TimmyBoy said:I was wondering if people thought the Death penalty teaches venegence and violence? I propose that this is exactly what the death penalty does.
Calm2Chaos said:If you can name me one person that was killed using the death penalty, and then became vengefull or violent then you may have something. People have freewill and freedom to decide, least in most cases. How exactly does this make a person violent or vengefull if they weren't prior?
TimmyBoy said:I am not an expert on the death penalty. It seems though that the death penalty teaches vengence and violence. The idea of the justice system is to bring true justice, however, vengence is not just and it certainly is not right. Two wrongs have never made a right. I think the fact that the justice system uses the death penalty is a reflection of America as a blood nation, a nation based on survival of the fittest, violence and vengence. The use of the death penalty also sets a bad example to the rest of society.
Calm2Chaos said:Why doesn't it surprise me that you would see the US as a blood nation :roll:
The death penalty has been around in many form for many years. And being 37, I don't feel violent nor vengeful because of it. I don't know ayone that does for that matter. I am not sure why I should have to pay 1000's of dollars to make a prisoner comfortable in jail for the rest of his life? They get 3 hots and a cot, TV, access to other activities and education that some people not in jail don't have access to. If your willing to take someones life without consideration, then you should be willing to forfiet your own to pay for your crimes.
Originally Posted by TimmyBoy
I was wondering if people thought the Death penalty teaches venegence and violence? I propose that this is exactly what the death penalty does.
. We also have the highest prison population in the world.
George_Washington said:The Death penalty does not teach violence.
What it does teach is that there are harsh penalties for breaking the law and it shows the punk criminals out there that the people aren't going to take any of their B.S.
In terms of how we treat criminals, we are probably the most or at least one of the most lenient countries in the world.
I say let's change that.
I think we should take a clue from Middle Eastern countries that the dealth penalty not only works but works well. One thing I like about Middle Eastern countries is that they aren't afraid to prosecute criminals like we are over here. In Saudi Arabia, if you steal, you get your hand cut off. Sounds pretty good, doesn't it?
I say we not only keep imploring the death penalty but also bring back the idea of having public executions like they used to have traditionally in old Europe. I think that would put a healthy fear into people not to break the law. It would also let the people witness the deaths of these violent bastards and a healthy respect for the state.
I also think for people who do committ the most horrific crimes such as muiltiple murders, brutal rapes of children, etc, we need to make them die in a much more painful way. The "lethal injection" method is far too humane for these people. I say let's bring back the guilotine or something.
TimmyBoy said:Their are alot of European countries which do not use the death penalty and their murder and crime rates are much lower than that of the United States. I do not know if that has anything to do with the fact that some of these European countries have a more socialistic economic system or and have outlawed the death penalty. Their could be other factors besides that contribute to their low murder rates.
I am opposed to the death penalty because an eye for an eye makes everybody blind and two wrongs do not make a right. It also sets a bad example that violence and vengance is OK. Governments are violent institutions which seem to set a bad example to the people. I would like to quote infamous terrorist Timothy McVeigh after he was sentenced to death, their is alot of truth in his statement no matter what you might think of him:
"If the court please, I wish to use the words of Justice Brandeis in Olmstead to speak for me. He wrote, 'Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher for good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example.' That's all I have."
-Timothy McVeigh
jamesrage said:I disagree that the governement sets a bad example because the ones that usually commit the murders and all those other crimes do not pay attenntion to politics nor could they care enough about political issues.Heck most Americans do not pay attention to political issues except for once every four years and They do not even pay attention to what is happening in their own back yard.
As for your "if we were more like those socialist" idea,those that are usually behind bars grew up poor and on social services(welfare,foodstamps,section8, wic and so on).Poor tend to feel as though the world owes them something or that everybody should have a big screen television and nice car.What seperates us from Europe is that we have race parasites such as Jesse Jackson,Al Sharpton,KKK,AB,Nazis and a few others who are hellbent on keeping blacks seperate from whites,they accuse the other side of being evil and blaming them for their problems.This is one of the reasons why we have such a high crime rate.Prisons are one of the most racist and segregated places in the country.
Calm2Chaos said:Why is that I am not out commiting henious crimes, and killing people? I live in this country and the effect your speaking of seems to not effect me. Would seem to me the people commiting these type crimes are crimes. They are not acting out because of the death penalty, they are just trying to not get caught. NO the death penalty does not teach violence and vengence. You have free will, what you choose to do with it is up to you. There is no one to blame but themselves
TimmyBoy said:Tooth for tooth, eye for an eye makes everything just and right eh Chaos?
TimmyBoy said:Tooth for tooth, eye for an eye makes everything just and right eh Chaos?
TimmyBoy said:I was wondering if people thought the Death penalty teaches venegence and violence? I propose that this is exactly what the death penalty does.
GySgt said:Who cares? Getting rid of scum that not only does not contribute to society, but also preys on it, is a good thing. Even cancer get's cut out.
George_Washington said:You don't understand. People who committ horribly violent crimes simply deserve to be killed. If the state doesn't kill them, then it makes the state look weak in the eyes of criminals and criminals don't respect weakness.
TimmyBoy said:Stooping to the same level of the killer makes us no better and does not make the overall situation any better either. The idea of the justice system is to bring justice, not to be some sort of surgical doctor removing a cancer.
TimmyBoy said:Stooping to the same level of the killer makes us no better and does not make the overall situation any better either. The idea of the justice system is to bring justice, not to be some sort of surgical doctor removing a cancer.
Orignally posted by FinnMacCool
Does it teach vengence? I dunno but I think its certainly supported by people who believe in the whole 'eye for an eye' thing. I mean when I was a kid, I always wanted to see criminaols executed but now that I'm older I'm not so sure
Originally Posted by TimmyBoy
Timothy McVeigh's statement is not only applied to the death penalty but also to the US government's actions in foreign policy. Governments are violent institutions. He fought in Desert Storm and saw the Highway of Death. He witnessed the extreme violence of the government overseas and the sheer terror associated with modern warfare. He learned and followed the example of the US government as well as Bin Laden. I mean, saying that the US government does not set a bad example is like saying it is OK for the government to act as accomplices to genocide in Bosnia, supporting coups that bring dictators to power who in turn kill 500,000 of his own people and saying that is OK to wreck 4 countries in South America and kill 200,000 people in the process. This is the sort of example that is set by the US government. This is the sort of example that Timothy McVeigh followed when he blew up the Federal Buidling in Oaklohoma. When asked, how he felt about the deaths of the children in the nursury which was in the Federal Building, Timothy stated they were unfortunate "colateral damage." "Colateral damage" was a term the US government used for thousands of innocent civilians killed in bombing raids in Iraq and many other countries. Some of these civilians being children. So, when McVeigh called the loss of the children "colateral damage" he was merely following the example of the US government. He embodied everything that was wrong with the US government and that is what people hated about Timothy McVeigh. He was a human being like you or myself, but what people hated about Timothy was they saw the US government's actions and behavior in him, without realizing, that is what they were hating. Of course, by sentencing him to death, it only re-inforced Timothy's statement, that the government teaches by example.
People who murder don't think about whether the state is weak or strong. That
is the last thing from their minds when they murder.