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How would I exploit labor? I'm a laborer working to collect money, which I in turn use to buy food. I specifically said accumulate wealth in mass numbers as well.
So if you were given the chance, you would not do either of those? I'm pretty sure there are people living in a state much worse than yours. Where is your capital?
Accumulate billions of dollars and seek out workers in Africa/china/haiti/etc to exploit cheap labor? If I was given the chance, I'd hope not. That is what I'm talking about here, not the small business owner or mcdonalds manager.
So do not the small business owner (or the bourgeoisie) try not to exploit labor? Do they not try to make use of the surplus value? Do they not try to accumulate more? Do they not desire billions? Do you not desire billions?
A small business owner does exploit labor, yes, but most small businesses don't grow into multi billion dollar international giants that exploit third world countries and control where food goes,etc,etc,etc.... I focus on the real problems, one step at a time I suppose. I don't desire billions either, just enough to help my family, and feed myself.
So you wouldn't want enough to get you a nice car? A big house maybe? Some good education for your kids (if you have some or are planning to have some)? How about some nice clothes?
In addition, does the fact that small businesses aren't yet multi-billion dollar corporations change the fact that they try to accumulate wealth? Does having the intent but not the means excuse the crime/wrong? Don't all multi-billion dollar corporations get their start somewhere?
I wouldn't need a nice car, a big house? I live comfortably in a small house now, education shouldn't cost money... but If I needed to get education for kids I don't have, I would attempt to save money to do this, as the entire world revolves around using money to buy what is needed to live from capitalists. Nice clothes? I have clothing, that's all I need. I've mentioned they are trying to accumulate wealth, but it is not logical to focus on them, I don't see small businesses literally destroying other countries, the environment, etc, etc, etc... I never said it excuses it, and I suppose they do, but it's no excuse for the acts they commit.
A small business owner does exploit labor, yes, but most small businesses don't grow into multi billion dollar international giants that exploit third world countries and control where food goes,etc,etc,etc....
I don't desire billions either, just enough to help my family, and feed myself.
Don't you think it is hypocritical of you to try to save some money for your children then when billions don't even have enough to eat?
Don't you think it is hypocritical of you to try to save some money for your children then when billions don't even have enough to eat?
That's interesting. I've got an uncle who built himself into a multi-millionaire. No college education, blue-collar worker, just created a company, worked 14 hour days 6 days a week, blood, sweat, tears, etc. Built up an incredible success record by paying his workers more than the going wage on the market, enabling him to hire and retain the best.
Now, those people got their jobs - got their pay raises, their ability to feed their families, from my uncle's initial hard work and investment. The business is really a family - they go to each others' houses on Christmas, their kids know each other, most of them have been together over a decade, etc. How, exactly, is that an exploitative relationship on his part?
So.... you want to live in (by US Standards) serious poverty.
my biggest criticism of his presidency is that he didn't go straight to the American people with a frank sales pitch more often. however, to do what needed done, you'd have to have the America of 1930. we live in an America that is divided almost 50 / 50, and that divide is the size of an ocean. that means that neither side can get much of anything done, even when the economy gets destroyed by gambling.
Accumulate billions of dollars and seek out workers in Africa/china/haiti/etc to exploit cheap labor? If I was given the chance, I'd hope not. That is what I'm talking about here, not the small business owner or mcdonalds manager.
So if you ran a business you would overpay for labor? That's kind of stupid.
I wouldn't purposefully rely on sweatshops, no. Overpay for labor? If a sweatshop worker produces $100 in clothing per hour, and gets paid 25 cents an hour AND THAT'S BEING GENEROUS TO THE SWEATSHOP OWNERS, I guess that's not exploitation.
So what would you do? Would you keep your operations in America even if there was cheaper labor elsewhere?
The issue with this is, saving a couple thousand dollars in order to get privatized education is nothing to hoarding billions of dollars and purposefully not distributing food to make sure a profit is made. I donate to charities whenever I can that help deal with hunger, but when you live in a system where you need to acquire money to buy what is needed to live from those who sell it for profit.. well, the world sucks.
I've always heard that good business owners exist who will want to pay laborers a somewhat honest wage in comparison to the value they produce, I know they do exist, almost always small businesses, but are you telling me business owners, by nature, always look for the cheapest labor to produce more profit for themselves? Interesting news.
Although he can give a good speech, he doesn't appear to me to be an effective salesperson. That's one problem that he has. Not only that, I think he made the mistake early on of trying to please everybody.
I'm telling you that it's good business. Why would I pay someone fifteen dollars an hour when I can pay someone three dollars an hour for the same work? It just doesn't make any sense to pay twelve dollars more than I need to.
my guess is that he thought that it was possible to build a bipartisan consensus to solve major issues at first. it's going to take a long time before everyone accepts that the system itself needs significant changes, and that a new and optimistic politician might not be enough.
So you admit capitalists can care less about how much they pay their laborers? Thanks for the support Henrin, as always.
So you admit capitalists can care less about how much they pay their laborers? Thanks for the support Henrin, as always.
Tell me, would you pay fifteen dollars for a product when you can get the same product for three dollars?
the problem is you have an unrealistic view of society and economics. It might be why you are stuck raging against the system rather than doing well in it. but the fact remains, labor is a commodity. If I ran a company that used lots of steel, I'd go out of business if I paid 20 dollars more per pound of steel than my competitors. If I am a delivery company, I'd go out of business if I paid 3 dollars more for a gallon of fuel than other delivery companies. and If I pay 10 dollars more an hour for the same quality of labor as my competitors I will also go out of business.
and you can argue that some workers are underpaid but that is based on your subjective views rather than the reality of the marketplace
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