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Federal Air Marshal fires weapon on a plane

aps

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A passenger was shot and has died from his injuries.
 

shuamort

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Deegan

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The gentleman was mentally ill, and had been off his medicine. His wife shouted this to the FAM's, but I suppose they felt the situation warranted this shoot to kill action.
 

FinnMacCool

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Well that **** happens I guess. They probably didn't know what he could've had in his bag and they were afraid. Firing a weapon a plane is kinda dangerous though.
 

aps

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shuamort said:
That'll teach him for not bringing his seat and tray table to a complete upright position.

Seriously, who would claim they have a bomb in their carry-on, then run away from agents and then attempt to reach in the bag while running away?
I know I shouldn't be laughing about this, but that is just hysterical, shuamort. Priceless!

He was mentally ill? Wow.
 

scottyz

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It sounds like a case of suicide by cop. He was mentally ill and off his meds from what i've read.
 

debate_junkie

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scottyz said:
It sounds like a case of suicide by cop. He was mentally ill and off his meds from what i've read.
And screaming he had a bomb in his bag. Then, when the marshalls had him cornered, he reached inside the same bag he said contained a bomb, and they fired. I'm guessing this is the first nationally known use of deadly force by the FAMs, but I have to ask, if his wife knew he was off his medication, what was she and the rest of his family doing? Vacationing instead of stablizing an unhealthy mind?
 

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FinnMacCool said:
Well that **** happens I guess. They probably didn't know what he could've had in his bag and they were afraid. Firing a weapon a plane is kinda dangerous though.
They weren't on the plane when the weapon was discharged. They were in the jetway, as the man was attempting to get off the plane and into the airport. Imagine if he'd made it inside, and DID have a bomb? What would we be talking about then?
 

shinigami_axel

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The security was probably aiming to incapacitate him or something along the lines. I've never heard of a cop actually firing a deadly blow when they intended to....
[joke over]

I feel sorry for the guy but really his death could be used to show how security is working now. It might give people more confidence, but it will probably just scare them.
 

cnredd

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shuamort said:
Seriously, who would claim they have a bomb in their carry-on, then run away from agents and then attempt to reach in the bag while running away?
I'm guessing "No one twice"...
 

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I'm unsure of the nature of the man's mental stability, but one thing that's comforting is that the FAM's are on the job, and aren't afraid to use deadly force if necessary. If this had been an actual terrorist there'd be a great deal more praise for these brave people who play a major role in ensuring safety on airliners.

To the woman who lost her husband I certainly will say a prayer for her, and I'm sorry for her loss, but I hope she understands that the FAMs were only doing their job.
 

cnredd

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JustMyPOV said:
I'm unsure of the nature of the man's mental stability, but one thing that's comforting is that the FAM's are on the job, and aren't afraid to use deadly force if necessary. If this had been an actual terrorist there'd be a great deal more praise for these brave people who play a major role in ensuring safety on airliners.

To the woman who lost her husband I certainly will say a prayer for her, and I'm sorry for her loss, but I hope she understands that the FAMs were only doing their job.
:yt

Here, here...

3 Hail Mary's go out to the family....(pause, because I just said them)...but the procedures in place are to ensure the safety of the people; not the individual...

When someone goes off like that, there are no guarantees...The safety of the passengers becomes the highest priority...

I'm sure the Marshalls will not sleep well tonight...They took someone's life...

But they should seek comfort in the fact that any action otherwise may have resulted in far worse...

There are no winners...:(
 

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JustMyPOV said:
I'm unsure of the nature of the man's mental stability, but one thing that's comforting is that the FAM's are on the job, and aren't afraid to use deadly force if necessary. If this had been an actual terrorist there'd be a great deal more praise for these brave people who play a major role in ensuring safety on airliners.

To the woman who lost her husband I certainly will say a prayer for her, and I'm sorry for her loss, but I hope she understands that the FAMs were only doing their job.
I agree completely. It's an unfortunate situation, but the FAM's certainly did their job and that is encouraging.
 
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Liberal pundit, Alan Colmes, was already making this story a partisan issue on his radio show last night. He made the argument that the air marshall was trigger happy and killed unnecessarily. If, however, the marshall didn't shoot the man and the guy had detonated the bomb (which he insisted he had), Alan would have insisted that airport security hasn't changed since 911 and that the administration is failing. These guys are so transparant.
 

steen

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Liberals like me don't agree. In this post-9/11 time, if somebody acts really weird on a plane and makes what even sounds like threats, then they frankly run a big chance of dying. THAT is reality. If not death by airmarshal, then death by other passengers. If you can not fly under these conditions, you frankly should stay off the plane. That is the reality.
 
T

The Real McCoy

FinnMacCool said:
Firing a weapon a plane is kinda dangerous though.
The Air Marshalls use a different kind of ammunition, bullets that don't penetrate the fuselage.
 
T

The Real McCoy

KCConservative said:
Liberal pundit, Alan Colmes, was already making this story a partisan issue on his radio show last night. He made the argument that the air marshall was trigger happy and killed unnecessarily. If, however, the marshall didn't shoot the man and the guy had detonated the bomb (which he insisted he had), Alan would have insisted that airport security hasn't changed since 911 and that the administration is failing. These guys are so transparant.
Sadly, everything is becoming a partisan issue. Pretty soon a man will buy a television set and a right winger will shout "It doesn't have a V-Chip!" while some lefty will call him "Capitalist pig!"
 

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Passengers: Alpizar Didn't Say 'Bomb'

Some passengers are claiming the guy never said bomb.
One passenger said he "absolutely never heard the word 'bomb' at all" during the uproar as the Orlando-bound flight prepared to leave Miami on Wednesday.
Some passengers, including John McAlhany, said they believe Alpizar was no threat to anyone.

McAlhany, a 44-year-old construction worker who was returning home from a fishing trip in Key West, said he was sitting in Seat 21C when he noticed a commotion a few rows back.

"I heard him saying to his wife, 'I've got to get off the plane,'" McAlhany said. "He bumped me, bumped a couple of stewardesses. He just wanted to get off the plane."

Alpizar ran up the aisle into the first-class cabin, where marshals chased him onto the jetway, McAlhany said.

McAlhany said he "absolutely never heard the word 'bomb' at all."

"The first time I heard the word 'bomb' was when I was interviewed by the
FBI," McAlhany said. "They kept asking if I heard him say the B-word. And I said, 'What is the B-word?' And they were like, 'Bomb.' I said no. They said, 'Are you sure?' And I am."

Added another passenger, Mary Gardner: "I did not hear him say that he had a bomb."
Witnesses said Alpizar's wife, Anne Buechner, had frantically tried to explain he was bipolar, a mental illness also known as manic-depression, and was off his medication.

The National Alliance on Mental Illness called on the Air Marshal Service and other law enforcement agencies to train officers if they don't already in responding to people with severe mental illness.

Others said Alpizar's mental health didn't matter while marshals were trying to talk to him and determine if the threat was real.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051209/ap_on_re_us/airplane_shooting_62;_ylt=AvH.LEOFMUojEda0c4b_A0HbdQQB;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

Perhaps it could have been handled better, but I still think the FAM reacted the way he should have. I wonder why that man wasn't on his meds.
 

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KCConservative said:
Liberal pundit, Alan Colmes, was already making this story a partisan issue on his radio show last night. He made the argument that the air marshall was trigger happy and killed unnecessarily.
His opinion. What makes that statement Liberal or Conservative?


KCConservative said:
If, however, the marshall didn't shoot the man and the guy had detonated the bomb (which he insisted he had), Alan would have insisted that airport security hasn't changed since 911 and that the administration is failing. These guys are so transparant.
Your speculation. It seems as though your the one trying to make this a partisan issue.


On the record, if the report is correct, I think the Marshalls had no other option.
 
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BWG said:
His opinion. What makes that statement Liberal or Conservative?




Your speculation. It seems as though your the one trying to make this a partisan issue.


On the record, if the report is correct, I think the Marshalls had no other option.
I see. So Colmes gets to state his opinion but you take issue with me stating mine. Got it. :roll:
 

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I must say, I too had a big problem with the actions of these men.

First, the bags had gone through screening, and no bomb was detected.

Second, the man ran out of the plane, had he wanted to hurt others, why run out of the plane?

Third, his wife screamed that he was mentally unstable, and was off his medicine.

Finally, why did they not just shoot him in his arm or upper chest, this would have thrown him off the bag?

I have some questions, and I am a conservative.
 

LaMidRighter

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cnredd said:
I'm guessing "No one twice"...
:2funny: Brevity is the soul of wit my friend.
 
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There's a reason we don't yell Fire in a crowded theatre and there's a reason we don't yell Bomb on an airplane. The air marshall did his job. I can hear the critics now, if the marshall hadn't shot him and the guy actually detonated a bomb. Think people.
 

Deegan

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KCConservative said:
There's a reason we don't yell Fire in a crowded theatre and there's a reason we don't yell Bomb on an airplane. The air marshall did his job. I can hear the critics now, if the marshall hadn't shot him and the guy actually detonated a bomb. Think people.

It's o.k to ask questions James, we don't want anymore innocent people killed, do we?:confused:
 
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