Fact Check: Trump's State Of The Union Address

[Fletch]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am so sick to death of abortion being a political issue. And I have been for decades.

Plus there is a lot of irony that a man who was vocally pro-choice for his entire life, including partial birth abortion, is pretending to care about the issue today. It's a political wedge. I'm so tired of hearing about it.

Anyway, I loved how the Sheriff of El Paso fact checked him, and showed what a liar Trump is. Yes, all Presidents lie, deceive, stretch the truth, whatever. Not to the degree this guy does.

One other thing that struck me is he has a bad tendency to come across as if he is reading someone else's words (he is, but they all do/did), and doesn't really believe a word he's saying. Reagan, as he was delivering the words written by someone else, made them his own. He believed in what he said. Trump doesn't, for the most part.

That said, he did what he had to do last night, but I'm sure he'll manage to screw up whatever good he did himself with his usual idiotic barrage of Tweets over the next few days.

And he needs to stop the Nixonesque pissing about partisan investigations. He doesn't do himself any good when he goes there.

That post contained the first spark of reason I have seen in a post of yours in almost 3 years. Heres hoping that that spark becomes a flame and the the poster formerly known as tres borrachos awakens from her TDS coma and returns to her former brilliant self. :cheers:

 

[Fletch]

:bs

Not a liberal. I was actually registered Rep. until Trump.

Trump did not win the election based on any of his merits or actual qualifications. He won because he's better at lying through his teeth. Make lots of noise, repeat things until they become true, deny or minimize when the "truth" is no longer convenient. The man flip flops so much that no one can possibly know what he's for or against. He's a disgrace to the office that he occupies.

Fine. Liberals and even some non-liberals could live a thousand years and still never understand why Trump won. Whats really going to be funny is when he does it again.

 

[Incredulous]

Fine. Liberals and even some non-liberals could live a thousand years and still never understand why Trump won. Whats really going to be funny is when he does it again.

Well, you've been known to be wrong before - per your signature - so I'm going to take that opinion with a grain of salt. :lamo

 

[Manc Skipper]

And yet, he beat "Queen Hilary".
That must really anger you...

He was stolen the win by Putin.

 

[CaughtInThe]

Okay. Have it your way.

Be that guy my sig is talking about.

I don't see Sigs but it must say "Don't let Republican Media con you".

 

[Fletch]

He was stolen the win by Putin.

I believe the Collusion Truther CT sub forum is under construction by the Trump Group and is currently taking design input from future residents...

 

[upsideguy]

I simply cannot believe this lying piece of gutter trash is president.

He's simply an inveterate liar. Everything he says is false. It'a amazing.

I hate him and anyone who supports him. You are all diseased animals.

"....I'm sure some of them are good people...."

 

[EMNofSeattle]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am so sick to death of abortion being a political issue. And I have been for decades.

Plus there is a lot of irony that a man who was vocally pro-choice for his entire life, including partial birth abortion, is pretending to care about the issue today. It's a political wedge. I'm so tired of hearing about it.

Anyway, I loved how the Sheriff of El Paso fact checked him, and showed what a liar Trump is. Yes, all Presidents lie, deceive, stretch the truth, whatever. Not to the degree this guy does.

One other thing that struck me is he has a bad tendency to come across as if he is reading someone else's words (he is, but they all do/did), and doesn't really believe a word he's saying. Reagan, as he was delivering the words written by someone else, made them his own. He believed in what he said. Trump doesn't, for the most part.

That said, he did what he had to do last night, but I'm sure he'll manage to screw up whatever good he did himself with his usual idiotic barrage of Tweets over the next few days.

And he needs to stop the Nixonesque pissing about partisan investigations. He doesn't do himself any good when he goes there.

When the left decides to stop killing babies and that killing babies is not a “woman’s right” it can stop being an issue. I don’t care that Trump used to support it. He’s on the right side now.

It is very sad that ending human life for selfish desires is a wedge issue, but I did not choose that and if it is to be a wedge issue I will happily accept I’m not on the selfish killing side of the wedge and I do not desire it to go away

 

[Xelor]

'fact checking' that starts with complaining that the President didn't "congratulating the opposition party for its electoral success", isn't my idea of fact checking. Already starting as a hit piece, didn't finish reading it.

Blue:
That your "idea of fact checking" doesn't comport with the content in the NPR article reflects insouciance toward context. The truth and accuracy of assertions and observations depends every bit as much on literal "name, date, place, quantity, color, etc." accuracy as it does on the qualities such as intent, situation, discussion topic, etc. that combine to imbue contextual accuracy.

In the realm of political analysis and editorializing, there's no dearth of commentators and observers who either disregard or contort facts, I dare say a great many more do so re: a matter's context. While one cannot stop such from omitting contextual elements from their consideration, one can be an erudite enough consumer of commentary to know when they've done so and, in turn, not take them seriously, or if/when they're found to have often so done, deem them dissemblers, distrust and disregard them.

What that? Because it's, quite frankly, not that hard to simply discover and subsequently tell the "truth, whole truth and nothing but the truth," especially when discussing public policy and politics.


Red:
Well, that is what it is, but in doing so, you missed the part of the OP that is basic fact-check content.

 

[Media_Truth]

Those (bolded above) words allowed for quite a bit of wiggle room which is why the bill (essentially just removing the existing requirements that the life or health of the "mother" must be in jeopardy according to multiple doctors) failed to pass. The bottom line was that some wanted to relax the requirements allowing for a single doctor to agree to the wishes of the "mother" to terminate a pregnancy at any point (even after delivery?) with no need to show that a danger to the life or health of the "mother" exists.

Please provide a link. The Trump lies point out that there are so may untruths on this matter that I would want to see backup for your assertions.

 

[Media_Truth]

I will never underestimate Rush and Hannity. They may be liars but they've mastered their craft of manipulation. They kind of remind me of David Koresh.

It's incredible. You are correct about NOT underestimating their radical notions. There are people that listen to them and hang on every word, like it's some deep spiritual philosophical truth!

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Less than half the nation, when you consider numbers.

Let's look at real issues here:

70% of Americans support Medicare for all.
over 60% of Americans support higher taxes on the wealthy.

In fact, an overwhelming majority of americans support Bernie Sanders' economic policies.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/191504/majority-support-idea-fed-funded-healthcare-system.aspx
https://www.kff.org/global-health-p...-alternative-or-creating-a-single-payer-plan/
https://www.kff.org/medicaid/poll-finding/medicare-and-medicaid-at-50/
5 facts on how Americans view taxes | Pew Research Center
https://news.gallup.com/poll/190775/americans-say-upper-income-pay-little-taxes.aspx

Now. I agree, consensus does not equal correctness, but at the end of the day, we as a nation need to be honest about the economic system we have.

1. Rich folks own the land, and thus the power.
2. Rich folks own the businesses, and thus the power of employment.
3. Rich folks own the stock market, and thus, leverage the power of the retirement system via crashes and booms.

The rich used to be taxed much higher. Yes, they had some write offs, but that's not the point. The rich have, as the owners of production, DESPITE being taxed lower, consolidated power by removing employee ownership; consolidated wealth by removing profit sharing, and consolidated political clout by mucking with campaign finance laws.

We need to be real about these issues and not just use soundbytes like "lower taxes create jobs!" to sell public policy. A job is useless if it doesn't pay the bills.

Over all, americans, the majority, do not agree with the republican agenda. If for some reasons the city dwellers all left for the country, and spilled into red state america, what do you think would happen?

They support those things when liberal pollsters ask those questions devoid of what the consequences of a “yes” would be.

 

[CaughtInThe]

It's incredible. You are correct about NOT underestimating their radical notions. There are people that listen to them and hang on every word, like it's some deep spiritual philosophical truth!

I'm mainly blame Rush Limbaugh. He was the young punk who came along and figured out how to make a killing off of the gullibles. The rest of them just copied his business model.

But it had to happen. A bunch of the kids of the greatest generation were spoiled and looking for get rich quick schemes. Rush and Hannity found it.

 

[Media_Truth]

Trump's best economic results for the first two years of any Presidency!! Fact check that?

I notice how Trump said nothing about the skyrocketing deficit. Unfortunately, the presiding president gets to pick the topics for the State of the Union address. Obama used to talk about Climate Change, and US accomplishments in renewable energy. None of that talk here.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Please provide a link. The Trump lies point out that there are so may untruths on this matter that I would want to see backup for your assertions.

That (bolded above) is a very reasonable request. You will note, in the following link to the bill's text, that it is simply the existing Virginia abortion law with much of it removed by strikeouts.

Bill Tracking - 2019 session > Legislation

 

[Conservative]

I notice how Trump said nothing about the skyrocketing deficit. Unfortunately, the presiding president gets to pick the topics for the State of the Union address. Obama used to talk about Climate Change, and US accomplishments in renewable energy. None of that talk here.

And I have noticed that you never back up your claims that the rising deficit is the result of Trump spending. Climate change??? OMG, an economic disaster in waiting with the leftwing programs. Would have thought you learned something from Solyndra but apparently that is beyond your ability to understand or address

 

[tres borrachos]

When the left decides to stop killing babies and that killing babies is not a “woman’s right” it can stop being an issue. I don’t care that Trump used to support it. He’s on the right side now.

It is very sad that ending human life for selfish desires is a wedge issue, but I did not choose that and if it is to be a wedge issue I will happily accept I’m not on the selfish killing side of the wedge and I do not desire it to go away

The good news is you have an entire forum to debate abortion.

My post was about abortion being a political issue and discussed at the State of the Union.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

The good news is you have an entire forum to debate abortion.

My post was about abortion being a political issue and discussed at the State of the Union.

And it’s dumb because you know exactly why it’s an issue and why your position that it shouldn’t be is a non starter.

You are free to start threads in the abortion forum if you wish however.

 

[Media_Truth]

That (bolded above) is a very reasonable request. You will note, in the following link to the bill's text, that it is simply the existing Virginia abortion law with much of it removed by strikeouts.

Bill Tracking - 2019 session > Legislation

Thank you for providing that. First, it must be stated that abortion is LEGAL in this country. Before taking office, our politicians swear on a Bible that they will uphold the laws of this country.

Now the details - they struck out a 2nd Trimester requirement of abortion procedures being performed in a hospital. Many surgeries are now being performed in clinics, as an outpatient service. I had a vasectomy as outpatient over 20 years ago. It does tend to maintain lower medical costs.

Most of the changes to the bill involved Third Trimester abortions. Everything was deleted except the following:

Before performing any abortion or inducing any miscarriage or terminating a pregnancy as provided in § 18.2-72, 18.2-73, or 18.2-74, the physician shall obtain the informed written consent of the pregnant woman. However, if the woman has been adjudicated incapacitated by any court of competent jurisdiction or if the physician knows or has good reason to believe that such woman is incapacitated as adjudicated by a court of competent jurisdiction, then only after permission is given in writing by a parent, guardian, committee, or other person standing in loco parentis to the woman, may the physician perform the abortion or otherwise terminate the pregnancy.

I am not a fan of 3rd Trimester abortions, except to save the mother's life. There is still a requirement of the physician obtaining permission. At this point, I go back to my original paragraph. Abortion is legal in this country, and politicians swear to uphold our laws. Taking out the remainder of the text (2 physician requirement, etc) is adherent to the legality of abortion. The mother and/or family can make this decision, with their (single) physician. Roe vs Wade does not differentiate between Trimesters.

 

[Media_Truth]

And I have noticed that you never back up your claims that the rising deficit is the result of Trump spending. Climate change??? OMG, an economic disaster in waiting with the leftwing programs. Would have thought you learned something from Solyndra but apparently that is beyond your ability to understand or address

Yes, we all know that you like to ignore Republican deficits. One need only look at the years of deficit growth to see where the problem is. But you prefer to deflect.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Thank you for providing that. First, it must be stated that abortion is LEGAL in this country. Before taking office, our politicians swear on a Bible that they will uphold the laws of this country.

Now the details - they struck out a 2nd Trimester requirement of abortion procedures being performed in a hospital. Many surgeries are now being performed in clinics, as an outpatient service. I had a vasectomy as outpatient over 20 years ago. It does tend to maintain lower medical costs.

Most of the changes to the bill involved Third Trimester abortions. Everything was deleted except the following:

Before performing any abortion or inducing any miscarriage or terminating a pregnancy as provided in § 18.2-72, 18.2-73, or 18.2-74, the physician shall obtain the informed written consent of the pregnant woman. However, if the woman has been adjudicated incapacitated by any court of competent jurisdiction or if the physician knows or has good reason to believe that such woman is incapacitated as adjudicated by a court of competent jurisdiction, then only after permission is given in writing by a parent, guardian, committee, or other person standing in loco parentis to the woman, may the physician perform the abortion or otherwise terminate the pregnancy.

I am not a fan of 3rd Trimester abortions, except to save the mother's life. There is still a requirement of the physician obtaining permission. At this point, I go back to my original paragraph. Abortion is legal in this country, and politicians swear to uphold our laws. Taking out the remainder of the text (2 physician requirement, etc) is adherent to the legality of abortion. The mother and/or family can make this decision, with their (single) physician. Roe vs Wade does not differentiate between Trimesters.

Asking that the doctor have the woman's consent is simply abortion on demand. What was dropped was any need for the doctor to verify (attest to?) a medical need (necessity?) for performing the abortion.

 

[Media_Truth]

And I have noticed that you never back up your claims that the rising deficit is the result of Trump spending. Climate change??? OMG, an economic disaster in waiting with the leftwing programs. Would have thought you learned something from Solyndra but apparently that is beyond your ability to understand or address

Oh, and before you even start responding with Obama's debt, I'll answer. Bush executed the worst presidential pass-on since the Great Depression. After two years of high deficits, Obama reduced the deficit very nicely. See graph.

 

[Conservative]

Oh, and before you even start responding with Obama's debt, I'll answer. Bush executed the worst presidential pass-on since the Great Depression. After two years of high deficits, Obama reduced the deficit very nicely. See graph.

Yep, TARP wasn't passed and signed which recapitalized the banks so how is that a bad hand off? Your partisanship and ignorance of the data is becoming legendary

 

[Media_Truth]

Asking that the doctor have the woman's consent is simply abortion on demand. What was dropped was any need for the doctor to verify (attest to?) a medical need (necessity?) for performing the abortion.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but per Roe vs Wade, the woman does have this right; and our politicians swear to uphold these rights.

 

[Conservative]

Yes, we all know that you like to ignore Republican deficits. One need only look at the years of deficit growth to see where the problem is. But you prefer to deflect.

View attachment 67249830

Last time I checked congress was made up of Democrats and Republicans and that is where the legislation begins and the spending is authorized. Maybe a civics class would help you and keep you from making dumb statements.