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Dissecting the presidents speech

ReverendHellh0und

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I would like to go over trumps speech in full to see where the truth and the lies are. paragraph by paragraph..... or more accurately a couple paragraphs at the time. Please chime in in what you think is an outright lie, or an incorrect statement. Please refrain from personal bull**** and focus on the discussion. thank you.




The President’s Speech




PRESIDENT TRUMP: My fellow Americans, tonight I’m speaking to you because there is a growing humanitarian and security crisis at our southern border.
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Every day, Customs and Border Protection agents encounter thousands of illegal immigrants trying to enter our country. We are out of space to hold them, and we have no way to promptly return them back home to their country. America proudly welcomes millions of lawful immigrants who enrich our society and contribute to our nation, but all Americans are hurt by uncontrolled illegal migration.








I see no falsehoods or lies in this first paragraph, do you? in the next half hr or so I will post the next portion of the speech to see if we can find lies or misinformation.




Please discuss
 
Nope. But its already being spun by at least one author at Wapo as Trump should have said "hundreds" instead of "thousands" even though in the same paragraph the author cites that statistically in fiscal year 2018 1000 people entered the US illegally per day.

Fact-checking President Trump’s Oval Office address on immigration

“Every day Customs and Border Patrol agents encounter thousands of illegal immigrants trying to enter our country.”

Southern border apprehensions in fiscal 2018 averaged 30,000 a month (or 1,000 a day). They ticked up in the first two months of fiscal 2019, but it’s a stretch to say “thousands” a day. Better to say “hundreds.
 
I would like to go over trumps speech in full to see where the truth and the lies are. paragraph by paragraph..... or more accurately a couple paragraphs at the time. Please chime in in what you think is an outright lie, or an incorrect statement. Please refrain from personal bull**** and focus on the discussion. thank you.




The President’s Speech




PRESIDENT TRUMP: My fellow Americans, tonight I’m speaking to you because there is a growing humanitarian and security crisis at our southern border.
ADVERTISEMENT


Every day, Customs and Border Protection agents encounter thousands of illegal immigrants trying to enter our country. We are out of space to hold them, and we have no way to promptly return them back home to their country. America proudly welcomes millions of lawful immigrants who enrich our society and contribute to our nation, but all Americans are hurt by uncontrolled illegal migration.








I see no falsehoods or lies in this first paragraph, do you? in the next half hr or so I will post the next portion of the speech to see if we can find lies or misinformation.




Please discuss

I see no glaring falsehoods* but do see the glaring omission of what attracts illegal immigrants and allows between 12M and 20M to remain inside the US. I also see no mention of the percentage of illegal immigrants who entered illegally by crossing the Southern border as opposed to simply never leaving once allowed legal entry to vacation, shop, work or attend school. Border security is but one form of "controlling" illegal immigration.

EDIT: there is one falsehood in that "thousands per day" is extremely unusual - typically it is "hundreds per day" that attempt to cross the border illegally.
 
Last edited:
"there is a growing humanitarian and security crisis at our southern border."

There isn't a "growing" crisis. Illegal immigration has been coming down by in large. Things have been getting better. There is a problem still, that needs to be addressed. But it needs to be addressed based on facts. Not this "the sky is falling, mexicans are coming to rape us" Trump mentality.

You could say that the humanitarian portion of the "crisis" is growing. But that's entirely based on Trumps own decisions. He has enacted policy that only creates confusion and chaos at the border with the purpose of making it so bad to try to be a refugee into america that they won't even try.
 
Nope. But its already being spun by at least one author at Wapo as Trump should have said "hundreds" instead of "thousands" even though in the same paragraph the author cites that statistically in fiscal year 2018 1000 people entered the US illegally per day.

Fact-checking President Trump’s Oval Office address on immigration

It's spin to give the exact numbers and point out that "thousands" is incorrect? If he's doing a thorough fact check I think it's fair to point out that an average of about 1000 per day is not "thousands" per day. I don't see how that is spinning it.
 
"there is a growing humanitarian and security crisis at our southern border."

There isn't a "growing" crisis. Illegal immigration has been coming down by in large. Things have been getting better. There is a problem still, that needs to be addressed. But it needs to be addressed based on facts. Not this "the sky is falling, mexicans are coming to rape us" Trump mentality.

You could say that the humanitarian portion of the "crisis" is growing. But that's entirely based on Trumps own decisions. He has enacted policy that only creates confusion and chaos at the border with the purpose of making it so bad to try to be a refugee into america that they won't even try.




Disagree the rejected asylum seekers who are now stuck with no way home would also disagree.
 
It's spin to give the exact numbers and point out that "thousands" is incorrect? If he's doing a thorough fact check I think it's fair to point out that an average of about 1000 per day is not "thousands" per day. I don't see how that is spinning it.

Since when is a thousand considered "hundreds" and not included in the category of "thousands"? You're getting hung up on one letter, ya know that right?
 
wouldn't anything more than a thousand constitute thousands?

I think generally thousands implies 2,000+. But again, I really don't mind Trump using it compared to the hyperbole politicians usually use.
 
Since when is a thousand considered "hundreds" and not included in the category of "thousands"? You're getting hung up on one letter, ya know that right?

Since when is a thousand considered "thousands"? It's not my problem that the english language only uses one letter to differentiate thousands and a thousand lol. Not sure why you think that has anything to do with what's correct. The guy gave the exact number and said that hundreds would be more accurate than thousands. Which is empirically true.
 
I think generally thousands implies 2,000+. But again, I really don't mind Trump using it compared to the hyperbole politicians usually use.




indeed, and would the media ever hold obama to the "Truth standard" they hold trump over on his healthcare? I think not.
 
Since when is a thousand considered "hundreds" and not included in the category of "thousands"? You're getting hung up on one letter, ya know that right?

One letter that generally implies at least multiple thousands. I think using "thousands" to mean a little over 1,000 is both grammatically wrong and would go against what most people would presume when you say thousands.

But I'm not really hung up on it, I don't think. I don't care. I just think WaPo is technically correct, and Trump's usage is technically wrong. But it's not a big deal.
 
Disagree the rejected asylum seekers who are now stuck with no way home would also disagree.

There have always been rejected asylum seekers. Why do you think they'd disagree with me and why would that make them correct?
 
There have always been rejected asylum seekers. Why do you think they'd disagree with me and why would that make them correct?





Has there ever been a paid for by american liberals backed by soros caravan that once they made it to the border, dumped like the democrats dumped the kavanaugh girls?
 
One letter that generally implies at least multiple thousands. I think using "thousands" to mean a little over 1,000 is both grammatically wrong and would go against what most people would presume when you say thousands.

But I'm not really hung up on it, I don't think. I don't care. I just think WaPo is technically correct, and Trump's usage is technically wrong. But it's not a big deal.

Agreed. If you are fact checking something then it's something I would point out. I think a fair minded person does not think that 1100 is "thousands". Hundreds would simply be more accurate if you aren't going to give the exact number.
 
indeed, and would the media ever hold obama to the "Truth standard" they hold trump over on his healthcare? I think not.

Not really relevant so far as I can see. I wasn't claiming anything about Obama, the news media, or the ACA, none of which I particularly like.

But on the one little issue of whether thousands is technically right or not, I don't think it was technically right for Trump's usage.
 
Not really relevant so far as I can see. I wasn't claiming anything about Obama, the news media, or the ACA, none of which I particularly like.

But on the one little issue of whether thousands is technically right or not, I don't think it was technically right for Trump's usage.




NO I know that. but for example we heard all sorts of excuses why "you will save 2500" was not a lie. I was using that as the bar to determine if "thousands" was a lie given it was 1700
 
Has there ever been a paid for by american liberals backed by soros caravan that once they made it to the border, dumped like the democrats dumped the kavanaugh girls?

I agree. That's never happened. Are you under the impression that it has?

Not even sure why you'd bring it up nor what it has (even remotely) to do with what we are discussing. There's an entire section devoted to conspiracy theories if interested.
 
https://www.influencewatch.org/non-profit/pueblo-sin-fronteras/


They paid to buss them there, then you all dumped them there.


ReverendHellh0und said:
Please refrain from personal bull**** and focus on the discussion

You should heed your own advice and refrain from the personal stuff. I didn't dump anybody anywhere. Trumps dishonesty/falsehoods in the speech are plenty enough for 1 thread, we need not add any on top of that.

But ok, I see a link to a website created by a right wing think tank (correct me if I'm wrong on that) who claim they are trying to get immigrants in to the US illegally. As far as I can tell the organization attempts to help refugees and migrants get out of harms way, file paperwork, give them legal advice, apply for refugee status etc. But I can't find anything corroborating that they are trying to get people here illegally. Or that they are funded by Soros or that they are even a mainstream liberal group. And I've also seen plenty of sources stating that these caravans are nothing new. It has happened before.

I can't see where you've backed up any of your claims or how the incredibly biased source (that references world net daily LOL) shows me to be wrong in any way.
 
You should heed your own advice and refrain from the personal stuff. I didn't dump anybody anywhere. Trumps dishonesty/falsehoods in the speech are plenty enough for 1 thread, we need not add any on top of that.

But ok, I see a link to a website created by a right wing think tank (correct me if I'm wrong on that) who claim they are trying to get immigrants in to the US illegally. As far as I can tell the organization attempts to help refugees and migrants get out of harms way, file paperwork, give them legal advice, apply for refugee status etc. But I can't find anything corroborating that they are trying to get people here illegally. Or that they are funded by Soros or that they are even a mainstream liberal group. And I've also seen plenty of sources stating that these caravans are nothing new. It has happened before.

I can't see where you've backed up any of your claims or how the incredibly biased source (that references world net daily LOL) shows me to be wrong in any way.




So the blah blah fronteras group didin't fund the caravan?



I haven't made a personal comment at all. please do the same.
 
So the blah blah fronteras group didin't fund the caravan?



I haven't made a personal comment at all. please do the same.

Why are you asking me? I never brought them up. You made the claim that american liberals and Soros funded the caravan. And when questioned you point to a non-prophet immigration group that assists refugees to get out of harms ways and help with filing refugee status etc. If you could stay on topic it would be easier to discuss this. If you want to argue that this immigration group paid for and organized the caravan and it's never been done before then I'm all ears.
 
Why are you asking me? I never brought them up. You made the claim that american liberals and Soros funded the caravan. And when questioned you point to a non-prophet immigration group that assists refugees to get out of harms ways and help with filing refugee status etc. If you could stay on topic it would be easier to discuss this. If you want to argue that this immigration group paid for and organized the caravan and it's never been done before then I'm all ears.




jeesh


who paid to get the migrants to the border by those buses the media didn't show you.... (unless you believe the migrants chose to walk an extra 1000 miles to get to tj instead of brownsville and did so at an average daily speed of over 20mph).


Google pueblo sin frontera.
 
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