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Detroit Pensions and Corruption

Mach

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Detroit pensions: Bribes, a $5,000 poker chip and a big financial hole - Aug. 28, 2013
According to FBI and court documents, city and pension fund officials allegedly accepted bribes and kickbacks -- ranging from cash payments to lavish trips, entertainment and private plane flights -- in exchange for steering more than $200 million in pension fund investments.

For example, one former trustee of the police and fire fund allegedly accepted thousands of dollars in cash, a $5,000 casino chip, and trips to Florida and the Bahamas for he and his "mistress," according to the criminal indictment. He has entered a not guilty plea and is awaiting trial, scheduled for next year.

And just this month, a former chief of staff to a Detroit City Council member pleaded guilty to accepting $15,000 in cash bribes in 2007 in exchange for pushing for a $15 million investment in speculative real estate in the Turks and Caicos Islands. He faces up to ten years in prison and a fine of up to $250,000, according to an FBI release
.

Overall, seven people have been convicted in relation to the pension fund investigation, while four more are facing criminal indictments, according to an FBI document.

"Detroit's bankruptcy and the risk to retirees' pension benefits demonstrate the importance of rooting out corruption from Detroit's two pension funds," U.S. Attorney Barbara McQuade said in a statement. "The pension funds should be managed to benefit retirees, not to line the pockets of public officials."
Man, I've been partying with the wrong crowd. Government pension trustees and city council is apparently where it's at. And just imagine if they had managed to not go bankrupt, half this stuff would have likely gone on indefinitely. Makes you wonder how may cities are getting away with such things every day. What's amazing is we should look to government for regulation, setting the rules of the game like a referee, beyond reproach. Instead we have the referees playing in the game, then outright cheating. It's so unfortunate. I suspect if we just collection more than 40% taxes from he wealthy though, it will solve all of this.
 

joG

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Detroit pensions: Bribes, a $5,000 poker chip and a big financial hole - Aug. 28, 2013
Man, I've been partying with the wrong crowd. Government pension trustees and city council is apparently where it's at. And just imagine if they had managed to not go bankrupt, half this stuff would have likely gone on indefinitely. Makes you wonder how may cities are getting away with such things every day. What's amazing is we should look to government for regulation, setting the rules of the game like a referee, beyond reproach. Instead we have the referees playing in the game, then outright cheating. It's so unfortunate. I suspect if we just collection more than 40% taxes from he wealthy though, it will solve all of this.

When citizens delegate power of government to individuals it does not pay to trust those persons. If the citizens do not keep a controlling eye on them, it's their own fault.
 

danarhea

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Detroit pensions: Bribes, a $5,000 poker chip and a big financial hole - Aug. 28, 2013
Man, I've been partying with the wrong crowd. Government pension trustees and city council is apparently where it's at. And just imagine if they had managed to not go bankrupt, half this stuff would have likely gone on indefinitely. Makes you wonder how may cities are getting away with such things every day. What's amazing is we should look to government for regulation, setting the rules of the game like a referee, beyond reproach. Instead we have the referees playing in the game, then outright cheating. It's so unfortunate. I suspect if we just collection more than 40% taxes from he wealthy though, it will solve all of this.

Here's the deal with the pensions. Paying out the pensions of public service workers in Michigan is actually written into Michigan's Constitution. If Detroit can't pay the pensions, then the state will have to pay them. And whoever is lining their pockets with pension money should go to prison for about 40 years.
 

Mach

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When citizens delegate power of government to individuals it does not pay to trust those persons. If the citizens do not keep a controlling eye on them, it's their own fault.

Indeed, if you invest in government, it carries the same potential risks that investing in say, Enron carries. If we use taxpayer funds to subsidize that risk, it's market distortion...and outright unfair to ordinary taxpayers.
 

MaggieD

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Detroit pensions: Bribes, a $5,000 poker chip and a big financial hole - Aug. 28, 2013
Man, I've been partying with the wrong crowd. Government pension trustees and city council is apparently where it's at. And just imagine if they had managed to not go bankrupt, half this stuff would have likely gone on indefinitely. Makes you wonder how may cities are getting away with such things every day. What's amazing is we should look to government for regulation, setting the rules of the game like a referee, beyond reproach. Instead we have the referees playing in the game, then outright cheating. It's so unfortunate. I suspect if we just collection more than 40% taxes from he wealthy though, it will solve all of this.

I can't tell you how happy I am that this information has surfaced. Thanks for the information.
 

Mach

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Here's the deal with the pensions. Paying out the pensions of public service workers in Michigan is actually written into Michigan's Constitution. If Detroit can't pay the pensions, then the state will have to pay them. And whoever is lining their pockets with pension money should go to prison for about 40 years.

How does that make sense? Why can't we get government to back all our pensions?
Union pushes legislation to pass protecting their pensions using state's ability to both persist (Enron collapsed...), and to collect taxes. That's basically using taxpayers to back their retirement investments, and they receive higher rates on those pension investments as a result. It's all kinds of unfair compared to my 401K. It's designed to be abused, and we're surprised when it's abused? The notion that because corrupt politicians signed it into law that's therefore OK, is worrisome.
 

danarhea

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How does that make sense? Why can't we get government to back all our pensions?
Union pushes legislation to pass protecting their pensions using state's ability to both persist (Enron collapsed...), and to collect taxes. That's basically using taxpayers to back their retirement investments, and they receive higher rates on those pension investments as a result. It's all kinds of unfair compared to my 401K. It's designed to be abused, and we're surprised when it's abused? The notion that because corrupt politicians signed it into law that's therefore OK, is worrisome.

No, you got your information from a bad source. My bet is FOX News or Drudge Report. This Amendment to the Michigan Constitution was voted on in an election and passed. It was the will of the people of the State of Michigan.
 

CalGun

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They have lots of money to invest. Lots of money gets thrown at them to encourage "said" investments. I know a public pension manager quite well. He's accepted "investor paid" trips to China, Japan, and Dubai to attract his decision to invest funds in those countries. He reports them so its not illegal - and no he hasn't taken any $5k poker chips and he always travels alone (no family) and for very brief periods - like 3 days max.


Detroit pensions: Bribes, a $5,000 poker chip and a big financial hole - Aug. 28, 2013
Man, I've been partying with the wrong crowd. Government pension trustees and city council is apparently where it's at. And just imagine if they had managed to not go bankrupt, half this stuff would have likely gone on indefinitely. Makes you wonder how may cities are getting away with such things every day. What's amazing is we should look to government for regulation, setting the rules of the game like a referee, beyond reproach. Instead we have the referees playing in the game, then outright cheating. It's so unfortunate. I suspect if we just collection more than 40% taxes from he wealthy though, it will solve all of this.
 

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Detroit pensions: Bribes, a $5,000 poker chip and a big financial hole - Aug. 28, 2013
What's amazing is we should look to government for regulation, setting the rules of the game like a referee, beyond reproach. Instead we have the referees playing in the game, then outright cheating. It's so unfortunate. I suspect if we just collection more than 40% taxes from he wealthy though, it will solve all of this.


There's no doubt the pool of corruption is deep and wide in Detroit, but trying to somehow tie this to a discussion about regulation and taxes requires a pretty good imagination. You'll find corruption everywhere there is money, period. Deregulation has been the name of the game in wall street too and look how well that worked out for us. In fact the only difference between the corruption in Detroit and that in Wall Street is that the crooks in detroit might actually serve some time where a Wall Street banker or CEO might have to....do nothing.
 

Fenton

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There's no doubt the pool of corruption is deep
and wide in Detroit, but trying to
somehow tie this to a discussion about regulation and taxes requires a pretty good imagination. You'll find corruption everywhere there is money, period. Deregulation has been the name of the game in wall street too and look how well that worked out for us. In fact the only difference between the corruption in Detroit and that in Wall Street is that the crooks in detroit might actually serve some time where a Wall Street banker or CEO might have to....do nothing.

Spoken like someone who has no idea of what the hell they're talking about.

Detroit during Bush's Presidency was rife with corrupt Liberal Democrats all the way up to the Mayor.

Kwami Kirkpatrick.

The " corruption" coming from Wall Street is a generic term Libs like to use to justify their own innate Corruptuon.

Next time BE SPECIFIC. WHAT WALLSTREET CORRUPTION ?
 

pdog

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Spoken like someone who has no idea of what the hell they're talking about.

I can see the ren cen out my window. Where are you?


Detroit during Bush's Presidency was rife with corrupt Liberal Democrats all the way up to the Mayor.

Kwami Kirkpatrick.

The " corruption" coming from Wall Street is a generic term Libs like to use to justify their own innate Corruptuon.

Next time BE SPECIFIC. WHAT WALLSTREET CORRUPTION ?

Nice dodge. Again, how are you making the connection of corruption to regulation and taxes.
 

Fenton

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I can see the ren cen out my window. Where are you?





Nice dodge. Again, how are you making the connection of corruption to regulation and taxes.

Lemme Guess.....

Your attributing the lack of regulations to the 2008 Collapse ? Thats Hillarious....and expected.
 

pdog

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Lemme Guess.....

Your attributing the lack of regulations to the 2008 Collapse ? Thats Hillarious....and expected.

I'm not attributing anything - the OP tried to make some sort of case against regulation and taxes using the corruption as a reason with no explanation. Do we need to go over the components of a debate again?
 
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