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Giving Putin an 'off ramp'. Personally I think we should give him the same one we gave Germany and Japan during WW2.

bongsaway

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Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.
 
Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.
I guess you forgot how nukes.
 
We rebuilt Germany and Japan after WW2, leading to them being our best allies. Punitive action against Germany after WW1 led to WW2. US oil embargo against Japan and freezing their assets in 1941 soon had them bombing Pearl Harbor. "Complete surrender" is an offramp into a brick wall. We're treading on quicksand.
 
How nukes what? We have nukes too and unless we do something about the tyrant putin, people like him will slowly but surely destroy any and all forms of democracy unless we stop them while we can.

We've got plenty of people here in the US doing their best to destroy American democracy. The Dems are letting them get away with it.
 
Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.

Are you in the military ?
 
How nukes what? We have nukes too and unless we do something about the tyrant putin, people like him will slowly but surely destroy any and all forms of democracy unless we stop them while we can.

At some point, I would agree with you. But what we have to gain at the moment is not worth the risk of Armageddon.

Yes we have to draw lines, but those lines must be widely understood to be absolute, like attacking a NATO country.

Sticking with well established lines reduces the likelihood of foolish escalation his part.
 
Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.

.....so you think we should invade Russia and or launch nuclear strikes against it?

I mean, I suppose if you want to kill tens of millions of Americans that’s the quickest way to do it.
 
.....so you think we should invade Russia and or launch nuclear strikes against it?

I mean, I suppose if you want to kill tens of millions of Americans that’s the quickest way to do it.

Easy to type words.....tougher to deal with when the bullets start flying.
 
As Michael Tyson said, "everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the face."
 
Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.
Watch The Day After.
 
We rebuilt Germany and Japan after WW2, leading to them being our best allies. Punitive action against Germany after WW1 led to WW2. US oil embargo against Japan and freezing their assets in 1941 soon had them bombing Pearl Harbor. "Complete surrender" is an offramp into a brick wall. We're treading on quicksand.

We rebuilt...yes, but only after what most would term AS "complete surrender".
My only argument about German reparations was that maybe they needed to be much more measured, so as NOT to topple their economy however one would be errant in leaving the effects of The Great Depression out of the equation.
The oil embargo against Japan was based on a great many things, chief among them being Japan's brutal campaign against nearly all of Asia.
 
.....so you think we should invade Russia and or launch nuclear strikes against it?

I mean, I suppose if you want to kill tens of millions of Americans that’s the quickest way to do it.
Did I say either of those two things or are they your words? I do not get the lack of reading comprehension from some folks? We can do the same thing with putin that h.w. did with saddam without ever touching russian soil.
 
Did I say either of those two things or are they your words? I do not get the lack of reading comprehension from some folks? We can do the same thing with putin that h.w. did with saddam without ever touching russian soil.

Lol what? No, we certainly couldn’t. Russian air defense networks are substantially better than Iraq’s were back in 91, and they can easily kill far, far more Americans than Saddam ever dreamed of.

The “off ramp” we gave Germany and Japan was invasion and full occupation. That’s not a possibility we have with Russia, and pretending otherwise is silly.
 
We rebuilt...yes, but only after what most would term AS "complete surrender".
My only argument about German reparations was that maybe they needed to be much more measured, so as NOT to topple their economy however one would be errant in leaving the effects of The Great Depression out of the equation.
The oil embargo against Japan was based on a great many things, chief among them being Japan's brutal campaign against nearly all of Asia.

I understand what you say. Nonetheless, though justified, the US and world response resulted in WW2. Like Japan and Germany, Russia has territorial ambition. I don't see Putin giving in but for internal forces, such as the oligarchs and others high-up in the governance of Russia.
 
Did I say either of those two things or are they your words? I do not get the lack of reading comprehension from some folks? We can do the same thing with putin that h.w. did with saddam without ever touching russian soil.

"We can do the same thing with putin that h.w. did with saddam without ever touching russian soil."

What same thing would that be?
 
"We can do the same thing with putin that h.w. did with saddam without ever touching russian soil."

What same thing would that be?
Chase him back into russia like H.W. chased saddam back into iraq.
 
Chase him back into russia like H.W. chased saddam back into iraq.

.....you do realize what “chased Saddam back into Kuwait” was numerous airstrikes, including airstrikes across Iraq proper, and NATO engaging in direct combat with the Iraqis.
 
.....you do realize what “chased Saddam back into Kuwait” was numerous airstrikes, including airstrikes across Iraq proper, and NATO engaging in direct combat with the Iraqis.
I'm fine with nato having direct combat with russian troops in ukraine. We don't need to strike russia itself.
 
The thing is though is that there seems to be only one outcome to all of this: a hot war with Russia. You people can delude yourself with happy thoughts of Putin leaving Ukraine and all is good, but that would not be reality.

Putin already declared war of Europe, no he did not use those words. But Putin invaded Ukraine and moments before told us (again) that his point is to rebuild the USSR's borders. Nato nations are included in that goal.

Now we know that Putins military is lacking, meaning that his method of expanding Russian borders is the use of nukes. Putin will keep threatening nukes/WW3 while taking over other countries. It's too late we are in WW3 the world just is in denial. Just look at what Putin is doing in Ukraine and the world sits on their hands in fear of starting something that is already going on.
 
I'm fine with nato having direct combat with russian troops in ukraine. We don't need to strike russia itself.

Then A) there’s zero chance of Russia being “pushed out” and B) you just started a shooting war with a nuclear power with thousands of warheads pointed at American cities.

The contrast between the jingoism of folks on on this board and the attitudes of everyone I met at Fort Sill is truly a sight to behold.
 
Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.

Putin's off ramp should take him straight to Hell.

Do not pass go, do not collect $200.
 
Eventually if putin does not stop his aggression against ukraine, other countries, like the u.s., will get involved in the fight and I say we give putin the same off ramp we gave to germany and japan, complete surrender. Why this guy thinks russia is stronger than the rest of the world together is beyond my reasoning.

This is a very poor post, you do understand why don't you?
 
How nukes what? We have nukes too and unless we do something about the tyrant putin, people like him will slowly but surely destroy any and all forms of democracy unless we stop them while we can.

You want a play a game of chicken with a country that has thousands of nuclear weapons, and could destroy the United States multiple times over?
 
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