• Please keep all posts on the Rittenhouse verdict here: Rittenhouse Verdict. Note the moderator warnings in the thread. The thread will be heavily moderated with a zero tolerance policy for any baiting, flaming, trolling or other rule breaks. Stick to the topic and not the other posters. Thank you.
  • This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Don't make the Anti-Gay Folks Angry

Ntharotep

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 18, 2015
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
663
Location
Florida
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
I can't say I am either. Bangladesh is a very violent country....
 

OrphanSlug

A sinister place...
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 24, 2011
Messages
26,459
Reaction score
23,066
Location
Atlanta
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
It is Bangladesh we are talking about here, not south Alabama. This nation has been on the human rights watch list for as long as I can remember. Last I check this nation has one of the worst scores on rights afforded to the people, continually makes the news for government abuse of the reporters and other advocates for change, one of the lowest human development index scores (especially when it comes to education and healthcare,) terrible poverty rates, and ranks near the top in forced under-aged girls being married *and* accusations of human trafficking info forced labor and prostitution.

No one but authority is safe in that nation.

As sad as it sounds, I am impressed this "leading gay rights activist and editor" survived as long as he did. Does not make it right, just not surprised to see this sort of violence from this third world hellhole of a nation.
 

X Factor

Anti-Socialist
Dungeon Master
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2010
Messages
59,750
Reaction score
30,423
Location
El Paso Strong
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
The Islamic State group claimed responsibility for the attack through its news agency, saying the 58-year-old professor who wrote poetry and fiction had been murdered for "calling for atheism".

I've often seen it said we need to understand terrorism and do our best to not provoke it. Did the victims provoke this?
 
Last edited:

OrphanSlug

A sinister place...
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 24, 2011
Messages
26,459
Reaction score
23,066
Location
Atlanta
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
I've often seen it said we need to understand terrorism and do our best to not provoke it. Did the victims provoke this?

I guess that depends on point of view and how you define provoke. The "Islamic State group" has zero tolerance for anything deemed as competition to their interpretation of authority and purpose, in that context then anyone LGBT would be provoking the Islamic State group. But, that is exclusively from the Islamic State group point of view. They would look at just about anything they did not like as provoking them into a response per their own beliefs on what they should do to anyone who does not comply.
 

reinoe

DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 8, 2013
Messages
16,824
Reaction score
7,183
Location
Out West
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Centrist
It is Bangladesh we are talking about here, not south Alabama.
To be fair, sometimes I can't tell the difference when it comes to their human rights record.
 

calamity

Privileged
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Monthly Donator
Joined
Feb 12, 2013
Messages
160,474
Reaction score
57,512
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Centrist
I've often seen it said we need to understand terrorism and do our best to not provoke it. Did the victims provoke this?

If they did, they should have been better prepared, maybe carry a few guns and a couple big dogs in the home.
 

chromium

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
16,968
Reaction score
3,770
Location
A2
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I've often seen it said we need to understand terrorism and do our best to not provoke it. Did the victims provoke this?

oh right, so they deserved to be slaughtered for being gay, is that what you're saying? Homosexuality *already* carries a life sentence in bangladesh. It *already* was intolerable there. I have no desire to win those responsible over (and no it is not the victims), only to bring them to justice

if muslims were ever 'provoked' en mass by the west into murderous extremism it would've been by the invasion and bombings in iraq, not by gay activists who were already hated and hunted down. I am sure that trump's proposal to ban all muslims from the country also will not help to dissuade moderate muslims from becoming extremist

i am curious how you find it possible that the same victims can provoke their own violent murder, while others have no problem with their behavior. I'm thinking that must mean the fault lies with the killers!
 

VanceMack

MSG Benavides TAB
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 1, 2010
Messages
77,304
Reaction score
32,898
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexuallllllllizzzziimn
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexugggmnmhin
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexuallllllvblllsldmn
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexualgrgtawemnllllizzzziimn

Huh...Even my computer wont let me type that lie.

But at least is not ALL Muslims...
 

chromium

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
16,968
Reaction score
3,770
Location
A2
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I guess that depends on point of view and how you define provoke. The "Islamic State group" has zero tolerance for anything deemed as competition to their interpretation of authority and purpose, in that context then anyone LGBT would be provoking the Islamic State group. But, that is exclusively from the Islamic State group point of view. They would look at just about anything they did not like as provoking them into a response per their own beliefs on what they should do to anyone who does not comply.

they cannot be reasoned or negotiated with and no mutual understanding is possible. Like any genocidal fanatics, they're too far off the deep end and it would require too much sacrifice of our own values and freedom to appease them. The only recourse is to take them out
 

chromium

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
16,968
Reaction score
3,770
Location
A2
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexuallllllllizzzziimn
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexugggmnmhin
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexuallllllvblllsldmn
Most Muslims are very accepting of homosexualgrgtawemnllllizzzziimn

Huh...Even my computer wont let me type that lie.

But at least is not ALL Muslims...

actually in western countries, muslims are more tolerant of gay rights than christian evangelicals, according to the polls. Obviously not in bangladesh, but it's clear that once assimilated into western culture or at least exposed to gay people, muslims can be won over just as much as any other religious group
 

Fishking

DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 3, 2016
Messages
30,201
Reaction score
10,394
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
To be fair, sometimes I can't tell the difference when it comes to their human rights record.

Really?

That's a pretty disgusting and disingenuous comment.
 

Fishking

DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 3, 2016
Messages
30,201
Reaction score
10,394
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
actually in western countries, muslims are more tolerant of gay rights than christian evangelicals, according to the polls. Obviously not in bangladesh, but it's clear that once assimilated into western culture or at least exposed to gay people, muslims can be won over just as much as any other religious group

What polls?
 

X Factor

Anti-Socialist
Dungeon Master
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2010
Messages
59,750
Reaction score
30,423
Location
El Paso Strong
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
oh right, so they deserved to be slaughtered for being gay, is that what you're saying? Homosexuality *already* carries a life sentence in bangladesh. It *already* was intolerable there. I have no desire to win those responsible over (and no it is not the victims), only to bring them to justice

if muslims were ever 'provoked' en mass by the west into murderous extremism it would've been by the invasion and bombings in iraq, not by gay activists who were already hated and hunted down. I am sure that trump's proposal to ban all muslims from the country also will not help to dissuade moderate muslims from becoming extremist

i am curious how you find it possible that the same victims can provoke their own violent murder, while others have no problem with their behavior. I'm thinking that must mean the fault lies with the killers!

Easy, chrom, I, in no way, meant to suggest or imply that the victims deserved what happened here. On the contrary, I find it very easy to unconditionally condemn terrorism and I've never, ever agreed that terror victims just deserve it or had it coming. My comment was directed at those who do say it's on us to avoid provoking terrorism and I was curious if that same suggestion would apply here or is terrorism only justified if it targets the right people?
 

X Factor

Anti-Socialist
Dungeon Master
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2010
Messages
59,750
Reaction score
30,423
Location
El Paso Strong
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
actually in western countries, muslims are more tolerant of gay rights than christian evangelicals, according to the polls. Obviously not in bangladesh, but it's clear that once assimilated into western culture or at least exposed to gay people, muslims can be won over just as much as any other religious group

Right, the important part of this story is to be sure we condemn those Christian evangelicals. Anything to criticize the "right" people and avoid criticizing the "wrong" people, eh?

Well enjoy, I think I'm pretty much done with this. It's clear it doesn't matter who actually did what, Christians are always gong to be the ones to blame (according to some).
 
Last edited:

Fishking

DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 3, 2016
Messages
30,201
Reaction score
10,394
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Alabama is a pretty disgusting place.

I don't particularly care about any of your personal angst regarding Alabama (if you even have much of a basis for it) and that has nothing to do with your hyperbole regarding how it's barely different than Bangladesh.

It's like the people comparing Trump to Hitler. I don't like Trump but I also haven't seen him murder anyone or carry out genocide, among other things.
 

chromium

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
16,968
Reaction score
3,770
Location
A2
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Right, the important part of this story is to be sure we condemn those Christian evangelicals. Anything to criticize the "right" people and avoid criticizing the "wrong" people, eh?

Well enjoy, I think I'm pretty much done with this. It's clear it doesn't matter who actually did what, Christians are always gong to be the ones to blame (according to some).

easy yourself, i think clearly i was not blaming evangelicals for the murders in bangladesh. I was only addressing his misconception that muslims are inherently anti gay. If they immigrate and adopt western values as well as other religions, then it's clearly ignorant to pretend that islam is inescapably violently homophobic
 

OrphanSlug

A sinister place...
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 24, 2011
Messages
26,459
Reaction score
23,066
Location
Atlanta
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
they cannot be reasoned or negotiated with and no mutual understanding is possible. Like any genocidal fanatics, they're too far off the deep end and it would require too much sacrifice of our own values and freedom to appease them. The only recourse is to take them out

We are more or less on the same page here.

But we do need to stress a very important point. "Our values and freedom" does not apply once we are standing inside of Bangladesh (and many places similar.) Those things we hold as inherent value to whom we are become meaningless to groups like the Islamic State group.

It is not about support or opposition to what this guy was trying to do, it is about the nation we are talking about here and people like this group.

I am not surprised at all at the degree of violence displayed here, it is not uncommon in a nation such as Bangladesh.
 

X Factor

Anti-Socialist
Dungeon Master
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2010
Messages
59,750
Reaction score
30,423
Location
El Paso Strong
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
easy yourself,

If you're going to accuse me of stuff without acknowledging that you might actually be wrong, you really have no room to complain.

i think clearly i was not blaming evangelicals for the murders in bangladesh. I was only addressing his misconception that muslims are inherently anti gay. If they immigrate and adopt western values as well as other religions, then it's clearly ignorant to pretend that islam is inescapably violently homophobic

You did definitely say that Christians are worse, even if light of this story. Like I say, make sure you get your shots in. Who do you condemn for these murders? Can you even choke it out?
 

Glen Contrarian

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 21, 2013
Messages
17,688
Reaction score
8,046
Location
Bernie to the left of me, Hillary to the right, he
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
I don't particularly care about any of your personal angst regarding Alabama (if you even have much of a basis for it) and that has nothing to do with your hyperbole regarding how it's barely different than Bangladesh.

It's like the people comparing Trump to Hitler. I don't like Trump but I also haven't seen him murder anyone or carry out genocide, among other things.

Yeah, it's not like Trump's ever advocated for everyone of a certain religion to register with the government. Oh, wait....
 

chromium

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
16,968
Reaction score
3,770
Location
A2
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
If you're going to accuse me of stuff without acknowledging that you might actually be wrong, you really have no room to complain.



You did definitely say that Christians are worse, even if light of this story. Like I say, make sure you get your shots in. Who do you condemn for these murders? Can you even choke it out?

well, the same poll shows catholics at 60% support, with muslims at 42%, so i no more meant to imply all christians are homophobic than all muslims. It's just i don't like that poster singling muslims out. I would and have said the same thing if anyone defined all christians by the atrocities in uganda

but i should've framed it as muslims in bangladesh are far more extremist than muslims in the west and left it at that
 

X Factor

Anti-Socialist
Dungeon Master
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2010
Messages
59,750
Reaction score
30,423
Location
El Paso Strong
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
well, the same poll shows catholics at 60% support, with muslims at 42%, so i no more meant to imply all christians are homophobic than all muslims. It's just i don't like that poster singling muslims out. I would and have said the same thing if anyone defined all christians by the atrocities in uganda

but i should've framed it as muslims in bangladesh are far more extremist than muslims in the west and left it at that

Well,'don't do me any favors. The bummer is that I actually would have agreed with your point if you could have resisted the inevitable "but look how much more Christians suck" deflection.
 
Top Bottom