Example of Socialism in the United States

[Bucky]

Living in Seattle I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism. Seattle somehow elected a socialist on the Seattle City Council. We are talking a true socialist who belongs in the Socialist Alternative, a Trotskyist political party. I wish I was making this up but it is true. She's an economics professor. Seriously.

Here are some of her radical ideas:

On climate change:

KSHAMA SAWANT: Well, we’re here mainly because this is an absolutely historic weekend for the budding movement against climate change. And the fact that hundreds of thousands of people are here marching together in solidarity shows that they are more than ready for collective action. And what we were talking about last night was that this collective action needs to be channeled into a really radical, militant, nonviolent mass movement that will raise concrete political demands.

Socialist Seattle Politician Kshama Sawant: We Need a Radical Militant Nonviolent Climate Movement | Democracy Now!

Changing Columbus Day:

This year's Columbus Day holiday will have a slightly different, more Native flavor in the city of Seattle. Thanks to a unanimous vote this summer by the city council, the federal holiday will now be known by a different name: Indigenous Peoples' Day.

"This is about taking a stand against racism and discrimination," Seattle City Council member Kshama Sawant told the Seattle Times. "Learning about the history of Columbus and transforming this day into a celebration of indigenous people and a celebration of social justice ... allows us to make a connection between this painful history and the ongoing marginalization, discrimination and poverty that indigenous communities face to this day."

Seattle Swaps Columbus Day For 'Indigenous Peoples' Day' : Code Switch : NPR

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

 

[Carjosse]

The Columbus Day thing is completely valid issue, as after all it celebrates a genocidal maniac child rapist who discovered the Bahamas. For some reason Americans have an entire day dedicated to him. Should the Congo celebrate Leopold Day or Germany celebrate Hitler Day?

 

[FieldTheorist]

Living in Seattle I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism. Seattle somehow elected a socialist on the Seattle City Council. We are talking a true socialist who belongs in the Socialist Alternative, a Trotskyist political party. I wish I was making this up but it is true. She's an economics professor. Seriously.

Here are some of her radical ideas:

On climate change:



Socialist Seattle Politician Kshama Sawant: We Need a Radical Militant Nonviolent Climate Movement | Democracy Now!

Changing Columbus Day:



Seattle Swaps Columbus Day For 'Indigenous Peoples' Day' : Code Switch : NPR

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

Personally I'm totally against Trotskyism, but let's set that aside. What damage has she allegedly wrought to Seattle? Your opening statement, to wit, was "I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism." Either renaming a public holiday and fighting for democracy has now been redefined to be "destructive" or else you don't know what you're talking about. I'd wager it's the latter.

 

[Paleocon]

The Columbus Day thing is completely valid issue, as after all it celebrates a genocidal maniac child rapist who discovered the Bahamas. For some reason Americans have an entire day dedicated to him. Should the Congo celebrate Leopold Day or Germany celebrate Hitler Day?

Why do you hate your ancestors?

 

[Van Basten]

Pretty sure she's not a Trotskyist, SA might be one of those big tent socialist parties.

The Columbus Day thing is completely valid issue, as after all it celebrates a genocidal maniac child rapist who discovered the Bahamas. For some reason Americans have an entire day dedicated to him. Should the Congo celebrate Leopold Day or Germany celebrate Hitler Day?

A free day off for the kids is a free day off.

EDIT:

Is the forum looking weird for anyone else here?

 

[dimensionallava]

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

thats radical too you?

 

[shrubnose]

Living in Seattle I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism.

Seattle somehow elected a socialist on the Seattle City Council. We are talking a true socialist who belongs in the Socialist Alternative, a Trotskyist political party. I wish I was making this up but it is true. She's an economics professor. Seriously.

Here are some of her radical ideas:

On climate change:



Socialist Seattle Politician Kshama Sawant: We Need a Radical Militant Nonviolent Climate Movement | Democracy Now!

Changing Columbus Day:



Seattle Swaps Columbus Day For 'Indigenous Peoples' Day' : Code Switch : NPR

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

How can you call yourself a 'centrist' and post BS like you've posted in this comment?

:lol:

Fill us in.

 

[Frank Apisa]

Living in Seattle I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism. Seattle somehow elected a socialist on the Seattle City Council. We are talking a true socialist who belongs in the Socialist Alternative, a Trotskyist political party. I wish I was making this up but it is true. She's an economics professor. Seriously.

Here are some of her radical ideas:

On climate change:



Socialist Seattle Politician Kshama Sawant: We Need a Radical Militant Nonviolent Climate Movement | Democracy Now!

Changing Columbus Day:



Seattle Swaps Columbus Day For 'Indigenous Peoples' Day' : Code Switch : NPR

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

You do sound as though you are afraid of her.

She is speaking her mind...championing the issue she advocates.

Why would that frighten you...unless, perhaps, you think they might become popular among the majority of people?

 

[Chomsky]

Living in Seattle I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism. Seattle somehow elected a socialist on the Seattle City Council. We are talking a true socialist who belongs in the Socialist Alternative, a Trotskyist political party. I wish I was making this up but it is true. She's an economics professor. Seriously.

Here are some of her radical ideas:

On climate change:



Socialist Seattle Politician Kshama Sawant: We Need a Radical Militant Nonviolent Climate Movement | Democracy Now!

Changing Columbus Day:



Seattle Swaps Columbus Day For 'Indigenous Peoples' Day' : Code Switch : NPR

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

Well, I see socialism right in my very own immediate family!

It's called MediCare.

And after a long career of running her beauty shop from her late 20's until she was 72, all the while paying taxes as a productive citizen, it allows my mom to rest comfortably in her waning twilight years without bankrupting her or us.

Yeah - that socialism is a bitch, ain't it?

 

[Chomsky]

The Columbus Day thing is completely valid issue, as after all it celebrates a genocidal maniac child rapist who discovered the Bahamas. For some reason Americans have an entire day dedicated to him. Should the Congo celebrate Leopold Day or Germany celebrate Hitler Day?

Now that's a bit harsh, no?

Alright, Columbus Day *was* a give-away in the States to appease the burgeoning Italian-American community. It still is, along with in my city, the separately celebrated "Venetian Night" flotilla (I'm not sure if other waterfront cities with significant Italian-American populations do the latter).

And I suppose they could've went with Amerigo Vespucci as an alternative, and I think a valid argument could be made for him of sorts. But I suppose each man simply represented their native city state's ethos, with Vespucci being the more academic Florentine observer & thinker to Columbus' brash Genovese mercantile oriented exploratory leadership.

But unlike Leif Erikson's voyages a half a millennia earlier, Columbus opened the door for permanent European interaction with the New World. For better or worse, he was a man of his place and time. I think he's getting the short end of the stick, here. Over 3 centuries later the first President of the United States was a slave owner (and many after him), and we don't let that blemish his otherwise positive deeds.

I won't deny Columbus was a tyrannical governor in the new world, but I do not believe a comparison to Leopold or Hitler is an equivalency. I can kinda' see what you're getting at with Leopold, but still don't see it.

 

[Bucky]

Personally I'm totally against Trotskyism, but let's set that aside. What damage has she allegedly wrought to Seattle? Your opening statement, to wit, was "I get to witness first hand the destructive nature of socialism." Either renaming a public holiday and fighting for democracy has now been redefined to be "destructive" or else you don't know what you're talking about. I'd wager it's the latter.

Thank you for the post FT.

She is a rebel-rouser that has been arrested for disorderly conduct. She fights for policies that hurt our state - and supports candidates that would hurt the United States. A mandatory $15 minimum wage, fighting against a mythical foe in global warming, etc.

You can see the SA's goals right here. So how many of these policy would bankrupt America:

About SA | Socialist Alternative

Fighting for the 99%
Create living-wage union jobs for all the unemployed through a massive public works program to develop mass transit, renewable energy, infrastructure, healthcare, education, and affordable housing.
Free, high quality healthcare for all. Replace the failed for-profit insurance companies with a publicly funded single-payer system as a step towards fully socialized medicine.
No budget cuts to education & social services! Full funding for all community needs. The federal government should bail out states to prevent cuts and layoffs. A massive increase in taxes on the rich and big business, not working people.
Raise the federal minimum wage to $15/hour, adjusted annually for cost of living increases and regional differences, as a step towards a living wage for all.
A minimum guaranteed weekly income of $600/week for the unemployed, disabled, stay-at-home parents, the elderly, and others unable to work.
Stop home foreclosures and evictions. For public ownership and democratic control of the major banks.
No more layoffs! Take bankrupt and failing companies into public ownership and retool them for socially necessary green production.
Free, high quality public education for all from pre-school through college. Full funding for schools to dramatically lower teacher-student ratios. Stop the focus on high stakes testing and the drive to privatize public education.
Repeal all anti-union laws like Taft-Hartley. For democratic unions run by the rank-and-file to fight for better pay, working conditions, and social services. Full-time union officials should be regularly elected and receive the average wage of those they represent.
For a guaranteed living wage pension.
Shorten the workweek with no loss in pay and benefits – share out the work with the unemployed and create new jobs.

 

[Cyrylek]

The Columbus Day thing is completely valid issue, as after all it celebrates a genocidal maniac child rapist who discovered the Bahamas. For some reason Americans have an entire day dedicated to him. Should the Congo celebrate Leopold Day or Germany celebrate Hitler Day?

Columbus is remembered as a symbolic figure, the Discoverer. Hitler and Leopold II are remembered primarily for the great evil they did.

As the Warden of the Mint, Isaac Newton had sent a lot of people to gallows, for mere counterfeiting. But it would be weird to demand renaming The Newton's Laws of Motion lest we celebrate such barbarism....

 

[Dragonfly]

I'm still waiting for the OP to show me some example of actual "socialism".

 

[Bucky]

I'm still waiting for the OP to show me some example of actual "socialism".

Here you go:

Free, high quality healthcare for all. Replace the failed for-profit insurance companies with a publicly funded single-payer system as a step towards fully socialized medicine.

Capitalism produces poverty, inequality, environmental destruction and war. We need an international struggle against this system.

Take into public ownership the top 500 corporations and banks that dominate the U.S. economy and run them under the democratic management of elected representatives of the workers and the broader public. Compensation to be paid on the basis of proven need to small investors, not millionaires.
A democratic socialist plan for the economy based on the interests of the overwhelming majority of people and the environment. For a socialist United States and a socialist world.

 

[DamnYankee]

Give the leftists enough time they will have Seattle looking like Detroit in a few years.

 

[fmw]

OP, she expressed an opinion and you expressed one as well. We move on.

 

[Bucky]

A minimum guaranteed weekly income of $600/week for the unemployed, disabled, stay-at-home parents, the elderly, and others unable to work.

She essentially wants to give $28,800 to people for doing nothing. This is in addition with unemployment benefits, disability benefits, Social Security, etc they already receive. Can you say, insolvent?

Free, high quality healthcare for all. Replace the failed for-profit insurance companies with a publicly funded single-payer system as a step towards fully socialized medicine.

Not possible.

Socialist Seattle Politician Kshama Sawant: We Need a Radical Militant Nonviolent Climate Movement

This is a war against oil, corporations and businesses. All against what? A fight against a mythical opponent in global warming which may or may not be caused my humans.

The federal government should bail out states to prevent cuts and layoffs. A massive increase in taxes on the rich and big business, not working people.

She's friends with Bernie Sanders. This idea she supports the 99% and fights against the 1% is a farce. A "massive increase in taxes" on the rich is essentially anyone in the middle class or above.

 

[Frank Apisa]

She essentially wants to give $28,800 to people for doing nothing. This is in addition with unemployment benefits, disability benefits, Social Security, etc they already receive. Can you say, insolvent?



Not possible.



This is a war against oil, corporations and businesses. All against what? A fight against a mythical opponent in global warming which may or may not be caused my humans.



She's friends with Bernie Sanders. This idea she supports the 99% and fights against the 1% is a farce. A "massive increase in taxes" on the rich is essentially anyone in the middle class or above.

She sounds like a smart woman. You're lucky to have her.

 

[Bucky]

Well, I see socialism right in my very own immediate family!

It's called MediCare.

And after a long career of running her beauty shop from her late 20's until she was 72, all the while paying taxes as a productive citizen, it allows my mom to rest comfortably in her waning twilight years without bankrupting her or us.

Yeah - that socialism is a bitch, ain't it?

Chomsky, we all know Medicare is a ponzi scheme. It is the definition of that. I hate robin hood/socialist policies like this.

 

[Bucky]

She sounds like a smart woman. You're lucky to have her.

I am unsure how a socialist can be a professor in economics when socialists do not understand basic economics 101.

 

[Carjosse]

Now that's a bit harsh, no?

Alright, Columbus Day *was* a give-away in the States to appease the burgeoning Italian-American community. It still is, along with in my city, the separately celebrated "Venetian Night" flotilla (I'm not sure if other waterfront cities with significant Italian-American populations do the latter).

And I suppose they could've went with Amerigo Vespucci as an alternative, and I think a valid argument could be made for him of sorts. But I suppose each man simply represented their native city state's ethos, with Vespucci being the more academic Florentine observer & thinker to Columbus' brash Genovese mercantile oriented exploratory leadership.

But unlike Leif Erikson's voyages a half a millennia earlier, Columbus opened the door for permanent European interaction with the New World. For better or worse, he was a man of his place and time. I think he's getting the short end of the stick, here. Over 3 centuries later the first President of the United States was a slave owner (and many after him), and we don't let that blemish his otherwise positive deeds.

I won't deny Columbus was a tyrannical governor in the new world, but I do not believe a comparison to Leopold or Hitler is an equivalency. I can kinda' see what you're getting at with Leopold, but still don't see it.

Give them John Cabot day, he actually discovered part of North America. He was not a product of time as the Spanish later tried to persecute him for his crimes so the likeness to Nazis can continue and are perfectly valid.

 

[Carjosse]

Why do you hate your ancestors?

Not mine, I would rather celebrate John Cabot, also Italian and actually discovered North America but with money from the English or how about Jacques Cartier, famous explorer who also helped discover North America.

 

[JasperL]

Changing Columbus Day:

Seattle Swaps Columbus Day For 'Indigenous Peoples' Day' : Code Switch : NPR

She truly is a radical, dangerous women. Anti-police, Anti-business type person. She recently voted against building a new arena in Seattle. She will defend a Black Lives Matter Activist over a cop any day of the week. She defends rent control and allowing homeless people to reside on sidewalks.

I don't have a problem with Columbus Day, and I wholeheartedly support her stance on public arenas which are nothing but crony capitalism for wealthy team owners. They don't make any economic sense, and so as an economics professor, she's just voting with the evidence on those boondoggles. Their only justification is a lot of people want a team in their city and are willing for taxpayers to heavily subsidize their entertainment options. IMO, if the team wants public subsidies, let the team be publicly owned like it is in Green Bay, instead of letting the benefits flow to a small group of wealthy owners. At least the city should demand an ownership share if it's going to put up half or more of the cost of a stadium for its use.

 

[Chomsky]

Give them John Cabot day, he actually discovered part of North America. He was not a product of time as the Spanish later tried to persecute him for his crimes so the likeness to Nazis can continue and are perfectly valid.

Alright, fair enough.

You do seem to have a good sense of history.

I'll respect your opinion.

 

[Chomsky]

Chomsky, we all know Medicare is a ponzi scheme. It is the definition of that. I hate robin hood/socialist policies like this.

To the bolded: No I don't, beyond your unsupported assertion. Please explain.

And I like this policy.

So what is the free-market healthcare solution for my octogenarian mother? What do you propose?