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Europe

Quertol said:
Ah, why is it the responsibility of the government to provide healthcare?

Call it civilisation.
 
Naughty Nurse said:
Call it civilisation.


Call it robbing from those that actually work...

Modern day Robin Hood? I think not... It is wrong!
 
galenrox said:
Now, I am an unabashed capitalist, and I would say that just about the last thing that could be said about universal health care and social welfare is wrong. If there is anything, I would say misapplied.
There is nothing wrong with social welfare. Since in capitalism there is such a thing as the natural rate of unemployment, typically between 3 and 4 percent, then it would be extremely callous of a society to essentially say "Aw, **** them", when in fact they just so happen to be the person left without a chair when the music stopped.
The problem comes from the fact that the people don't see this as their responsibility. When the government takes the money from the rich and gives it to the poor, this really screws with the economy. Now the only real solution to this would be for people to voluntarily do this. The really interesting thing about markets is you could do the exact same thing, and have the only difference be whether it was voluntary or forced on by the government will determine whether or not it ****s with the market.
But social welfare is important in our society on many fronts. Although you say that it's not the government's job, answer me this. Isn't it the government's job to minimize crime and protect our property? Well then social welfare is the government's job, considering the association between crime and poverty, and poverty and unemploymnet.

People should get off their rumps and work... That is what they need to do... I understand taking care of those who can't help themselves, but c'mon... Those who can work should... No if's, and's or but's...
 
Cheap government provided health care isn't created just to support the unemployed. Rather its to make it cheap, so healthcare isn't such a problem to afford. People who are takin the most advantage of cheap healthcare in Europe aren't the unemployed, but the sick. And the majority of sick people i'm guessin do have jobs (or their parents have jobs) and are hard working people. Of course taxes are a lot more over there, but the government eliminates the hassle of affording healthcare by doing so.
 
Quertol said:
Modern day Robin Hood? I think not... It is wrong!

So what, Robin Hood's a hellspawn, and G.W. is God,

so is it right to steal from the poor and give to the rich
 
Quertol said:
People should get off their rumps and work... That is what they need to do... I understand taking care of those who can't help themselves, but c'mon... Those who can work should... No if's, and's or but's...

I'd love to see a capitalist work, tell them to get off their rumps and work, instead of own, or all of them disabled?
 
Comrade Brian said:
I'd love to see a capitalist work, tell them to get off their rumps and work, instead of own, or all of them disabled?

I believe in capitalism. I work... What dont you understand about that?
 
Quertol said:
Call it robbing from those that actually work...

Modern day Robin Hood? I think not... It is wrong!

We were talking about the government providing health care.

Now I work extremely hard - full time hours, on my feet most of the day. Ocassionally I get sick. I go to the doctor. I pay nothing. If I need to be admitted to hospital, I pay nothing.

But guess what? It isn't free. I have paid taxes all my working life. Part of the reason I pay taxes is so that I will get health care when I need it.

How am I robbing anybody?
 
Naughty Nurse said:
We were talking about the government providing health care.

Now I work extremely hard - full time hours, on my feet most of the day. Ocassionally I get sick. I go to the doctor. I pay nothing. If I need to be admitted to hospital, I pay nothing.

But guess what? It isn't free. I have paid taxes all my working life. Part of the reason I pay taxes is so that I will get health care when I need it.

How am I robbing anybody?

Those that have not worked, and not paid taxes can also go to the doctor and pay nothing...

THat is my point...

Leave healthcare to the free market and it will lead to better hospitals and better care....

THat is what the free market does...
 
Quertol said:
Those that have not worked, and not paid taxes can also go to the doctor and pay nothing...

THat is my point...

Leave healthcare to the free market and it will lead to better hospitals and better care....

THat is what the free market does...

I think everyone, regardless of paying taxes has the right to live. I'll admit that the British Healthcare service is not in great condition, but its better than hospitals being run like businesses.

I hate that a man has to pay $20,000 for an operation to live, where's the humanity in it?
 
Soviet_Guy: "Europe is greater than America, it has survived for centuries and was the core of civilization, what do I think, invasion and the conquering of Capitalist America, that's what."

You got to be kidding me, you think Europe's survival makes it great? It makes Europe look bad. Ponder this: Britain had centuries (if not a thousand years or more) to build itself and become great, yet the colonists who lived in America had only been there for less then a century and they beat the brits ass. Then later We kicked Spanish ass in Mexico and in the carribean. We became a world super power in about two hundred years and it took individual european countries thousands to become great. Besides most of your european countries **** themselves to even think of war.
 
But remember, americans were just europeans. Many of our ideas were borrowed from those of French/English Enlightenment thinkers. And remember there is gonna be a time when America's gonna lose its sole super power status (hopefully not any time soon). And Europe didn't take thousands of years to become great. All civilizations go through cycles. But you're rite, survival doesn't make it great, just makes it rich in culture and history.
 
Quertol said:
Ah, why is it the responsibility of the government to provide healthcare?

It's what's known as a caring society. The responsibility of us all to help and protect the weakest and most vulnerable in society, like the elderly and the sick. That's a concept that's beyond you United Statesians, I know. You preach all that Christian love and sharing crap, but in reality, like the church, you only worry about your own wallets.
 
Quertol said:
Those that have not worked, and not paid taxes can also go to the doctor and pay nothing...

THat is my point...

Leave healthcare to the free market and it will lead to better hospitals and better care....

THat is what the free market does...

I understand you regard yourself as a religious person, Quertol.

Is this the true face of religion - I'm alright, Jack, F*** you!

Any system has its weaknesses, be it public or private. However, I am an atheist and I believe that care of one's fellow human beings who, for what ever reason, require help, is paramount to a civilised society.
 
Quertol said:
I believe in capitalism. I work... What dont you understand about that?

I mean capitalist as in owning and rich, the top of society, the only people who really gain from capitalism.
 
Comrade Brian said:
I mean capitalist as in owning and rich, the top of society, the only people who really gain from capitalism.


Capitalist implies those who believe in capitalism... Not those who own corporations...
 
Comrade Brian said:
Capitalist can also mean rich.

I never said that I wasn't rich...

Compared with what many others make throughout the world, we in the US, are considered rich...

It's not a bad thing to have money...
 
Naughty Nurse said:
I understand you regard yourself as a religious person, Quertol.

Is this the true face of religion - I'm alright, Jack, F*** you!

Any system has its weaknesses, be it public or private. However, I am an atheist and I believe that care of one's fellow human beings who, for what ever reason, require help, is paramount to a civilised society.

I never said that I was religious... I'm not. I merely have a personnal relationship with Jesus Christ...
 
Quertol said:
I never said that I was religious... I'm not. I merely have a personnal relationship with Jesus Christ...

He a lover or something?
 
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