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Congressman Murtha has said the U.S. Military is broken. Do you believe that?

Congressman Murtha says the U.S. Military is broken. Do you believe that?

  • Yes

    Votes: 3 23.1%
  • No

    Votes: 10 76.9%

  • Total voters
    13

M14 Shooter

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The US military is, presently, doing everything it is supposed to be doing as wll as it could be reasonably expected to do it.

Given that, there's no basis for the argument that it is broken.

Murta, like so many Democrats before him, has sold his soul for political gain.
 

Navy Pride

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I have all the respect in the world for Congressman Murtha and I salute him for his 37 years service in the Marine Corps but I think he does a terrible disservice when he says the greatest military in the world is broken......

I don't know why he did it but I saw him allying himself with one of the biggest liberals in the Congress Nancy Pelosi today and I can only surmise it is for political reasons..........

Shame on you Congressman for putting down the military you served so admirably in..............
 

26 X World Champs

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Navy Pride said:
your comments please:
UGH! This poll, again, is based on FALSE PRETENSE. Jack Murtha NEVER said the military is broken! It is a complete untruth.

Here is what he said direct from his congressional website. This is his official press release:

The future of our military is at risk. Our military and their families are stretched thin. Many say that the Army is broken. Some of our troops are on their third deployment. Recruitment is down, even as our military has lowered its standards.
Source: http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/pa12_murtha/pr051117iraq.html

The wording of the poll is inaccurate, it's not true. This poll should be shut down and this thread should be closed.

I thought that when someone quotes a public figure in a post they're also supposed to post a source that shows the exact quote? I note that nothing was provided and that Jack Murtha was slandered.
 

26 X World Champs

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M14 Shooter said:
The US military is, presently, doing everything it is supposed to be doing as wll as it could be reasonably expected to do it.

Given that, there's no basis for the argument that it is broken.

Murta, like so many Democrats before him, has sold his soul for political gain.
I do not understand your statement? Murtha has been a Congressman for more than 30 years, has no aspirations to run for a different office, and will easily be reelected next November.

He's also one of the, if not the biggest supporters of the military in the House. I find it shameful that some of you are writing:
NavyPride said:
Shame on you Congressman for putting down the military you served so admirably in.
How come when someone speaks out against Bush's policies a percentage of blind faith Bushies scold or belittle or personally attack the messenger? If someone who is an insider speaks from his knowledge and experience and readily admits that the purpose of his speaking out is his true beliefs how can you slander him like this thread is doing?

Murtha has also come out and not denied that he is restating what top echelon military commanders have privately told him about the war since these commanders have no way of speaking out directly.

Murtha NEVER said that the military is broken! It is an untruth.
 

Navy Pride

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26 X World Champs said:
UGH! This poll, again, is based on FALSE PRETENSE. Jack Murtha NEVER said the military is broken! It is a complete untruth.

Here is what he said direct from his congressional website. This is his official press release:


Source: http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/pa12_murtha/pr051117iraq.html

The wording of the poll is inaccurate, it's not true. This poll should be shut down and this thread should be closed.

I thought that when someone quotes a public figure in a post they're also supposed to post a source that shows the exact quote? I note that nothing was provided and that Jack Murtha was slandered.

As usual you are wrong.......Here is the article from USA Today where he said it.................We don't need to read from his propagnda website....

http://yahoo.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-12-01-murtha-iraq_x.htm?csp=1

Murtha says army is 'broken, worn out'
LATROBE, Pa. (AP) — Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha told a civic group.

I just wish you would do you home work one time before you open your mouth and insert your foot.........
 

FinnMacCool

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As usual you are wrong.......Here is the article from USA Today where he said it.................We don't need to read from his propagnda website....
Jesus ****ing Christ man. How long does it take for someone to have a ****ing propaganda website? Perhaps. . .two ****ing weeks? Does everyone who you disagree with have a propaganda website?
 

26 X World Champs

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Navy Pride said:
As usual you are wrong.......Here is the article from USA Today where he said it.................We don't need to read from his propagnda website....

http://yahoo.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-12-01-murtha-iraq_x.htm?csp=1

Murtha says army is 'broken, worn out'
LATROBE, Pa. (AP) — Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha told a civic group.

I just wish you would do you home work one time before you open your mouth and insert your foot.........
Try again? This is the complete quote, you spliced out his words, that is not kosher!
Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha told a civic group.
Let's keep things in context? He went on to say in the same article:
Murtha, a decorated Vietnam war veteran, said the Pennsylvania National Guard is "stretched so thin" that it won't be able to send fully equipped units to Iraq next year. Murtha predicted it will cost $50 billion to upgrade military equipment nationwide, but says the federal government is already reducing future purchases to save money.
He means the equipment is broken, not the personnel. His statement was confirmed in the same article here:
Lt. Col. Chris Cleaver, spokesman for the Pennsylvania National Guard at Fort Indiantown Gap, said "there are some deployment concerns."
I believe that the meaning of his words is that he is concerned that our Army personnel do not have the proper equipment to do their jobs and that endangers them.

He is NOT saying that the MILITARY is broken, that the MILITARY SYSTEM is broken, that the MILITARY is failing. I read it as meaning that they are stretched TOO THIN due to lack of equipment and personnel and that by this time next year we will not be able to deploy enough personnel or equipment.

Calling his official congressional website "propaganda" is yet another slap in his face and actually a slap in the face of America. The text that I posted previously was his official press release that started this entire discussion.

To support what he actually meant this is another quote from his "propaganda" site as you call it:
The war in Iraq has caused huge shortfalls at our bases in the U.S.
Much of our ground equipment is worn out and in need of either serious overhaul or replacement.
Finally I think it's important to read what Murtha really thinks of our military, he said:
Our military has done everything that has been asked of them, the U.S. can not accomplish anything further in Iraq militarily. IT IS TIME TO BRING THEM HOME.
Source: http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/pa12_murtha/pr051117iraq.html
 

M14 Shooter

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26 X World Champs said:
I do not understand your statement? Murtha has been a Congressman for more than 30 years, has no aspirations to run for a different office, and will easily be reelected next November.
And...?
The democrats are looking for ways to use the War against Bush and the GOP. Anything they can do in this effort, they will. Getting hawks like Murtha to criticize the war benifits them greatly, and so the party leadership of the House leans on them to get them to tow the party line.

It happened to (formerly pro-life) Al Gore and (formerly anti-hollywwood smut) Joer Lieberman -- Murtha is just another example.

I, too salute Murtha for his service -- but he has sold his integrity.

[quoite]Murtha NEVER said that the military is broken! It is an untruth.[/QUOTE]
Odd. UPI and AP and ABC say otherwise:
LATROBE, Pa., Dec. 1 (UPI) -- U.S. Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., says the war in Iraq has left the U.S. Army "broken, worn out" and "living hand-to-mouth."
LATROBE, Pa., dec 1 (AP) - Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha (news, bio, voting record) told a civic group.
LATROBE, Pa. Dec 1, 2005 — Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha told a civic group.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=1364634&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

In fact, here;s a whole list of news sources that say otherwise:
http://news.search.yahoo.com/news/search?p=murtha+army+broken&c=
 

Navy Pride

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FinnMacCool said:
Jesus ****ing Christ man. How long does it take for someone to have a ****ing propaganda website? Perhaps. . .two ****ing weeks? Does everyone who you disagree with have a propaganda website?
Our Military is not broke no matter how you on the left try and spin it.......
 

Navy Pride

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26 X World Champs said:
Try again? This is the complete quote, you spliced out his words, that is not kosher!

Let's keep things in context? He went on to say in the same article:

He means the equipment is broken, not the personnel. His statement was confirmed in the same article here:

I believe that the meaning of his words is that he is concerned that our Army personnel do not have the proper equipment to do their jobs and that endangers them.

He is NOT saying that the MILITARY is broken, that the MILITARY SYSTEM is broken, that the MILITARY is failing. I read it as meaning that they are stretched TOO THIN due to lack of equipment and personnel and that by this time next year we will not be able to deploy enough personnel or equipment.

Calling his official congressional website "propaganda" is yet another slap in his face and actually a slap in the face of America. The text that I posted previously was his official press release that started this entire discussion.

To support what he actually meant this is another quote from his "propaganda" site as you call it:

Finally I think it's important to read what Murtha really thinks of our military, he said:

Source: http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/pa12_murtha/pr051117iraq.html
I will post the whole article if you want me too..........
 

Navy Pride

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Navy Pride said:
I will post the whole article if you want me too..........

Here you go Champs...

Posted 12/1/2005 8:25 PM Updated 12/1/2005 8:29 PM


Murtha says army is 'broken, worn out'
LATROBE, Pa. (AP) — Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha told a civic group.

Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., shown here on Nov. 17, has called for a full withdrawal from Iraq.
By Lauren Burke, AP

Two weeks ago, Murtha created a storm of comment when he called for U.S. troops to leave Iraq now. The Democratic congressman spoke to a group of community and business leaders in Latrobe on Wednesday, the same day President Bush said troops would be withdrawn when they've achieved victory, not under an artificial deadline set by politicians.

Murtha predicted most troops will be out of Iraq within a year.

"I predict he'll make it look like we're staying the course," Murtha said, referring to Bush. "Staying the course is not a policy."

Murtha, 73, the ranking Democrat on the House Appropriations defense subcommittee, expressed pessimism about Iraq's stability and said the Iraqis know who the insurgents are, but don't always share that information with U.S. troops. He said a civil war is likely because of ongoing factionalism among Sunni Arabs, and Kurds and Shiites.

He also said he was wrong to vote to support the war.

"I admit I made a mistake when I voted for war," Murtha said. "I'm looking at the future of the United States military."

Murtha, a decorated Vietnam war veteran, said the Pennsylvania National Guard is "stretched so thin" that it won't be able to send fully equipped units to Iraq next year. Murtha predicted it will cost $50 billion to upgrade military equipment nationwide, but says the federal government is already reducing future purchases to save money.

Murtha, who represents a western Pennsylvania district that includes Latrobe, was first elected to Congress in 1974.

Lt. Col. Chris Cleaver, spokesman for the Pennsylvania National Guard at Fort Indiantown Gap, said "there are some deployment concerns."

Cleaver said some guard units had to leave equipment in Iraq when they returned to the United States, which could cause training problems here.

But Cleaver also said most of the 2,100 Guard troops now deployed with the 2nd Brigade Combat Team can't be sent back to Iraq for a second tour of duty anyway, because of regulations that limit redeployment.
 

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Navy Pride said:
I will post the whole article if you want me too..........
Against the rules of the site. Maybe you can read my post instead and respond to it? See if you can do it without using the word "left".

I sincerely believe that you've twisted the meaning of Murtha's words, on purpose, to bait and attack Democrats. The question asked in the poll is proof.

You attacked Murtha's official congressional site, calling it propaganda. If you had actually read the page that I sourced you would know that he was making a policy statement. In other words he was expressing his beliefs, that is not propaganda. I get the idea that if someone disagrees with you or Bush in writing you consider that to be propaganda.
 

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26 X World Champs said:
Against the rules of the site. Maybe you can read my post instead and respond to it? See if you can do it without using the word "left".

I sincerely believe that you've twisted the meaning of Murtha's words, on purpose, to bait and attack Democrats. The question asked in the poll is proof.

You attacked Murtha's official congressional site, calling it propaganda. If you had actually read the page that I sourced you would know that he was making a policy statement. In other words he was expressing his beliefs, that is not propaganda. I get the idea that if someone disagrees with you or Bush in writing you consider that to be propaganda.
I did not twist them because his quote is right in the article........Now enough of this nonsense...If you think the military is broken and I think you do just cote that way OK.......In fact I think you already did.........:roll:

Oh and since I don't want to get banned from this forum I will be ignoring you posts from now on..........Have a nice evening........:lol:
 

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Navy Pride said:
Here you go Champs...

Posted 12/1/2005 8:25 PM Updated 12/1/2005 8:29 PM


Murtha says army is 'broken, worn out'
LATROBE, Pa. (AP) — Most U.S. troops will leave Iraq within a year because the Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand to mouth," Rep. John Murtha told a civic group.

Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., shown here on Nov. 17, has called for a full withdrawal from Iraq.
By Lauren Burke, AP

Two weeks ago, Murtha created a storm of comment when he called for U.S. troops to leave Iraq now. The Democratic congressman spoke to a group of community and business leaders in Latrobe on Wednesday, the same day President Bush said troops would be withdrawn when they've achieved victory, not under an artificial deadline set by politicians.

Murtha predicted most troops will be out of Iraq within a year.

"I predict he'll make it look like we're staying the course," Murtha said, referring to Bush. "Staying the course is not a policy."

Murtha, 73, the ranking Democrat on the House Appropriations defense subcommittee, expressed pessimism about Iraq's stability and said the Iraqis know who the insurgents are, but don't always share that information with U.S. troops. He said a civil war is likely because of ongoing factionalism among Sunni Arabs, and Kurds and Shiites.

He also said he was wrong to vote to support the war.

"I admit I made a mistake when I voted for war," Murtha said. "I'm looking at the future of the United States military."

Murtha, a decorated Vietnam war veteran, said the Pennsylvania National Guard is "stretched so thin" that it won't be able to send fully equipped units to Iraq next year. Murtha predicted it will cost $50 billion to upgrade military equipment nationwide, but says the federal government is already reducing future purchases to save money.

Murtha, who represents a western Pennsylvania district that includes Latrobe, was first elected to Congress in 1974.

Lt. Col. Chris Cleaver, spokesman for the Pennsylvania National Guard at Fort Indiantown Gap, said "there are some deployment concerns."

Cleaver said some guard units had to leave equipment in Iraq when they returned to the United States, which could cause training problems here.

But Cleaver also said most of the 2,100 Guard troops now deployed with the 2nd Brigade Combat Team can't be sent back to Iraq for a second tour of duty anyway, because of regulations that limit redeployment.
Other then the headline, which was written by the reporter, where does it quote him as having made the statement?

In regards to the poll. Do I think our military is broken? No. But I do have Jimmy Buffett playing in my head for some reason.

"We can't run at this pace very long."

We've got guys on their second and third deployments. How long until it's their forth and fifth? We can't seem to get enough new recruits for some reason. On top of that we're borrowing money like there's no tomorrow. Between Iraq, Afghanistan and now a couple major hurricanes we're going through a ton of money. Seems like something going to have to give somewhere...sometime.

It's like trying to reason with hurricane season.
 

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Let's tar and feather Murtha in the Town square! Who's with me? :roll:
 

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Pacridge said:
Other then the headline, which was written by the reporter, where does it quote him as having made the statement?

In regards to the poll. Do I think our military is broken? No. But I do have Jimmy Buffett playing in my head for some reason.

"We can't run at this pace very long."

We've got guys on their second and third deployments. How long until it's their forth and fifth? We can't seem to get enough new recruits for some reason. On top of that we're borrowing money like there's no tomorrow. Between Iraq, Afghanistan and now a couple major hurricanes we're going through a ton of money. Seems like something going to have to give somewhere...sometime.

It's like trying to reason with hurricane season.
Do you really think the USA reporter could repeat it if Murtha did not say it?
 

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scottyz said:
Let's tar and feather Murtha in the Town square! Who's with me? :roll:
No I would never do that to a man that served his country in the Military like Murtha did..........I just think he has sold out his conservative beliefs to a liberal like Pelosi and that is sad..........
 

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Navy Pride said:
Do you really think the USA reporter could repeat it if Murtha did not say it?

Well do you have an actual quote of him saying it?

Does anyone have the text of his speech?

And yes I think reporters get things wrong all the time.
 

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Navy Pride said:
No I would never do that to a man that served his country in the Military like Murtha did..........I just think he has sold out his conservative beliefs to a liberal like Pelosi and that is sad..........
Did it ever occur to you that Murtha was simply stating what he believes? I find it impossible to believe that he would allow himself to be played in the manner that you wrote, "sold out."

Intelligent human beings have the ability to change their minds, especially when the facts change. Murtha is the most knowledgeable House member regarding our military, no one else is more connected than he is or knows more about the military than he does.

The fact that he is speaking out now is what politicians are supposed to do. He's articulating his point of view and his creditabilty to all but those of the Bush Blind Faith crowd are smart enough to know that he is doing what a Congressman is elected to do, represent his district and to take a stand.

He was a war hero in two wars and a member of Congress since 1974. He's the antithesis of the Jean Schmidt, the NEWEST member of Congress who humiliated herself a few weeks back with her vicious, bitter attack of Jack Murtha. The difference in these two members of Congress is gigantic.
 

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Pacridge said:
Well do you have an actual quote of him saying it?

Does anyone have the text of his speech?

And yes I think reporters get things wrong all the time.
Yeah like Dan Rather did.........That said if the reporter misquoted Murtha then the USA Today Newspaper could be sued......Besides what he said has been on all the news shows tonight........

It was debated by 2 congressmen on Hannity and Coomes tonight........
 

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The US military is overstretched but I wouldn't say it is "broken." In order to break the US military you have to break it's heart and soul and this simply hasn't happenned nor will it ever happen. The heart and soul of the US military has never been broken and never will be.
 

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Our heart and spirit is unbreakable.
 

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Navy Pride said:
Yeah like Dan Rather did.........That said if the reporter misquoted Murtha then the USA Today Newspaper could be sued......Besides what he said has been on all the news shows tonight........

It was debated by 2 congressmen on Hannity and Coomes tonight........
I take it that's a- no, you don't have an actual quote of him saying it. People saying he said it isn't exactly the same thing as him saying it... is it?
 

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TimmyBoy said:
Our heart and spirit is unbreakable.
Amen to that my friend Amen and no one should ever insinuate otherwise Murtha or anyone else..............
 
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