Dems Confront Cartoon Pete Buttigieg After Iowa Caucus

[Paradoxical]

That's exactly what y'all, Trump, and Putin want. It would have never been an issue had we just rallied around Hillary. :shrug:

Putin? LMAO. He is under your bed chatting with McCarthy.

 

[Phys251]

It's more from the sum total of DP posts by the bigger Bernie fans. We've got threads accusing Buttgieg of being influenced by Russians because one Russian donated. We've got a thread insinuating that the DNC is rigging the primary for Bernie because a Dem organization in Nevada hired someone who left his staff, coupled with attacks on anyone who doesn't have a problem with that as them not caring about election fraud, so on and so forth. CTs that sound very much like the CTs used to defend Trump.

It's getting ****ing ridiculous. It doesn't help Bernie - you can't insult people or CT your way to more support for Bernie - it only helps Trump. America, even including the left in general, is simply not far left enough to love all his ideas. And one cannot virtue-shame and/or virtue-signal people into switching to loving Bernie. The more fierce all that is, the more likely his fans are going to sit at home if he doesn't win, and the more people do that the more likely it is Trump wins. (And, because of how people tend to work, the more likely one is to turn people off Bernie ...even if it shouldn't work that way).

I don't know about your cartoon because I generally don't do the "here, watch this video" thing. But if you're wondering where their comments came from, I'm suggesting it's probably from the vicinity of the things I just said.

:applaud

 

[Phys251]

Since Sanders’s Supporters — another SS — are chicken**** backstabbers, let them squirm on a contested convention in which a real progress-ive, Sen. Sherrod Brown, is drafted.

No, they're not. :doh Most of 'em anyway. Don't respond to poo-flinging with the same.

 

[The Mark]

First it was Hillary.
Next it was Kamala.
Then it was Klobuchar.
Then Biden. Then Warren. Now Buttigieg.

Is there any Democrat running for president that you Sanders supporters won't hate? :lol:

I don't hate any of them, and I frankly don't know if any sanders supporters do - or why they would IF they do.

The examples you give are simply products of the system we are trying to change, if it weren't them it would be someone else in the same place.

And despite wanting to change it, they're all better than Trump. Even Bloomberg is better than Trump.

I haven't seen any evidence of these "Bernie Bros" I keep seeing mentioned. But then, I don't go on twitter more than once a week, so maybe that's why.

 

[Phys251]

I don't hate any of them, and I frankly don't know if any sanders supporters do - or why they would IF they do.

The examples you give are simply products of the system we are trying to change, if it weren't them it would be someone else in the same place.

But the way that some of y'all are going at it is so. ****ing. Repulsive.

Every Sanders supporter in this thread needs to stop, and read Post #6.

 

[Linc]

No, they're not. :doh Most of 'em anyway. Don't respond to poo-flinging with the same.

They are on this board and every other board, as you’re experiencing tonight and every night.

Not responding to these back-stabbing punks four years ago worked out real well, didn’t it?

 

[Phys251]

They are on this board and every other board, as you’re experiencing tonight and every night.

Not responding to these back-stabbing punks four years ago worked out real well, didn’t it?

:sigh:

 

[The Mark]

But the way that some of y'all are going at it is so. ****ing. Repulsive.

Every Sanders supporter in this thread needs to stop, and read Post #6.

Sanders supporters aren't all the same.

 

[Phys251]

Sanders supporters aren't all the same.

Don't play the #notallsanderssupporters game with me. It's a phenomenon that's real and present. Now go read Post #6.

 

[GreatNews2night]

So you don't see any problem with bursting into a thread via a completely off-topic post that has nothing to do with the OP and smearing all Sanders supporters as CTs and bullies essentially on the basis of how some people acted on social media?

I thought you knew better than to interpret anecdotes as evidence and absolutes, but maybe I was wrong.

I'm not passing judgment on the sequence of posts and on whether or not Mr Person burst into a thread, off-topic. I tend to think that the topic is the Dem primary and comments on any aspect of candidates and their supporters are fair game.

I'm saying that what he said about conspiracy theories and insults *is* happening here, yes. Because it is. Just today like I said, I saw three examples elsewhere, and one here: "gormless centrists" mentioned in this very thread by a Bernie fan. Look, "gormless" is pretty bad. It means lacking intelligence or vitality, stupid or dull. Is this the best way of getting people to vote for Bernie?

But I never intended to imply that every Bernie fan is like this. I've made it clear over and over, including directly to you, that I don't consider that *you* do it. I also had singled out Checkerboard Strangler as someone who didn't do it... just to be surprised today by him doing it, and being quite insulting to moderates. The "another one" I mentioned above, unfortunately, was Chckerboard Strangler. When even someone so thoughtful like him starts this kind of speech, it's not good. I said to him I was disappointed. In the same post he expressed deep (and frankly, insulting) contempt for moderates but said he needs our votes... I said, look, expressing contempt for someone is a poor strategy to get that person's vote.

Regardless of what the OP was, yes, the conversation went to the in-fighting. Look, it's not surprising. The in-fighting is becoming the big elephant in the room so no wonder it becomes the topic, especially when the OP is a stimulus to think of it again. It's partially how we lost 2016 to Trump. Maybe we should all learn from it and not lose 2020 to Trump as well.

 

[Surrealistik]

I'm not passing judgment on the sequence of posts and on whether or not Mr Person burst into a thread, off-topic. I tend to think that the topic is the Dem primary and comments on any aspect of candidates and their supporters are fair game.

I'm saying that what he said about conspiracy theories and insults *is* happening here, yes. Because it is. Just today like I said, I saw three examples elsewhere, and one here: "gormless centrists" mentioned in this very thread by a Bernie fan. Look, "gormless" is pretty bad. It means lacking intelligence or vitality, stupid or dull. Is this the best way of getting people to vote for Bernie?

But I never intended to imply that every Bernie fan is like this. I've made it clear over and over, including directly to you, that I don't consider that *you* do it. I also had singled out Checkerboard Strangler as someone who didn't do it... just to be surprised today by him doing it, and being quite insulting to moderates. The "another one" I mentioned above, unfortunately, was Chckerboard Strangler. When even someone so thoughtful like him starts this kind of speech, it's not good. I said to him I was disappointed. In the same post he expressed deep (and frankly, insulting) contempt for moderates but said he needs our votes... I said, look, expressing contempt for someone is a poor strategy to get that person's vote.

Regardless of what the OP was, yes, the conversation went to the in-fighting. Look, it's not surprising. The in-fighting is becoming the big elephant in the room so no wonder it becomes the topic, especially when the OP is a stimulus to think of it again. It's partially how we lost 2016 to Trump. Maybe we should all learn from it and not lose 2020 to Trump as well.

I never disputed that these things were happening and there were Sanders supporters behaving badly (which I do not approve of), because of course there are, and there always will be, just as there are brutal attacks, dismissals and smears against Sanders and his supporters that are undeserved which happen all the time.

My point is it's in poor taste for someone like Person to come in here out of the blue and do this ridiculous drive by in trying to equate his anecdotal experiences to the totality of Bernie supporters which is a ****ing crock. Hell, most of the problems he had with me personally were just factually not true; for example, I have never supported CTs RE: Iowa and Nevada despite pointing out missteps there (which do not rise to the level of conspiracy; nepotism and conflict of interest at absolute most, and nothing remotely close to 'rigging'), and have in fact mentioned to you my hope that the primary process remain clean because of how bad a compromised process would be for Democrats in November.

 

[The Mark]

It's more from the sum total of DP posts by the bigger Bernie fans. We've got threads accusing Buttgieg of being influenced by Russians because one Russian donated. We've got a thread insinuating that the DNC is rigging the primary for Bernie because a Dem organization in Nevada hired someone who left his staff, coupled with attacks on anyone who doesn't have a problem with that as them not caring about election fraud, so on and so forth. CTs that sound very much like the CTs used to defend Trump.

It's getting ****ing ridiculous. It doesn't help Bernie - you can't insult people or CT your way to more support for Bernie - it only helps Trump. America, even including the left in general, is simply not far left enough to love all his ideas. And one cannot virtue-shame and/or virtue-signal people into switching to loving Bernie. The more fierce all that is, the more likely his fans are going to sit at home if he doesn't win, and the more people do that the more likely it is Trump wins. (And, because of how people tend to work, the more likely one is to turn people off Bernie ...even if it shouldn't work that way).




I don't know about your cartoon because I generally don't do the "here, watch this video" thing. But if you're wondering where their comments came from, I'm suggesting it's probably from the vicinity of the things I just said.

As a Sanders supporter, I am concerned by the tendency of some supporters to ascribe to conspiracy what incompetence would more simply explain.

It may be more dramatic and "fun" to think there's a coordinated cabal of establishment staffers funded by wealthy democrats seeking to keep the underdog down, but correlation does not equal causation.

I'm going to need more solid evidence than currently exists before I believe some **** like the DNC and Iowa Democratic Party are working in back rooms with the Buttigieg campaign to build a crappy app for $68k so they can rig caucuses.
At least more solid than "Buttigieg campaign bought some services from a service company that also provided an app to Iowa."

If serious about wanting Sanders to win this thing, stop getting distracted by potential conspiracies and work to get Sanders elected.

 

[GreatNews2night]

Just the opposite. I shouldn’t have to explain that to someone who projects such intelligence.

Please clarify and explain, then. I believe that if a contested convention simply results in people finally aligning behind the candidate with the most delegates even if this candidate, like all others, was unable to gather a required majority in first ballot, then, fine. But if a contested convention results in a candidate with the most delegates not being nominated, and this candidate who gets thwarted this way is Bernie, even I, not a Bernie fan by any means (but willing to vote for him and support him if he wins) would be outraged and would have a hard time supporting the nominee, let alone Bernie fans.

If there is a contested convention with Bernie ahead but he ends up losing, then the vast majority of his supporters will sit out, vote third party, or even vote for Trump, and there is no way in hell that the Dem nominee out of the convention will win the election. You better have a very good explanation to convince me that this won't be the case.

Say, Bernie has 45% of the delegates. Bloomberg has 15%. Other candidates split the other 40%. Then the party manages to nominate Bloomberg.

Immediately there will be the wildest conspiracy theories that Bloomberg bribed people with his billions and bought the nomination.

Try to beat Trump with this kind of sentiment. It's not going to happen.

Or, like you suggested, the convention gets Senator Sherrod Brown out of a hat. Whoa. What is made of the will of the people, of the MILLIONS of Dem primary voters who earnestly supported Bernie and Biden and Warren and Buttigieg and Klobuchar etc., who will then say, OK, our opinion counts for nothing, the party goes and gets someone else who wasn't even running, why have primaries, then? Again, not a great feeling to go and beat Trump, regardless of the fact that Sherrod Brown is actually very nice (I wish Hillary had picked him and not the very bland Tim Kaine) and would be a good bridge between moderates and progressives. Remember, Brown said he doesn't even want the veep position, much less the presidency. He was invited to run and said he wasn't interested. And then suddenly he is the nominee?

Even in terms of name recognition and broad national support, he would start too late. No, that's not a good idea.

Sherrod Brown would have had a very good shot if he had accepted to run. As a latecomer without the legitimacy of the popular vote, in a contested convention, he wouldn't beat Trump, especially not without the support of a huge chunk of the voters of the candidate with the most delegates, who would feel cheated and robbed.

 

[Linc]

"Wahhh I want to vote against Medicare for all because Bernie Bros were mean to me on the internet"

Enjoy the rest of your regressive political life under the thumb of fascist republicans.

 

[btthegreat]

First it was Hillary.
Next it was Kamala.
Then it was Klobuchar.
Then Biden. Then Warren. Now Buttigieg.

Is there any Democrat running for president that you Sanders supporters won't hate? :lol:

It depends on the supporter I suppose but some of them show the political maturity of toddler and the very first line of attack is always character assassination. They start with some innuendo, find a check the campaign received and draw a straight line. The worst of them will destroy anyone through ridicule, insinuation, and protest. If you watch the pattern, its really no different than Trump used to neuter then crush his opposition. Bernie is a decent,good man, and he can manage to make his socialist points without reaching for the nearest conspiracy in the drawer, and supergluing his newest Democratic rival to that conspiracy. There is no way we will ever unite as a party with these kinds of attacks as the basis of interaction. They demonize too quickly and too uniformly and Sanders can't control the stridency and vitriol in his own camp.

I want Bernie and his ideas. I don't want people who suggest everyone who is opposed to Bernie is an enemy to the 'revolution'

 

[GreatNews2night]

I haven't seen any evidence of these "Bernie Bros" I keep seeing mentioned.

You don't see any evidence? Look at post #12 here in this very thread. "It's the DNC and the gormless centrists."

 

[CMPancake]

Enjoy the rest of your regressive political life under the thumb of fascist republicans.

As compared to my life under Neoliberals was any better?

 

[CMPancake]

You don't see any evidence? Look at post #12 here in this very thread. "It's the DNC and the gormless centrists."

You can always quote me, but here you are proving my exact point.

 

[GreatNews2night]

You can always quote me, but here you are proving my exact point.

That's called projection. Look it up.

 

[CMPancake]

That's called projection. Look it up.

[Stares directly into the camera that is surely recording this masterful work of satire.]

 

[Linc]

As compared to my life under Neoliberals was any better?

Bernie Supporters — BSers — are owed a life.

The rest of us have/had to earn it.

A very small part of me wants to see Brad Parscale, trump, and the RNC destroy bernie.

 

[CMPancake]

Bernie Supporters — BSers — are owed a life.

The rest of us have/had to earn it.

A very small part of me wants to see Brad Parscale, trump, and the RNC destroy bernie.

Yes, I do believe Americans are owed the right to live without dying from a lack of Healthcare. Do Moderates not feel the same way?

 

[dobieg]

That's exactly what y'all, Trump, and Putin want. It would have never been an issue had we just rallied around Hillary. :shrug:

lolol


Can't get thru a thread without some clown post about Putin and Trump.

 

[CMPancake]

That's exactly what y'all, Trump, and Putin want. It would have never been an issue had we just rallied around Hillary. :shrug:

And then you guys proceeded to lose so maybe those instincts to rally around a moderate aren't exactly so great, are they?

 

[GreatNews2night]

[Stares directly into the camera that is surely recording this masterful work of satire.]

You actually think you are funny and smart, huh?