Context for Black Lives Matter

[Gimmesometruth]

No, you LACK CONTEXT OR UNDERSTANDING.

The manufactured outrage I speak of is such protest like "HANDS UP DON'T SHOOT!" A false narrative from Ferguson where an honest police officer was forced to shoot a criminal. The BLM chant was based on lies, and is still chanted today in reference to that event. The whole NARRATIVE is manufactured.

That you couldn't figure that out, had to create your own false narrative about my words, is an indictment on your comprehension skills.

That is not "the whole narrative", this is a straw argument. This outrage that is expressed by BLM did not begin in 2014, this is again a removal of all context. Police violence against Blacks has a long history in the US, BLM is one group in a long history of Civil Rights protest, the idea that you can remove this context is insane.

 

[Renae]

That is not "the whole narrative", this is a straw argument. This outrage that is expressed by BLM did not begin in 2014, this is again a removal of all context. Police violence against Blacks has a long history in the US, BLM is one group in a long history of Civil Rights protest, the idea that you can remove this context is insane.

Okay, you've lost all credibility as a serious person. I think we can write you off now.

:2wave:

 

[Gimmesometruth]

I didn't deny that......why lie about what I said?

And I gave you TWO cases, not NO CASES.

FFS...already forgetting yer argument, yer argument was no cases have been presented that were legitimate, it was a dumb argument easily defeated.

Get with the program here.

Want more? Freddie Gray, Tamir Rice, and that terminally obese illegal cigarette seller in NY.....the "I can't breave" guy.

I have no idea what you think your argument is now, you have formulated nothing....other than someone is supposed to "apologize" for cases where there were, in fact, aspects of racism. You have tried to change your failed argument.....into nonsense.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Okay, you've lost all credibility as a serious person. I think we can write you off now.

:2wave:

The fact that as per usual you cannot formulate an argument supporting this new distraction proves that you are not "serious" about debate.

It just amazes me how you always turn debate on argument...into attacks on the person.

 

[Mr Person]

Okay, you've lost all credibility as a serious person. I think we can write you off now.

The organization called BLM may have formed following events you mention, but that does not mean they cannot be (or are not) motivated by the long history of poorer treatment of blacks than of whites by the police.

Similarly, the fact that you can find a few BLM activists who committed wrongs does not mean that all of BLM is about supporting those wrongs.



Humans are not fungible, but when one disagrees with the actions of individuals in a group one perceives to be "the other", one tends to treat that group as if it were fungible. (Similarly, see all the "libs this, cons that" threads)

 

[Mr Person]

No, you LACK CONTEXT OR UNDERSTANDING.

The manufactured outrage I speak of is such protest like "HANDS UP DON'T SHOOT!" A false narrative from Ferguson where an honest police officer was forced to shoot a criminal. Yet that officer today cannot work as a police officer, his career ruined. Because of manufactured lies and outrage. The BLM chant was based on lies, and is still chanted today in reference to that event. The whole NARRATIVE is manufactured.

That you couldn't figure that out, had to create your own false narrative about my words, is an indictment on your comprehension skills.

That was one of the incidents.

What are you demanding? Should BLM dissolve, then reform another group called "stop beating us" and make it undeniably clear on their website that it's about the last 100 years, not just "hands up don't shoot!"?




Funny enough - if funny is the right word - a black man was recently shot despite lying down with his hands up, asking not to be shot. Hmmmm.....

:doh

 

[Renae]

The organization called BLM may have formed following events you mention, but that does not mean they cannot be (or are not) motivated by the long history of poorer treatment of blacks than of whites by the police.

Similarly, the fact that you can find a few BLM activists who committed wrongs does not mean that all of BLM is about supporting those wrongs.



Humans are not fungible, but when one disagrees with the actions of individuals in a group one perceives to be "the other", one tends to treat that group as if it were fungible. (Similarly, see all the "libs this, cons that" threads)

Where is there concern for black behavior with cops? I don't see them out trying to fix THAT side fo the equation.

 

[GhostlyJoe]

Oh, FFS.

This should be posted in every BLM thread until some of you people actually friggin read it.

Here's the companion report showing the Michael Brown probably didn't have his hands up. But Michael Brown is the drop of water that broke the dam, so to speak. Click the first link. That's the real issue that needed to be addressed in Ferguson.

Here's the DOJ report on Cleveland.

There are many more such reports.

Can we stop the obfuscation? BLM has a real grievance.

 

[GhostlyJoe]

Also, to take on another conservative talking pont: There are groups that address inner-city violence. There are marches. There are rallies. All across the country. Here's a recent one. Thank you.

Now, let's fix our broken justice system.

 

[VanceMack]

For some reason I dont see Tacarra Morgan's name listed anywhere there. Tyshawn Lee is missing too.

 

[VanceMack]

Also, to take on another conservative talking pont: There are groups that address inner-city violence. There are marches. There are rallies. All across the country. Here's a recent one. Thank you.

Now, let's fix our broken justice system.

Dozens showed up. For the 2 hour long event. yep...that should do it. :roll:

 

[RetiredUSN]

Also, to take on another conservative talking pont: There are groups that address inner-city violence. There are marches. There are rallies. All across the country. Here's a recent one. Thank you.

Now, let's fix our broken justice system.

The snitch rule is in effect in every one of these cities and neighborhoods you talk about. As soon as the rally is over, the dealers, hookers, and thugs are right back out there, while the ralliers lock themselves indoors. Cities all through the Hampton Roads area, including Hampton, Norfolk, Portsmouth, Newport News, and cities like Richmond, Baltimore, Philly have all kinds of rallies.

Rallies have not made one iota of difference in street crime,or thug shootings and murders in the Hampton Roads area. It has almost doubled this year and it is only July.

Crime is on the rise again in Baltimore because the cops have refused to be pro-active. (Freddie Gray)

 

[bluesmoke]

The context of “Black Lives Matter” came from two black people having conversation and one saying to the other “our lives matter” in the context of being black. The term “Black Lives Matter” does not mean to say black lives matter more than others, but that black lives need at least matter at all, to say as if they haven’t been mattering at all. Just another point, most of what I hear critical in this forum about BLM is based on events that are not organized by the BLM organization.

 

[VanceMack]

Wow...I actually bothered to watch the foolish video. Shockingly...it is completely chock full of lies. And see...thats your problem. Not only are you ignoring 'black lives' that dont matter, the ones you are parading around as your cause dont fit.

-Zimmerman killed Trayvon and was acquited because the evidence presented AT TRIAL 9('the system') showed Martin was the aggressor.
-Eric Garner was not killed by cops...he died because he was morbidly obese and resisted arrest. In short...because he was fat and stupid. X + stupid is ALWAYS a dangerous combination.
-The video evidence PROVES that there was no 'hands up' as presented in this video, that crawford DROPPED the gun and ran...and then...inexplicable for some reason in the face of approaching officers, darted FOR THE WEAPON.
-The Obama justice department PROVED that Darren Wilson was being attacked by Mike Brown. Holder led the charge and even with the INTENT to prove Wilson guilty, was FORCED to admit...everything Browns buddy and several of the witneses said...the things which triggered riots...were a complete and total LIE.

On...and on...and on...

If the intent of the video was to prove that BLdM is a farce built on lies...it has succeeded.

 

[VanceMack]

The context of “Black Lives Matter” came from two black people having conversation and one saying to the other “our lives matter” in the context of being black. The term “Black Lives Matter” does not mean to say black lives matter more than others, but that black lives need at least matter at all, to say as if they haven’t been mattering at all. Just another point, most of what I hear critical in this forum about BLM is based on events that are not organized by the BLM organization.

But black lives DONT matter to all, and CERTAINLY not to those in the black community. The only black lives they care about are the ones they can exploit.

 

[Mr Person]

Where is there concern for black behavior with cops? I don't see them out trying to fix THAT side fo the equation.

I don't see why a group that is aimed at the long history of poorer treatment of blacks than of whites by the police should have to make sure to list all the bad things black people have done vis a vis cops anymore than, say, a pro-Democracy group trying to build support in foreign countries has any duty to list all of the bad things done by democracies. (or any more than, say, a pro-trans rights groups in support of bathroom bills has an obligation to list any sex crimes committed by trans people).

Why on Earth would you think that by opposing the very real history of mistreatment of blacks by police, one becomes accountable for bad things done by criminals who happen to be black?



That would only begin to make sense if your position was that when an officer panics and shoots a guy who's lying on his back with his hands in the air asking not to be shot, it might be a justified overreaction because somewhere else in the country, a black person shot a cop. I'd say that's ludicrous, however, because police need to respond to individual situations, not impose group punishment.

 

[Mr Person]

Crime is on the rise again in Baltimore because the cops have refused to be pro-active. (Freddie Gray)

Cops have refused to be pro-active because, when a black man suffers a broken neck while in police custody, police officers are investigated?

Oh my dear Lord, are you ****ing me? I mean really? Black people shouldn't be angry when a black man dies in police custody in suspicious circumstances because, if they say anything, cops might refuse to do their ****ing jobs?

It's not like they are unaware that they're signing up for a dangerous job. But they have the power of life and death over citizens in a Democracy, and with that comes great responsibility. Similarly, you assume great responsibility as a surgeon. Should we not punish and sue surgeons when people die under the knife in circumstances in which they should be perfectly safe, because then maybe surgeons might not try so hard? Please.



I really hope you meant to type something else, because that would be the most wrong-headed view I've seen.

 

[RetiredUSN]

Cops have refused to be pro-active because, when a black man suffers a broken neck while in police custody, police officers are investigated?

Oh my dear Lord, are you ****ing me? I mean really? Black people shouldn't be angry when a black man dies in police custody in suspicious circumstances because, if they say anything, cops might refuse to do their ****ing jobs?

It's not like they are unaware that they're signing up for a dangerous job. But they have the power of life and death over citizens in a Democracy, and with that comes great responsibility. Similarly, you assume great responsibility as a surgeon. Should we not punish and sue surgeons when people die under the knife in circumstances in which they should be perfectly safe, because then maybe surgeons might not try so hard? Please.



I really hope you meant to type something else, because that would be the most wrong-headed view I've seen.

The judge is more knowledgeable than you and I both...............was the judge wrong headed?

The moron killed himself looking for a easy payday.

 

[GhostlyJoe]

Dozens showed up. For the 2 hour long event. yep...that should do it. :roll:

Great response :roll:

 

[GhostlyJoe]

But black lives DONT matter to all, and CERTAINLY not to those in the black community. The only black lives they care about are the ones they can exploit.

Are you denying the existence of inner-city anti-violence campaigns? This talking point has been debunked. Let go of the hate, man. Racism is so ugly.

 

[GhostlyJoe]

The snitch rule is in effect in every one of these cities and neighborhoods you talk about. As soon as the rally is over, the dealers, hookers, and thugs are right back out there, while the ralliers lock themselves indoors. Cities all through the Hampton Roads area, including Hampton, Norfolk, Portsmouth, Newport News, and cities like Richmond, Baltimore, Philly have all kinds of rallies.

Rallies have not made one iota of difference in street crime,or thug shootings and murders in the Hampton Roads area. It has almost doubled this year and it is only July.

Crime is on the rise again in Baltimore because the cops have refused to be pro-active. (Freddie Gray)

It proves that people in the city do care about inner-city violence, despite talking points to the contrary. It also shows that there's a fundamental problem of trust between the inner-city communities and local police. That issue needs to be addressed. And shame on the cops if they refuse to do their jobs ethically.

 

[RetiredUSN]

It proves that people in the city do care about inner-city violence, despite talking points to the contrary. It also shows that there's a fundamental problem of trust between the inner-city communities and local police. That issue needs to be addressed. And shame on the cops if they refuse to do their jobs ethically.

You get a few dozen videos and claim ethics violations are widespread.

There are 26 million police stops every year, and another 15-20 million calls for the police to go to................without any violence at all.

 

[GhostlyJoe]

You get a few dozen videos and claim ethics violations are widespread.

There are 26 million police stops every year, and another 15-20 million calls for the police to go to................without any violence at all.

I was talking specifically about your claim that Baltimore police have allowed crime to flourish by stepping back enforcement. If true, then shame on them.

I don't dispute your stats. At the very least, they prove that there IS such a thing as a "routine stop" -- millions of "routine stops," even.

Most cops are trying to do their job to the best of their ability. Most of them aren't "bad cops." Likewise, most priests weren't pedophiles. But in the Catholic Church, there was a culture of secrecy and silence that enabled a tiny number of abusers to continue their abuse without consequence for years. That's a cultural issue within the institution itself that perpetuates bad behavior by the few. I charge that too many police department operate with a similar culture of secrecy and silence when it comes to misconduct. Read the reports. Read this story. Read the recent thread about the LAPD.

My call is for accountability and an end to "blue wall of silence."

 

[RetiredUSN]

I was talking specifically about your claim that Baltimore police have allowed crime to flourish by stepping back enforcement. If true, then shame on them.

I don't dispute your stats. At the very least, they prove that there IS such a thing as a "routine stop" -- millions of "routine stops," even.

Most cops are trying to do their job to the best of their ability. Most of them aren't "bad cops." Likewise, most priests weren't pedophiles. But in the Catholic Church, there was a culture of secrecy and silence that enabled a tiny number of abusers to continue their abuse without consequence for years. That's a cultural issue within the institution itself that perpetuates bad behavior by the few. I charge that too many police department operate with a similar culture of secrecy and silence when it comes to misconduct. Read the reports. Read this story. Read the recent thread about the LAPD.

My call is for accountability and an end to "blue wall of silence."

Where is this blue wall of silence? Are we talking about pockets of corruption that we read about, or a overall virus running through our police forces/

 

[GhostlyJoe]

Where is this blue wall of silence? Are we talking about pockets of corruption that we read about, or a overall virus running through our police forces/

I would say mostly pockets of corruption. But also a broader shared culture and a legal system that makes it very difficult to expose and prosecute police misconduct. I don't think it's a virus. I think we need to reform some aspects of policing as a matter of policy and encourage greater cohesion between the peaceful members of any community and its police force.