Germany rejects multi billion $ Helicopter deal with Boeing and Lockheed

[braindrain]

There was never and at no point a serious intention to buy the F-35, a leading official of the Luftwaffe even got fired one year earlier when he openly favored the F 35.

The F 35 is no advanced design. It only has one engine, which makes it a flawed design from the start. The f 35 cant go super sonic. Its slow and is a failed design.

As for the radar, tracked the F 35 for 100 km.

Question, whats the standard procedure to savely land a F 35 with engine failure? Ohhhh you cant? Because it just has one! Too bad.

Are we just supposed to take your word on that. Sorry but as many times as you have been caught both lying and not knowing what you are talking about I put zero credibility in what you say.

Your knowledge of fighters seems to be as nonexistent as your knowledge golf the history of Germany. Only a truly clueless person would try and claim the F35 is not an advanced design. It is undeniable the most advanced fighter in the world in many respects. I get you hate America but your bias is so bad it’s making you look extremely foolish an uneducated



You know what other plane only has one engine. The F16. One of the most successful designs of the last 40 odd years. But please continue proving just how clueless you are.

And for more evidence you don’t know what you are talking about the F35 can go supersonic. You claiming otherwise is just straight up stupidity.

And yes we know a radar manufacturer looking to sell its radars claims it tracked a F35 after knowing the exact location and time it would be near that radar. But know evidence to support this claim and no details of what kind of track could they maintain. Knowing a plane is in the area but being unable to get a weapons lock is pretty much the purpose is stealth. Only people who are completely clueless thinks it makes planes invisible to radar

But please continue embarrassing yourself. It’s giving me a pretty good laugh.

 

[Rostocker]

Are we just supposed to take your word on that. Sorry but as many times as you have been caught both lying and not knowing what you are talking about I put zero credibility in what you say.

Your knowledge of fighters seems to be as nonexistent as your knowledge golf the history of Germany. Only a truly clueless person would try and claim the F35 is not an advanced design. It is undeniable the most advanced fighter in the world in many respects. I get you hate America but your bias is so bad it’s making you look extremely foolish an uneducated



You know what other plane only has one engine. The F16. One of the most successful designs of the last 40 odd years. But please continue proving just how clueless you are.

And for more evidence you don’t know what you are talking about the F35 can go supersonic. You claiming otherwise is just straight up stupidity.

And yes we know a radar manufacturer looking to sell its radars claims it tracked a F35 after knowing the exact location and time it would be near that radar. But know evidence to support this claim and no details of what kind of track could they maintain. Knowing a plane is in the area but being unable to get a weapons lock is pretty much the purpose is stealth. Only people who are completely clueless thinks it makes planes invisible to radar

But please continue embarrassing yourself. It’s giving me a pretty good laugh.

I have never lied.

You want it? Here:

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35 - The Aviation Geek Club

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35

theaviationgeekclub.com

He got fired in 2018 for supporting the F-35. That was one year before Germany dismissed the F-35. The F-35 never had any chances to be chosen but the interest was upheld for other reasons.

And no, the F-35 is not the most advanced design. The F-22 is far superior in evry aspect to it. (See i name a american aircraft, you should offer the F 22, we would have bought it)

We dont use the F-16 either, since single engine aircrafts are not suitable for the standards we place.

The F-35 cant go supersonic. She breaks apart and is not able to super cruise. The Eurofighter can supercruise, the F-35 can not.

The Pentagon will have to live with limits on F-35’s supersonic flights

The Navy's and Marine Corps' versions of the F-35 will have restrictions on how long they can fly at supersonic speeds because of a risk of damage to the tail section.

www.defensenews.com

When going supersonic for more than a few minutes, the outer layer bubbles off and the wings get damaged.

As for our radar, the F-35 is very slow with low maneuver capability. She depends on stealth. When our radar can track it, its dead. Its that easy. You can shot it down with FLAK, thermal rockets or simply send up a Eurofighter.


The F-35 doesnt match what Germany wants. We want an aircraft that can easily reach any point of Germany to defend our airspace. It must be able to supercruise. We wont partisipate in any NATO bullshit anyways where we have to fly attacks on other airspace, so what we want and need is power, speed.

The F-22 would offer that. The F-35 does not.

 

[Fledermaus]

I have never lied.

You want it? Here:

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35 - The Aviation Geek Club

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35

theaviationgeekclub.com

He got fired in 2018 for supporting the F-35. That was one year before Germany dismissed the F-35. The F-35 never had any chances to be chosen but the interest was upheld for other reasons.

And no, the F-35 is not the most advanced design. The F-22 is far superior in evry aspect to it. (See i name a american aircraft, you should offer the F 22, we would have bought it)

We dont use the F-16 either, since single engine aircrafts are not suitable for the standards we place.

The F-35 cant go supersonic. She breaks apart and is not able to super cruise. The Eurofighter can supercruise, the F-35 can not.

The Pentagon will have to live with limits on F-35’s supersonic flights

The Navy's and Marine Corps' versions of the F-35 will have restrictions on how long they can fly at supersonic speeds because of a risk of damage to the tail section.

www.defensenews.com

When going supersonic for more than a few minutes, the outer layer bubbles off and the wings get damaged.

As for our radar, the F-35 is very slow with low maneuver capability. She depends on stealth. When our radar can track it, its dead. Its that easy. You can shot it down with FLAK, thermal rockets or simply send up a Eurofighter.


The F-35 doesnt match what Germany wants. We want an aircraft that can easily reach any point of Germany to defend our airspace. It must be able to supercruise. We wont partisipate in any NATO bullshit anyways where we have to fly attacks on other airspace, so what we want and need is power, speed.

The F-22 would offer that. The F-35 does not.

The statement the F-35 cannot go supersonic is a lie.

Short bursts supersonic means it can go supersonic.

Just not for extended times..

 

[braindrain]

I have never lied.

You want it? Here:

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35 - The Aviation Geek Club

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35

theaviationgeekclub.com

He got fired in 2018 for supporting the F-35. That was one year before Germany dismissed the F-35. The F-35 never had any chances to be chosen but the interest was upheld for other reasons.

And no, the F-35 is not the most advanced design. The F-22 is far superior in evry aspect to it. (See i name a american aircraft, you should offer the F 22, we would have bought it)

We dont use the F-16 either, since single engine aircrafts are not suitable for the standards we place.

The F-35 cant go supersonic. She breaks apart and is not able to super cruise. The Eurofighter can supercruise, the F-35 can not.

The Pentagon will have to live with limits on F-35’s supersonic flights

The Navy's and Marine Corps' versions of the F-35 will have restrictions on how long they can fly at supersonic speeds because of a risk of damage to the tail section.

www.defensenews.com

When going supersonic for more than a few minutes, the outer layer bubbles off and the wings get damaged.

As for our radar, the F-35 is very slow with low maneuver capability. She depends on stealth. When our radar can track it, its dead. Its that easy. You can shot it down with FLAK, thermal rockets or simply send up a Eurofighter.


The F-35 doesnt match what Germany wants. We want an aircraft that can easily reach any point of Germany to defend our airspace. It must be able to supercruise. We wont partisipate in any NATO bullshit anyways where we have to fly attacks on other airspace, so what we want and need is power, speed.

The F-22 would offer that. The F-35 does not.

You lie constantly on this site.Your lies have been pointed out both myself and other posters on this forum.
You do know your link doesn’t support your claim that Germany never seriously considered buying the F35 right.

Its good seeing you prove that you have no clue what you are talking about. First of I never claimed the F35 was the most advanced fighter simply that it was an advanced design. Which it is. Besides that in many ways it is the most advanced in the world. No other plane has any where near the sensor fusion and unmatched situational awareness the F35 provides its pilots. It is far and away the worlds most advanced STOVL aircraft. Sorry but your hate for America doesn’t change facts.

It is irrelevant if Germany uses the F16 or not. You claimed that the F35 is a failure because it only uses one engine. The success of the F16 proves you have no idea what you are talking about as usual.

More proof of your lies. One post you claim the F35 can’t go supersonic. The next you are admitting it can. That you have to constantly lie tells everyone just the type of person you are.

And you still have provided zero proof that you can track the F35 in any type of realistic scenario or that you you can achieve any type of weapons lock. And that you think modern countries air defense is counting on flak guns to defend their country is rather humorous. And your back up plan is to have the Eurofighter go after the f35, after you already admitted the eurofighter was a bigger failure then the F35, After all you declare the F35 was a failure due to having 3 crashes in one year and the Eurofighter has crashed 4 in one year.

Germany’s military is a joke and what you think they want or need is irrelevant. Even more so as you are clueless on this topic as demonstrated over and over. Besides the F35 was removed from the competition due to political and domestic economic reasons. Not military reasons.
And you are not getting the F22 as the US doesn’t trust your country enough. And going by the racist and ignorant views you have already shown here, if you are any type of indication of where Germany is headed, then I agree with not giving the country responsible for two world wars any more advanced tech. Would hate to have to destroy you country all over again. Especially seeing as this time we may not be so generous post war as we were last time. Would hate to see the US treat you guys the way you have treated any of the countries you guys temporarily took over. But then that would never happen as we are a better people then you.

 

[smallvoice]

I admit...thats wow...

Germany wants to buy several dozns of heavy transport helicopter to replace the old CH-53G .

60 helicopters have to be replaced and its the largest Helicopter deal on the market right now. The only companies who can sell
helicopters of this type are Boeing and Lockheed. For both companies this deal was very important and at least one of them
expected to get the contract.

Today it was announced that both are out of the game. Analysts say this is a political decission, not a strategic one, since there is no replacement.

Both Lockheed and Boeing offered participation of many german companies in this project, in the end it did not change the fact, that because the
bad german - american relations, Merkel is not willing to give any contracts into the US.

Insiders say, that Germany demands from both companies that the helicopter gets "germanized", which means it is supposed to be build in Germany, from german
corporations under Airbus.

Bundeswehr: Der geplatzte US-Helikopterdeal lässt tief blicken - WELT

Einer der größten bundesdeutschen Rüstungsdeals ist geplatzt. Das Verteidigungsministerium hat zwei großen US-Firmen beim Ersatz des altgedienten Transporthubschrauber CH-53G vorerst einen Korb gegeben. Der Schritt lässt einen strategischen Rückzieher vermuten.

www.welt.de

@Tangmo @Dayton3

Well. I'm certainly not riding in it....

 

[beerftw]

Thats bullshit of course. There are several german Designed Helicopters.

This Baby for example

There simply was no market for a German heavylift Helicopter. There also is no market now, but i agree that we should Not spend money to USA

That looks like the nh90, a nato made helicopter from multiple nations, not a german design, but a collaberation of nato nations. To be truthfull it looks like a half assed attempt to copy the mi-8/mi-17 soviet helicopters but with just enough change they could not be called copycats.

I looked up a list of german designed helicopters, they are all either unmade prototypes, or ultralights, not military craft.

The next closest I could find to that helicopter in the pic was a french designed helicopter. There are no german designed helicopters in the german military, there are a few germany had a small part in design but none they themselves designed.

 

[beerftw]

I have never lied.

You want it? Here:

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35 - The Aviation Geek Club

German Air Force Chief fired for supporting F-35

theaviationgeekclub.com

He got fired in 2018 for supporting the F-35. That was one year before Germany dismissed the F-35. The F-35 never had any chances to be chosen but the interest was upheld for other reasons.

And no, the F-35 is not the most advanced design. The F-22 is far superior in evry aspect to it. (See i name a american aircraft, you should offer the F 22, we would have bought it)

We dont use the F-16 either, since single engine aircrafts are not suitable for the standards we place.

The F-35 cant go supersonic. She breaks apart and is not able to super cruise. The Eurofighter can supercruise, the F-35 can not.

The Pentagon will have to live with limits on F-35’s supersonic flights

The Navy's and Marine Corps' versions of the F-35 will have restrictions on how long they can fly at supersonic speeds because of a risk of damage to the tail section.

www.defensenews.com

When going supersonic for more than a few minutes, the outer layer bubbles off and the wings get damaged.

As for our radar, the F-35 is very slow with low maneuver capability. She depends on stealth. When our radar can track it, its dead. Its that easy. You can shot it down with FLAK, thermal rockets or simply send up a Eurofighter.


The F-35 doesnt match what Germany wants. We want an aircraft that can easily reach any point of Germany to defend our airspace. It must be able to supercruise. We wont partisipate in any NATO bullshit anyways where we have to fly attacks on other airspace, so what we want and need is power, speed.

The F-22 would offer that. The F-35 does not.

I do not think you understand stealth, for one supersonic and stealth do not work together very well, the sonic boom is detectable, and the soviets figured out in the 1960's how to track supersonic jets by radar distortion even if the actual aircraft does not show up. For stealth to work it needs to be subsonic, discipline of communications(ie radio and radar can be tracked to who sent it) and also understanding radar.

Israel does stealth missions all the time without stealth aircraft, they use discipline in communications, and use the terrain to their advantage. In the falklands war britain got messed up pretty bad by ancient argentinian aircraft because they flew short distances close to the water ie below the radar, the british ships could not see them until it was too late, what saved the british was that they were using old ww2 era bombs and dropping them too low to function properly.


On supersonic, they can go more than a few seconds supersonic, they may not be able to sustain supersonic speeds more than a minute or two, however many aircraft can not anyways. For the stealth to work supersonic would be to get into range quick enough then go subsonic to avoid detection, or going supersonic because you got caught and getting out of dodge. For dogfights supersonic is not how they are fought, because that becomes a turning battle, where thrust and wing displacement make the most difference, and in bvr confrontations, rushing to your target as fast as possible is not the goal unless the role is interceptor, which the f-35 is not intended to be.

 

[Rostocker]

You lie constantly on this site.Your lies have been pointed out both myself and other posters on this forum.
You do know your link doesn’t support your claim that Germany never seriously considered buying the F35 right.

Its good seeing you prove that you have no clue what you are talking about. First of I never claimed the F35 was the most advanced fighter simply that it was an advanced design. Which it is. Besides that in many ways it is the most advanced in the world. No other plane has any where near the sensor fusion and unmatched situational awareness the F35 provides its pilots. It is far and away the worlds most advanced STOVL aircraft. Sorry but your hate for America doesn’t change facts.

It is irrelevant if Germany uses the F16 or not. You claimed that the F35 is a failure because it only uses one engine. The success of the F16 proves you have no idea what you are talking about as usual.

More proof of your lies. One post you claim the F35 can’t go supersonic. The next you are admitting it can. That you have to constantly lie tells everyone just the type of person you are.

And you still have provided zero proof that you can track the F35 in any type of realistic scenario or that you you can achieve any type of weapons lock. And that you think modern countries air defense is counting on flak guns to defend their country is rather humorous. And your back up plan is to have the Eurofighter go after the f35, after you already admitted the eurofighter was a bigger failure then the F35, After all you declare the F35 was a failure due to having 3 crashes in one year and the Eurofighter has crashed 4 in one year.

Germany’s military is a joke and what you think they want or need is irrelevant. Even more so as you are clueless on this topic as demonstrated over and over. Besides the F35 was removed from the competition due to political and domestic economic reasons. Not military reasons.
And you are not getting the F22 as the US doesn’t trust your country enough. And going by the racist and ignorant views you have already shown here, if you are any type of indication of where Germany is headed, then I agree with not giving the country responsible for two world wars any more advanced tech. Would hate to have to destroy you country all over again. Especially seeing as this time we may not be so generous post war as we were last time. Would hate to see the US treat you guys the way you have treated any of the countries you guys temporarily took over. But then that would never happen as we are a better people then you.

I dont lie, i dont speak perfect english and then aoh twist facts slightly unclear words and make bullshit out of it.

Its so advanced...it cant afford a 2nd engine and cant supercruise...how pathetic.

Its a cheap plane for export mainly.

The F 35 was never intended to be bought, not for economic reasons (F 35 is cheap and the current plan we have costs much more), but for simply not making deals with Trumpistan.

Beside that, yes, FLAK is a modern way to destroy such aircrafts. We have steerable ammo, that explodes infront the target, creating a veil of tungsten projectiles that rip the aircraft apart.

 

[Rostocker]

I do not think you understand stealth, for one supersonic and stealth do not work together very well, the sonic boom is detectable, and the soviets figured out in the 1960's how to track supersonic jets by radar distortion even if the actual aircraft does not show up. For stealth to work it needs to be subsonic, discipline of communications(ie radio and radar can be tracked to who sent it) and also understanding radar.

Israel does stealth missions all the time without stealth aircraft, they use discipline in communications, and use the terrain to their advantage. In the falklands war britain got messed up pretty bad by ancient argentinian aircraft because they flew short distances close to the water ie below the radar, the british ships could not see them until it was too late, what saved the british was that they were using old ww2 era bombs and dropping them too low to function properly.


On supersonic, they can go more than a few seconds supersonic, they may not be able to sustain supersonic speeds more than a minute or two, however many aircraft can not anyways. For the stealth to work supersonic would be to get into range quick enough then go subsonic to avoid detection, or going supersonic because you got caught and getting out of dodge. For dogfights supersonic is not how they are fought, because that becomes a turning battle, where thrust and wing displacement make the most difference, and in bvr confrontations, rushing to your target as fast as possible is not the goal unless the role is interceptor, which the f-35 is not intended to be.

We need supersonic aircrafts to defend our airspace, not stealth. Chances that we would participate in NATO action where we would need to fly into enemy airspace is near zero.

We need an aircraft that can supercruise.


And thats the main point, we want it only to defend ourself. The german comittment to NATO is zero, since we denie since decades to join any NATO enemy. We denied action in Syria, Libya, Ukraine. And when we support then with some photo taking and intelligence.

 

[Rostocker]

That looks like the nh90, a nato made helicopter from multiple nations, not a german design, but a collaberation of nato nations. To be truthfull it looks like a half assed attempt to copy the mi-8/mi-17 soviet helicopters but with just enough change they could not be called copycats.

I looked up a list of german designed helicopters, they are all either unmade prototypes, or ultralights, not military craft.

The next closest I could find to that helicopter in the pic was a french designed helicopter. There are no german designed helicopters in the german military, there are a few germany had a small part in design but none they themselves designed.

Thats wrong of course. The big majority of "European" projects are infact german concepts. The engines ect designed and build by MTU and ZF. The frogs part in development is chosing the color of the paint.

Beside that, Helicopters are a primitive design, there is nothing difficult in them. There simply is no global market share to win.

 

[braindrain]

I dont lie, i dont speak perfect english and then aoh twist facts slightly unclear words and make bullshit out of it.

Its so advanced...it cant afford a 2nd engine and cant supercruise...how pathetic.

Its a cheap plane for export mainly.

The F 35 was never intended to be bought, not for economic reasons (F 35 is cheap and the current plan we have costs much more), but for simply not making deals with Trumpistan.

Beside that, yes, FLAK is a modern way to destroy such aircrafts. We have steerable ammo, that explodes infront the target, creating a veil of tungsten projectiles that rip the aircraft apart.

Yes you do lie. It’s been proven multiple times by multiple people.
That you think have two engines instead of one is some how advanced proves just how pathetic your knowledge on this topic is. And you prove it again but claiming the F35 is mainly for export.
And you keep making the claim Germany never intended to buy the F35 but provide no evidence to support it. Sorry I don’t care about the unsupported claims of some who has already been caught lying. And yes it was political and domestic reasons that the F35 was dropped. You should learn a bit more about your own country.
Good thing you are not in charge of Germany’s air defense. Tell me how exactly the steerable Ammo is going to lock onto the F35 without a radar lock. It appears your knowledge of air defense is as lacking as it is on all other military related topics and Germany history.

 

[braindrain]

Thats wrong of course. The big majority of "European" projects are infact german concepts. The engines ect designed and build by MTU and ZF. The frogs part in development is chosing the color of the paint.

Beside that, Helicopters are a primitive design, there is nothing difficult in them. There simply is no global market share to win.

I guess we are adding helicopters to another topic you are clueless on.

Tell me is there anything you actually knowledgeable on.

 

[Rostocker]

Yes you do lie. It’s been proven multiple times by multiple people.
That you think have two engines instead of one is some how advanced proves just how pathetic your knowledge on this topic is. And you prove it again but claiming the F35 is mainly for export.
And you keep making the claim Germany never intended to buy the F35 but provide no evidence to support it. Sorry I don’t care about the unsupported claims of some who has already been caught lying. And yes it was political and domestic reasons that the F35 was dropped. You should learn a bit more about your own country.
Good thing you are not in charge of Germany’s air defense. Tell me how exactly the steerable Ammo is going to lock onto the F35 without a radar lock. It appears your knowledge of air defense is as lacking as it is on all other military related topics and Germany history.

It was clear from day one that the F-35 wont be bought because political and technological reasons.

The Radar can lock it, knows its Position. Fire and boom. You dont need to hit directly. It creates a cascade of tungsten fragments.

 

[Rostocker]

I guess we are adding helicopters to another topic you are clueless on.

Tell me is there anything you actually knowledgeable on.

Much more than you in pretty much anything. You are old and soon cold.

 

[braindrain]

It was clear from day one that the F-35 wont be bought because political and technological reasons.

The Radar can lock it, knows its Position. Fire and boom. You dont need to hit directly. It creates a cascade of tungsten fragments.

It’s political and domestic economic issues. And no you haven’t. You should probably stop lying.

And you have provided zero evidence that you can get any type of radar lock in a real world scenario let alone one good enough to fire at the plane with any kind of effects. Knowing exactly when and where to look is not a real life situation. But then you would know that if you knew anything at all about this topic.
But it’s clear you don’t and just keep throwing crap out there hoping you get something right eventually.
Sort of like how you tried to use the Rheinmetall Oerlikon as an effective weapon against the F35.
Obviously not knowing that system is designed as a CIWS designed to protect ships from missiles with a max range of 16000 feet. Care to guess how high the F35 can drop bombs and fire missiles from.
This is why smart people don’t talk about things you are clueless on. It just makes them look dumb. You should learn that lesson.

 

[braindrain]

Much more than you in pretty much anything. You are old and soon cold.

Is that why you are constantly wrong and have to resort to lying all the time.

 

[Rostocker]

Is that why you are constantly wrong and have to resort to lying all the time.

I never lie and i was right in pretty much evrything i said.

Just because you dont know much doesnt make it a lie.

Btw i forgot one factor why the F-35 was dodged.

Germany is a creator, not a consumer nation. We had no participation in the design and construction of the aircraft (like UK for example). No german corporations were part of this project. So technology wise
we would gain nothing from this. If the deal would have been done 10 yeare earlier it might have had better chances, because Germany would have been implemented in the design process and maybe a two engine version would have been possible, which could super cruise.

The political stuff aside, that Merkel would never give Trump a deal, the F-35 simply doesnt match what its intended for.

Defending German airspace, able to supercruise to any part of Germany in shortest time possible. Stealth is not important for that, since we dont act in enemy airspace (we basicly dont participate in any actions above enemy nations since decades).

Our focus is on speed. The Eurofighter can supercruise, the F-35 cant.

Another factor is, that USA is seen as not 100% trustworthy and we would be bound for decades on US spareparts.

That the F-35 has so many flaws that it needs temperated hangars to stay operational...that each pilot needs an individual helmet which costs half a million and cant be worn by other pilots including an own technician for each helmet...is just the ice of the cake.

Its that different mission profile that you dont understand and propably never will.

We will never fly missions against Russia or Iran. We did not even participare in Libya. We want a fast interceptor, operate in our airspace and thats it.

Speed, power, agility. Build in Germany or at least huge german participation.

 

[braindrain]

I never lie and i was right in pretty much evrything i said.

Just because you dont know much doesnt make it a lie.

Btw i forgot one factor why the F-35 was dodged.

Germany is a creator, not a consumer nation. We had no participation in the design and construction of the aircraft (like UK for example). No german corporations were part of this project. So technology wise
we would gain nothing from this. If the deal would have been done 10 yeare earlier it might have had better chances, because Germany would have been implemented in the design process and maybe a two engine version would have been possible, which could super cruise.

The political stuff aside, that Merkel would never give Trump a deal, the F-35 simply doesnt match what its intended for.

Defending German airspace, able to supercruise to any part of Germany in shortest time possible. Stealth is not important for that, since we dont act in enemy airspace (we basicly dont participate in any actions above enemy nations since decades).

Our focus is on speed. The Eurofighter can supercruise, the F-35 cant.

Another factor is, that USA is seen as not 100% trustworthy and we would be bound for decades on US spareparts.

That the F-35 has so many flaws that it needs temperated hangars to stay operational...that each pilot needs an individual helmet which costs half a million and cant be worn by other pilots including an own technician for each helmet...is just the ice of the cake.

Its that different mission profile that you dont understand and propably never will.

We will never fly missions against Russia or Iran. We did not even participare in Libya. We want a fast interceptor, operate in our airspace and thats it.

Speed, power, agility. Build in Germany or at least huge german participation.

Your lies have been called out multiple times by multiple posters. Sorry trying to pretend your honest is not going to fly.
And it’s funny seeing you talk negatively about the F35 helmet while all the pilots that talk about it talk about what a massive leap forward it is and the incredible situational awareness it gives them. And it’s not the helmet that is custom to the pilot. It’s the helmet liner. You should probably have some clue to what you are talking about.
And the fact that you can’t comprehend that advanced stealth coatings need different requirements then non stealth airplanes is not surprising.
And it’s funny not that long ago you were claiming how rich Germany was as a country but now you are all worried over the cost of some helmets and temperature controlled hangers. Doesn’t seem like the worries of a rich nation to me.

And over and over again you proof you really don’t know what you are talking about.
Last I looked Germany is still planning on buying the F18. Which is not only not built in Germany but also can’t super cruise and is not much faster then a F35.
Apparently Germany doesn’t agree with you when it comes to what the German government wants or needs.
And of course Germany won’t fly missions over Russia or Iran. You would have to have a functional military to do that. And Germany doesn’t have that.

 

[Rostocker]

Your lies have been called out multiple times by multiple posters. Sorry trying to pretend your honest is not going to fly.
And it’s funny seeing you talk negatively about the F35 helmet while all the pilots that talk about it talk about what a massive leap forward it is and the incredible situational awareness it gives them. And it’s not the helmet that is custom to the pilot. It’s the helmet liner. You should probably have some clue to what you are talking about.
And the fact that you can’t comprehend that advanced stealth coatings need different requirements then non stealth airplanes is not surprising.
And it’s funny not that long ago you were claiming how rich Germany was as a country but now you are all worried over the cost of some helmets and temperature controlled hangers. Doesn’t seem like the worries of a rich nation to me.

And over and over again you proof you really don’t know what you are talking about.
Last I looked Germany is still planning on buying the F18. Which is not only not built in Germany but also can’t super cruise and is not much faster then a F35.
Apparently Germany doesn’t agree with you when it comes to what the German government wants or needs.
And of course Germany won’t fly missions over Russia or Iran. You would have to have a functional military to do that. And Germany doesn’t have that.

We are rich because we dont spend money on bullshit.

The entire media here made fun about how laughable the F-35 is.

Here for example in "Die Welt" they mock that that helmet cost more than 30 VW Golf

F-35-Kampfjet: Helm für Piloten kostet so viel wie 30 VW Golf - WELT

Es ist ein Wunderwerk der Technik: Mit dem Super-Helm für F-35-Kampfpiloten lassen sich sogar Waffen mit Augenbewegungen steuern. Solche Finessen haben freilich ihren Preis – und der steigt langsam ins Unermessliche.

www.welt.de

And report how flawed that model is. As the article says, the helmet is a symbol for flaws, bugs and overpriced bullshit. Then defence minister von der Leyen is praised for having dodged that crap.

"Die Welt" is part of the Springer Media, they belong Friede Springer who is a close friend to Merkel, so the Springer press usually writes what Merkel want them to write. The F 35 is mocked in german media as the worst crap under the sun. Media is full of reports here how ridicolous flawed that shit is.

For example when one pilot is ill, the aircraft cant fly with another pilot because the helmet wont fit. So when terrorists enter german airspace with a hijacked aircraft, our Luftwaffe could not intercept when the personalized helmets strike.

Who develops such crap?

As for the F -18, its a subsititute because the old NATO nuclear sharing policy. And even that might die, since the SPD, Merkels coalition partner, is so much anti usa, they wont sign any purchase there.

And of course we have no functional military, we have an idiot who does the defense for us.

We have q saying here, the cow doesnt get slaughtered, as long it gives milk.

 

[braindrain]

We are rich because we dont spend money on bullshit.

The entire media here made fun about how laughable the F-35 is.

Here for example in "Die Welt" they mock that that helmet cost more than 30 VW Golf

F-35-Kampfjet: Helm für Piloten kostet so viel wie 30 VW Golf - WELT

Es ist ein Wunderwerk der Technik: Mit dem Super-Helm für F-35-Kampfpiloten lassen sich sogar Waffen mit Augenbewegungen steuern. Solche Finessen haben freilich ihren Preis – und der steigt langsam ins Unermessliche.

www.welt.de

And report how flawed that model is. As the article says, the helmet is a symbol for flaws, bugs and overpriced bullshit. Then defence minister von der Leyen is praised for having dodged that crap.

"Die Welt" is part of the Springer Media, they belong Friede Springer who is a close friend to Merkel, so the Springer press usually writes what Merkel want them to write. The F 35 is mocked in german media as the worst crap under the sun. Media is full of reports here how ridicolous flawed that shit is.

For example when one pilot is ill, the aircraft cant fly with another pilot because the helmet wont fit. So when terrorists enter german airspace with a hijacked aircraft, our Luftwaffe could not intercept when the personalized helmets strike.

Who develops such crap?

As for the F -18, its a subsititute because the old NATO nuclear sharing policy. And even that might die, since the SPD, Merkels coalition partner, is so much anti usa, they wont sign any purchase there.

And of course we have no functional military, we have an idiot who does the defense for us.

We have q saying here, the cow doesnt get slaughtered, as long it gives milk.

So they write BS propaganda that’s not based on reality. And I am supposed to be impressed why exactly. A perfect example is the criticism of the F35 helmet. Yet all the pilots who have actually form with talk about the unparalleled situational awareness it gives them. I don’t doubt you don’t realize this but situational awareness is huge for fighter pilots.
But I am not surprised that the master race has to try and attack those who at actually better then them. It’s a defense mechanism for people who have already lost two world wars and are a 2nd rate world power.

 

[skeptic llc]

If Germany wants to turn to Russia to fight against a Nato without Germany there's not much the USA can do except to flatten Germany from the air again. So maybe you should put in writing where you're going with this angry attitude of yours and your list of grievances you were up nights pacing and making.

Oh my.

 

[Rostocker]

So they write BS propaganda that’s not based on reality. And I am supposed to be impressed why exactly. A perfect example is the criticism of the F35 helmet. Yet all the pilots who have actually form with talk about the unparalleled situational awareness it gives them. I don’t doubt you don’t realize this but situational awareness is huge for fighter pilots.
But I am not surprised that the master race has to try and attack those who at actually better then them. It’s a defense mechanism for people who have already lost two world wars and are a 2nd rate world power.

A 2nd rate world power that is most popular nation in the world

https://www.thelocal.de/20200727/germany-rated-most-admired-country-in-the-world

Technology is one of our core fields. We know when someone wants to sell us crap.

That helmet is crap. Its the canverous tumor grown from a mafia defense industry. They leech your tax money away with bullshit like this.

Its same reason why we favor russian pipeline gas over american LNG. Its simply technical more practical than putting energy into gas to liquify it, ship it over the atlantic, put energy in it to store it here ect.

We strive for technological excellence. To have a plane that can only fly with a personalized helmet is not practical, it makes one vulnerable.

Thats one of the main problems aside from the political issues. If Germany would have participated in the development like UK, there maybe would be a version that suits our needs, with two engines and without that ridicolous helmet. But the way it is, it simply would not work for us.

All that bla bla aside and since you say you know that sguff, would it be possible to make adaptions according to our intended mission profile? Get rid of the helmet and make it able to supercruise?

 

[RetiredUSN]

Sour that you lost the biggest helicopter deal on the market?

Last time i checked, we decide what we buy and what not.

Have you summed up the amount of contracts you lost already?

90 F-35 cancelled by Germany
60 helicopters cancelled by Germany

All in all this is at 29 billion $.

What amuses me most is that it angers you that much, that you threaten war against us.

I have news for you, just because this alliance breaks apart doesnt mean we are enemies.

America drops more than 29 billion every year on pet projects just to sway politicians in the house and senate for their votes. (pork and earmarks)

Germany cancelling a contract is a drop in the bucket.

I hear the Sukhoi is a pretty good fighter.......................go get it.

 

[Rostocker]

America drops more than 29 billion every year on pet projects just to sway politicians in the house and senate for their votes. (pork and earmarks)

Germany cancelling a contract is a drop in the bucket.

I hear the Sukhoi is a pretty good fighter.......................go get it.

I dont know. Losing 46 billion sounds not so good for lokheed. First losing F 35 deql, now helicopter. Its even worse for Boeing, which is on life support.

 

[braindrain]

A 2nd rate world power that is most popular nation in the world

https://www.thelocal.de/20200727/germany-rated-most-admired-country-in-the-world

Technology is one of our core fields. We know when someone wants to sell us crap.

That helmet is crap. Its the canverous tumor grown from a mafia defense industry. They leech your tax money away with bullshit like this.

Its same reason why we favor russian pipeline gas over american LNG. Its simply technical more practical than putting energy into gas to liquify it, ship it over the atlantic, put energy in it to store it here ect.

We strive for technological excellence. To have a plane that can only fly with a personalized helmet is not practical, it makes one vulnerable.

Thats one of the main problems aside from the political issues. If Germany would have participated in the development like UK, there maybe would be a version that suits our needs, with two engines and without that ridicolous helmet. But the way it is, it simply would not work for us.

All that bla bla aside and since you say you know that sguff, would it be possible to make adaptions according to our intended mission profile? Get rid of the helmet and make it able to supercruise?

It’s easy to like a country that has no real power and spends most of its time virtue signaling.
Let’s see who’s opinion shooting I put more credibility in. Pilots who have actually used the helmet in question and know what they are talking about or a poster in an Internet forum who lies constantly and proven he knows nothing on this topic. Let me tell you that’s not a real hard choice.

Again you prove to not only not know what you are talking about but are also unable to learn. It’s not the helmet that is custom to the pilot but the replaceable liner. Besides Germany doesn’t even have enough qualified pilots for it to matter.

What’s even funnier is there are plenty of higher ups in the Germany military that supported the purchase of the F35 but they where overruled due to political issues. But hey I am sure you know more then then right?