Busting the myths of transparency around the EU-US trade deal
On 7 October, the second round of negotiations for a far-reaching transatlantic trade deal will begin in Brussels. Amidst calls for greater openness and public participation, the European Commission has gone into propaganda mode, promoting myths about the transparency and accountability of the talks. See through its feel-good rhetoric with Corporate Europe Observatory’s myth-busting guide to secrecy, corporate influence and lack of accountability in the transatlantic trade negotiations.
digital rights activists have warned the European Commission that secrecy “could kill TTIP just as effectively as it killed ACTA”.
In response, the Commission has gone on a PR offensive. In a series of Q&A, briefing papers about transparency in EU trade negotiations and leaflets explaining why TTIP is not ACTA, the Commission’s trade department (DG Trade) is portraying itself as the model of transparency. “There is more interest in this potential deal than any we have worked on before,” they say, “We realise that this requires new initiatives to shed more light on what is going on throughout the negotiations.”
However these “new initiatives” of theirs cast more shadow than light. Let us guide you through some of the key myths about openness and accountability in DG Trade.
Of course we should have different trariffs, morons.stop the practice of using differential tariffs to discourage imports of processed goods, while encouraging raw materials and thereby protecting European manufacturing.
I think privatization to a point is good. So is competition. not only should some services be privatized, but privatized in a way that creates competition between the companies. Having the state fully own public services without any chance of private companies emerging in those fields is stupid.reverse its focus on privatising public services, and the aggressive pursuit of opportunities for European companies to run public services elsewhere.
So I posted about the EU-Moldavia trade agreement, and that's nice, but now for something bad.
http://corporateeurope.org/trade/2013/09/busting-myths-transparency-around-eu-us-trade-deal
So read the whole page if you're interested in the top link.
This link however is a to website that will provide some other information, mainly, how the trade agreement between the EU and the USA should be done:
Alternative Trade Mandate | Trade isn
http://www.alternativetrademandate.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/ATM-Document-Final-EN.pdf
The pdf provides an easy read.
Now of course, the document is made in order to better benefit the EU and it's people according to the views of the NGOs that worked on it. Now I don't subscribe to all the things listed there, especially when it comes to labor rights and business. For instance, this is crap in their proposal:
Of course we should have different trariffs, morons.
or this:
I think privatization to a point is good. So is competition. not only should some services be privatized, but privatized in a way that creates competition between the companies. Having the state fully own public services without any chance of private companies emerging in those fields is stupid.
Almost everything written here is idiotic and hippie: Issue #9: Intellectual Property Rights are rights for all – not just a few
So yeah
There are a lot of things I disagree with in the alternative view. But they do raise a good point in regards to transparency. So they are correct in what they want as an end result, but their proposals are at times stupid, silly and rather hippie-like. And hippies don't get to make public policies.
I'd just like to say. This EU-USA trade agreement has the seeds in it to be a greatly beneficial arrangement for both the EU and the USA. So that's why extra care needs to be put in place on how people handle these affairs because if this agreements ends up poorly or disadvantageous for one side, it's going to create resentment and spoil the chance for future agreements to be made.
So I like the fact that there are people who are publicly warning officials that they are keeping an eye on them and they better be on their best behavior. And I'd like to think that I'm one of them.
Contrary to what some people think, I'm not an euroskeptic in the sense that I'd like to see the EU to fail. I am quite fond of the idea of an European union, just not the way the current EU works. Bureaucrats and unelected pencil-pushers call the shots, Brussels is the 2nd largest lobby hotspot in the world after washington DC... constant propaganda and wishful thinking, talking to us, the public, like we're idiots that can be manipulated, etc.
But I do think that the EU can reform itself. I do believe that with enough public input, the EU can adjust.
Programs like these:
Ongoing debate - European Commission
And others that I posted around here are good initiatives.
I'd just like to say. This EU-USA trade agreement has the seeds in it to be a greatly beneficial arrangement for both the EU and the USA. So that's why extra care needs to be put in place on how people handle these affairs because if this agreements ends up poorly or disadvantageous for one side, it's going to create resentment and spoil the chance for future agreements to be made.
So I like the fact that there are people who are publicly warning officials that they are keeping an eye on them and they better be on their best behavior. And I'd like to think that I'm one of them.
Contrary to what some people think, I'm not an euroskeptic in the sense that I'd like to see the EU to fail. I am quite fond of the idea of an European union, just not the way the current EU works.
Bureaucrats and unelected pencil-pushers call the shots,
..Brussels is the 2nd largest lobby hotspot in the world after washington DC.
constant propaganda and wishful thinking, talking to us, the public, like we're idiots that can be manipulated, etc.
But I do think that the EU can reform itself. I do believe that with enough public input, the EU can adjust.
Programs like these:
Ongoing debate - European Commission
And others that I posted around here are good initiatives.
The EU is based in myth and nobody would want it, if the lore had not been sold instead of the facts. Why would they want to be open and honest now?
Eh.. the myth has been created by the anti-EU crowd and their media outlets. The EU is very open and the information is freely available, but it is you that has to seek it out.. it does not come to you.
As for the EU-US trade agreement. One simple rule.. what we give the US, we also receive as a minimum back. I am so tried of being the one giving and giving while the US gives us nothing in return.
I agree, but the problem with these agreements are not the commission since they are nothing but administrators working for someone, but in fact the member nations governments. For example, the agreements done after 9/11 with the US on anti-terror and such, were pushed through by the member states governments with the UK at the front without much public scrutiny and well we know how that ended up. .....
That is a myth, they like to tell each other and their peoples over here. When I have checked these stories out (and no, I am not going to do your homework for you) or asked friends at the WTO or in German industry, what they could say about this or that matter, the stories have regularly been false.
Not really. What are you talking about?
I agree[...]with[...] people like Nigel Ferage with the facts.
Open and transparent?
When talks are open they result in the battle of Seattle..............
That is why they hide in totalitarian places ..................Doha, Dubai etc.
And its just another trade deal to SCREW AMERICA. That is 100% sure, secret or not, the result is the same.
If you do not understand what is happening, don't comment.
Shortened your comments for spacial purposes. And no, I did read everything and I know your comment is completely the opposite with what is left in the comment bracket. And the truth is, both the pro-EU and the anti-EU side is guilty of such tactics. This is just a demonstration. It's not just 1 sided.
On your comment in particular.
The comission is made up of member state leaders
and they were anti-ACTA when the people of their respective countries went into the streets to protest.The EU parliament became anti-ACTA when the people in the countries where each europarliamentar activated went in the streets to protest. So ACTA got defeated by the people because the politicians feared losing their fat-ass paychecks from a really good job if they wouldn't repeal ACTA.
It is the people who are standing in the way of letting the internet become a censored dead-space, not the politicians. the politicians are the idiots who want to turn the internet in a dead-space. It is the fact that they love their political careers too much that they keep on the straight and narrow. So the EU parliament is not the "watchdog". The people are.
The pencil-pushers and Merkel and Cameron and the lot of them are all in the same boat. It's not like one doesn't want to do something but Merkel and Cameron threatens them with an anal probing if they don't comply. They all love their little plans because all of them were there when they made the god damn plans so that there's something for everyone. They're all on the same god damn side.
I understand the EU sufficiently well to know what I'm dealing with. I don't appreciate you attacking my knowledge on the fact that you don't like what I'm saying.
On the notion of lobbyists. Well the "big lobby groups" in DC are bigger than the lobby groups in the EU. This is because big oil, big pharma and big everything else in the USA have US-wide unrestricted reach... or less restricted. So they are bigger corporations with deeper pockets and who worked the system for a longer time. If the EU becomes more like the USA, we will eventually have the same problems. The big lobby groups in the EU will become bigger and bigger, they'll work the system and manipulated the process and end up having the same power as their counterparts in the US have now.
So we should be grateful that the "federalization" with the focus on centralization of power in Brussels hasn't happened aggressively. It's what saves us from the big corporations owning the politicians... and it is a defense.
The pro-EU propaganda is just as bad as the anti-EU propaganda.
I am just not partisan. I listen to both sides, and judge for myself and give credit where credit is due. You have decided to put your fingers in the ears and go: NANANANANNA whenever an anti-EU point is brought up by the anti-EU people. Now you are just one person, but when leaders in the EU do this, they create disharmony and dissent and reinforce the anti-EU people.
The EU needs reform buddy. national states need reform too, but not in order to grant more powers to the EU.
I don't care much for the strassbourg to brussels business. I think those fatsos in Parliament should move their fat asses and start running or going on a bike every 6 months for the trip. It's just 430km. Politician survival race. whoever doesn't reach there in 2 days or ends up in the bottom 10% gets the boot. Bike only!
Open and transparent?
When talks are open they result in the battle of Seattle..............
That is why they hide in totalitarian places ..................Doha, Dubai etc.
And its just another trade deal to SCREW AMERICA. That is 100% sure, secret or not, the result is the same.
the European comission is indeeed formed by the people appointed by each members state but who appoints them? Their are the mouthpieces of each member state.
It's like saying that the foreign minister doesn't represent the country because he's the foreign minister and not the head of state. It's technically true but in truth, they work with the same agenda in mind.
As to ACTA. Whatever reservations were in the EU legislature and executive branch, they weren't the ones that started the popular protests. It was people influencing people. Common people, not the politicians who rallied the protesters and energized the movement.
And I know national politicians are corrupt assholes who only care about themselves. I'm RO dammit, I know this too well. But the EU politicians are just as bad.
I just said that they haven't been as efficient in lobbying in the EU because the EU is not the USA. They aren't as big and don't have as big pockets... nor is their influence so far reaching. Also, there are over 700 people in the EU parliament as opposed to the US Congress.
I'll tell you one legislation that got passed and it sure as hell looks like something coming out of a bankers' wet dream:
ESA-European Stability Mechanism.
One Bank to rule them all, One Bank to find them,
One Bank to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
That's the ESA. And what they will rule over is nation states.
I made a whole god damn topic about it. Maybe 2 topics, I don't recall. I'll gladly link you them if you want to know. So while I don't know if it was lobbied by the banks, is sure as hell looks like it. No sound mind that wants to preserve national sovereignty would ever draft such a legislation.
I don't deny the fact that the smoking lobbyists are not as efficient in the EU... or that the auto lobbyists are not as efficient. But they're small fry.
The EU has been increasing it's powers time and time again with every treaty.
I know that people say the treaty of Lisbon, which empowers the EU Parliament further, is a measure to enhance democracy. And it may true, under auspicious circumstances but as it stands, it just empowered an institution that is indeed democratically elected... but the electorate also contains idiots.
I didn't say that the fatsos want to move. What fatso did you ever see that wanted to run? But I'm not joking. Let the bastards sweat! Get their fat asses on bikes and in 2days, go from Brussels to Strassbourg, meeting people along the way that will tell them what a ****ty job their are doing and how they are ruining the economy.
No it is not a myth. Historically we have opened up our markets to the US far more than the US has opened up to Europe. That has to do a lack of balls from the EU and its member nations.
So you are saying that when we in Europe want bank records, personal information and so on, about US citizens, then we get them on request? Because the US gets our information pretty much on request... By the time you go to the US, the US not only knows that you are coming because you are required to inform them that you are, but they have automatically gotten your financial information and a lot of other information and when you arrive they fingerprint you.
Now tell me.. do we do that to Americans when they want to come to Europe? Of course not, because that would be illegal both according to local law, but also the US would be pissed at us.
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