First known armed services religious exemptions to COVID vaccine granted

[ttwtt78640]

What? All one has to do is believe it's true to make it a valid claim? So does that mean the folks who believe trump is still president, makes him the president because they believe it to be true against the mountain of evidence that says no, he is not president?

That (bolded above) is what religion is - a firmly held personal belief. Are you trying to assert that the government (via it’s agent’s opinions?) may decide (establish?) which religious affiliations or professed religious beliefs are acceptable (valid?)? That seems to be precisely what (someone in?) the USMC is up to (according to the OP) - they have examined many (hundreds?) of religious exemption requests and (so far?) found two of them to be acceptable (valid?).

BTW, It is not necessary to bring a Trump reference into every thread.

 

[yankintx]

I know when I was standing in line at bootcamp with my sleeves pulled up and getting umpteen shots in the arms 1 or 2 at a time as I would step forward, that I didn't have any say in it at that point.

Nor did i

Lined us up like cattle, aah memories of Lackland

 

[bongsaway]

That (bolded above) is what religion is - a firmly held personal belief. Are you trying to assert that the government (via it’s agent’s opinions?) may decide (establish?) which religious affiliations or professed religious beliefs are acceptable (valid?)? That seems to be precisely what (someone in?) the USMC is up to (according to the OP) - they have examined many (hundreds?) of religious exemption requests and (so far?) found two of them to be acceptable (valid?).

BTW, It is not necessary to bring a Trump reference into every thread.

So how do these marines make killing ok in their heads but a vaccine is out of the question on religious grounds? I'm not positive but when I was growing up and being 'taught' about religion, one of the things written on those stone tablets was, thou shall not kill.

You're right it isn't necessary, but like rock and roll, I like it.

 

[ttwtt78640]

So how do these marines make killing ok in their heads but a vaccine is out of the question on religious grounds? I'm not positive but when I was growing up and being 'taught' about religion, one of the things written on those stone tablets was, thou shall not kill.

You're right it isn't necessary, but like rock and roll, I like it.

They work for the defense department and killing attackers is not forbidden.

 

[jamesrage]

So how do these marines make killing ok in their heads but a vaccine is out of the question on religious grounds? I'm not positive but when I was growing up and being 'taught' about religion, one of the things written on those stone tablets was, thou shall not kill.

You're right it isn't necessary, but like rock and roll, I like it.

That is a mis-translation. It is thou shalt not murder. Not thou shalt not kill. Murder and killing a not synonymous words. Murder is basically the unlawful killing of another human being. Anyone who has actually read or studied the bible knows that. Especially when you consider the fact the Israelites did a lot of killing to claim the land from the Canaanites.

 

[RabidAlpaca]

They work for the defense department and killing attackers is not forbidden.

Lol, yes, because historically marines have been used for defense. /s Offensive assault is their whole thing. These people are just liars.

 

[bongsaway]

They work for the defense department and killing attackers is not forbidden.

Their religious beliefs work for the defense department? Somehow these marines have convinced themselves killing is ok but getting the covid vaccine is against their religion? Who is attacking america that the marines are fighting?

 

[bongsaway]

That is a mis-translation. It is thou shalt not murder. Not thou shalt not kill. Murder and killing a not synonymous words. Murder is basically the unlawful killing of another human being. Anyone who has actually read or studied the bible knows that. Especially when you consider the fact the Israelites did a lot of killing to claim the land from the Canaanites.

Ten Commandments

• I am the LORD thy God.
• No other gods before me.
• No graven images or likenesses.
• Not take the LORD's name in vain.
• Remember the sabbath day.
• Honour thy father and thy mother.
• Thou shalt not kill.
• Thou shalt not commit adultery.

 

[Bum]

Wow.....folks, take a deep breath!

We still do not know what religion it was granted under, but everyone seems assume automatically it was Christianity?
I'm not saying it isnt, but no one knows for sure, so why the strident hostility here?

Everyone have a Coke and a smile.

 

[jamesrage]

Ten Commandments

• I am the LORD thy God.
• No other gods before me.
• No graven images or likenesses.
• Not take the LORD's name in vain.
• Remember the sabbath day.
• Honour thy father and thy mother.
• Thou shalt not kill.
• Thou shalt not commit adultery.

Again its a mis-translation in the King James bible. Anyone who has actually read the bible understands this.Jesus in Mathew 19:18 says murder, not kill in the King James version.

"Thou shalt not kill": some legal and linguistic problems - PubMed

Large plaques of the religious precepts generally known as the Ten Commandments were recently placed in official public spaces in several states. This practice has been successfully challenged in federal courts of appeals, and the challenge was upheld by the Supreme Court in April 2003. Yet...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Thou shalt not kill" is actually a mistranslation of the Hebrew, "You shall not murder. The two statements are not synonymous,

The commandment that 'Thou shalt not kill' refers to murder

www.chicagotribune.com

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

The Marine Corps has approved two requests to service members who are refusing the COVID-19 vaccine on religious grounds, marking what are believed to be the first known religious exemptions granted across all the armed services — out of thousands of requests.
The Pentagon has maintained the services would consider religious grounds for refusing the mandatory COVID-19 vaccine lawful order, but until now, no requests are known to have been granted. The majority of service members are fully vaccinated, but some are still seeking exemptions.

Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin mandated the COVID-19 vaccine in September but allowed the services to come up with their own implementation deadlines and plans to process exemption requests.

First known armed services religious exemptions to COVID vaccine granted

The article does not specify which religions it granted the exemptions for.

That sort of takes the steam out of the "The military is completely denying its members their religious freedom to refuse vaccinations." position, doesn't it.

What the "Change of Station" orders for those two will read as I simply don't want to guess at specifically, but I would hazard a guess that the orders are likely to place the two Marines somewhere that they have next to no contact with other human beings.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

I have read that some are using the excuse that aborted fetal cells were used (somehow) in the development of the vaccine. Whether that is true and whether that upsets their god is debatable, but if one professes to believe that to be true and against their god’s wishes it would appear to be a valid religious objection.

There is no biblical prohibition against using "aborted fetal cells" for anything.

Probably that is because the people who wrote "The Bible" didn't know that there was any such thing as "fetal cells" (or even "cells" for that matter).

God sure slipped up on that one, didn't She?

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Yes, apparently fetal cells lines from 70's & 80's were used in the development of the vaccines. Just as is done with many other vaccines. But, there's no fetal material used in the manufacturing process. They were only used as part of the R & D effort.

BTW - The Holy See has signed-off on the vaccines, so Catholics can't get a CO on it. But, maybe some other denomination may?

As I recall it, the "life span" of a "fetal cell" is approximately 30 days and then it divides into two cells.

Let's take 1980 as the middle of the "70's & 80's" period. Than makes around 510 "life spans" and since each generation is only 50% of the previous one, that means that a current "fetal cell material" cell is around 2.9833362924800826973163861261852e-154 of the original "fetal cell".

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Again its a mis-translation in the King James bible.

It's also only eight.

Anyone who has actually read the bible understands this.Jesus in Mathew 19:18 says murder, not kill in the King James version.

"Real True Believers" don't have to read The Bible because their preachers will tell them what is in it. Considering the functional literacy level in the United States of America, it is probable that more than half of those "Real True Believers" actually can NOT "read The Bible" and have to have someone tell them what is in it.

"Thou shalt not kill": some legal and linguistic problems - PubMed

Large plaques of the religious precepts generally known as the Ten Commandments were recently placed in official public spaces in several states. This practice has been successfully challenged in federal courts of appeals, and the challenge was upheld by the Supreme Court in April 2003. Yet...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Thou shalt not kill" is actually a mistranslation of the Hebrew, "You shall not murder. The two statements are not synonymous,

The commandment that 'Thou shalt not kill' refers to murder

www.chicagotribune.com

Picky, picky, picky.

The leaders of "The _[fill in the blank] Church INC." have a lengthy history of telling people that "The Bible means" whatever they feel like telling them it does - REGARDLESS of what they told them "The Bible means" the previous day.

 

[roguenuke]

I have read that some are using the excuse that aborted fetal cells were used (somehow) in the development of the vaccine. Whether that is true and whether that upsets their god is debatable, but if one professes to believe that to be true and against their god’s wishes it would appear to be a valid religious objection.

Except that there is a legitimate reason to revoke/deny all religious exemptions, not to give any, and that is force readiness. There should not be any given, at all.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Why?

It affects combat readiness.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Just as long as killing in the name of corporate profit is OK with their religion I guess.....

 

[ttwtt78640]

Except that there is a legitimate reason to revoke/deny all religious exemptions, not to give any, and that is force readiness. There should not be any given, at all.

I‘ve never been a fan of anyone being able to say that they are personally exempt from X law, rule or regulation because their chosen sky daddy wills it to be so.

 

[Manc Skipper]

Assuming its a Christian religion; still waiting to hear what belief the exemption was granted under.

I presume it's about a fetal cell line (first developed decades ago) which are used to test ALL drugs today. If that's their case, then a whole raft of commonly used medicines developed since the 1960's is now barred to them!
If they can't bear to take a vaccine that was tested using old fetal tissue cells grown in vats, then they can't have any modern antibiotics, painkillers, Viagra, you name it!

You asked, we answered: Do the COVID-19 vaccines contain aborted fetal cells?

Do the COVID-19 vaccines contain aborted fetal cells?

www.nebraskamed.com

 

[jamesrage]

It's also only eight.

"Real True Believers" don't have to read The Bible because their preachers will tell them what is in it. Considering the functional literacy level in the United States of America, it is probable that more than half of those "Real True Believers" actually can NOT "read The Bible" and have to have someone tell them what is in it.

Picky, picky, picky.

The leaders of "The _[fill in the blank] Church INC." have a lengthy history of telling people that "The Bible means" whatever they feel like telling them it does - REGARDLESS of what they told them "The Bible means" the previous day.

I would think that

It's also only eight.

"Real True Believers" don't have to read The Bible because their preachers will tell them what is in it. Considering the functional literacy level in the United States of America, it is probable that more than half of those "Real True Believers" actually can NOT "read The Bible" and have to have someone tell them what is in it.

Picky, picky, picky.

The leaders of "The _[fill in the blank] Church INC." have a lengthy history of telling people that "The Bible means" whatever they feel like telling them it does - REGARDLESS of what they told them "The Bible means" the previous day.

"Real true believers" should have heard enough of the stories from the bible growing up to know that that thou shalt not kill really means thou shalt not murder. Especially the stories concerning the Israelites taking the land from the Canaanites and other undesirables after leaving Egypt .

 

[Common Sense 1]

Some seem so very upset because two marines received exemptions.
Raging over this.......
Coffee time! Take a chill!

 

[coyote505]

Hospitals are so full of covidiots that people who need lifesaving care can't get it. If you choose to go all Christian Science when it comes to vaccines, then have the courage of your convictions when you get Covid. Stay Home!

 

[Lursa]

IMO if the head of a religion says it's ok to get vaxxed, then people in that religion dont get an exemption. Period.

God never says it's wrong and if you commit to a religion, then you should follow what the leader says is ok.

 

[roguenuke]

I‘ve never been a fan of anyone being able to say that they are personally exempt from X law, rule or regulation because their chosen sky daddy wills it to be so.

I can see giving consideration for such exemptions as long as they aren't limited to religion and are inconsequential to anything (I'd rather just see those rules change that aren't needed, but that's harder to do than getting exemptions like this). So if someone wants to wear a yarmulke in uniform while simply on base and it isn't going to hurt anyone, be a hazard or paint them as a target in hostile country, then it should be allowed. If no one is put in danger from it, then so be it.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

I would think that

"Real true believers" should have heard enough of the stories from the bible growing up to know that that thou shalt not kill really means thou shalt not murder.

"Murder" of course, being defined as whatever the leaders of "The _[fill in the blank]_ Church INC." feel like defining it as.

Especially the stories concerning the Israelites taking the land from the Canaanites and other undesirables after leaving Egypt .

Please do not mention the fact that the Hebrews committed genocide, rape, plunder, and waged aggressive war. Doing anything that even hints that the Hebrews committed genocide, rape, plunder, and waged aggressive war constitutes "antisemitism".