Democrats should immediately confront the minimum wage rate issue.

[Anarchon]

...I know what you're going for, but it seems a bit disingenuous to go into someone else's thread where they advocate for a specific policy, then ask them why they're telling you what they're advocating for. I mean, what were you expecting? Did you think OP was looking for some boys to crack open a cold one with?

It would be disingenuous if the policy they are advocating didn't affect me. Unfortunately, it does.

 

[Eriech]

Democrats should immediately confront the federal minimum wage rate issue.

I’m among those that advocate a minimum wage rate gradually increased to higher purchasing power and thereafter monitored and (when necessary to retain its targeted purchasing power), it should be updated prior to New Year’s date of the following year. In my opinion, annual increases of 12% until the rate achieves 125% of its February 1968 purchasing power is reasonable.

It would be possible, but politically problematic for the Republican majority U.S. Senate not to pass an alternative bill responding to the Democratic House’s bill. Usually, there are differences between bills that may, (or may not) be reconciled by negotiators from each chamber. A bill sent to the president for his consideration must be passed by both houses with exactly the same drafted language. That usually requires both chambers to again vote and pass a draft of the bill that’s a mutually agreed upon update.

Possible House’s negotiating positions:

The Senate will be displeased by the concept of pegging the rate’s purchasing power.
The House’s alternative position could be, lose the purchasing power provision but give us 15% annual increase for 10 years.

The Senate may then find the purchasing power concept less objectionable but they're then displeased with the 12%.
The House’s alternative position could be, 8% increase every Labor Day until the rate achieves 125% of its February 1968 purchasing power, but the rate’s additionally annually updates reflecting changes in the CPI-U will begin prior to the New Year’s day following the enactment day of the Bill.

I hope the Democratic negotiators would be polite and respectful beyond civility, but FIRM! they should not acquiesce or attempt to placate to the opposition. Democrats should be fully prepared to leave the negotiating table and permit the differences to be resolved by the 2020 general elections.

Respectfully, Supposn ​

Republicans should counter with a firm counter.....eliminate the minimum wage all together. The real minimum is and always will be 0.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

 

[joko104]

The Democrats in Congress definitely should immediately propose that the USA's minimum wage be reduced to $4 a day to match that of Mexico. Any and restrictions or tariffs to protect American jobs is evil as is Americans making more than Mexicans. If any other country has a minimum lower than $4 a day, that should be the new minimum. The Democratic Party should vote for its own principles.

 

[Grand Mal]

To point out flaws in your thinking, because unfortunately, you make sure they affect me.

If the flaws in my thinking affect you it's your doing, not mine.

 

[Anarchon]

If the flaws in my thinking affect you it's your doing, not mine.

Not when you pay brutes to force me to comply with your thinking.

 

[Grand Mal]

Not when you pay brutes to force me to comply with your thinking.

Am I supposed to try to guess what the hell that means?

Oh, wait, is this a reprise of your anarchy bullcrap? And you've put me in the role of a dictatorial government?
Well, if that's the case this discussion is going nowhere.

 

[Anarchon]

Am I supposed to try to guess what the hell that means?

Oh, wait, is this a reprise of your anarchy bullcrap? And you've put me in the role of a dictatorial government?
Well, if that's the case this discussion is going nowhere.

I wouldn't guess that it would go anywhere, but then again, you started it.

 

[Grand Mal]

I wouldn't guess that it would go anywhere, but then again, you started it.

Yeahwhatever.
Hey, it just occured to me- do anarchists speak Esperanto?

 

[SDET]

Democrats should immediately confront the federal minimum wage rate issue.

I’m among those that advocate a minimum wage rate gradually increased to higher purchasing power and thereafter monitored and (when necessary to retain its targeted purchasing power), it should be updated prior to New Year’s date of the following year. In my opinion, annual increases of 12% until the rate achieves 125% of its February 1968 purchasing power is reasonable.

It would be possible, but politically problematic for the Republican majority U.S. Senate not to pass an alternative bill responding to the Democratic House’s bill. Usually, there are differences between bills that may, (or may not) be reconciled by negotiators from each chamber. A bill sent to the president for his consideration must be passed by both houses with exactly the same drafted language. That usually requires both chambers to again vote and pass a draft of the bill that’s a mutually agreed upon update.

Possible House’s negotiating positions:

The Senate will be displeased by the concept of pegging the rate’s purchasing power.
The House’s alternative position could be, lose the purchasing power provision but give us 15% annual increase for 10 years.

The Senate may then find the purchasing power concept less objectionable but they're then displeased with the 12%.
The House’s alternative position could be, 8% increase every Labor Day until the rate achieves 125% of its February 1968 purchasing power, but the rate’s additionally annually updates reflecting changes in the CPI-U will begin prior to the New Year’s day following the enactment day of the Bill.

I hope the Democratic negotiators would be polite and respectful beyond civility, but FIRM! they should not acquiesce or attempt to placate to the opposition. Democrats should be fully prepared to leave the negotiating table and permit the differences to be resolved by the 2020 general elections.

Respectfully, Supposn ​

They might get that in exchange for full repeal of Obamacare.

 

[Anarchon]

Yeahwhatever.
Hey, it just occured to me- do anarchists speak Esperanto?

I don't catch your meaning.

P.S. As one who obeys, your sig doesn't flatter you.

 

[DH Kirkwood]

I support the intentions behind minimum wage hikes, but I feel like in reality such hikes only cause inflation. I think we need to come up with some more effective ways to make sure workers are being fairly compensated.

Inflation happens anyway. When wages aren't raised to account for that, then you end up with rampant income inequality.

 

[What if...?]

Here's a thought. Instead of increasing wages why don't we instead try and find a way to reduce the costs of products?

Like housing?

 

[Grand Mal]

I don't catch your meaning.

P.S. As one who obeys, your sig doesn't flatter you.

Esperanto. That contrived pseudo-language that was supposed to unite the world and make us all brothers and sisters. Do anarchists speak it?

 

[Anarchon]

Esperanto. That contrived pseudo-language that was supposed to unite the world and make us all brothers and sisters. Do anarchists speak it?

The only thing anarchists necessarily share is a lack of support for government.

 

[Grand Mal]

The only thing anarchists necessarily share is a lack of support for government.

That and a touchingly naive faith in the basic goodness of humanity. But I think y'all are missing a good trick with the Esperanto angle. It could be a thing for you, ya know?

 

[Anarchon]

That and a touchingly naive faith in the basic goodness of humanity. But I think y'all are missing a good trick with the Esperanto angle. It could be a thing for you, ya know?

As for the goodness of man, my sig covers that. And trying to tell anarchists they need to agree on some language, or anything for that matter, means you still aren't capable of understanding what anarchy is.

 

[Cfscott]

Take this for what it is worth, but I think that setting a minimum wage is a really bad idea for a number of reasons. I am 59 and own a small business.

When I was 18 I was working at a pizza place while a freshman at college. The minimum wage was 2.65. I had been there for a few months and was already making 3.00. The new minimum wage was set to kick in January 1st 1979. I was working December 31, 1978. Now we probably had 20 people working at our location - I would say 1/2 made the minimum. Either they were new, or they just did enough to get by and had not gotten a raise. When we closed that night, we pulled all the menus down and raised the prices on everything to cover the increased cost. Those of us making more than the minimum did not get any raise. What I realized at that moment all over the country - other businesses were doing the same thing. Even for the people that got a raise .25 cents per hour, that raise was going to disappear as everything you purchased was going to be inflated to cover the cost.

Second - I always hear about a "living wage". You can't feed a family on minimum wage. Well no ****. You are not financially able to support a family on a starter job. You know, you might need to work your way up, find a better paying job and save a little money before you start trying to support a family. I know - what an old out of date way of thinking.

Finally as a small business owner, we have a small snowball business. Most of the cost to run 2 snowball stands is labor. We run an almost 50% labor cost. It is labor intensive and people oddly enough do not want to pay a crap load for flavored ice. It is a nice treat, but they are not going to pay and arm and a leg for it. We give raises for anyone that is a good worker and really good raises for great workers. We employ over 30 people most high school or college students. We can offer them a fun job, a flexible schedule and a fair wage. It is not a huge profit business - we probably clear about twice what a full time worker for us makes in a year. Now, for that magnificent sum My wife works there full time, I have to do all of the books, advertising, pay all of the taxes, sales tax and deal with all of the inspections and red tape. On top of that, we had to invest 50k of our saving to start the business. 15 dollar minimum wage and we would just close the business. No one is going to pay 30 to 40% more for a snowball than we currently charge. If they did, our business would drop off so much we would lose money. Multiply that times the millions of small business across the country.

It hurts the workers - they lose jobs and the most unskilled take the biggest hit, it pushes businesses to more and faster move to automation, it hurts the consumer at large - inflation helps no one and finally it hurts the small business owner.

Amazon just decided to raise their minimum wage to 15. Cool. To do that they pulled all employee performance bonuses, pulled any stock awards. Now the very best worker has no incentive to keep being the best worker. On top of that, Amazon has announced they will work to make sure all companies are forced to follow their lead by having the federal government adopt a 15 minimum wage. That is a great way to kill your smaller less well positioned competition. Amazon can afford to add more robots much easier than a lot of smaller companies which they compete with.

There is no such thing as a free lunch. You can't wave a magic wand and make unskilled labor all of a sudden worth 30k a year. It sounds great. I can't imagine anything good coming from it.

I wish you guys all the best.

Charles

 

[OscarLevant]

I support the intentions behind minimum wage hikes, but I feel like in reality such hikes only cause inflation. I think we need to come up with some more effective ways to make sure workers are being fairly compensated.

.
Historically speaking wage hikes Chase inflation not the other way around

 

[Good4Nothin]

There is an interesting idea I heard of -- it's called supply and demand. Most progressives don't know about this, but it's really cool. You let wages and prices get set automatically by the economic system. The government doesn't have to do anything! Maybe we should try it?

 

[I'm Supposn]

If the demands are firm then by definition there is no negotiation going on and " polite and respectful beyond civility" would be a farce because the " polite and respectful beyond civility" listen and negotiate..

Hawkeye10, I prefer determining my own acceptable alternatives prior to entering negotiations. Its preferable that I have have a mix of alternative tools, rather than a single demand with a “take it or leave it” strategy. But both of those negotiating strategies can be pursued in a respectful, civil manner.

Due to human faults, we do not always succeed to subdue or otherwise tame our angers which may be justified, but are detrimental to civility and mutual respect.

We may negotiate firmly and try to listen, understand, and consider other parties' positions. It's possible that a party may suggest something not been previously considered and that may lead to a mutually acceptable solution.

Respectfully, Supposn

 

[I'm Supposn]

There is an interesting idea I heard of -- it's called supply and demand. Most progressives don't know about this, but it's really cool. You let wages and prices get set automatically by the economic system. The government doesn't have to do anything! Maybe we should try it?

Good4Nothin, I suppose every industrial nation has something, (I would suppose a law) similar to the U.S. federal minimum wage rate. Prior to such provisions, low wages in particular, and wages in general are subject to “racing to the bottom”.

I'm a proponent for annually increasing the federal minimum wage rate by 12.5% until it exceeds 25% of its February 1968 Cost-Price Index value. There after it should be monitored and annually adjusted when necessary as not to fall below that purchasing power.

Respectfully, Supposn