Cuban Dissidents Arrested On Way to Apostolic Nunciature in Havana

[Tigerace117]

He was a victim of his father and his father's religion. Fact, not fiction like your religious beliefs.

No, he wasn't. Stalin was not a victim of anything. Just because you are a Stalin fanboy doesn't change the fact that he was one of history's worst monsters.

 

[Realitywins]

No, he wasn't. Stalin was not a victim of anything. Just because you are a Stalin fanboy doesn't change the fact that he was one of history's worst monsters.

Still in denial I see. You really do hate facts don;t you? No question Stalin was a monster, but way behind the catholic church.

 

[Tigerace117]

Still in denial I see. You really do hate facts don;t you? No question Stalin was a monster, but way behind the catholic church.

The Catholic Church doesn't even come close to Stalin's kill total.

 

[RAMOSS]

The Catholic Church doesn't even come close to Stalin's kill total.

THe estimates for Stalin deaths vary greatly. What figures are you using, and can you back those figures up?

 

[Tigerace117]

THe estimates for Stalin deaths vary greatly. What figures are you using, and can you back those figures up?

Twentieth Century Atlas - Death Tolls

 

[RAMOSS]

Twentieth Century Atlas - Death Tolls

And why do you think that 'necromatrics.com' is a valid source??? Like I said, there is a vast difference of opinion among many scholars, going from 1.5 million to 20 million, where 20 million is an extreme that very few accept. The references he uses have very vague references, and are cherry picking accusations.

 

[Sandokan]

Cuban religious freedom activist threatened
Cuban religious freedom activist threatened - Christian Solidarity Worldwide

2 May 2017

Fếlix Yuniel Llerena López, A 20 year-old religious freedom activist and university student, was detained and threatened on his return to Cuba following a visit to the US, which included advocacy meetings arranged by Christian Solidarity Worldwide (CSW) in Washington, DC to raise concerns about continued violations of religious freedom in Cuba.

Llerena López was interrogated by state security agents upon arrival at the Abel Santamaria International Airport in Santa Clara on 27 April. On 28 April, he was detained by state security, interrogated, threatened and forced to sign an ‘Acta de Advertencia’ or pre-arrest warrant for public disorder. Llerana López reported that he was questioned aggressively by two high ranking state security officers, who appeared to have detailed information about his activities while in the United States.

They told him: “This is a country town; the people here don’t know anything about human rights and if one of these country peasants is made to believe that you are going to commit a terrorist act, he is going to cut you open with a machete, and later you won’t be able to say that we sent him.”
Click link above for full article.

Less forgivable is the Religious Left’s self-absorbed indifference to the actual plight of Cuban Christians and the real cause of their sufferings. Will the same church groups that demand easier travel for themselves to Cuba ever speak equally as forcefully for human rights and full religious freedom in Cuba?

 

[Sandokan]

Cubans Denounce Castro Regime’s Persecution of Religious Groups
https://panampost.com/karina-martin/2017/04/24/cubans-castro-persecution-religious-groups/

By: Karina Martín - Apr 24, 2017, 10:45 am

Religious Cubans denounced the lack of religious freedom in Cuba. (Twitter)

Five Cubans representing religious faiths went to the International Bureau of Religious Affairs of the United States Department of State to report violations of religious freedom on the Caribbean island.

Felix Llerena and Yiorvis Bravo, Cuban residents, as well as Yoaxis Marcheco, Mario Felix Lleonart and Raudel Garcia, who live in the United States, denounced arbitrary arrests, interrogations and the demolition and confiscation of places of worship.

We exposed the violations of religious freedoms on the island, especially against the apostolic movement, the demolition of church buildings, and the outlawing of more than a thousand churches of the Assembly of God throughout the territory,” Llerena said.

The group of Cubans, all coordinators of the Patmos Institute, an independent project that aims to be an open discussion forum on Christianity, denounced that the Cuban regime harasses various religious groups and calls them “illegal.”
Click link above for full article.

This rampant religious persecution by the Castroit regime is barely mention by the main stream media. Those Cubans who want to practice their religion, frequently are repressed by the regime.

Religious believers abroad should make vocal their support for the Cuban people seeking to live out their faith under Castroit regime oppression.

 

[SCitizen]

The Catholic Church doesn't even come close to Stalin's kill total.

I do not know. Stalin's Justice System was as severe as Justice System in USA since 1990s -- the incarceration rate of about 1% of all population. About 750,000 people have been executed and 1,400,000 died in GULAG. That is an enormous number. But many of these sacrifices were a necessity since USSR was preparing for war with Germany. Most of those who died in GULAG died during the War 1941-1945 due to overall shortage.

Nazis were much much more brutal.

 

[Tigerace117]

I do not know. Stalin's Justice System was as severe as Justice System in USA since 1990s -- the incarceration rate of about 1% of all population. About 750,000 people have been executed and 1,400,000 died in GULAG. That is an enormous number. But many of these sacrifices were a necessity since USSR was preparing for war with Germany. Most of those who died in GULAG died during the War 1941-1945 due to overall shortage.

Nazis were much much more brutal.

Dude, we get it. You think Stalin was great. It's an odd thing to think considering how anti Semitic the man was in later years, but whatever. But you really don't need to repeat this unsupported claim that the US' prison system is "as bad as Stalin's gulags" every five minutes. Number one, that's just not true, and number two it's insulting to the millions of people who died in the actual gulags.

Grabbing poor people and sending them to a freezing prison camp in Siberia for the crime of being poor is a lot worse than anything the US does.

 

[SCitizen]

Grabbing poor people and sending them to a freezing prison camp in Siberia for the crime of being poor is a lot worse than anything the US does.

Stalin's measures were very immoral, but they were taken due to national emergency. In 1930s, rapid industrialization was the only way to win the coming War with Germany. Terrible as it was -- innocent people were sacrificed in order to save more people from the fate which would have been had Germany won.

In 1947 -- '53 there was another wave of repression -- against minor theft. As inhuman as it is, USSR had to develop nuclear resources to avoid possible US aggression.

The vast majority of people who were in GULAG were innocent. But during an emergency some people had to be sacrificed in order for others to survive.

 

[SCitizen]

Grabbing poor people and sending them to a freezing prison camp in Siberia for the crime of being poor is a lot worse than anything the US does.

USA 2017 is not under an existential threat. USSR 1930 -- 1952 was.

 

[Tigerace117]

Stalin's measures were very immoral, but they were taken due to national emergency. In 1930s, rapid industrialization was the only way to win the coming War with Germany. Terrible as it was -- innocent people were sacrificed in order to save more people from the fate which would have been had Germany won.

In 1947 -- '53 there was another wave of repression -- against minor theft. As inhuman as it is, USSR had to develop nuclear resources to avoid possible US aggression.

The vast majority of people who were in GULAG were innocent. But during an emergency some people had to be sacrificed in order for others to survive.

There was no emergency going on in the USSR in the 1930s. In fact, the emergency situation was caused by Stalin killing and impeisoning thousands upon thousands of skilled workers and soldiers, weakening the Red Army and the rest of Soviet society.

Had he not gutted the Red Army the likelyhood remains that Russia would have done much better when Hitler invaded and fewer soviet citizens would have died.

Sending people to Siberian prison camps for the crime of saying the wrong thing at the wrong time--- or the right thing at the wrong time--- is immoral pure and simple.

Considering that the USSR was the one looking to expand its ideology at all costs, the claim that they needed nuclear weapons to protect against "aggression" is funny.

 

[Tigerace117]

USA 2017 is not under an existential threat. USSR 1930 -- 1952 was.

The USSR wasn't under any existential threat before 1941 and after 1945.

 

[SCitizen]

The USSR wasn't under any existential threat before 1941 and after 1945.

The fact that 2.1 million people were either executed or died in GULAG from 1930 to 1953 is a tragedy. But USSR was under existential threat from Germany until Germany was broken in 1944. And USSR was under existential threat from USA until there was nuclear weapon parity in 1950s.

USA has shown to be a brutal power when they bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki and inflicted about a million civilian losses on North Korea during the Korean War -- which was a relatively minor conflict.

 

[Tigerace117]

The fact that 2.1 million people were either executed or died in GULAG from 1930 to 1953 is a tragedy. But USSR was under existential threat from Germany until Germany was broken in 1944. And USSR was under existential threat from USA until there was nuclear weapon parity in 1950s.

USA has shown to be a brutal power when they bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki and inflicted about a million civilian losses on North Korea during the Korean War -- which was a relatively minor conflict.

The USSR wasn't under existential threat until 1941. That's an eleven year period when there was no threat whatsoever yet people were continually butchered.

Another cheap excuse designed to hand wave away atrocities.

You mean when they saved the lives of millions of Japanese civillians who otherwise would have been thrown into battle armed with little more than spears? Yeah, that was really brutal :roll:

North Korea shouldn't have invaded the South if they didn't want to get into a war.

 

[SCitizen]

The USSR wasn't under existential threat until 1941. That's an eleven year period when there was no threat whatsoever yet people were continually butchered.

The probability of WWII was approaching 100%. Thus, Stalin had to conduct Industrialization.

 

[Tigerace117]

The probability of WWII was approaching 100%. Thus, Stalin had to conduct Industrialization.

Lots of other countries conducted industrialization without murdering thousands of people.

 

[SCitizen]

Lots of other countries conducted industrialization without murdering thousands of people.

USSR was under emergency situation. It was certain since at least 1930 that War is imminent. German victory would have meant a genocide of all Soviet Jews and tens of millions of Soviet citizens. Thus, industrialization was accomplished at a great pace and a great cost.

 

[Tigerace117]

USSR was under emergency situation. It was certain since at least 1930 that War is imminent. German victory would have meant a genocide of all Soviet Jews and tens of millions of Soviet citizens. Thus, industrialization was accomplished at a great pace and a great cost.

No, nobody in 1930 thought that war was "imminent".

Stalin didn't give a damn about Soviet Jews, seeing how anti Semitic he was later in his life.

Once again, other countries industrialized with killing millions of people.

 

[SCitizen]

Stalin didn't give a damn about Soviet Jews, seeing how anti Semitic he was later in his life.

Most Tanakh (Old Testament) kings had both sins and virtues. King Saul had killed many kohens who served in the Temple.

Stalin had saved millions of Jews and that is his virtue. Of course he had sins.

 

[Tigerace117]

Most Tanakh (Old Testament) kings had both sins and virtues. King Saul had killed many kohens who served in the Temple.

Stalin had saved millions of Jews and that is his virtue. Of course he had sins.

Stalin didn't give a damn about the Jews. He hated them. Virulently.

 

[SCitizen]

Stalin didn't give a damn about the Jews. He hated them. Virulently.

But he saved millions of Jews. That is what counts.

 

[Sandokan]

Cuban religious freedom activist threatened
Cuban religious freedom activist threatened - Christian Solidarity Worldwide

2 May 2017

Fếlix Yuniel Llerena López, A 20 year-old religious freedom activist and university student, was detained and threatened on his return to Cuba following a visit to the US, which included advocacy meetings arranged by Christian Solidarity Worldwide (CSW) in Washington, DC to raise concerns about continued violations of religious freedom in Cuba.

Llerena López was interrogated by state security agents upon arrival at the Abel Santamaria International Airport in Santa Clara on 27 April. On 28 April, he was detained by state security, interrogated, threatened and forced to sign an ‘Acta de Advertencia’ or pre-arrest warrant for public disorder. Llerana López reported that he was questioned aggressively by two high ranking state security officers, who appeared to have detailed information about his activities while in the United States.

They told him: “This is a country town; the people here don’t know anything about human rights and if one of these country peasants is made to believe that you are going to commit a terrorist act, he is going to cut you open with a machete, and later you won’t be able to say that we sent him.”

Llerena López’s mother, Mileidis López Sosa, who did not travel with her son, was also temporarily detained and interrogated in what appears to be another attempt to intimidate the young activist.
Click link above for full article.

Less forgivable is the Religious Left’s self-absorbed indifference to the actual plight of Cuban Christians and the real cause of their sufferings. Will the same church groups that demand easier travel for themselves to Cuba ever speak equally as forcefully for human rights and full religious freedom in Cuba?

 

[Sandokan]

Christians in Cuba worry about student's alleged persecution
https://www.local10.com/news/cuba/christians-in-cuba-worry-about-students-alleged-persecution

After trip to the U.S., Cuban pro-democracy student gets expelled
By Andrea Torres - Digital Reporter/Producer , Hatzel Vela - Reporter
Posted: 2:01 PM, May 10, 2017

Felix Llerena traveled to Washington in April.

HAVANA - A 20-year-old history student dared to publicly criticize the Cuban government. He also defied them when he met with U.S. officials to try to influence President Donald Trump's policy.

During a meeting with representatives of the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom in Washington, Félix Llerena wore a suit and tie. The ten members of the U.S. federal government commission make policy recommendations to Congress, the Secretary of State and Trump.

Llerena documented his trip on social media. He drank coffee under the U.S. flag and visited the Radio y Televisión Martí studio in Miami. The U.S. federal government has been financing the TV station's programs in Spanish since 1990.

"I am returning to continue the struggle for your true liberation," Llerena wrote on Facebook during his return flight to Cuba.
Click link above for full article.

Felix Llerena was expelled from the university for political reasons. He has been harassed by State Security due to his religious believes and criticism of the Castroit regime. The Education under the regime is atheist. Since the founding of the Republic of Cuba in 1902, all public colleges and universities has been open to all races and religious beliefs. The official slogan in the Cuban universities, taken from a Fidel Castro speech, says: “the university is for the revolutionaries”. According to the regime slogan the non-revolutionary students have no right to higher education.