Do you support a smoking ban in your city? (1 Viewer)

[americanwoman]

Last week they enacted a smoking ban in my city. Although I am a social smoker occasionally I don't really like the smell especially in restaraunts, which this ban targets.
However what really amazes me in this beautiful free country of America,is that the government will take away the power of a business owner and tell them they have to ban a legal susbstance from being used in their own establishments. That is one of the most unconstitutional things I have ever heard of. It just blows my mind how people support this kind of dictatorship in our country and thats what it comes down to. The government is banning you to use a legal substance on a private owned property.
I think a smoke ban could be a good thing but I really think each business should have the option to go smokeless. When you take away that option you take away the freedoms this country was built on. So do you support a smoking ban? I certainly don't.

 

[Deegan]

Oh God, don't even get me started on this subject!

I will just say this, no, a private business should be allowed to allow there customers the right to engage in a legal act, and if smoking is legal, then it's their right to decide. If you don't like it, find a place that does not allow it, if you don't want to work around it, find a place that does not allow it. That said, many have gone the way of the dictator, and many a city has stepped all over the rights of their people, I suspect that this will soon find it's way to the SCOTUS, and they will find it unconstitutional.

 

[Kandahar]

I agree. It's absurd for the government to dictate such a policy to all of the businesses within an area. Let them ban it if they want, but there's no reason they should be forced to do so.

 

[Spartacus FPV]

If business owners think they'll see increased revenue from banning smoking, let them. But dont force them to.

Personally I consider Second Hand smoke bulls***. The only study the EPA and American Cancer Society quote on the effects of second hand smoke was thrown out by a federal court. You cant find a single credible study on the issue. All #'s you see on second hand smoke since are projections based on the % from said study.

This is an issue of freedom, and there is alot of hypocrisy surrounding it. But thats the nature of tobacco and alchohol law.

 

[TheNextEra]

First of all, I am repulsed completely by smokers. I think the idea that people inhale smoke into their lungs on a daily and addictive basis to be compeltely stupid. I absolutely hate the smell of second hand smoke.

Now, with that out of the way, NO, a private business should not be forced to ban smokers. As a non-smoker that lives in Reno, NV, if I find a place to smokey, I LEAVE and don't come back.

It is the businesses right to allow smokers and it is my right as a paying customer to not give them my business because of it. That is how it should work IMO.

 

[Spartacus FPV]

Now, with that out of the way, NO, a private business should not be forced to ban smokers. As a non-smoker that lives in Reno, NV, if I find a place to smokey, I LEAVE and don't come back.

It is the businesses right to allow smokers and it is my right as a paying customer to not give them my business because of it. That is how it should work IMO.

:applaud

Most rational and open minded post by an anti-smoker i've read. Exercise your market power.

First of all, I am repulsed completely by smokers. I think the idea that people inhale smoke into their lungs on a daily and addictive basis to be compeltely stupid. I absolutely hate the smell of second hand smoke.

Well as a casual smoker (non-smoker according to smokers, smoker according to non-smokers) I started just to add a little buz ontop of my intoxation when I was out drinking. I've recently started buying a pack here or there because I get out of so much work by taking smoke breaks.

Its nice to have a little buzz here or there during the day. Granted it does have adverse health effects and some dont enjoy the presence of someone who smells like a cig but to consider us 'stupid'... thats beyond me.

 

[Calm2Chaos]

Of course not.. Not only is this a private business being forced to ban a legal substance. But your taking away a person right to make a choice in the matter. If there is a restaurant owner out there that thinks his buisness would be better of non smoking then he should be able to make it so (of which there are plenty). This gives the consumer the ultimate right to choose using there dollars, which is the loudest voice of all. Instead we have a group of Nazi like activist that think I am unable to think and choose for myself. SO they have forced the government into thinkning for me. I have had numerous debates on this issue on this very site. And have yet to get a decent response that actually merits thought. The primary reason is "I" don't like it. If you have a reason that beats "make your own decisions" then I would love to hear it. NOt exactly sure how we can ban smoking in public places, but drinking anywhere but home is still legal. American what city are you in that just pushed the ban....Philly?

 

[TheNextEra]

Granted it does have adverse health effects and some dont enjoy the presence of someone who smells like a cig but to consider us 'stupid'... thats beyond me.

Sorry I should have expanded on what I was calling stupid. My point was not to the casual smoker, but to those that smoke two - three packs a day, everyday. That is what I meant by "daily and addictive basis".

Even then I am wrong and apologize, I should not have called it stupid, because there are people who want to quit, that just can't. So I spologize for using the term stupid to those people as well.

And also don't get me wrong, it is not easy to quit. I was supportive to a friend of mine who finally quit after 25 years of smoking. He has quit off and on but this time it has finally taken hold for him (going on 4 years for him now without smoking).

 

[Spartacus FPV]

Sorry I should have expanded on what I was calling stupid. My point was not to the casual smoker, but to those that smoke two - three packs a day, everyday. That is what I meant by "daily and addictive basis".

Even then I am wrong and apologize, I should not have called it stupid, because there are people who want to quit, that just can't. So I spologize for using the term stupid to those people as well.

And also don't get me wrong, it is not easy to quit. I was supportive to a friend of mine who finally quit after 25 years of smoking. He has quit off and on but this time it has finally taken hold for him (going on 4 years for him now without smoking).

Fair enough.

Who are the two who voted YES but failed to leave any discussion points or reasoning?

 

[Calm2Chaos]

Fair enough.

Who are the two who voted YES but failed to leave any discussion points or reasoning?

Probably the same people with the infoulable argument for a smoking ban of ..." I don't like it and it smells". NEver mind freedom of choice. :lol: :roll: :doh

 

[Gibberish]

I live in San Diego where a lot of this is going on, the banning of smoking on a public beach and more or less smoking basically being illegal in California except your house. I have a lot of friends that smoke and I don't mind it as long as they are courteous enough to not do it right next to me and to not throw their butts on the ground.

Realistically what we do see is smokers having a smoke anywhere they want without thinking of those around them that might not be smokers and not want to inhale secondhand smoke. If I had a flatulence problem would the smoker be ok with me farting in their face? It's legal right? These smokers then, once finished, flick their cigarette butt ever so coolie into a nearby bush.

Now to the question, I answered yes to the question "Do you support a smoking ban in your city?" but with conditions. There should only be ban on smoking as if smokers continue to litter and not be courteous of non-smokers around them, and only in public places (not privately owned, unless the owner chooses to ban smoking). I definitely don't agree with the government forcing a business to allow or disallow smokers.

 

[americanwoman]

American what city are you in that just pushed the ban....Philly?

Omaha. They've been pushing this for awhile now. The city council just passed this recently, with a most hypocritical exception. Any bar having keno and our horse racing park are all exempt for 5 years from this ban. Of course the city gets lots and lots of tax money from those establishments. So even though the council say places won't see a decline in business from this ban, they are still safe-guarding all their precious tax dollars from certain businesses.

 

[Deegan]

Omaha. They've been pushing this for awhile now. The city council just passed this recently, with a most hypocritical exception. Any bar having keno and our horse racing park are all exempt for 5 years from this ban. Of course the city gets lots and lots of tax money from those establishments. So even though the council say places won't see a decline in business from this ban, they are still safe-guarding all their precious tax dollars from certain businesses.

Try owning a cigar bar, and having them do this to you, and I agree, that is very hypocritical indeed, they safety of the tax revenue is obviously more important then the health of the citizens!:roll:

 

[Jerry]

I support a ban on smoking in all places which must accommodate the public.
Busses, restaurants, private businesses, etc.

Furthermore, I support a ban on smoking within one's own residence and vehicle when miner children are present.

I wear my bias on my sleeves here. I don't appreciate having been forced to grow up in a home filled with smoke. I don't appreciate having been forced to visit the homes of my parents friends while it was filled with smoke. I don't appreciate having been forced to sit in a car filled with smoke.

I was forced to be a second hand smoker, and I assert my God given right not to have to breath in any substance against my will.

You can thank my dad and his friends for my support on all such smoking bans.

Smokers have abused their right to smoke what and where they wish, and now they will loss it.

 

[TheNextEra]

I was forced to be a second hand smoker, and I assert my God given right not to have to breath in any substance against my will.

So how are you being forced against your will in a PRIVATE business? Last I checked you aren't FORCED to go in those places. You can choose otherwise.

I can't complain about a ban in public places as I can understand that, but private businesses? Sorry, can't agree there. Don't like it, don't go in.

 

[Captain America]

I am against the government restricting even more of our freedoms. I have no objection to a smoking ban in public places that are not privately owned. I think it should be left up to the private establishments to decide their own smoking policies. I fully support a business establishment right to choose. I support the individuals right not to patronize that establishment if their smoking policy goes against their preferences.




PS....sorry nextera....you beat me to it by 3 minutes....

yeah....what nextera said..

 

[Jerry]

So how are you being forced against your will in a PRIVATE business? Last I checked you aren't FORCED to go in those places. You can choose otherwise.

I can't complain about a ban in public places as I can understand that, but private businesses? Sorry, can't agree there. Don't like it, don't go in.

Yup. When my dad went into, say, his car shop (a privet business), I, as his miner child, was made to come in with him. I had no choice. I could not leave on my own. I could not wait out side. I could not wait in the car. If the parent says "no" then the answer is "no".

So, check again. Children ARE forced to go into places and CAN NOT choose otherwise without parental permission.

How was I to leave my own residence?

How was I to leave a moving car?

 

[Gibberish]

How was I to leave my own residence?

How was I to leave a moving car?

If your parents choose to not think of your health and force you into these situations that is something that should be brought up with them. America should not have to pay a price for your parents lack of thoughtfulness towards you being exposed to secondhand smoke.

I had similar situations and do agree with you from an anger stand point but I would not try to inflict a ban or punishment on others private affairs because of the parenting style I grew up in. It is up to your parent to make it so you do not have to go into those buildings or into that car.

 

[Deegan]

I support a ban on smoking in all places which must accommodate the public.
Busses, restaurants, private businesses, etc.

Furthermore, I support a ban on smoking within one's own residence and vehicle when miner children are present.

I wear my bias on my sleeves here. I don't appreciate having been forced to grow up in a home filled with smoke. I don't appreciate having been forced to visit the homes of my parents friends while it was filled with smoke. I don't appreciate having been forced to sit in a car filled with smoke.

I was forced to be a second hand smoker, and I assert my God given right not to have to breath in any substance against my will.

You can thank my dad and his friends for my support on all such smoking bans.

Smokers have abused their right to smoke what and where they wish, and now they will loss it.

Well I certainly respect your position on this, and you seem to have some very real examples, and some very legitimate points. That said, I think your first step should be to work to change the law first. If you can make smoking illegal, then that would be constitutionally correct, because until you do that, it's just not feasible to ask people not to do something that is legal, where, and when they want to. Should we outlaw bars all together, because we all know how many people are effected by drunk drivers, so you can see how this could get very ridiculous, very fast. I might also add that not everyone who smokes is as irresponsible as has been your experience, and I would ask you to consider that.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

As a former smoker (20+ years) I don't understand why one cannot wait until they are done eating & smoke when they go outside to their vehicle (this is directed at those smokers who sit around & smoke after their meal while a lobby full of hungry people wait for a table). However, I also don't understand how any level of a U.S. government (city, state, federal) can honestly believe it's their place to tell an owner of private property that they cannot allow a legal activity to take place on their private property.

These bans/laws I believe will eventually be ruled unconstitutional. If not --- soon you'll be getting sued because the cable guy got cancer after coming into your home to install cable & you were smoking & caused his/her illness which led to their death. This is a private property issue --- not a public health issue. Tobacco smoke is the smallest contributor to environmental pollution --- think motor vehicles - factories - etc. We certainly aren't banning them or closing them down --- even when the factories are repeat offenders of violating pollution laws. Nope, they just assess a fine & all is well. It's about revenue.

 

[-Demosthenes-]

It's rather reasonable for a city to outlaw the spread of proven cancer causing chemicals into the air, but rather unreasonible for to do so for private property. Government has no place legislating what anyone does in private property as long as it doesn't hurt anyone who doesn't consent to the risk, or affect others outside the property.

 

[Kandahar]

Yup. When my dad went into, say, his car shop (a privet business), I, as his miner child, was made to come in with him. I had no choice. I could not leave on my own. I could not wait out side. I could not wait in the car. If the parent says "no" then the answer is "no".

So, check again. Children ARE forced to go into places and CAN NOT choose otherwise without parental permission.

How was I to leave my own residence?

How was I to leave a moving car?

The point you make about children being exposed to secondhand smoke is very reasonable and certainly deserves consideration (although I would probably oppose that as well). However, nothing forces adults to walk into a restaurant/bar/club/whatever where there is smoking. Therefore those businesses should be allowed to do as they want.

 

[talloulou]

Here in Washington State you can't even smoke in a bar! I finally quit smoking due to the fact that smokers are now treated like the community crack addicts! I guess instead of declaring tobacco illegal they are just going to make it so that you can't smoke anywhere.....

 

[Jerry]

How do I say this succinctly.......
Given that no one is required to abide by another's cultural norms or morality, then if the law will not protect children, who will?

That is to say that if parents drop the ball, and the law may not interfere, then what recourse does a child have?

Mandating a given moral code is not the answer. Neither is legislation. So unless people willingly accept common sense civility and manners on their own, I don't see an answer.

It seems to be a cultural issue, not a legal one.
So, how does one convince a people to willingly accept common sense civility and manners?

 

[Deegan]

How do I say this succinctly.......
Given that no one is required to abide by another's cultural norms or morality, then if the law will not protect children, who will?

That is to say that if parents drop the ball, and the law may not interfere, then what recourse does a child have?

Mandating a given moral code is not the answer. Neither is legislation. So unless people willingly accept common sense civility and manners on their own, I don't see an answer.

It seems to be a cultural issue, not a legal one.
So, how does one convince a people to willingly accept common sense civility and manners?

Lead by example, that's really all you can do, and I happen to agree with you, parents that smoke around their children, are bad parents.