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Cops can be wrong, but not legally guilty (Blake)

Simpletruther

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In the Blake case, I am not saying the cop did no wrong.

Most people don’t seem to acknowledge the gray areas, these situations are on a continuum from perfect cop reaction to completely wrong obviously criminal reaction.

The reality is much more nuanced. The cop reacted too soon in the Blake case, but he was provoked into do so.
if he delays one more second, and he could be dead. He has a reasonable fear of that, given a dangerous felon is ignoring commands and possibly reaching for a weapon (it’s happened many times and cops have died exactly like this).

I will not hold cops to a standard of perfection, either:

1. be perfect in a dangerous situation

2. or die,

3. or go to prison.


Those are the three options you give a cop when you don’t allow for misjudgments.

Sorry but perps have a responsibility to walk the line in these situations, do exactly as you are told, why? Exactly because cops are not perfect and you might die unnecessarily if you act a fool.

And ignoring cops with guns drawn and reaching in your car while being arrested on felony charges is the definition of acting a fool.
 
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Simpletruther

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In the Blake case, I am not saying the cop did no wrong.

Most people don’t seem to acknowledge the gray areas, these situations are on a continuum from perfect cop reaction to completely wrong obviously criminal reaction.

The reality is much more nuanced. The cop reacted too soon in the Blake case, but he was provoked into do so.
if he delays one more second, and he could be dead. He has a reasonable fear of that, given a dangerous felon is ignoring commands and possibly reaching for a weapon (it’s happened many times and cops have died exactly like this).

I will not hold cops to a standard of perfection, either:

1. be perfect in a dangerous situation

2. or die,

3. or go to prison.


Those are the three options you give a cop when you don’t allow for misjudgments.

Sorry but perps have a responsibility to walk the line in these situations, do exactly as you are told, why? Exactly because cops are not perfect and you might die unnecessarily if you act a fool.

And ignoring cops with guns drawn and reaching in your car while being arrested on felony charges is the definition of acting a fool.

Nothing?
 

Stealers Wheel

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If a cop says "I feared for my life," he gets to kill anyone he wants.

I personally hold them to this standard: If a non-cop citizen did the exact same thing, would they get a pass? If not, the cops should not, either.

Unfortunately, there are enough people in this country that believe a cop is ALWAYS justified in their behavior, no matter what, that cops are never held to the same standard as non-cops.

I'm reminded of the incident in California, where, in broad daylight, the cops without a word opened fire on a man sitting on his porch playing with a hose nozzle. The man died immediately. The DA, decided not to charge the officers, saying they had done nothing wrong.

If the neighbor who had called the police had done the exact same thing, he would have been charged and convicted. The police are not held to the same standards as non-cops.
 

EMNofSeattle

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If a cop says "I feared for my life," he gets to kill anyone he wants.

I personally hold them to this standard: If a non-cop citizen did the exact same thing, would they get a pass? If not, the cops should not, either.

Unfortunately, there are enough people in this country that believe a cop is ALWAYS justified in their behavior, no matter what, that cops are never held to the same standard as non-cops.

I'm reminded of the incident in California, where, in broad daylight, the cops without a word opened fire on a black man sitting on his porch playing with a hose nozzle. The man died immediately. The DA, decided not to charge the officers, saying they had done nothing wrong.

If the neighbor who had called the police had done the exact same thing, he would have been charged and convicted. The police are not held to the same standards as non-cops.

The cops are nearly never wrong. It’s just for Marxist liberals to seize the means of production they first need to destroy faith in institutions
 

EMNofSeattle

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In the Blake case, I am not saying the cop did no wrong.

Most people don’t seem to acknowledge the gray areas, these situations are on a continuum from perfect cop reaction to completely wrong obviously criminal reaction.

The reality is much more nuanced. The cop reacted too soon in the Blake case, but he was provoked into do so.
if he delays one more second, and he could be dead. He has a reasonable fear of that, given a dangerous felon is ignoring commands and possibly reaching for a weapon (it’s happened many times and cops have died exactly like this).

I will not hold cops to a standard of perfection, either:

1. be perfect in a dangerous situation

2. or die,

3. or go to prison.


Those are the three options you give a cop when you don’t allow for misjudgments.

Sorry but perps have a responsibility to walk the line in these situations, do exactly as you are told, why? Exactly because cops are not perfect and you might die unnecessarily if you act a fool.

And ignoring cops with guns drawn and reaching in your car while being arrested on felony charges is the definition of acting a fool.

The cop did zero wrong. Jacob Blake’s life did not matter as soon as he reached into that car.

He could not be allowed to grab a weapon, he could not be allowed to escape with those children in the car.
 

Simpletruther

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If a cop says "I feared for my life," he gets to kill anyone he wants.

I personally hold them to this standard: If a non-cop citizen did the exact same thing, would they get a pass? If not, the cops should not, either.

Unfortunately, there are enough people in this country that believe a cop is ALWAYS justified in their behavior, no matter what, that cops are never held to the same standard as non-cops.

I'm reminded of the incident in California, where, in broad daylight, the cops without a word opened fire on a man sitting on his porch playing with a hose nozzle. The man died immediately. The DA, decided not to charge the officers, saying they had done nothing wrong.

If the neighbor who had called the police had done the exact same thing, he would have been charged and convicted. The police are not held to the same standards as non-cops.
This rant has nothin to do with the OP. I didn’t remotely claim cops are always justified and said exactly the opposite. .
 

CaughtInThe

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Once all the muslims take over this country, and white people become minorities, and the Muslim police treat the white people differently than the muslims, and shoot white people more often in similar situations, I just don't think the white parents have the guts to stand up for justice like the black community currently is.
 

Stealers Wheel

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The cops are nearly never wrong. It’s just for Marxist liberals to seize the means of production they first need to destroy faith in institutions

Yes, it's true. First, we cannot believe our intelligence services. Next, we cannot believe NOAA. Then we cannot believe the DOJ or the FBI. We cannot believe CDC or FDA. We cannot trust the USPS. We cannot trust the Pentagon or the courts.

No matter how hard Trump has tried to instill faith in these institutions, liberals have done everything in their power to destroy them. Thank God we've got you to protect us from revisionist history.
 

Simpletruther

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The cop did zero wrong. Jacob Blake’s life did not matter as soon as he reached into that car.

He could not be allowed to grab a weapon, he could not be allowed to escape with those children in the car.

He could waited to verify the man wasn’t getting a weapon or leaving.
 

Simpletruther

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Once all the muslims take over this country, and white people become minorities, and the Muslim police treat the white people differently than the muslims, and shoot white people more often in similar situations, I just don't think the white parents have the guts to stand up for justice like the black community currently is.

If white peiple begin to murder at an astoundingly higher rate than the Muslims, literally a mind blowing 5 times higher rate, I would understand the differing treatment.
 

CaughtInThe

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If white peiple begin to murder at an astoundingly higher rate than the Muslims, literally a mind blowing 5 times higher rate, I would understand the differing treatment.

you're like the 3rd dude in two days that doesn't understand what "similar" means.
 

EMNofSeattle

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He could waited to verify the man wasn’t getting a weapon or leaving.

He was either grabbing a weapon or leaving, those are literally the only two reasonable actions he could take at the time Blake was shot. In both cases capping his ass was justified. So no the police officers didn’t have to wait one more second.
 

bullseyelqcs

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If white peiple begin to murder at an astoundingly higher rate than the Muslims, literally a mind blowing 5 times higher rate, I would understand the differing treatment.

So let me get this straight....to you its perfectly okay that if a cop pulls me over for a busted tail light he gets to treat me different because of something I had absolutely no control of? So much for innocent until proven guilty, right?

Now come on and tell me that all I have to do to negate this difference is be perfect in my interaction and not do anything that might touch that potentially raw nerve and make the officer do something he may or may not regret for the rest of his life. Forget expecting expecting the officer to simply not treat me like I am threat from the onset, right?
 

Simpletruther

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He was either grabbing a weapon or leaving, those are literally the only two reasonable actions he could take at the time Blake was shot. In both cases capping his ass was justified. So no the police officers didn’t have to wait one more second.

I have to disagree......strongly, , one could come up countless things he might be doing. Maybe he was getting a smoke to calm down, or giving instructions to his kids.

Also, I don’t think him leaving would justify shooting him. Shoot his tires out if he tries to leave.
 

Simpletruther

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So let me get this straight....to you its perfectly okay that if a cop pulls me over for a busted tail light he gets to treat me different because of something I had absolutely no control of? So much for innocent until proven guilty, right?
No, treating you different doesn’t mean you are not considered innocent. It does mean more caution would be taken if you did non compliance things like reach into your car after Just having resisted and physically assaulted an officer.
And so in that moment you would be more likely to be shot by the cop fearing the worst, than if you part of a much less violent profile. That is just common sense.
Now come on and tell me that all I have to do to negate this difference is be perfect in my interaction and not do anything that might touch that potentially raw nerve and make the officer do something he may or may not regret for the rest of his life. Forget expecting expecting the officer to simply not treat me like I am threat from the onset, right?
 

bullseyelqcs

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No, treating you different doesn’t mean you are not considered innocent. It does mean more caution would be taken if you did non compliance things like reach into your car after Just having resisted and physically assaulted an officer.

It means I am guilty of being a higher risk threat than someone else. If he can approach me with the mindset that I am more likely to be a threat, he has already judged me differently that another citizen.

But thanks for telling me exactly what I thought you would.
 

Simpletruther

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It means I am guilty of being a higher risk threat than someone else.
No, it’s not a crime to a part of a higher risk group. You are mistaken.

If he can approach me with the mindset that I am more likely to be a threat, he has already judged me differently that another citizen.
That is ridiculous, because you be objectively more likely to be a threat based upon statistics, so he would simply be acknowledging reality, not judging you.

You would indeed be “more likely to be a threat” statistically. . Are you anti science?

But thanks for telling me exactly what I thought you would.

You are welcome.
 

CLAX1911

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In the Blake case, I am not saying the cop did no wrong.

Most people don’t seem to acknowledge the gray areas, these situations are on a continuum from perfect cop reaction to completely wrong obviously criminal reaction.

The reality is much more nuanced. The cop reacted too soon in the Blake case, but he was provoked into do so.
if he delays one more second, and he could be dead. He has a reasonable fear of that, given a dangerous felon is ignoring commands and possibly reaching for a weapon (it’s happened many times and cops have died exactly like this).

I will not hold cops to a standard of perfection, either:

1. be perfect in a dangerous situation

2. or die,

3. or go to prison.


Those are the three options you give a cop when you don’t allow for misjudgments.

Sorry but perps have a responsibility to walk the line in these situations, do exactly as you are told, why? Exactly because cops are not perfect and you might die unnecessarily if you act a fool.

And ignoring cops with guns drawn and reaching in your car while being arrested on felony charges is the definition of acting a fool.

I think this needs to be examined by a court of law. Investigated and witnesses questioned.
 

Simpletruther

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I think this needs to be examined by a court of law. Investigated and witnesses questioned.

True. I am just discussing issues in general using this particular example.
 

Simpletruther

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Outside of what constitutes self-defense I'm not sure what issues there are.

Are you justified in using lethal Force in this instance. It really depends on the circumstance.

No, I don’t think it’s justified, not do I think it warrants charges. It was a misjudgment, but an understandable one in the moment. The greater misjudgment belonged to the perp, whom resisted and refused to follow commands then did something potentially dangerous for cops.
 

bullseyelqcs

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No, it’s not a crime to a part of a higher risk group. You are mistaken.


That is ridiculous, because you be objectively more likely to be a threat based upon statistics, so he would simply be acknowledging reality, not judging you.

You would indeed be “more likely to be a threat” statistically. . Are you anti science?



You are welcome.

So again, its perfectly okay that agents of the government don't have to recognize my individualism because others who share traits with me, one in particular, have done bad things? Its fine for them to approach me with a level of intensity that they wouldn't approach you with because I look like someone else who committed a crime weeks ago that they interacted with?


Talk about non compliance things that might get someone killed.....

Tell me again there isn't a certain luxury to not being a minority.
 

Simpletruther

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So again, its perfectly okay that agents of the government don't have to recognize my individualism because others who share traits with me, one in particular, have done bad things? Its fine for them to approach me with a level of intensity that they wouldn't approach you with because I look like someone else who committed a crime weeks ago that they interacted with?


Talk about non compliance things that might get someone killed.....

Tell me again there isn't a certain luxury to not being a minority.

Being more cautious around someone who clearly is statically more likely to be dangerous isn’t denying your “individuality” it’s acknowledging objective reality.

And you know his. You would be more cautious around a black late at night in a dark alley with his pants hanging down and gang colors on than you would a well dressed Asian.
 

bullseyelqcs

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No, I don’t think it’s justified, not do I think it warrants charges. It was a misjudgment, but an understandable one in the moment. The greater misjudgment belonged to the perp, whom resisted and refused to follow commands then did something potentially dangerous for cops.

So we just call the possible permanent paralysis or death of a citizen at the hands of an officer a learning experience?!?!?!?!?
 
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