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Do we have "souls?"

kal-el

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There is no scientific evidence for such a thing. It all falls on beliefs. How can someone imagine an "immortal" soul escaping from a body after death, where the hell would it go? The universe is infinite.
 

nkgupta80

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it is wierd to think that if there is no such thing as a soul, this feeling of existing would be completely gone when we die...itd just flat out disappear
 

kal-el

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nkgupta80 said:
it is wierd to think that if there is no such thing as a soul, this feeling of existing would be completely gone when we die...itd just flat out disappear
Yes, but my take on it is when we die, the quantity of energy disperses, losing all identity, and blends in with all the rest of the surrounding air. IMO death is just an eternal sleep.
 

George_Washington

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Yes, I do think we have souls. I cannot imagine a Universe that would allow us to be created, have consciousness, and then suddenly take it all away. If that were the case than we would it allow us to be self aware in the first place?
 

kal-el

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George_Washington said:
Yes, I do think we have souls. I cannot imagine a Universe that would allow us to be created, have consciousness, and then suddenly take it all away. If that were the case than we would it allow us to be self aware in the first place?
Ok, but the universe is infinite, right? There's probably an infinite number of inhabited planets out there. For a kind estimate let's say there's hundreds of human-like beings out there. In the Bible it says that God gives each individual a unique soul upon conception. If he does this to everyone on these planets, it has to be unfeasable to say the least, even if he is "supernatural", like many like to pretend.
 

George_Washington

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kal-el said:
Ok, but the universe is infinite, right? There's probably an infinite number of inhabited planets out there. For a kind estimate let's say there's hundreds of human-like beings out there. In the Bible it says that God gives each individual a unique soul upon conception. If he does this to everyone on these planets, it has to be unfeasable to say the least, even if he is "supernatural", like many like to pretend.
I'm not a scientist by any means but I don't think the Universe is infinite. It's constantly expanding but that doesn't mean it's infinite. I was under the impression that eventually the Universe will collapse back on itself, thus proving it isn't infinite.
 

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I think the idea of a soul was a creation we had to have to deal with death; our own and the death of loved ones. Some people can't deal with the finality of dying. It absolutely terrifies me, to the point of denying that I will ever have to die one day. (Hoping for a cure for death is a fool's errand, but you never know.) And like many, I have seen death close to me. The pain is unimaginable, and it is at that very moment that I realized just why religion exists and is so needed. I wished I could believe I would see her again one day...and that is why the idea of a soul was created. I wish I could believe, but I don't.:(
 

hiker

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George_Washington said:
I'm not a scientist by any means but I don't think the Universe is infinite. It's constantly expanding but that doesn't mean it's infinite. I was under the impression that eventually the Universe will collapse back on itself, thus proving it isn't infinite.
Scientists also believe the universe will continue to spread outward forever. We can't know these things, and we never will.
 

George_Washington

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hiker said:
Scientists also believe the universe will continue to spread outward forever. We can't know these things, and we never will.
Actually, no they don't. From what I learned in my astronomy class...we don't know yet if it will continue to expand. It depends on how much matter is in the Universe. So it could either keep expanding forever or collapse back on itself at some point.

More matter means it will collapse; less matter means it will keep expanding, basically.
 

Columbusite

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I'd like to say yes, but there is plenty to keep me from doing that. Never has a soul been detected. Not to mention where were they before the big bang and if they are our essence why our bodies need a brain to function?
 

stsburns

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kal-el said:
There is no scientific evidence for such a thing. It all falls on beliefs. How can someone imagine an "immortal" soul escaping from a body after death, where the hell would it go? The universe is infinite.
Of course their isn't any science to prove it! Evolution is too busy being promoted! Because if scientists could prove we had souls, Evolution would be out the door! Which would contradict the popular belief of the American Culture. You gave me a question, I think I have answered it to the best of my abilities, now it is time to answer a question from me. Do you believe in ghosts?
 

kal-el

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George_Washington said:
I'm not a scientist by any means but I don't think the Universe is infinite. It's constantly expanding but that doesn't mean it's infinite. I was under the impression that eventually the Universe will collapse back on itself, thus proving it isn't infinite.
Well, Bruno begs to differ:

http://www.laputanlogic.com/articles/2003/11/24-0001.html

Which ever direction we look, the universe continues forever.

Originally posted by hiker
I think the idea of a soul was a creation we had to have to deal with death; our own and the death of loved ones. Some people can't deal with the finality of dying. It absolutely terrifies me, to the point of denying that I will ever have to die one day. (Hoping for a cure for death is a fool's errand, but you never know.)
Well, cloning may one day enable us to live eternally.

Originally posted by stsburns
Do you believe in ghosts?
Nope. How would disproving of the existance of immortal souls,disaprove evolution?
 

hiker

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stsburns said:
Of course their isn't any science to prove it! Evolution is too busy being promoted! Because if scientists could prove we had souls, Evolution would be out the door! Which would contradict the popular belief of the American Culture. You gave me a question, I think I have answered it to the best of my abilities, now it is time to answer a question from me. Do you believe in ghosts?
No: everything "paranormal" has a rational explanation. Some people will decide that the rational does not fit what they want to believe, and we get creations like ghosts, elves, bigfoot, etc.
 

George_Washington

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kal-el said:
Well, Bruno begs to differ:

http://www.laputanlogic.com/articles/2003/11/24-0001.html

Which ever direction we look, the universe continues forever.
Um, I don't think somebody who lived centuries ago is really as credible as modern physicists. The Universe expanding forever is dependant on it not being weighed down by matter, in a sense.



Well, cloning may one day enable us to live eternally.
Yeah, that's a theory, too. But eventually the sun is going to destroy the Earth so either we'll all die eventually or have to relocate somewhere else. We'll probably end up getting too over populated way before than anyway.
 

hiker

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kal-el said:
Well, cloning may one day enable us to live eternally.
You know, I was really thinking more along the lines of turning off the parts of your genes that tell your cells to stop reproducing. They've isolated the part of our genetic code that works as a clock for cells, so it's not that farfetched.
 

hiker

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George_Washington said:
Yeah, that's a theory, too. But eventually the sun is going to destroy the Earth so either we'll all die eventually or have to relocate somewhere else.
I suppose we will all be gone by then anyway. I suspect that by then, we will have either evolved to the point of no longer needing our meatsacks (bodies) or will have displaced our consciousness into computors and sent ourselves to some other part of the galaxy. Life will find a way. :smile:
 

kal-el

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hiker said:
You know, I was really thinking more along the lines of turning off the parts of your genes that tell your cells to stop reproducing. They've isolated the part of our genetic code that works as a clock for cells, so it's not that farfetched.
Good idea, but I think cloning is inevitable. Probably not in the anywhere near-future, but eventually. How can we continue to beleive in a "supernatural" God, when we can reach eternal life here on earth?

Originally posted by George_Washington
Um, I don't think somebody who lived centuries ago is really as credible as modern physicists. The Universe expanding forever is dependant on it not being weighed down by matter, in a sense
And he was burned alive at the stake for this beleif that at the time, was out of the mainstream.
 

stsburns

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hiker said:
No: everything "paranormal" has a rational explanation. Some people will decide that the rational does not fit what they want to believe, and we get creations like ghosts, elves, bigfoot, etc.
Yes, but it is one thing SCIENCE can't explain! But they can tell you about just about everything else!? SOOOO TRUSTWORTHY ARE THEY?
 

stsburns

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kal-el said:
Nope. How would disproving of the existance of immortal souls,disaprove evolution?
Because if they could prove that a "Spirit" of "Soul" doesn't exist, than many Religions must be wrong! Then Evolution would have an edge over religion!
 

kal-el

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stsburns said:
Yes, but it is one thing SCIENCE can't explain! But they can tell you about just about everything else!? SOOOO TRUSTWORTHY ARE THEY?
Yes, they are. Science, along with physics and biology, give a great explanation of everything. O, by the way, the burden of proof is on you that ghosts exist, not a doubter.
 

nkgupta80

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stsburns said:
Yes, but it is one thing SCIENCE can't explain! But they can tell you about just about everything else!? SOOOO TRUSTWORTHY ARE THEY?
what cna't they explain. that we have souls? maybe. They can't explain a lot of things. Science can't explain why we exist, what is the purpose of the universe, how the universe was created, if there is something beyond the universe, etc. etc. But no human can really answer these questions anyways...
 

kal-el

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stsburns said:
Because if they could prove that a "Spirit" of "Soul" doesn't exist, than many Religions must be wrong! Then Evolution would have an edge over religion!
It really would matter little,since religions do their best to vulgarize science at all costs. They want there subjects to remain as stupid and easily controllable as possible, and they do this by depriving them of scientific knowledge. It is only in the absence of science that the church can remain in power.
 

hiker

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George_Washington said:
But keep in mind that even if the Universe does expand forever, that doesn't mean that new planets, stars, etc. new matter will also be produced.
Granted. But being as how I was under the assumption you were referring to the end of times, I was relating what I heard on the astronomy shows on the Science Channel. I never had any formal training in the field.
 

stsburns

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kal-el said:
Yes, they are. Science, along with physics and biology, give a great explanation of everything. O, by the way, the burden of proof is on you that ghosts exist, not a doubter.
But some actually have "physical" data, not just hunches! Moans, objects moving for no reason, drastic changes in temperature, etc... that all of our geniuses brains can't even ponder on why it happens?
 
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