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Economists bullish on Biden's $3 trillion infrastructure plan

Rogue Valley

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3/29/21
President Biden and Congressional Democrats look set to push forward a $3 trillion infrastructure bill. What we're hearing: "Stimulus helps build the bridge for the recovery to reach the other side, but an investment in infrastructure is the fuel to jump start the economic engine," Beth Ann Bovino, U.S. chief economist at S&P Global, says in an email. S&P predicts Biden's infrastructure plan will create 2.3 million jobs by 2024, inject $5.7 trillion into the economy — which would be 10 times what was lost during the recession — and raise per-capita income by $2,400. Economists at Goldman Sachs again revised up their outlook for growth this year in a Sunday note to clients, predicting real consumption will grow by 9.5% in Q1 and 12.5% in Q2, citing retailer reopenings, the reversal of winter storm effects and a decline in new COVID-19 infections. Further, they note that OpenTable restaurant reservations are nearing 70% of normal nationwide and are back above their pre-crisis level in Texas. They also anticipate the pace of fiscal support to U.S. consumers will accelerate by $1 trillion on an annualized basis (or 5% of GDP) for March and the second quarter, relative to the previous six months. "We have to have a big public works program," Lawrence Baxter, director of the Global Financial Markets Center at Duke, tells Axios. Baxter compares Biden's proposed new programs to New Deal initiatives like the Blue Ridge Parkway that were created to battle unemployment following the Great Depression. "They’re not daring to call it that because that would be a lightning rod," he adds.


Most economists agree; the government should continue injecting money into the US economy to stimulate consumer buying, employment, and economic growth.
 

Most economists agree; the government should continue injecting money into the US economy to stimulate consumer buying, employment, and economic growth.
They've got five-Trillion dollars left on the credit card.

They better raise taxes, so we can balnce the budget and start paying back and all this money doesn't just get lapped up by the rich.
 
Before anyone goes on about the horrors of spending money: we have had to do this for a long ****ing time.

This isn't about some liberal who loves spending money for the sake of spending money (about as stupid as claiming a liberal loves big government because bigness of government is an alleged liberal goal). This is about bridges and dams about to fail. This about road repairs and building that cannot be adequately funded by gas taxes. This is about our electrical grid, our plumbing infrastructure, and so much more.

Three trillion is only about half the overall infrastructure work we're looking at in coming decades.



And if spending money was bad, if you actually meant that, then you'd have been outraged each time the GOP pushed threw a new tax cut. You didn't because either you don't really believe borrowing is bad OR because you don't really care what happens in the future so long as you can buy an extra iphone each year today. We can scoot taxes back up to where we're paying

Or, maybe, we'll get away with not doing that and escaping via a mix of GDP growth and possibly inflating our way out of it (at great pain). Japan has managed a Debt:GDP ratio that's more like 2:1, whereas we're more like 1:1. We've got a lot of borrowing room, actually. We just shouldn't be stupid about it.

But we can't ignore our tottering infrastructure.



Narrator: we're going to be stupid about it.
 




Most economists agree; the government should continue injecting money into the US economy to stimulate consumer buying, employment, and economic growth.
The reality that we have driven the nat'l debt to such high levels during a time when interest rates are near zero and NO infrastructure work has been done is disturbing at best. $3T is nice, we need more like a $10T infrastructure plan.
 
The reality that we have driven the nat'l debt to such high levels during a time when interest rates are near zero and NO infrastructure work has been done is disturbing at best. $3T is nice, we need more like a $10T infrastructure plan.
There's a limit even to a Keynesian bail out. It all sounds so lovely until we come up short, and we will. Look at the examples. The EU has been bailing out until it demanded austerity on the part of Greece. Rich nations just like rich people are not immune to over spending. This is reckless spending until we see some serious results in terms of an upsurge in American economic strength and American manufacturing brought home and even a dent in our deficit in terms of what we're spending now. Thanks!!
 
There's a limit even to a Keynesian bail out. It all sounds so lovely until we come up short, and we will. Look at the examples. The EU has been bailing out until it demanded austerity on the part of Greece. Rich nations just like rich people are not immune to over spending. This is reckless spending until we see some serious results in terms of an upsurge in American economic strength and American manufacturing brought home and even a dent in our deficit in terms of what we're spending now. Thanks!!
I'm not talking about a bailout, I'm talking about an infrastructure plan. Much of our technology is 100 years old, and many of our roads and bridges are older. The pandemic has shown that nationwide broadband is not a good idea it is required. New infrastructure would mean new manufacturing, but it wouldn't mean new jobs.
 
There could be many important repair/replace efforts, but if the bridge or road is currently being tolled, then not one red cent should be spent by the Feds on such a project.
 
I'm not talking about a bailout, I'm talking about an infrastructure plan. Much of our technology is 100 years old, and many of our roads and bridges are older. The pandemic has shown that nationwide broadband is not a good idea it is required. New infrastructure would mean new manufacturing, but it wouldn't mean new jobs.
Regardless, we should not be making plans of this magnitude until we steady the ship. What you are suggesting is that we take on more water, when we've already flooded the decks. Biden is trying to be the second "New Deal" president, but there's a big difference between the economy that Roosevelt faced and the economy that Biden is facing. We weren't awash in debt back in Roosevelt's time, and even more to the point - despite Franklin's efforts - we never really pulled out of mediocre economic conditions until WWII. Biden is spending like a madman while we're already facing the greatest debt load in US history. Our biggest problem is that too many people think that the Keynesian path is limitless. It's not. And we have to be realistic or we'll go the way of Greece. Thanks!!
 
I'm not talking about a bailout, I'm talking about an infrastructure plan. Much of our technology is 100 years old, and many of our roads and bridges are older. The pandemic has shown that nationwide broadband is not a good idea it is required. New infrastructure would mean new manufacturing, but it wouldn't mean new jobs.
Rereading this post I meant to say that the manufacturing that returned wouldn't mean new jobs (automation), but the infrastructure repair most certainly would create jobs.
 
Regardless, we should not be making plans of this magnitude until we steady the ship. What you are suggesting is that we take on more water, when we've already flooded the decks. Biden is trying to be the second "New Deal" president, but there's a big difference between the economy that Roosevelt faced and the economy that Biden is facing. We weren't awash in debt back in Roosevelt's time, and even more to the point - despite Franklin's efforts - we never really pulled out of mediocre economic conditions until WWII. Biden is spending like a madman while we're already facing the greatest debt load in US history. Our biggest problem is that too many people think that the Keynesian path is limitless. It's not. And we have to be realistic or we'll go the way of Greece. Thanks!!
Every infrastructure job creates work, work creates tax revenue. The only way (imo) out of this is growth. I also reject your Greece comparison. The natural and economic resources of the two countries are not comparable.
 
Every infrastructure job creates work, work creates tax revenue. The only way (imo) out of this is growth. I also reject your Greece comparison. The natural and economic resources of the two countries are not comparable.
But philosophically they are, and resources have little to do with it. I don't care how much resource you have, if you're outstripping before replenishing, it will make for an economic problem. Thanks!!
 
But philosophically they are, and resources have little to do with it. I don't care how much resource you have, if you're outstripping before replenishing, it will make for an economic problem. Thanks!!
Sorry, meant to say 'untapped' resources. Besides, debt only matters when there is a D president.
 
But philosophically they are, and resources have little to do with it. I don't care how much resource you have, if you're outstripping before replenishing, it will make for an economic problem. Thanks!!

This isn't a response. Greece doesn't control their monetary policy, and as a result of their various trade and monetary treaties, they are limited with respect to fiscal policy. Comparing the two is asinine.
 
$3T is nice, we need more like a $10T infrastructure plan.

If the government guarantees $3 trillion worth of expenditure, i guarantee the private sector contributes more than $7 trillion. We are of course talking about a span of 10 to 15 years.
 
And how much of this $3T will find it's way into Union coffers?
 
Sorry, meant to say 'untapped' resources. Besides, debt only matters when there is a D president.
Not true. It matters across the board. Thanks!!
 




Most economists agree; the government should continue injecting money into the US economy to stimulate consumer buying, employment, and economic growth.
Couple of problems. The government is going to be about 7 trillion in debt over the Covid relief bail outs and the infrastructure bill if the dems do what they are talking about. For the economist that may look good on the short term because it's putting money into circulation. Keep in mind it's government printed money that on the long term will have to be paid for in the future or it will be a real problem that will harm the long term economy. Democrats don't usually look too long term, their answer always being just print more or tax more.
 
Not true. It matters across the board. Thanks!!
How can that be untrue, both are critical factors of production? That would be like comparing two peoples wealth and ability to increase that wealth by measuring what each have in their pockets when one has minimal other assets while the other has a massive bank account.
 
Why the obsession with America's infrastructure? Sure our "infrastructure" is "tottering". But American infrastructure is ALWAYS tottering. I can show you cover stories from U.S. News & World Report from the early 1980s (40 years ago) that was about America's tottering infrastructure.

Yet despite the so called problems with our infrastructure our economy has grown pretty decently over those four decades.
 
LET me preempt the Righties on here:

1. Economists know shit
2. Socialism run amok
3. Joe has dementia
4. The MSM loves this
5. George Soros
6. Kudlow said this would be a disaster
7. I don't like it, I don't know why I don't like it, but I was told by someone this is a horrible plan, so I will just go with that.
 
LET me preempt the Righties on here:

1. Economists know shit
2. Socialism run amok
3. Joe has dementia
4. The MSM loves this
5. George Soros
6. Kudlow said this would be a disaster
7. I don't like it, I don't know why I don't like it, but I was told by someone this is a horrible plan, so I will just go with that.

I think you got it... except for number one. 1) Some economists do know their shit.
7) over the top hyperbole
 
I think you got it... except for number one. 1) Some economists do know their shit.
7) over the top hyperbole
yup, George Soros is behind this spending bill.
 
Regardless, we should not be making plans of this magnitude until we steady the ship. What you are suggesting is that we take on more water, when we've already flooded the decks. Biden is trying to be the second "New Deal" president, but there's a big difference between the economy that Roosevelt faced and the economy that Biden is facing. We weren't awash in debt back in Roosevelt's time, and even more to the point - despite Franklin's efforts - we never really pulled out of mediocre economic conditions until WWII. Biden is spending like a madman while we're already facing the greatest debt load in US history. Our biggest problem is that too many people think that the Keynesian path is limitless. It's not. And we have to be realistic or we'll go the way of Greece. Thanks!!
The debt servicing is 6% of GDP, well within what the nation can handle. Moreover, the plan calls for raising taxes on corporations.
 
Every infrastructure job creates work, work creates tax revenue. The only way (imo) out of this is growth. I also reject your Greece comparison. The natural and economic resources of the two countries are not comparable.
The only way out of what? The economy is growing. Unemployment is low and falling. We arent in a recession. What is it you think we need to stimulate ourselves out of?
 
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