Donald Trump's 95-Minute Rant

[clownboy]

Ah, a comforting thing to say.
Republicans think America is stupid, though. Not much comfort there, huh?

No. Republicans think some voters are stupid, democrats think the entire country, except for the parts they like is.

 

[clownboy]

If Trump supporters are the base of the Republican party, the next President will definitely be a Democrat. Is there a candidate on either side with a smaller constituency?

Your opinion is noted. And yes, all the candidates on either side that are not in the top two.

 

[Grand Mal]

Your opinion is noted. And yes, all the candidates on either side that are not in the top two.

For a Republican to win a Presidential election, he has to carry every Republican vote. If Trump gets nominated, I believe a lot of Republicans will pass on the election.
Trump is a 'statement candidate' but the Republican Party is in no position to make statements. They have to nominate whomever has the best chance of getting elected, not whomever appeals most to their own hard core.

 

[clownboy]

For a Republican to win a Presidential election, he has to carry every Republican vote. If Trump gets nominated, I believe a lot of Republicans will pass on the election.
Trump is a 'statement candidate' but the Republican Party is in no position to make statements. They have to nominate whomever has the best chance of getting elected, not whomever appeals most to their own hard core.

Keep spinning. For him to win the general he'll need the same amount of republicans AND democrats AND independents that anyone else will need. The base was ready to walk away from this election as it stood, before the primary field announced themselves. Trump and Carson have brought them back. The republicans will vote for Trump if he gets the nod. Some democrats and independents will vote for Trump if he gets the nod. Everyone will have their own reasons, from enthusiastic support to holding their noses and just voting party lines to just can't stand the other person running.

What if predictions on head to heads in the general are entirely unreliable at this point. It won't be until after the primaries when they become meaningful.

 

[Grand Mal]

Keep spinning. For him to win the general he'll need the same amount of republicans AND democrats AND independents that anyone else will need. The base was ready to walk away from this election as it stood, before the primary field announced themselves. Trump and Carson have brought them back. The republicans will vote for Trump if he gets the nod. Some democrats and independents will vote for Trump if he gets the nod. Everyone will have their own reasons, from enthusiastic support to holding their noses and just voting party lines to just can't stand the other person running.

What if predictions on head to heads in the general are entirely unreliable at this point. It won't be until after the primaries when they become meaningful.

He'll get fewer Democrats and independents than someone less controversial would and that means he'll need allthe Republican votes.
I dunno, if Mitt Romney couldn't pull it off, do you really think Trump can? Geez, he's already alienating people- imagine him in a fight for the White House. He'll piss off so many people that only middle-class, middle-aged middle-swollen white males will vote for him.
Let's look at his track record. How did his last election go?

 

[Taylor]

Trump stated that Iowa voters (whom he needs) are stupid, and then he compared Ben Carson to Child Molesters and implied maybe he should be killed.

Well, not exactly. He was asking "how stupid are the people of Iowa, how stupid are the people of this country to believe this crap" (the "crap" being one or more of Ben Carson's stories). I just don't see many people taking that personally.

I haven't heard the "he should be killed" claim, but Carson himself already downplayed the significance of the child molester analogy.

 

[Kobie]

Tells Iowa Voters that they are stupid. Compares Ben Carson to child molesters.




That's Our Trump!

I was absolutely slack jawed when I saw some of Trump's comments this morning. I didn't think even he was that nuts.

 

[Kobie]

Democrats think America is a loser.

Oh for the love of ...

Can you post one thing that isn't partisan drivel?

 

[Kobie]

Did you even watch the speech at all? I ask because the speech bears no resemblance to your description. You should always take into account that there is always going to be someone in the thread who actually watches, regardless of how long it is.

"Rant?" "No control?" Anyone can watch for five minutes and see how uncharacteristically slowly he is speaking. Probably because there are no time limits like there are in the debates where we're used to seeing him. I would have preferred he speak much faster.

It was the typical Donald Trump that we've been seeing for months, completely off the cuff, no Obama teleprompters, nothing new, but like always it made you feel good because he is so "Pro-America." I don't know how anyone could not like his message. Like this speech, it's always God Bless America, full speed ahead and we're going to make it happen." Believe it.

It's also encouraging because regardless of what happens from this point on, that message is not going away, it's resonating too widely and working too well.

:lamo

How's that Kool-aid taste?

 

[le bouffon]

Yeah, except that's NOT the job of a CEO. Their job is to negotiate riches for the shareholders even if the other guy has to suffer from a bad deal. That translates well to the job of President in Trump's case. Who would you rather have negotiating treaties, someone who's done it on a daily basis and is very successful in getting his own way (benefitting us) or Obama who can't seem to negotiate himself out of a paper bag?

Nevermind, I know you'd choose Obama.

Forget the JCPOA with Iran?

 

[American]

Ah, a comforting thing to say.
Republicans think America is stupid, though. Not much comfort there, huh?

Actually it's not comforting, it's sad.

 

[cpwill]

Again, old electoral thinking. The landscape has changed.

:lol: since 2012/2014?

Every time you have predicted Trump's ruin using this old thought you have been proven wrong.

:shrug: I predicted he would begin to slide after Fiorina successfully made him look less Alpha (because that is much of why people who support him are behind him) in the second debate, and I was correct. I predicted that his obvious complete lack of understanding about policy wouldn't accelerate that slide (because the people supporting him didn't come to him because of his policy positions, they wouldn't be put off that his weren't well thought out), and I was correct. I predict that this rant will hurt him (though not catastrophically, it will just continue a slide) with Iowa caucus-goers, where evangelicals tend to dominate, and we will see.

Elections are won nowadays by turning out ideologically consistent bases. Trump, more than any other candidate in the GOP field scores badly by that metric. The only candidate that comes close to him is Bush.

Not really.

In the republican side, being a private sector "success" is seen as a huge plus. In no other field does success in an unrelated field trump success in the field itself. Graham/Kasich would stomp all over the Trump/Carson circus if this was about issues. It's about appealing to the rabid dog that wrestled free from the GOP's propaganda machine.

Reading back, do you notice how your reply has nothing whatsoever to do with what you were replying to?

Trump has the highest negatives (in some polls he ties with Bush) with the Republican Base. In today's elections, Presidential races are won by exciting and turning out your base. Trump will depress the base as much or more than Bush.

:shrug: which is why he would lose, and lose badly.

 

[cpwill]

Well, not exactly. He was asking "how stupid are the people of Iowa, how stupid are the people of this country to believe this crap"

:lol: yeah. The question "How stupid are you" depends on the assumption that you are stupid, Taylor.

I haven't heard the "he should be killed" claim,

He didn't claim it. He subtly implied it when he stated that Carson was like a child molester "and there's only one cure for them, but we don't want to talk about it".

Carson himself already downplayed the significance of the child molester analogy.

No, Carson asked people to pray for Trump, which, as a Christian, is exactly what you are supposed to do when people abuse you.

Even for Trump, this was a disgusting statement.

 

[ric27]

For an hour and 35 minutes, Republican front-runner Donald Trump vented about everything that's wrong with this country and this election. Gone was the candidate's recent bout of composure and control on the campaign trail. He said he would "bomb the ****" out of areas controlled by ISIS and that he knows more about terrorists than U.S. military generals. He ranted about how everyone else is wrong on illegal immigration. He accused Hillary of playing the "woman's card," and said Marco Rubio is "weak like a baby." And he spent more than 10 minutes angrily attacking his chief rival, Ben Carson, at one point calling "pathological, damaged."

And yet Carson is doing well in the polls, Trump said in disbelief. "How stupid are the people of Iowa? How stupid are the people of the country to believe this crap?"

You can watch the entire video here (he starts talking about 35 minutes in):

The ironic part is that Trump is heavily dependent on those "stupid people" to be where he is currently. The Republican front-runner, ladies and gentlemen.

and they will vote for him

 

[Taylor]

:lol: yeah. The question "How stupid are you" depends on the assumption that you are stupid, Taylor.

"...to believe this crap" being the key phrase.

Basically the same thing many people on here say.

No, Carson asked people to pray for Trump, which, as a Christian, is exactly what you are supposed to do when people abuse you.

Even for Trump, this was a disgusting statement.

Carson has called the reporting on this "media spin" -

He also objected to a question saying Trump likened him to a child molester, saying that was media spin.

"I don't believe he called me a child molester," Carson said. "I always find it a little amusing what people in the press like to say. 'You compared this and therefore they're the same,' I don't buy all that."

 

[cpwill]

"...to believe this crap" being the key phrase.

Basically the same thing many people on here say.


Carson has called the reporting on this "media spin" -

:shrug: how stupid would you say you are for buying Trumps backpedaling, or confusing Carson's grace with an excuse for Trumps behavior?

Would you say that you reject the premise of the question because the question implies and assumes you are stupid?

 

[Dittohead not!]

Kind of ironic considering the brewhha over Trump not originally going to back whoever wins the nomination and the establishment having a cow over it.

As far as my Carson comment goes I already explained that it was based on previous collaboration between the two. Trump is not known to be a total jackass personally regardless of the bombast of his public persona.

Maybe Trump isn't a total jackass. Maybe he just plays one on TV.

 

[Taylor]

:shrug: how stupid would you say you are for buying Trumps backpedaling, or confusing Carson's grace with an excuse for Trumps behavior?

Would you say that you reject the premise of the question because the question implies and assumes you are stupid?

I would be stupid to believe that Trump was backpedaling, or that Carson was merely being graceful and does not actually believe that the reporting on Trump's statement was "media spin."

Likewise, I expect that people who are quite confident in their belief of Carson's stabbing story would reject Trump's implying that it makes them stupid. I just don't believe that this will result in a significant downturn for Trump, because I doubt that a lot of those people were Trump supporters to begin with.

 

[cpwill]

I would be stupid to believe that Trump was backpedaling, or that Carson was merely being graceful and does not actually believe that the reporting on Trump's statement was "media spin."

Well. I didn't honestly expect you to self-identify so readily, but yes, the people who buy the pro-Trump narrative that that's not a backpedal, and who are willing to pretend that Carson isn't being graceful, are indeed being stupid.

Likewise, I expect that people who are quite confident in their belief of Carson's stabbing story would reject Trump's implying that it makes them stupid. I just don't believe that this will result in a significant downturn for Trump, because I doubt that a lot of those people were Trump supporters to begin with.

Carson's rise happened as Trump's support slid, indicating he was indeed picking up his supporters. Furthermore, Iowa is strong with evangelicals who aren't going to be impressed with Trump declaring that anyone who believes in the redeeming potential of Christ in ones' life is stupid.

Of course, that would depend on them being smart enough to realize what he is saying, which, I agree with you, many of Trump's fans have demonstrated they are not.

 

[Risky Thicket]

For an hour and 35 minutes, Republican front-runner Donald Trump vented about everything that's wrong with this country and this election. Gone was the candidate's recent bout of composure and control on the campaign trail. He said he would "bomb the ****" out of areas controlled by ISIS and that he knows more about terrorists than U.S. military generals. He ranted about how everyone else is wrong on illegal immigration. He accused Hillary of playing the "woman's card," and said Marco Rubio is "weak like a baby." And he spent more than 10 minutes angrily attacking his chief rival, Ben Carson, at one point calling "pathological, damaged."

And yet Carson is doing well in the polls, Trump said in disbelief. "How stupid are the people of Iowa? How stupid are the people of the country to believe this crap?"

You can watch the entire video here (he starts talking about 35 minutes in):

The ironic part is that Trump is heavily dependent on those "stupid people" to be where he is currently. The Republican front-runner, ladies and gentlemen.

There are people saying exactly the same things standing on street corners shouting at an invisible audience. They're poor but no less insane. No one listens to them.

 

[Taylor]

Well. I didn't honestly expect you to self-identify so readily, but yes, the people who buy the pro-Trump narrative that that's not a backpedal, and who are willing to pretend that Carson isn't being graceful, are indeed being stupid.

Well if you're not going to address what I actually said, I'm left to conclude that you concede the point.

Carson's rise happened as Trump's support slid, indicating he was indeed picking up his supporters.

Again, false. Carson jumped something like 12.5 points at the end of October, coinciding with Trump's 1.5 point "slide" - if Carson was stealing Trump voters, they were quite few in number and certainly not responsible for his burst. The only candidate who lost a sizable share of support during that time was Fiorina, who was in 3rd place and is now in 6th.

[And over the past two weeks, Carson has slid 6.0 points whereas Trump has gained 3.5]

Furthermore, Iowa is strong with evangelicals who aren't going to be impressed with Trump declaring that anyone who believes in the redeeming potential of Christ in ones' life is stupid.

There is zero evidence of Trump implying, much less "declaring" that "anyone who believes in the redeeming potential of Christ in ones' life is stupid."

 

[cpwill]

Well if you're not going to address what I actually said, I'm left to conclude that you concede the point.

:shrug: you implicitly concurred with the point by accepting the description and acting within it.

Again, false. Carson jumped something like 12.5 points at the end of October, coinciding with Trump's 1.5 point "slide"

Trump dropped from the low 30s to the low 20s. In what special math world does 33-23=1.5?

There is zero evidence of Trump implying, much less "declaring" that "anyone who believes in the redeeming potential of Christ in ones' life is stupid."

:lol: yeah he did - he repeated Carson's story about his conversion, and then demanded to know how stupid people must be to believe that. This from the man who says he has never asked for forgiveness, and confused repentance and redemption with occasionally showing up at a church and "eating the little cracker". That would be like me claiming I know what it's like to be black because I used to wear dark makeup on stage. :lol:

Evangelicals know the difference.

 

[Taylor]

Trump dropped from the low 30s to the low 20s. In what special math world does 33-23=1.5?

Are we still talking about Iowa? Trump has never polled above 30. He was at 22.3 before Carson's rise. As of last week, he was at 24.0.

:lol: yeah he did - he repeated Carson's story about his conversion, and then demanded to know how stupid people must be to believe that.

Of course, he was talking about a belt buckle not only stopping a knife, but causing the blade to break - not about the "redeeming potential of Christ."

When a story needs to be embellished as much as you're trying to do, it only further demonstrates that the actual story is not really as damaging as you would like it to be.

 

[cpwill]

Are we still talking about Iowa? Trump has never polled above 30. He was at 22.3 before Carson's rise. As of last week, he was at 24.0.

I am talking about since his slide started post second debate when Fiorina put him down.

Of course, he was talking about a belt buckle not only stopping a knife, but causing the blade to break - not about the "redeeming potential of Christ."

No, he pretty specifically went through Carson's conversion story, the claim of redemptive power, and then asked how stupid Iowans must be to believe that.

When a story needs to be embellished as much as you're trying to do, it only further demonstrates that the actual story is not really as damaging as you would like it to be.

Actually one of the good things with Trump is, if you want to make him look like a blowhard who is playing his supporters for fools, all you need to do is quote him

 

[Absentglare]

I am talking about since his slide started post second debate when Fiorina put him down.

No, he pretty specifically went through Carson's conversion story, the claim of redemptive power, and then asked how stupid Iowans must be to believe that.

Actually one of the good things with Trump is, if you want to make him look like a blowhard who is playing his supporters for fools, all you need to do is quote him

Seriously ? I don't understand how you can continually condemn Trump for doing the same thing as Carson.

They're both pandering to different voter sets.

Trump is regurgitating fake outrage, Carson is regurgitating religious zealotry.

It's frightening that either one is taken seriously by American voters. They're ridiculously similar.

Trump clearly called out Carson's "conversion" rather than criticizing all religion. Seemed pretty obvious to me that he's calling out his rivals bizarre born-again religious fundamentalism. Seems a valid critique to me, after all, Carson was referring patients for abortions and now claims that the pyramids were built by Joseph (?) to store grain.