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gay marriage...

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DHard3006

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perversion of homosexual marriage...

jallman said:
bigot or defender of the social disgrace of bigotry?
Once again we get the bigot word. Now just which group is attacking a person for voicing their opinion. If I recall the definition of bigot says some thing about not being tolerant of other opinions. From the insults from the homosexuals or the defenders of the perversion of homosexuality I would say this group fits the definition of bigots.
shuamort said:
There's a jump in logic there.
Unlike your inability to disprove my facts.
shuamort said:
Or why do straight people not call themselves heterosexuals.
The only time heterosexuals refer to this is when they are talking about the perversion of homosexuality.
shuamort said:
Why do people named James go by "Jim"?
Well this does not really hide what James is does it. If there is no shame in being homosexuals Why the need for the word gay? Just adds more evidence that homosexuality is a perversion because of the need to hide behind a name.
shuamort said:
Why do people named James go by "Jim"? Why is there more than one word for the same thing? If this is what you're using to buttress your argument is lexicon and vernacular, well, your argument is even sadder than I thought.
The only argument I have used is facts.
Fact, it is impossible for homosexuals to reproduce. This alone makes homosexuality a perversion of the laws of nature.
Fact, the one thing that does not happen in nature is homosexual reproduction.
 

Technocratic_Utilitarian

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I would say that Army-of-God is sick by endorsing the assassination of abortion doctores. I am a far cry from Army-of-God because I stick to the legislative possess, instead of suicide bombing...oops, I mien, sniping those who I disagree with.

You force your religious nonsense on others without moral justification. Religions have no business in the affairs of anyone outside of that religion or beyond voluntary submission.

As for "my" ballot initiatives, Californians have been able to keep gay 'marriage off the books, so far, with ballot initiatives....and I don't live in California.

Their day will come. Nothing escapes SCOTUS forever, even horseshit laws like California. I guses that's what you get for hiring an actor Republitard as your governor as opposed to someone who is actually qualified and objective. Nowadays, you just toe the party line.



Once again we get the bigot word. Now just which group is attacking a person for voicing their opinion. If I recall the definition of bigot says some thing about not being tolerant of other opinions. From the insults from the homosexuals or the defenders of the perversion of homosexuality I would say this group fits the definition of bigots.

You can have an opinion, but you are still a bigot, because your opinion is wrong and base off of injustice via illogical prejudice. Just because you have the "right" of free speech does not mean people have to sit by and let everything fly, lies and all. Annthrax Coulter can say all terrorists are muslims, but that doesn't make her free from criticism.

Homosexuality isn't a perversion of anything. It quite frequently happens in nature uneducated nimph. Maybe if you picked up a biology book and put down your Bible, you would realise that. If you want to talk about perversions--look at Christianity. It's a bloody perversion of reality. People bei ng made from penis bones? RIbs? Dustflakes? Magical waters entrapped behind closed doors in the sky? Talking animals? Earth being 6k years old? Please. I stopped believing in faerietales when I was 10; sadly you kept it up.


Originally Posted by shuamort
There's a jump in logic there.
Unlike your inability to disprove my facts.

He doesn't have to disprove your facts. Have you actualy TAKEN any logic courses? Your logic is wrong, ergo, your argument is invalid. He need not refute an invalid argument. Please. Next!

The only time heterosexuals refer to this is when they are talking about the perversion of homosexuality.

Christians refer to themselves as sheep---and sheep are stupid, mindless animals. I guess that means Christians are stupid and...oh yea!

Well this does not really hide what James is does it. If there is no shame in being homosexuals Why the need for the word gay? Just adds more evidence that homosexuality is a perversion because of the need to hide behind a name.

Gay isn't hiding what homosexuals are you water nimph. Gay has been used prior to the term homosexual. The etymology of "gay" as in meaning "queer" goes back over 100 years. Learn before you talk. If anything, homosexaulity is a "sterilized" form of gay.


The only argument I have used is facts.
Fact, it is impossible for homosexuals to reproduce. This alone makes homosexuality a perversion of the laws of nature.
Fact, the one thing that does not happen in nature is homosexual reproduction.

Your entire Argument is logically invalid; don't you comprehend this, or do you not speak english very well? Natural != moral; Unnatural != immoral. THIS IS AN IS/OUGHT FALLACY STOP USING IT DOTARD! Facts also != morality. Reason does. Facts are worthless without reason.


However, half your facts are also wrong, which only makes you even dumber:

Fact: Is it possible for homosexuals to reproduce? Yes. Artificial insemination. Sterile Females also can't have children. Using your retarded perversion of logic, this means they are immoral.

Fact: Is homosexuality a perversion of nature? Nope. Your argument is false on two accounts.
Fact, the one thing that does not happen in nature is homosexual reproduction.

A. What the hell do you think a Human is, genius? A robot? No. It's an animal.

1. All Animals are parts of nature
2. All mammals are animals
3, All mammal characteristics are natural
4. Humans are mammals/animals.
5. Homosexuality is an animal characteristic
4. Ergo, homosexuality is part of nature.


B. Naturalistic Fallacy. It doesn't matter jack and **** whether or not reproduction in nature by homosexual animals occures. It's irrelevant. This is an is/ought fallacy. Look it up. I await your concession upon your return.

The same works for Bonobo Chimpanzees and penguins--many of which are homosexual and bisexual. Is this clear enough for you, or do I need to school you some more? YOur argument is wrong--STOP USING IT. Repetition does ont make your argument logical, just annoying. This isn't hard. Wake up. If you don't concede, you are nothing but a dishonest webtroll who isn't here for debate, but pontification of his religious bullshit.
 

Busta

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"You force your religious nonsense on others without moral justification. Religions have no business in the affairs of anyone outside of that religion or beyond voluntary submission."
Opposing gay 'marriage is no more a forcing of religion then advancing gay 'marriage is. The ballot only records a "Yes" or "No". The ballot does not record religion, nor does it record a "why".

"Their day will come. Nothing escapes SCOTUS forever, even horseshit laws like California. I guses that's what you get for hiring an actor Republitard as your governor as opposed to someone who is actually qualified and objective. Nowadays, you just toe the party line."
Ya, the day will come. My "fiction" spells that out as well.
As for the Term-Eliminator, I told you, I-do-not-live-in-California. Only Citizens of California can vote for the California Governor. I could not have voted for him if I wanted to. Oh, and my "party" is Independent, not Republican.

Besides, he will sign gay 'marriage into law once he is re-elected....just be patient (unless, of-coarse Demolition Man was more accurate then we thought and he Amends the Constitution, then runs for President).
 

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"You force your religious nonsense on others without moral justification. Religions have no business in the affairs of anyone outside of that religion or beyond voluntary submission."

Opposing gay 'marriage is no more a forcing of religion then advancing gay 'marriage is. The ballot only records a "Yes" or "No". The ballot does not record religion, nor does it record a "why".

False analogy as well as ignorance on your part. I don't care what your ballot says; when you make a decision, you best damn-well be prepared to justify it with a rational, cogent argument. You have not done that. You have no argument other than "religious" nonsense. Appeals to natural law and Appeals to the Bible are religious arguments and thus politically invalid. If you use them as your argument, you are voting on religion. You cannot force religions on non participants, nor are you allowed to legislate religious morality.

Ya, the day will come. My "fiction" spells that out as well.
As for the Term-Eliminator, I told you, I-do-not-live-in-California. Only Citizens of California can vote for the California Governor. I could not have voted for him if I wanted to. Oh, and my "party" is Independent, not Republican.

No kidding. I didn't say you lived in california. Notice I didn't say republican. I said republitard. Republican is a party. Republitard is a mentality. Although, there is little difference.

Besides, he will sign gay 'marriage into law once he is re-elected....just be patient (unless, of-coarse Demolition Man was more accurate then we thought and he Amends the Constitution, then runs for President).

He ought to sign in into Law if he has an ounce of reason.
 

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Re: perversion of homosexual marriage...

DHard3006 said:
Once again we get the bigot word. Now just which group is attacking a person for voicing their opinion. If I recall the definition of bigot says some thing about not being tolerant of other opinions. From the insults from the homosexuals or the defenders of the perversion of homosexuality I would say this group fits the definition of bigots.

Unlike your inability to disprove my facts.

The only time heterosexuals refer to this is when they are talking about the perversion of homosexuality.

Well this does not really hide what James is does it. If there is no shame in being homosexuals Why the need for the word gay? Just adds more evidence that homosexuality is a perversion because of the need to hide behind a name.

The only argument I have used is facts.
Fact, it is impossible for homosexuals to reproduce. This alone makes homosexuality a perversion of the laws of nature.
Fact, the one thing that does not happen in nature is homosexual reproduction.

Facts? Facts? FACTS? The only fact where you are concerned is this...you have no place in this debate. Busta...uses facts. Mort...uses facts. Kelzie...she is the fact goddess. You are nothing more than a slimy repetition of the same hate rhetoric that causes these debates to spin out of control. And yes, you are a bigot in every sense of the word. You have no basis for your argument, no capability to argue your baseless argument, and are really, just a shadow of an intellect copying your posts from some tract literature handed out by a bigot group.

We all know homosexual sex does not lead to reproduction...we all get that. We all get that you think homosexuality is a perversion. But when your thoughts become a defense for bigotry, I am sure we will all let you in on the development. In the meantime, get a new comment to parrot or STFU, bigot.
 

Busta

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"False analogy as well as ignorance on your part."
Since I have not made a false analogy, I have not shown ignorance.

"I don't care what your ballot says; when you make a decision, you best damn-well be prepared to justify it with a rational, cogent argument. You have not done that."
It's not *my* ballot, It's the county's ballot (or the state's, depending on what is being voted on).
As I said, it only records "Yes" or "No". Nothing ells.

"You have no argument other than "religious" nonsense. Appeals to natural law and Appeals to the Bible are religious arguments and thus politically invalid. If you use them as your argument, you are voting on religion."
Our Founding Fathers got their concepts of such rights as "..life, liberty, or property..." from their faith. Just as they did not spell out their faith when they enumerated their personal beliefs in the Constitution, neither do I enumerate my personal beliefs when I vote.
My personal faith/religious beliefs become vallid when I vote on them.
There is nothing wrong with voting one's conscience.

"...nor are you allowed to legislate religious morality.
I can when I vote.

"I didn't say you lived in California."
Ya, you did: "I guses that's what you get for hiring an actor Republitard as your governor..."; he could only be *my* Governor if I lived in California.

"He ought to sign in into Law if he has an ounce of reason."
The Term-Eliminator is a Kennedy Democrat in Republican clothing. He Vetoed that last gay 'marriage law because he needs to keep up the gig and keep his job. Just be patient....

Your hate clouds your mind, go have a cookie....that always works for me.
 
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Kelzie

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Re: perversion of homosexual marriage...

jallman said:
Facts? Facts? FACTS? The only fact where you are concerned is this...you have no place in this debate. Busta...uses facts. Mort...uses facts. Kelzie...she is the fact goddess. You are nothing more than a slimy repetition of the same hate rhetoric that causes these debates to spin out of control. And yes, you are a bigot in every sense of the word. You have no basis for your argument, no capability to argue your baseless argument, and are really, just a shadow of an intellect copying your posts from some tract literature handed out by a bigot group.

We all know homosexual sex does not lead to reproduction...we all get that. We all get that you think homosexuality is a perversion. But when your thoughts become a defense for bigotry, I am sure we will all let you in on the development. In the meantime, get a new comment to parrot or STFU, bigot.

Hello? What? Did I hear my name? And in connection with the word goddess nonetheless. I appreciate honesty in a man. ;)

Yeah. And what he said.
 

Busta

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Re: perversion of homosexual marriage...

Kelzie said:
Hello? What? Did I hear my name? And in connection with the word goddess nonetheless. I appreciate honesty in a man. ;)

Yeah. And what he said.

He said: "Kelzie...she is the fact goddess."

And that's a fact.
 

Kelzie

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Re: perversion of homosexual marriage...

Busta said:
He said: "Kelzie...she is the fact goddess."

And that's a fact.

Aww...you too? :lol:

I like this game. We can keep on playing allll night. Or at least for another 5 minutes cause I'm going to bed.
 

Busta

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Re: perversion of homosexual marriage...

Kelzie said:
Aww...you too? :lol:

I like this game. We can keep on playing allll night. Or at least for another 5 minutes cause I'm going to bed.

You don't mind if I worship you, do you? Just a little bit....Jesus will understand, er, I mien, forgive me.:cool:
 

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Since I have not made a false analogy, I have not shown ignorance.

Yes, you have. You simply ignore your fallacies. That's ignorance.

It's not *my* ballot, It's the county's ballot (or the state's, depending on what is being voted on).
As I said, it only records "Yes" or "No". Nothing ells.

I don't care what it says. YOu ought not say yes or no unless you have a logical, cogent argument. YOu don't have that.

Our Founding Fathers got their concepts of such rights as "..life, liberty, or property..." from their faith. Just as they did not spell out their faith when they enumerated their personal beliefs in the Constitution, neither do I enumerate my personal beliefs when I vote.
My personal faith/religious beliefs become vallid when I vote on them.
There is nothing wrong with voting one's conscience.

False. The majority of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence were plagarized by Thomas Jefferson and Madison. The true sources of the Declaration of Independence were the French Philosophes of the Enlightenment as well as the various French enlightend philosophers just as Voltair, Rousseau, and Montesqu. The primary theme of the French and American Enlightenments was rational secularaism and Deism. The Founding Fathers were largely Athiests and Deists, and the Deist moral code was not Christian, but Humanistic. Morality was derrived From Man's reason, not his emotions or his faith. Some people, however, were known as "Enlightened Chritians" who amalgamated Enlightenment secular philosphy with mainstream Christianity. Primarily, the Declaration's statements about "life, liberty, and happiness" did not come from faith at all, rather Appeal to Reason. In fact, the entire concept pursuit of happiness was a latter addition by Thomas Jeffersion due to the political pressures put on him by congress. The original word he used was "Property," not happines. Propety was the central tenet of Enlightenment ideology--secular ideology. Success came via the Virtue of Selfishness.


"...nor are you allowed to legislate religious morality.
I can when I vote.

No, you can't, because then you are legislating religion. No state, voter, nor national congress can legislate religion. That's a violation of the wall of separation. No religiously based law can be passed legally unless there is a secular proponent as the primary motivation.

Ya, you did: "I guses that's what you get for hiring an actor Republitard as your governor..."; he could only be *my* Governor if I lived in California.

You does not mean "you" in English. Unlike German, English only has 1 word for you, and you can make 3 different things. You singular, you plural, and you neutral. I was not referring to you.

The Term-Eliminator is a Kennedy Democrat in Republican clothing. He Vetoed that last gay 'marriage law because he needs to keep up the gig and keep his job. Just be patient....

Your hate clouds your mind, go have a cookie....that always works for me.

No, he's a republican in an independent constume. Your illogic clouds your argument. Fix it.
 

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Technocratic_Utilitarian said:
False. The majority of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence were plagarized by Thomas Jefferson and Madison. The true sources of the Declaration of Independence were the French Philosophes of the Enlightenment as well as the various French enlightend philosophers just as Voltair, Rousseau, and Montesqu. The primary theme of the French and American Enlightenments was rational secularaism and Deism. The Founding Fathers were largely Athiests and Deists, and the Deist moral code was not Christian, but Humanistic. Morality was derrived From Man's reason, not his emotions or his faith. Some people, however, were known as "Enlightened Chritians" who amalgamated Enlightenment secular philosphy with mainstream Christianity. Primarily, the Declaration's statements about "life, liberty, and happiness" did not come from faith at all, rather Appeal to Reason. In fact, the entire concept pursuit of happiness was a latter addition by Thomas Jeffersion due to the political pressures put on him by congress. The original word he used was "Property," not happines. Propety was the central tenet of Enlightenment ideology--secular ideology. Success came via the Virtue of Selfishness.

Nice! :applaud

I didnt expect the gloves to come off that eloquently...Busta...I think you are in for a real debate from here on. He just made a snap at the jugular.
 

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Re: perversion of homosexual marriage...

Busta said:
You don't mind if I worship you, do you? Just a little bit....Jesus will understand, er, I mien, forgive me.:cool:

thats fine, but I am her Pope. :cool:

And its cool, jesus can come to services too.
 

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Note* Jefferson's Declaration that all men are created equal. This is an Enlightenment concept derrived from Deism and Secular Humanism. During the Enlightenment, philosophers believed that man's reason was a unifying trait, and via this trait, all men were morally equal. Their "creator" gave them this "reason" by which they could live their own, independent lives from him.

Creator is used instead of God because they were not Christians, nor did they believe in any active God. Creator = Nature. Deists believed in a God of Nature. They were not Theists. In fact, myriad Founding Fathers decried organized religion, especially Christianity--these are including, but not limited to:

1. Thomas Jefferson
2. James Madison
3. Thomas Paine
4. Ben Franklin
5. John Adams


Further, regardless of what the Delcaration of Independence said, the DoI is not the Constitution. The Federal COnstitution is a strictly Secular Document based off of the "wall of separation" which is a term coined and intended to exist by Thomas Jefferson himself, so don't tell me it doesn't exist. It is also widely known through Jefferson's Writings that he did not gain his morality from his faith. If you read his personal letters, he states just the opposite. Furthermore, quotes from John Adams thoroughly show that the Founding Fathers had no intention of creation the United States on christian grounds.

Adams Quote: ohn Adams (the second President of the United States)

Adams signed the Treaty of Tripoli (June 7, 1797). Article 11 states:
“The government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”


From a letter to Charles Cushing (October 19, 1756):
“Twenty times in the course of my late reading, have I been upon the point of breaking out, ‘this would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it.’”


From a letter to Thomas Jefferson:
“I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved — the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!”


“...[the] Thirteen governments [of the original states] thus founded on the natural authority of the people alone, without a pretence of miracle or mystery, and which are destined to spread over the northern part of that whole quarter of the globe, are a great point gained in favor of the rights of mankind.”



Thomas Jefferson quotes:

[Befferson’s interpretation of the first amendment in a letter to the Danbury Baptist Association (January 1, 1802):
“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,’ thus building a wall of separation between church and State.” [/B]

Jefferson’s “The Statute of Virginia for Religious Freedom”:
“Our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions, more than on our opinions in physics and geometry....The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”


So don't bullshit me with your "Fathers got their ideas from their faith" rhetoric. I have delt with it before.
 

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Technocratic_Utilitarian said:
Note* Jefferson's Declaration that all men are created equal. This is an Enlightenment concept derrived from Deism and Secular Humanism. During the Enlightenment, philosophers believed that man's reason was a unifying trait, and via this trait, all men were morally equal. Their "creator" gave them this "reason" by which they could live their own, independent lives from him.

Creator is used instead of God because they were not Christians, nor did they believe in any active God. Creator = Nature. Deists believed in a God of Nature. They were not Theists. In fact, myriad Founding Fathers decried organized religion, especially Christianity--these are including, but not limited to:

1. Thomas Jefferson
2. James Madison
3. Thomas Paine
4. Ben Franklin
5. John Adams

Ha! Nice try but you're picking 5 people that had deist leanings and they are just a handful of people compared to the vast majority who signed the Declaration and Constitution, who happened to be Christian. You've failed to mentioned John Jay. Let's look at John Jay for a moment, the man who partially wrote the Federalist Papers. He was a Christian and was elected President of the Westchester Bible Society in 1818 and was President of the American Bible Society in 1821.

The one who was really the backbone of the Constitution, our government, and free enterprise system was overwhelmingly Alexander Hamilton, our first Secretary of Treasury. He was a Christian and was working towards founding the Christian Constitutional Society of America. His knowledge and understanding of quantitative subjects like finance and economics was far greater than Jefferson's or any of his contemporaries. John Adams failed to understand the concept of interest and how banks run. I'll admit though, Hamilton wasn't the best Christian in the world; he cheated on his wife and slacked off going to Church for a period of time. But he had proved to be a more more honest man than Thomas Jefferson and perhaps many of the other founding fathers. When Jefferson and others tried to unseat him from the Treasury, he was brutally honest about his affair with Maria Reynolds. In fact, he wrote a very long paper detailing every bit of his sexual affair. That certainly wasn't how Bill Clinton behaved in his similar predicament.

Further, regardless of what the Delcaration of Independence said, the DoI is not the Constitution. The Federal COnstitution is a strictly Secular Document based off of the "wall of separation" which is a term coined and intended to exist by Thomas Jefferson himself, so don't tell me it doesn't exist. It is also widely known through Jefferson's Writings that he did not gain his morality from his faith. If you read his personal letters, he states just the opposite. Furthermore, quotes from John Adams thoroughly show that the Founding Fathers had no intention of creation the United States on christian grounds.

Adams Quote: ohn Adams (the second President of the United States)

Adams signed the Treaty of Tripoli (June 7, 1797). Article 11 states:
“The government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”


From a letter to Charles Cushing (October 19, 1756):
“Twenty times in the course of my late reading, have I been upon the point of breaking out, ‘this would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it.’”


From a letter to Thomas Jefferson:
“I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved — the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!”


“...[the] Thirteen governments [of the original states] thus founded on the natural authority of the people alone, without a pretence of miracle or mystery, and which are destined to spread over the northern part of that whole quarter of the globe, are a great point gained in favor of the rights of mankind.”



Thomas Jefferson quotes:

[Befferson’s interpretation of the first amendment in a letter to the Danbury Baptist Association (January 1, 1802):
“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,’ thus building a wall of separation between church and State.” [/B]

Jefferson’s “The Statute of Virginia for Religious Freedom”:
“Our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions, more than on our opinions in physics and geometry....The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.”


So don't bullshit me with your "Fathers got their ideas from their faith" rhetoric. I have delt with it before.

You're claim that the founding fathers had no intention of creating a Christian America is fallicious because you've only cited two people as an example. Like I said, the man who contributed the most to our government was Alexander Hamilton. The Christian Constitutional Society that he had founded, it's purpose was to spread the Christian Faith and related moral issues around the nation. The only reason that never came to light was due to his unfortunate death at the hands of Aaron Burr.
 

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perversion of homosexual marriage...

jallman said:
In the meantime, get a new comment to parrot or STFU, bigot.
Moe proof of how hateful bigoted homosexuals are. LMFAO!
 

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Busta said:
Holey crap...1,015 posts!
Biggest thread I've ever seen.
And that's where we close 'em due to server issues. If someone wants to re-open another thread (*ahem* trainwreck *ahem*) feel free to go ahead and I'll place a link at the end of this one.
 
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