Forget Bathrooms - What About Locker Rooms?

[Dragonfly]

So lets say the who can use what bathroom thing get's resolved so that 99% of the population is happy. (Can't please 100% ever)

What about locker rooms? Places where, in many cases, complete nudity is in fact out in the open.
What about the shower situation?

Last locker rooms I was in had communal showers. No private stall. No separation curtains. Just big rooms with multiple shower heads sticking out of walls.
I haven't been in a "modern gym" or modern workout facility in ages so maybe it's different now. What's the locker room and shower situation like at a place like Planet Fitness or Crossfit type place?

Where does the tran-man go?
Where does the tran-girl go?

Does that become the next "battlefield"?

Now we're no longer talking about who is peeing/pooping in the stall next to you, now we're talking about who might be standing buck-naked right next to you in a shower.

How does this problem resolve itself?

How do you handle this for schools? Middle School and High School sports locker rooms?

Do we simply change the signs on the doors from "men" & "women", to "penis" and "vagina"?
Is that the simplest solution?

(cue the outrage from religious folks for the graphic needed to cover those signs):shock:

So what about it. This isn't about using the toilet. This is about changing and showering is group settings.

 

[Henrin]

It's already part of the battle. It's just harder for them to win, so they're focusing their attention on restrooms first.

There has also already been cases of protests and complaints filed due to transsexuals being allowed in locker rooms. Oh and yeah, it's something that has already affected some schools.

 

[David_N]

It really is going to turn into something that is blown out of proportion. I stand by with my popcorn.

 

[OrphanSlug]

This is getting absurd.

I have brought this up before, we are talking about suggestions and arguments for law that is not actively enforced. No matter if we are talking about someone using a bathroom or using a locker it would still come down to a complaint being made with some after the fact follow up by presumably law enforcement. No one is going to be standing outside of a bathroom or locker checking for someone's... equipment installed status... then telling them which room to go to.

This argument seems to be filled with unrealistic expectations on impact assuming more States pass these sort of laws on who pees where.

 

[Skeptic Bob]

The bathroom debate is just stupid because nobody sees anything anyway.

The locker room debate is actually one worth having. I think the rules should be left to the business establishment that owns the locker room. We can't always choose whether or not to use a public restroom. We usually have a choice when it comes to locker rooms.

 

[Dragonfly]

This is getting absurd.

I have brought this up before, we are talking about suggestions and arguments for law that is not actively enforced. No matter if we are talking about someone using a bathroom or using a locker it would still come down to a complaint being made with some after the fact follow up by presumably law enforcement. No one is going to be standing outside of a bathroom or locker checking for someone's... equipment installed status... then telling them which room to go to.

This argument seems to be filled with unrealistic expectations on impact assuming more States pass these sort of laws on who pees where.

I don't care who pee's/poops where.
The vast majority of public restrooms I've ever been in have stalls with doors on them. Meaning they are at least relatively private.
Most locker rooms are NOT private, which changes the scenario rather vividly.

 

[OrphanSlug]

I don't care who pee's/poops where.
The vast majority of public restrooms I've ever been in have stalls with doors on them. Meaning they are at least relatively private.
Most locker rooms are NOT private, which changes the scenario rather vividly.

Anyone (a State or City) proposing something that impacts locker rooms along these lines?

 

[Ntharotep]

I don't care who pee's/poops where.
The vast majority of public restrooms I've ever been in have stalls with doors on them. Meaning they are at least relatively private.
Most locker rooms are NOT private, which changes the scenario rather vividly.

Not sure "most" is accurate or how hard it would be to install a few curtains really.
When I was in HS this was indeed the case, just open showers with shower heads and no privacy.
I've been to camp grounds that are similar.
Most relatively modern facilities, however gyms pools and rec centers have stalls or curtains that can be drawn.

To me that is the simple answer. Install some curtains. It isn't a business closing expense and solves the issue rather easily.

Personally, I never wanted to look at other men when I was showering to begin with. But that's just me.

 

[Dragonfly]

Anyone (a State or City) proposing something that impacts locker rooms along these lines?

I have no idea. Sure seems like it might be on the horizon.

 

[Dragonfly]

Not sure "most" is accurate or how hard it would be to install a few curtains really.
When I was in HS this was indeed the case, just open showers with shower heads and no privacy.
I've been to camp grounds that are similar.
Most relatively modern facilities, however gyms pools and rec centers have stalls or curtains that can be drawn.

To me that is the simple answer. Install some curtains. It isn't a business closing expense and solves the issue rather easily.

Personally, I never wanted to look at other men when I was showering to begin with. But that's just me.

Like I said, I have no experience with modern facilities. I can easily foresee buildings being built with 3 restroom options in the future.

I know my youngest daughter worked as a lifeguard one summer in a large Club-Facility that was built about 10 years ago. Multiple indoor pools and gymnastics rooms and weights and all that stuff. She said the women's locker room was basically a nudist area. It was shocking for her as a 15 year old lifeguard to see so many middle-aged and older women walking around naked naked naked.

 

[Your Star]

OMG, you might see someone who doesn't fit the gender binary naked. :shock: Grab the torches people!!!

Give me a ****ing break.

 

[Ntharotep]

OMG, you might see someone who doesn't fit the gender binary naked. :shock: Grab the torches people!!!

Give me a ****ing break.

To be fair that is an adult outlook. A proper adult outlook granted.
If you are 9-16 then that outlook might be a bit different and have a different affect. Or it may not.
I still think the solution is simpler than revamping the locker rooms though. My opinion only.

 

[Chomsky]

So lets say the who can use what bathroom thing get's resolved so that 99% of the population is happy. (Can't please 100% ever)

What about locker rooms? Places where, in many cases, complete nudity is in fact out in the open.
What about the shower situation?

Last locker rooms I was in had communal showers. No private stall. No separation curtains. Just big rooms with multiple shower heads sticking out of walls.
I haven't been in a "modern gym" or modern workout facility in ages so maybe it's different now. What's the locker room and shower situation like at a place like Planet Fitness or Crossfit type place?

Where does the tran-man go?
Where does the tran-girl go?

Does that become the next "battlefield"?

Now we're no longer talking about who is peeing/pooping in the stall next to you, now we're talking about who might be standing buck-naked right next to you in a shower.

How does this problem resolve itself?

How do you handle this for schools? Middle School and High School sports locker rooms?

Do we simply change the signs on the doors from "men" & "women", to "penis" and "vagina"?
Is that the simplest solution?

(cue the outrage from religious folks for the graphic needed to cover those signs):shock:

So what about it. This isn't about using the toilet. This is about changing and showering is group settings.

I think this could easily be resolved by requiring sex-change operations and gender documentation changes to require one to be of be of legal age.

I feel this way in general, not just here specifically.

If a kid is considered to not be of legal age to consent to acts of a sexual nature, they sure aren't of legal age to change their sexual identity, physically or legally. Anything else they do would seem to be between them and their parents.

 

[Dragonfly]

I think this could easily be resolved by requiring sex-change operations and gender documentation changes to require one to be of be of legal age.

I feel this way in general, not just here specifically.

If a kid is considered to not be of legal age to consent to acts of a sexual nature, they sure aren't of legal age to change their sexual identity, physically or legally. Anything else they do would seem to be between them and their parents.

There are not children's locker rooms and adult locker rooms.

 

[Dragonfly]

OMG, you might see someone who doesn't fit the gender binary naked. :shock: Grab the torches people!!!

Give me a ****ing break.

You do realize for some people, it is a big deal.

 

[cabse5]

You do realize for some people, it is a big deal.

And it's like the argument we've been having on the bathroom discussion threads. Ideological VS. religious.

 

[LowDown]

Like I said, I have no experience with modern facilities. I can easily foresee buildings being built with 3 restroom options in the future.

I know my youngest daughter worked as a lifeguard one summer in a large Club-Facility that was built about 10 years ago. Multiple indoor pools and gymnastics rooms and weights and all that stuff. She said the women's locker room was basically a nudist area. It was shocking for her as a 15 year old lifeguard to see so many middle-aged and older women walking around naked naked naked.

What with the multiplication of genders (as silly as one may think that is) it seems like the only solution is to make everything unisex and single occupancy. Lockers could be managed by providing multiple private dressing/undressing rooms. Not stalls but rooms with a lockable door.

 

[Chomsky]

There are not children's locker rooms and adult locker rooms.

No, but my main concern is the elementary & H.S. locker rooms. I figure the adults, being big boys & girls, will figure it out on their own

 

[Dragonfly]

No, but my main concern is the elementary & H.S. locker rooms. I figure the adults, being big boys & girls, will figure it out on their own

I think you give many adults FAR too much credit.

 

[Chomsky]

I think you give many adults FAR too much credit.

Hey what can I say?

I'm a 'live and let live' guy!

I've always lived by the motto: "If it works for you, and doesn't bother me - good enough"!

 

[jet57]

So lets say the who can use what bathroom thing get's resolved so that 99% of the population is happy. (Can't please 100% ever)

What about locker rooms? Places where, in many cases, complete nudity is in fact out in the open.
What about the shower situation?

Last locker rooms I was in had communal showers. No private stall. No separation curtains. Just big rooms with multiple shower heads sticking out of walls.
I haven't been in a "modern gym" or modern workout facility in ages so maybe it's different now. What's the locker room and shower situation like at a place like Planet Fitness or Crossfit type place?

Where does the tran-man go?
Where does the tran-girl go?

Does that become the next "battlefield"?

Now we're no longer talking about who is peeing/pooping in the stall next to you, now we're talking about who might be standing buck-naked right next to you in a shower.

How does this problem resolve itself?

How do you handle this for schools? Middle School and High School sports locker rooms?

Do we simply change the signs on the doors from "men" & "women", to "penis" and "vagina"?
Is that the simplest solution?

(cue the outrage from religious folks for the graphic needed to cover those signs):shock:

So what about it. This isn't about using the toilet. This is about changing and showering is group settings.

Let a gay man "who identifies as a woman" into a women's locker room, and watch what happens.

 

[chromium]

The answer of course is that the transgender should be excluded from all walks of life. They clearly aren't miserable and hated enough

Yeah i found it strange as hell that the emergency session was to address bathrooms only, when locker rooms usually have far less privacy. I guess that's what happens when a bunch of mental 10 year olds rush through a 2 page law, just like they forgot to mention how to enforce it

I believe CC has mentioned several times that the solution he always recommends that always works is for a trans kid to use a unisex area separate from the others

Or everyone could just get the **** over it considering much of the rest of the world has two gender facilities

Or put up some privacy dividers. Just whatever else, stop with the national circus and let's at least pretend to solve real problems

 

[chromium]

No, but my main concern is the elementary & H.S. locker rooms. I figure the adults, being big boys & girls, will figure it out on their own

No one uses these any more except for sports teams. No one is forced into public nudity any more. Kids are far too obese and parents far too litigious for that to happen, even before any of this transgender witch hunt took off

 

[Dragonfly]

Let a gay man "who identifies as a woman" into a women's locker room, and watch what happens.

What do you think would happen? How would that play out?

 

[Dragonfly]

No one uses these any more except for sports teams. No one is forced into public nudity any more. Kids are far too obese and parents far too litigious for that to happen, even before any of this transgender witch hunt took off

No one uses what anymore? School locker rooms? Aren't kids required to take gym/phys ed in school? Change clothes and do something physical?

Hell, my kids had to take gym. They even had to do swimming for a semester. So you know, bathing suits require full nudity. Twice.