Gaza is an "Open Air Prison", Ghetto", "Refugee Camp"

[mbig]

Many people, especially I'm sure our non-Israeli posters, imagine some REAL Refugee camp like those that exist in Sudan etc.
But most Palestinians "Refugeee Camps", are now Towns/cities.

A Quick bird's-eye view of Gaza City and some Unintentional News from AlArabiya TV. Jan 2009
46 seconds.
YouTube - Hamas fires from foreign Press building in Gaza January 2009 - Unintentional News from Alarabiya-TV
Is that Athens or Gaza?

and
4 minutes in December 2008 16 months ago:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4g1-HTJYEk"]YouTube- Daily life in Gaza[/ame]

does that Look like the "Warsaw Ghetto".. or Sudan? OR a Prison Camp with Starving people behind Barbed Wire?
Or does it look like alot of Middle Eastern Mediterranean locales?

And yes, I know SUBSEQUENTLY one can produce Bombed Building Pictures from the "Cast Lead"... but THIS is about the Daily Life most people are under the Misimpression about.
So Spare us.
This string is about this so-called "open Air Prison" that people Slander Israel with.
Or some Tent City some think is Gaza.
-

 

[Picaro]

Oh, nonsense. There are tons of pictures of the horrors Gazniaks are living under. Check these out and then try to tell us they aren't living under an iron boot of oppression! These are from the end of last year, and I've never seen such horrific conditions!!!!

æßÇáÉ ÝáÓØíä Çáíæã ÇáÅÎÈÇÑíÉ - ÚÏÓÉ "ÝáÓØíä Çáíæã" ÊáÊÞØ ãÔÇåÏ ÇÓÊÚÏÇÏÇÊ ÇáÛÒíæä áÚíÏ ÇáÇÖÍì ÇáãÈÇÑß

I mean, check out the fashions they're forced to endure! That alone is enough to make Noam Chomsky cry! No wonder they're angry!!!

I've got a link somewhere with pictures from the balcony of one of the dozen four and five star hotels, showing several swimming pools, and the guy also posted pictures of several fountains, and those Evul Jooos are supposedly 'depriving them of water', as well! I'll dig those up, if the site is still online.

 

[Wiseone]

Not to pick sides, but you shouldnt complain that pictures of destruction and horrible living conditions are only selected photos, and then show us just some selected photos as a counter point.

 

[Apocalypse]

Not to pick sides, but you shouldnt complain that pictures of destruction and horrible living conditions are only selected photos, and then show us just some selected photos as a counter point.

Showing selected photos from the contradicting view in order to debunk and destroy a common misguided thought line is completely legitimate.

 

[Wiseone]

Showing selected photos from the contradicting view in order to debunk and destroy a common misguided thought line is completely legitimate.

I don't think it undermines the fact that Gaza is a terrible place to live for all kinds of reasons. I could show pictures of some horrible places in North Korea and then show Pyongyang and say "Well it must not be as bad as people say."

 

[mbig]

Not to pick sides, but you shouldnt complain that pictures of destruction and horrible living conditions are only selected photos, and then show us just some selected photos as a counter point.

I appreciate what you're saying but my "selected pictures" are Not Tiny zoomed in pics of one house or one [destroyed] building. (what the other side will post).

BOTH youtubes are of the Whole of Gaza City and and the second many parts of it.
an overview you Never see posted.
That's why I did.
Not the usual both sides 'gore' pictures.

That's very Different than showing one 'tiny violin' picture of a Single person, house, building, or even block.
Much harder to "select" the whole of Gaza City.

Did You have Any idea that's what Gaza City looked like? Or did you picture a hovel.
-

 

[Apocalypse]

I don't think it undermines the fact that Gaza is a terrible place to live for all kinds of reasons. I could show pictures of some horrible places in North Korea and then show Pyongyang and say "Well it must not be as bad as people say."

I do not think that you fully understand it.
One of the common propaganda lines heard against Israel is that Gaza is a Ghetto, where people are starving to their deaths because the Israelis block pasta from getting in.

That is of course absolutely wrong and an attempt to mislead and demonize.
While the life in Gaza are definitely not comparable to the life in Paris, they are also definitely not comparable to the life in the Nazi Ghettos, or the life in Somalia, Rwanda, Sudan, etc.

Kids in Gaza are as healthy as they come, people do not die from starvation everyday in the streets there, and the comparison to a Nazi Ghetto can be easily debunked by simply posting a few pics of the residents and seeing that they're not walking skeletons, and that they can go to the beach when they want to, or simply hang around playing in the streets without anyone telling them what to do (there are no Israeli soldiers in Gaza, except the kidnapped Gilad Shalit).

Now before you'll suggest that such propaganda is obviously not going to work, due to its insane ridiculousness and its lack of basic dependence on reality - you'd be surprised at how many people really buy into this and imagine Gaza as an African hell-hole with little children dying in the streets because they are not able to get their hands on any type of food.
One poster in this same forum has already made the comparison once.

Now again, life in Gaza is not comparable with life in Paris, and is indeed much worse than the life in the occupied West Bank, but by no means is there a basis for such a comparison with the Nazi's Ghettos.

 

[Wiseone]

I can agree with Apocalypse, I was just concerned the point of this topic was to undermine the legitimate problems in Gaza. The situation could be a lot worse of course but also could be better.

 

[Picaro]

Gaza's 'problems' aren't caused by Israelis or their blockade, period. You should, in the interest of 'fairness', also include Egypt when citing the blockade, since they are the other half of the issue.

In any case, Israelis didn't elect Hamas with an 80% majority of the vote, in what every international 'Rights' group monitoring the elections say was an 'honest' one; Gazans did that themselves, so they have nothing to snivel about. They aren't starving, they aren't oppressed by Israel, and they govern themselves; there is nothing at all misleading about these pictures.

 

[aaronssongs]

Gaza's 'problems' aren't caused by Israelis or their blockade, period. You should, in the interest of 'fairness', also include Egypt when citing the blockade, since they are the other half of the issue.

In any case, Israelis didn't elect Hamas with an 80% majority of the vote, in what every international 'Rights' group monitoring the elections say was an 'honest' one; Gazans did that themselves, so they have nothing to snivel about. They aren't starving, they aren't oppressed by Israel, and they govern themselves; there is nothing at all misleading about these pictures.

So you say. I'm sure there are others who would say otherwise.

 

[Mira]

There is Gaza city and there are the refugee camps such as Jabaliya, Rafah, Khan Younis, Maghazi, Boreij etc...

The unemployment rate in Gaza has reached over 40%, the highest in the world. I wouldn't call that "good living conditions".

 

[Apocalypse]

There is Gaza city and there are the refugee camps such as Jabaliya, Rafah, Khan Younis, Maghazi, Boreij etc...

The unemployment rate in Gaza has reached over 40%, the highest in the world. I wouldn't call that "good living conditions".

The unemployment is concerning but the situation of a region is not decided merely by its unemployment rates.

That's a lot due to the fact that a lot of Gazans decide to work at smuggling tunnels, a "business" that is not written under the employment rates of the statistic charts.

Oh, and mind you, Gaza's unemployment rate is concerning, but it is certainly not the "highest in the world" - that's simply ridiculous.
There are 11 nations that come before the Strip in their unemployment rates, and the population in each of those nations is way bigger than that of Gaza.

Source:

Country / Region ↓ Unemployment rate (%) ↓ Source / date of information ↓
Nauru Nauru 90.00 2004
Zimbabwe Zimbabwe 90.00 2009 (June)[67]
Liberia Liberia 85.00;[32] 88% among young Liberians[33] 2009 (July)
Turkmenistan Turkmenistan 70.00 2008 (November)[58]
Cocos (Keeling) Islands Cocos (Keeling) Islands (Australia) 60.00 2000
Mozambique Mozambique 60.00 2009
Tajikistan Tajikistan 60.00%; 80-90% among youth 2008 (August)[55]
Djibouti Djibouti 59.00 2007
Zambia Zambia 50.00 2000
Senegal Senegal 48.00;[citation needed] 30% among adults aged 24 and under[33] 2007
Lesotho Lesotho 45.00 2002
Gaza Strip Gaza Strip 44.00 2009 (April)[18]

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unemployment_by_country[/ame]

 

[Mira]

The unemployment is concerning but the situation of a region is not decided merely by its unemployment rates.

That's a lot due to the fact that a lot of Gazans decide to work at smuggling tunnels, a "business" that is not written under the employment rates of the statistic charts.

Oh, and mind you, Gaza's unemployment rate is concerning, but it is certainly not the "highest in the world" - that's simply ridiculous.
There are 11 nations that come before the Strip in their unemployment rates, and the population in each of those nations is way bigger than that of Gaza.

Source:


List of countries by unemployment rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That's fantastic ! I'm moving to Gaza then, sounds like heaven on earth :doh

 

[Apocalypse]

That's fantastic ! I'm moving to Gaza then, sounds like heaven on earth :doh

Why are you moving there?
Didn't you hear, Gaza has the highest unemployment rate in the world!

And that's not all, it also has the highest crime rate in the world, the lowest life expectancy rate in the world and the worst weather in the world!
Seriously, forget about all of those places where hundreds of people are murdered every week - Gaza is in a league of its own.

:doh

Seriously, if 44% is somehow higher than 90%, then why not simply make up the numbers and be done with it.

 

[Mira]

Why are you moving there?
Didn't you hear, Gaza has the highest unemployment rate in the world!

And that's not all, it also has the highest crime rate in the world, the lowest life expectancy rate in the world and the worst weather in the world!
Seriously, forget about all of those places where hundreds of people are murdered every week - Gaza is in a league of its own.

:doh

Well, when I see the video that mbig posted, I can't help but dream of a better life for me in Gaza. What a fantastic place full of life, good weather, colourful markets .... who wouldn't want to live in such a heaven under the friendly skies ?

edit: my bad, I should have said the highest unemployment rate in the ME.
So you're saying that Gaza will be considered an open-air prison only when unemployment reaches that of doomed African, countries ?

 

[Apocalypse]

Well, when I see the video that mbig posted, I can't help but dream of a better life for me in Gaza. What a fantastic place full of life, good weather, colourful markets .... who wouldn't want to live in such a heaven under the friendly skies ?

I know who would.
People who live in Sudan, Rwanda, Congo, Somalia, and Nazi Ghettos.

 

[Apocalypse]

So you're saying that Gaza will be considered an open-air prison only when unemployment reaches that of doomed African, countries ?

So you're saying that trees and honeybees have both evolved from bottle caps?

 

[Mira]

I know who would.
People who live in Sudan, Rwanda, Congo, Somalia, and Nazi Ghettos.

So in other words, until Gaza reaches the rate of the horror in Africa, it will be considered a heavenly place to live in. Interesting

 

[Apocalypse]

So in other words, until Gaza reaches the rate of the horror in Africa, it will be considered a heavenly place to live in. Interesting

What's interesting is the way you choose my words.

I've never said that Gaza is a heavenly place to live in.
Never.

Since you insist to declare it as if I did, in other words, lying, I'm going to act as if you've just stated that you hate black people.

 

[Apocalypse]

my bad, I should have said the highest unemployment rate in the ME.

Wrong again.


Turkmenistan is on the edge of the ME, and has a worse unemployment rate than the Gaza Strip.

 

[Mira]

What's interesting is the way you choose my words.

I've never said that Gaza is a heavenly place to live in.
Never.

Since you insist to declare it as if I did, in other words, lying, I'm going to act as if you've just stated that you hate black people.

I'm replying to the OP Apocalypse, read the title of the thread, watch the video that mbig posted, followed by the lovely pictures in the second post. If you know better, then why didn't you correct the OP ?

 

[Apocalypse]

I'm replying to the OP Apocalypse, read the title of the thread, watch the video that mbig posted, followed by the lovely pictures in the second post. If you know better, then why didn't you correct the OP ?

Where did he state that Gaza is a heaven on earth?
It's just not the hell on earth that people have tried to paint it as, that's all.

 

[Mira]

Where did he state that Gaza is a heaven on earth?
It's just not the hell on earth that people have tried to paint it as, that's all.

More than 40% unemployment ? half a dozen refugee camps ? no permission to leave the strip ? If that's not hell on earth then what is it ?

You're saying that things should get as bad as Africa before we even consider that the place is hell on earth . Would you live happilly in such conditions ?

 

[Wiseone]

I think we should instead of arguing if its "good" "bad" "really bad" or "black pit of human existence," which is just assigning meaningless and subjective labels, lets just focus on the facts of the situation, like 40% unemployment. I know I'm guilty of arguing in terms of "badness," but as long as we can agree on actual facts about the situation in Gaza thats at least a start. Once we can all agree on the facts, as we should because they are facts, we can argue opinions on just how bad it is.

 

[Apocalypse]

More than 40% unemployment ? half a dozen refugee camps ? no permission to leave the strip ? If that's not hell on earth then what is it ?

Unfortunately, it's just another ****-hole.
That doesn't make it a unique ****-hole, nor is its ****-holeness so terrifying.
There are ****loads of ****-holes in this ****ty planet, and you should know better than that to try and paint Gaza as the worst of them all.

You're saying that things should get as bad as Africa before we even consider that the place is hell on earth . Would you live happilly in such conditions ?

I wouldn't live happily in that place, nor would I live happily in Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Saudi-Arabia, Yemen, Egypt, Baharia and all of the rest of the common mideast ****-holes, and certainly would I not compare this ****hole to the hellholes in Africa or to an actual Nazi Ghetto.