• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Does the soul exist - Apart from the body/brain?

The Old Soul said:
If you doubt a soul (spirit) exists, volunteer as a Respite Caregiver at a Hospice. After a few bedside experiences you will be convinced that death is no more that a re-birth into the next realm, just as your birth into this realm was.
Click to expand...

I have seen and witnessed several deaths, and I agree with you.

I find the concept of "god" laughable, but I have seen death and I have seen the eyes lose their focus on this world, and then focus in on something else. Something that I could not see or perceive.

I think there is a spirit world there, maybe not "ghosts" per se, but a spiritual realm of some sort where the life-force is not dependent on a physical body. This is what I believe based on my experience. I have seen things that cannot be explained by "science", even though I believe in science and in fact have a science degree. Science won't ever explain everything. Because the physical world is not all that there is IMO.
 
noonereal said:
Your link does not speak to my post. Do you even realize this?
Click to expand...
What the link states is that there are clearly things that science cannot explain. If there are 11 things, there could be 12, 50, 100 or more. We still don't know all that much about our universe.
 
Lisa said:
The fact that I am an atheist (Humanist) means that I do not believe in an afterlife. We had no soul before we were born physically and there is no evidence that there is a soul afterward. I've seen a few people die, one of them very violently and I have felt nothing of a soul exiting their body.
Click to expand...
I am an Agnostic; was an Athiest until coming to grips with the vessel in which my spirit is contained.

A violent or sudden death is not a representative gauge of the dying experience. As a Hospice volunteer (I served 1 year full time), I was able to share the experience and disassociation some patients went through leaving this life, and their observations (glimpses) into the next.

My true awakening came about when I was caregiver when my father died of Pancreatic Cancer - it was a long and drawn out affair, with way more suffering that anyone should have to bear. The few days before he dropped into the final coma, he was lucid and alert; he would grab my arm with a start and say things like "Can you hear that? They are geting ready for me!" He would say that happily, and with an optimism I had not seen in months. It was like he had his foot in both existences, and even though he had a fer of death beforehand, he welcomed it at the end.

I saw this happen in varying degrees with the few patients I was fortunate enough to communicate with in their last days; some were profound, and some just listened intently; all came away from these 'glimpses' with a positive understanding of what they were going through, like a big weight was lifted. When a volunteer is the only one present, the dying share much more freely than if friends or family are present. I heard enough common anecdotal comments (they didn't necessarily tell me what they were experiencing, but it seemed more like sharing the experiences with me and whatever? like we were all in the room together), to see they were all experiencing very similar events crossing over.

With my dad, and a couple close patients, their soul/spirits left their bodies before physical death. No way to explain it, but it happened; the body was there, but the person was not, and they never came back once crossed over. It's a little like skydiving, you have to experience it to fully understand it. The possibilities of what occurs after death are limitless, but something does happen - it might be momentary or go on for eternity, but there is something going on beyond what we hear and feel in our worldly existence.
 
Luckyone said:
"None of those supposed mediums are legit"...............and you know this to be a fact or "believe it" to be a fact?

By the way "cold reading" does not explain something that was said between two people that no one ever knew was said, and I mean "specific" words and events that happened.

I do not for one second doubt that the large portion of Mediums are scams. Nonetheless, in history there have been many mediums that stated or predicted something before the fact that were never paid to say, had no personal benefit in saying them, or that had any clues that would help them say it.

Evidently, you have not done much research on the topic. I have done a fair amount and am presently expanding my research on it.

Start here:

11 epic mysteries scientists totally can’t solve​

Click to expand...

When someone doesn’t have an explanation, the correct thing to do is to say “We don’t know”. It is not to shoehorn a supernatural “explanation” into it with zero evidence.
 
noonereal said:
You would be wise to follow my posts as they will provide you with a guide to established science and more importantly deductive reasoning.
Click to expand...

In other words, what the mind (and science) have to say, right.

First of all, gaining knowledge has been my objective in life and I am about the most reasoning man you can find. "Prove your words" is a statement I have stated here a million times before and I totally believe that to be the case............................... Nonetheless, that statement has to do with what is already known to be true. Things that have occurred a million times before and we know the difference between fact and fiction.

In this case, no one has been able to "irrefutably" prove that there is no soul. That the soul is not different to the body/mind.

As such, we do know what the mind has been able to prove irrefutably, but we do not know what we do not know.

Show me one single study ever made that proves that there is NO SOUL! One? It has not been proven. As such, you cannot say with 100% confidence that there is no soul. You can believe what you want but cannot prove it.
 
Luckyone said:
What the link states is that there are clearly things that science cannot explain. If there are 11 things, there could be 12, 50, 100 or more. We still don't know all that much about our universe.
Click to expand...

How is this relevant to our discussion?

Its not. You are trying to offer the argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy to support your position.
Run that on one of the dopes here if you think you can get away with it. It will not work with me, my brother.
 
Luckyone said:
In other words, what the mind (and science) have to say, right.

First of all, gaining knowledge has been my objective in life and I am about the most reasoning man you can find. "Prove your words" is a statement I have stated here a million times before and I totally believe that to be the case............................... Nonetheless, that statement has to do with what is already known to be true. Things that have occurred a million times before and we know the difference between fact and fiction.

In this case, no one has been able to "irrefutably" prove that there is no soul. That the soul is not different to the body/mind.

As such, we do know what the mind has been able to prove irrefutably, but we do not know what we do not know.

Show me one single study ever made that proves that there is NO SOUL! One? It has not been proven. As such, you cannot say with 100% confidence that there is no soul. You can believe what you want but cannot prove it.
Click to expand...

This is the fallacy I just spoke to, again from you.

Your words and your posted self image are not in alignment.
Peace
 
Questerr said:
Again, the correct response is “I don’t know” not “therefore it must be supernatural”.
Click to expand...

In fact, it is not something that is in question.
As I said earlier, we do know in macro which is why science dismisses the silly soul thing.
 
Questerr said:
Again, the correct response is “I don’t know” not “therefore it must be supernatural”.
Click to expand...
Your explanation does not rule out the possibility of it actually being something that cannot be explained by science ever. Something that is different to science and that we don't know about its existence "yet". This could prove that science is not the only thing that exists in the universe.
 
Lisa said:
I doubt that there is a soul. We would also need to prove that there is a creator, which hasn't happened in over 2000 years of searching for any of them.
Click to expand...
The concept that there is/was a creator, and he/she is god/God, is a religious construct invented by humans. Speaking in hypotheticals, the 'creator' may not be God; the creator could be Nature - see my Reeves post. We are not accidents, we are an integral part of the universe we observe. It is just as possible we are not here at all, but a sentient dream...or whatever.
 
noonereal said:
This is the fallacy I just spoke to, again from you.

Your words and your posted self image are not in alignment.
Peace
Click to expand...
I am open to everything. I do not close my mind to something none of us know for sure. I will never say (as you said) that if it can't be explained by science then it cannot happen or be true. You are actually the one that is closing your mind and limiting it to what science knows.
 
Luckyone said:
Your explanation does not rule out the possibility of it actually being something that cannot be explained by science ever. Something that is different to science and that we don't know about its existence "yet". This could prove that science is not the only thing that exists in the universe.
Click to expand...

Everything we can verify does exist is explainable by science eventually.

Your mindset is no different than ancient people seeing lightning striking some guy’s spear point and assuming it must be the gods that are angry at him.
 
Luckyone said:
I am open to everything. I do not close my mind to something none of us know for sure. I will never say (as you said) that if it can't be explained by science then it cannot happen or be true. You are actually the one that is closing your mind and limiting it to what science knows.
Click to expand...

Please be carful when paraphrasing my words. I did not say or insinuate what you posted in this blurb.

Did you even research the fallacy I called you out on? Do you know why your argument is a logical fallacy now?
Do you understand why a logical fallacy disqualifies your debate?

You say you are open to knowledge. Prove it. Admit that you learned from me here today.
 
Questerr said:
Again, the correct response is “I don’t know” not “therefore it must be supernatural”.
Click to expand...

"Supernatural" is an actual thing you know.
Supernatural:
1(of a manifestation or event) attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature.

It is accurate for some phenomena to be labeled as "supernatural".
 
Luckyone said:
Does the soul exist outside of the body and the brain?

This is not a religious OP as we all know that religions all believe in the afterlife.

Nonetheless, the idea that the soul is something apart from the brain and the body is something that even many scientists believe does exist. That the soul does not die. That it is a form of energy that exists in all of us that remains alive after the body and the brain dies.

There have been too many confirmed cases of dead people whose "ghosts" have stayed around or have come back and I believe that those cases are not a religious resurrection but a soul that has been "strongly emotionally" tied to a person, a location, or a event that was of such consequence that the soul was unable to move on to another "universe" where souls live.

This is a topic of interest to all of us as it is not religion we are talking about but what makes a person who he is. For example, why do we have preferences for one color/flavor/emotion/and person from the moment we are born. Such preferences are not learned, they are there from the beginning. Why are some babies acting like older people from a very young age where others are not. Again, that is not something learned but innate.

What say you? Do souls exist?

One request (if possible), if you are going to answer, do it intelligently and with some information backing your opinion. This OP is not meant to be a play thing, though I know many of you will see it (and use it) as such.
Click to expand...
The Christian/Jewish/Muslim/Hindu belief is that the soul exists apart from the body. Essentially, it has a wetware interface with this universe.
 
Does the mind exist?
 
PeacefulWarrior said:
"Supernatural" is an actual thing you know.
Supernatural:
1(of a manifestation or event) attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature.

It is accurate for some phenomena to be labeled as "supernatural".
Click to expand...

You would first have to demonstrate that someone exists that is actually “beyond the laws of nature”.
 
Questerr said:
Everything we can verify does exist is explainable by science eventually.

Your mindset is no different than ancient people seeing lightning striking some guy’s spear point and assuming it must be the gods that are angry at him.
Click to expand...
You are entitled to your opinion. I am not here to prove anything. I put up this OP so that conversations about the topic can occur. One thing I do know, and that your insulting response does not address, is that neither you nor I know "for a fact" that I am wrong "or" right. This is reality.

I hope you enjoy my personal picture (according to you).

neanderthalLuckyone.jpg
 
Luckyone said:
You are entitled to your opinion. I am not here to prove anything. I put up this OP so that conversations about the topic can occur. One thing I do know, and that your insulting response does not address, is that neither you nor I know "for a fact" that I am wrong "or" right. This is reality.

View attachment 67381251
Click to expand...

If your lack of logic or rationalism is insulting to you, you don’t have to be illogical or irrational.
 
Luckyone said:
There have been too many confirmed cases....
Click to expand...

No there haven't. Certainly not "confirmed" in any meaningful way.

Luckyone said:
What say you? Do souls exist?
Click to expand...

We have no good reason to believe they exist. There's not a shred of convincing evidence for it, and plenty suggesting the contrary.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom