Democrats need to preserve their economic gains and dump social issues talk (1 Viewer)

[reinaert]

Social issues are economic issues.

 

[Niners 1990]

Biden tamed inflation while avoiding recession – something the vast majority of economists did not think was going to be possible in 2021. It was nothing short of a miracle. The economy is now crushing it by just about any parameter: consumer purchasing power, unemployment, DOW, GDP, etc…

Biden was like a highly skilled surgeon who saved the life of a patient by performing a complex emergency surgery during a major crisis. America is like the patient who is now cussing him out because the incision site’s still a little sore, and turning to a witch doctor.

And Harris should have discussed and mentioned that. She talked about abortion, abortion, abortion. Which, yes is an important issue. But white pro-choice women turned out for Trump as well, White women voted 52%-48% for Trump.

 

[Niners 1990]

Social issues are economic issues.

Abortion, yes.
LGBTQ, no.
Police brutality, it depends

Al Gore had the best economy in a long time for America in 2000 and resorted to anger and brimstone about guns and Bush's racism. He could talked about Clinton's economy than guns, guns, etc.

 

[reinaert]

Abortion, yes.
LGBTQ, no.
Police brutality, it depends

Al Gore had the best economy in a long time for America in 2000 and resorted to anger and brimstone about guns and Bush's racism. He could talked about Clinton's economy than guns, guns, etc.
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If a company doesn't protect a lesbian account manager from harassment, because there are no rules that say its managers must, how are the effects not economic, and how is the milieu in which it occurs not economic?

 

[BirdinHand]

White women voted 52%-48% for Trump

White women have never been a democratic stronghold.

 

[Phys251]

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Democratic presidents have been better for the American economy since 1992.......yes Biden may have screwed up with inflation, but the 2024 election should have been a Democratic victory. A morally bankrupt person like Trump shouldn't have won again.

2000 was a missed opportunity, the economy was better then than now. 2016 was a possible backlash against the first Black president......

In 2000, 2016 and 2024, instead of the economic gains made by Democrats, they pivoted to social issues talk (guns, Amadou Diallo, BLM, abortion). It turns off swing voters, who then vote Republican.

Simple as that.

We should throw abortion rights, civil rights, and trans rights under the bus?

No. Both social justice and economic justice are important.

 

[Perotista]

View attachment 67551684View attachment 67551683View attachment 67551685
Democratic presidents have been better for the American economy since 1992.......yes Biden may have screwed up with inflation, but the 2024 election should have been a Democratic victory. A morally bankrupt person like Trump shouldn't have won again.

2000 was a missed opportunity, the economy was better then than now. 2016 was a possible backlash against the first Black president......

In 2000, 2016 and 2024, instead of the economic gains made by Democrats, they pivoted to social issues talk (guns, Amadou Diallo, BLM, abortion). It turns off swing voters, who then vote Republican.

Simple as that.

The republicans going with Trump is what made this election close. Going by historical standards, the GOP should have won in a landslide. No sitting president has won reelection nor has that sitting president’s replacement won when a sitting president had an overall job approval of below 50%. The list.

1952 Truman 33%, his replacement Stevenson lost to Eisenhower

1968 LBJ 43%, his replacement Humphrey lost to Nixon

1976 Ford 45%, Ford lost reelection to Carter

1980 Carter 37%, Carter lost reelection to Reagan

1992 G.H.W. Bush 34%, Bush lost reelection to Bill Clinton

2008 G.W. Bush 28%, his replacement McCain lost to Obama

2020 Trump 43%, Trump lost reelection to Biden

2024 Biden 41%, his replacement Harris lost to Trump.

To top that off, between 55-65% of all Americans disapproved of Biden’s handling on most issues.

https://www.realclearpolling.com/polls/approval/joe-biden/issues

With those numbers, one would have expected Harris to lose by 10 points or so, the democrats lose around 30 house seats and 6-8 senate seats. That didn’t happen mainly because the Republicans went with Trump. Trump basically cancelled out all those bad numbers the Biden administration had rung up over the 4 years. One needs to remember; presidential elections are a referendum on the sitting president be that president running for reelection or his replacement running. In this case, Harris as VP was part of the Biden administration. Biden’s numbers transferred to her, yet Harris came within 1.5 points of Trump in the popular vote while the democrats gained 2 house seats. The democrats should be thankful the GOP went with Trump or the loss last year would have been much, much worse.

 

[ataraxia]

And Harris should have discussed and mentioned that. She talked about abortion, abortion, abortion. Which, yes is an important issue. But white pro-choice women turned out for Trump as well, White women voted 52%-48% for Trump.

Trumpism is a cult of devotion. We keep talking about it as if some more reason, rationality, empirical evidence would have been successful in breaking through this blind devotion. These "white women" voted for a rapist convicted felon fraud and traitor- you think there is anything "reasonable" that could have been said to convince them otherwise? How do you suggest reasoning with this "white woman"? It's like reasoning with a woman in love with her abuser, who keeps going back to him with the refrain "but he says he loves me". OK. Well then enjoy, lady.

 

[Perotista]

I don't vote for anti-trans bigots. As for guns, that issue belongs entirely to Republicans now. Democrats need to primarily focus on labor issues in the era of AI, automation, and Republican anti-worker policies like right to work for less.

I agree, Trump was the first republican president since Reagan, 1980 and 84 to win the working class or the blue collar workers. Trump came within 5 points of winning union households.

 

[Niners 1990]

Trumpism is a cult of devotion. We keep talking about it as if some more reason, rationality, empirical evidence would have been successful in breaking through this blind devotion. These "white women" voted for a rapist convicted felon fraud and traitor- you think there is anything "reasonable" that could have been said to convince them otherwise? How do you suggest reasoning with this "white woman"? It's like reasoning with a woman in love with her abuser, who keeps going back to him with the refrain "but he says he loves me". OK. Well then enjoy, lady.

Nothing, you cannot write off white women as a whole. You need to pull a 50%-50% or 51%-48-49%

Appeal to swing white women voters---the ones that voted for Trump-Biden-Trump.

 

[Phys251]

Nothing, you cannot write off white women as a whole. You need to pull a 50%-50% or 51%-48-49%

Appeal to swing white women voters---the ones that voted for Trump-Biden-Trump.

All two of them?

Throwing Black people and women under the bus is not the answer. I'll let you figure out why.

 

[Niners 1990]

I agree, Trump was the first republican president since Reagan, 1980 and 84 to win the working class or the blue collar workers. Trump came within 5 points of winning union households.

He got the white union vote---say what you want to say about John Fetterman---he knows how to appeal to guys like this.

You don't need to win white voters....you need to reduce the margins and get back Latino males---while holding on to Black voters.

 

[Niners 1990]

All two of them?

Throwing Black people and women under the bus is not the answer. I'll let you figure out why.

You need to attract swing white females.

Going all in on Black voters will alienate the swing voters--and the growing Latino voters. White voters are still a majority.

 

[Phys251]

You need to attract swing white females.

Going all in on Black voters will alienate the swing voters--and the growing Latino voters. White voters are still a majority.

Strawman. We need to find out who voted in 2020 but not 2024 and go from there.

 

[ataraxia]

Nothing, you cannot write off white women as a whole. You need to pull a 50%-50% or 51%-48-49%

Appeal to swing white women voters---the ones that voted for Trump-Biden-Trump.

Sometimes talking and reasoning to people just doesn't do it no matter how hard you try. Have you ever tried reasoning with a two-year-old who is having a temper tantrum? Sometimes you just got to let them do what they want and deal with the consequences later as best you can, or they just won't stop.

Enjoy the next 4 years America. Here's to hoping you'll still have a way back at the end of it... if your mistake is not irreversible.

 

[BirdinHand]

He got the white union vote---say what you want to say about John Fetterman---he knows how to appeal to guys like this.

You don't need to win white voters....you need to reduce the margins and get back Latino males---while holding on to Black voters.

Nope.

You need to figure out what will get the other 90ish million members of the electorate TO vote.

 

[Niners 1990]

We should throw abortion rights, civil rights, and trans rights under the bus?

No. Both social justice and economic justice are important.

No. Don't put it above the economy--Dems lost because they talked more about abortion than the economy----

 

[Phys251]

No. Don't put it above the economy--Dems lost because they talked more about abortion than the economy----

Wrong again. Biden should have announced he would be a one-term president over a year ago, in order to give the Dems a chance at an open primary. Harris didn't have enough time to prepare--and still came close.

 

[BirdinHand]

No. Don't put it above the economy--Dems lost because they talked more about abortion than the economy----

Sounds like something a person that voted for Trump would say

 

[Niners 1990]

Wrong again. Biden should have announced he would be a one-term president over a year ago, in order to give the Dems a chance at an open primary. Harris didn't have enough time to prepare--and still came close.

True. Very true.

Biden and his wife are to blame and Obama as well. Biden should have been the nominee in 2016, let him be a one-term or two-term president then.

Biden was selfish and it cost America.

 

[Niners 1990]

Nope.

You need to figure out what will get the other 90ish million members of the electorate TO vote.

Which means Josh Shapiro cannot be the 2028 nominee. He is Jewish, has ties to the IDF, etc. It would be a base killer.

Part of the Democratic base is pro-Palestine, anti-Israel. So that is a big conundrum.

 

[Phys251]

True. Very true.

Biden and his wife are to blame and Obama as well. Biden should have been the nominee in 2016, let him be a one-term or two-term president then.

Biden was selfish and it cost America.

Biden wasn't interested in running in 2016. Events in Charlottesville prompted him to run in 2020.

 

[Niners 1990]

Biden wasn't interested in running in 2016. Events in Charlottesville prompted him to run in 2020.

He would have rode the wave of Obama's popularity, and he did not have the baggage Hillary had.

 

[Phys251]

He would have rode the wave of Obama's popularity, and he did not have the baggage Hillary had.

Biden had a neutered Bernie Sanders, a president who bungled the pandemic, and a population that would rather have a turd sandwich for president than tRump.

 

[Niners 1990]

Biden had a neutered Bernie Sanders, a president who bungled the pandemic, and a population that would rather have a turd sandwich for president than tRump.

2020 was a poisoned chalice. It seems any Democrat in 2020 would have lost in 2024. COVID wrecked America. Trump wanted to return, the economy is his now. He has to lower grocery prices by September. If prices are still high, then he and Republicans will be blown out in 2026.

President is a thankless job.