a game has really nothing to do at all with actual violence. That's the thing that so many (unfortunately mostly on my side of the aisle) don't get. But falsely equating pretend with reality is also why some fools act like video games or movies or TV make people violent.
 

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Grandstanding, but grandstanding I support. These schools are public, and their often-ridiculous "zero-tolerance" policies are an impediment to the education and freedom of children. There is no doubt in my mind that these policies have gotten out of hand.

In fact, I have a personal anecdote. In high school one of my oldest friends, then a sophomore, went to school wearing a black shirt with a spoon on it and the caption "Cereal Killer" on it. She was nearly suspended for two weeks.

Model student with all AP courses, by the way.
 

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Yes, let's punish the children because the administration has stupid rules. :roll:

"Zero tolerance" rules are really just about zero thinking, zero responsibility, and zero liability. They're stupid. But stupid measures taken in response to stupid measures doesn't help.
 

radcen

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[h=5]Ok so i think those "zero tolerance" rules are a bit drastic when it comes to "playing" with imaginary guns but i also think this bill is also a bit drastic supporting defunding of these schools that have these rules.[/h]



Bingo. My thoughts exactly.

It's like sentencing a person to 90 days in jail for jay-walking.
 

Jack Fabulous

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What percentage of these school's funding comes from the Fed in the first place? I know it's probably significant but would it really "shut them down".
 
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Allowing schools to go so far overboard with these kind of policies is already hurting education. Schools need to be in the business of education, not brainwashing and indoctrination.

The most drastic plausible result of the policy proposed here would be to drive out of business those schools that indoctrinate and brainwash instead of educate. This is certainly a better result than allowing such schools to continue to operate in their current manner.

Why aren't school boards allowed to make local rules? I guess national education is a Republican goal now.
 

rocket88

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How else would you remove these draconian and downright stupid rules from schools? Even with public outcry in opposition to them, they're still in place.

I agree those rules are stupid, but defunding them seems like throwing out the baby with the bathwater. It's overkill.
 

Peter King

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Read more: GOP bill would defund schools with rules against playing with imaginary guns - The Hill's Floor Action

[/FONT][/COLOR][h=5]Ok so i think those "zero tolerance" rules are a bit drastic when it comes to "playing" with imaginary guns but i also think this bill is also a bit drastic supporting defunding of these schools that have these rules.[/h]




The anti-freedom party strikes again.

I do not agree with schools who have a zero tolerance for imaginary guns. I especially do not agree with the consequences of kids playing kids games. Now if it is a 10 or a 12 year old, they have some responsibility but 7 and under do not have the concept of killing with guns and how it relates to imaginary guns, so they should never be punished.

But with all of that told, removing funding for this kind of thing? Republicans should get busy working with democrats to get real problems solved rather than creating mountains of of molehills when it comes to these kinds of almost non-issues.
 
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